Im just in the beginning stage of choosing a rifle for Dangerous game. Im thinking its mainly gonna be for Buff and Hippo (possibly Elephant). Ive got a 9.3x74R; but I want something bigger. Im leaning towards 500NE (possibly 470NE); but 577NE keeps popping into my head.

Im pretty sure I wont be buying "another" DG gun any time soon or more likely at all. So this is decision time. On one hand 470 or 500 is enough; but if I pass up buying a 577; I probably wont ever get one. Its more than "need ve want"; well OK its that too, but a matter of is there real reason to jump to the 577.

I dont see either the 500NE or the 577NE being useful beyond Heavy Dangerous Game. So is the 577 too much where the 500 is just right, or is a 577 fine for BUFF and HIPPO?

Theres a part of me that wants a 4BORE too; but I think I cant hold off on that for now.....

You poor poor man, I will pray for you!

the 577 NE, with true book loads, seperates the he-man from the macho pretty darn quickly --

in a double gun, its about my limit

Im not "normally" recoil sensitive BUT this is a WHOLE new world to me.

What kind of rifle weight should I be looking for to "balance" the recoil?

Do the mercury devices help enough to make them worth the effort?

You can use a 577 for other game besides elephant and buffalo. I shot a whitetail with mine last year. Tried to frontal brain an Impala at 60 yards but missed. I do a lot of shooting with the 650 grain BPE bullet and cast lead. Tons of fun to shoot. Even have a 450 grain mold for it and had a 125 lb woman shoot it with no problems. The only disadvantage to the 577 is that it is heavy and ammo is expensive even to reload.

All mercury does is add weight and slosh around and drive me nutts. Took them out of my VC guns and wouldn't have one.

Sam

.500 NE (or .470 but I like the .500 better)

I have a VC 577 and have shot hippo and a number of buffalo and I don't find the recoil that bad and I love the rifle. i also have a heym 500 NE and it is lighter and easier to carry when walking long distance and recoil is similar because of weight. You will not go wrong with either but you should buy what feels good to you and have fun

I love the 500 and it is a great choice...
But there is a sublime and rare satisfaction from firing a 577 no doubt about it. Would not resale value be better on a 577 in case you changed your mind?

577 conjures up all the magic of African hunting in days gone bye...make mine a 577

IMHO, nothing over .500 is practical as a hunting rifle.

Rifle weight and recoil are the limiting physical factors, and for Americans, export laws are another problem besides.

No question - the 577

Practical - if that were the major concern, then:
- a bolt gun in 416 or 458 would be a better choice;
or
- a double in 450NE or 470NE would be a better choice

The reasons have been enumerated countless times here in AR.

I've read the argument over weight - sure the 577 is heavier but c'mon - 2 pounds are going to break you? Yes I have carried my 600 OK bolt gun on my own shoulder every day for the entirety of my safari. Just as heavy/light as a typical 577. My 71 year old father carried his own 585AHR - same weight. I'll be carrying my own 600NE double - 13.25lbs for elephant in about 2 month's time.

Recoil - again, if you are going for a 500NE a 577NE ain't much more. And we are not speaking about a day at the range shooting from a bench. One or possibly two shots ... standing ... at dangerous game. My father practiced with and used his 585AHR on Cape buffalo. It throws the same bullet at higher velocity than the 577NE.

Go with what you think will bring you the biggest grin. If you don't like it, you can always sell it at some later time.

Like Nike says....just do it!

Go with the 577 what the hell. You only love once. I am sure you can handle it.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
......export laws are another problem besides.

Can you explain this? Why would one be harder to export than another?

Thanks



I DO tend to think this will be the one and only HEAVY double Im ever likely to buy--especially if I buy a 577NE. The 577NE is calling me for all the reasons you guys have mentioned (just like its why I want a 4 Bore); but the price differences Im seeing between a 500NE and a 577NE will pay for another DG hunt.

If I was being sensible, I suppose a 470NE is the best option in terms of available guns and ammo (and scrounging ammo in country if I mine doesnt arrive) BUT this isnt about being senible is it??? Once we leave that issue behind, the 500NE is cool BUT the 577NE is in the "Waaaay Cool" category.

Arrrrrgh........

Very interesting that you should post this question now, as I am also struggling with whether or not I go after a 500 NE 3.25 or a 577?

I would truly like to have Butch Searcy make a new double for me, so this is a common caliber consternation we both share!

I say 500 NE...that way, you still have an excuse someday to buy yourself a beautiful double in 577 NE, while having a great killer of a cartridge already in your NE stable, the lauded 500!

Respects,

Phill

I actually had a chat with Mr Searcy today over this same issue. He counseled me towards the 500NE, and I have to respect a man that suggests you give him $20+ thousand dollars LESS than he could have.

Luckily I have some time before I have to decide. This is what I call a "MILK" project. I post a picture of what I THINK I want or a project Im thinking about on the frig. If I still want it when its time to throw out the old milk container then its a pretty good idea I really want it. If Ive moved on to other things while the milk is still fresh then the pic and the project get thrown out together---This ones tough, Im on my second gallon.....

I do not own any doubles - yet. But I got to shoot a few of Sams a couple of years ago. With that limited experience, I fee that the 577 is HUGE step up from the 9.3.

My dream is to onwn a 450/400 or may be a 450NE. If i had a 9.3X74R, then i might just go for a 500NE but more likely to settle for the 450NE.

Good luck with your quest. I hope you get some really nice wood on it....

Let's be honest
Most guns will work
It's about style and preference.
Who hunts without a PH who is probably using a 458 Lott or similar.
Live the dream.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
Let's be honest
Most guns will work
It's about style and preference.
Who hunts without a PH who is probably using a 458 Lott or similar.
Live the dream.

+1

"Live The Dream"

There is nothing like walking up to an elephant bull and frontal braining it with a 577 or any double for that matter. My 577 dumped my buffalo last year with a frontal under the chin shot and I was sold on the power of it.
I was born too late, should have been in africa 100 years ago.

quote:

I was born too late, should have been in africa 100 years ago.

Sam, you could have met Will there!!! :-)

My advice is find someone who you can talk into letting you shoot both side by side after a couple of shots you'll know what you really want. You can make anything shoot nice or real mean with weight and stock design. I have a very light 9lb 500 Jeffery that kicks like a mule and the same rifle in 458 Lott that is much more mellow. I love my 450-400 only because it is a useful comprimise. You can't go wrong with either it really come down to what feels good, shoots well and makes you happy.

Brad

quote:

Originally posted by EDELWEISS:

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
......export laws are another problem besides.

Can you explain this? Why would one be harder to export than another?

Thanks

It's rather a long story, but if you search this forum for the term "ITAR" you will learn all about it.

I had a Merkel in 500NE that weighed 10.25lbs and I thought the recoil was pretty stout with full house 570gr loads. Can anyone give me an idea of how a 577NE of proper weight would compare in recoil?

Sam buddy, If we were both born a 100 years ago we would never met and shot DRs.... you would have been in Africa and I would never have left India. Imagine hunting tigers ....

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
"Live The Dream"

There is nothing like walking up to an elephant bull and frontal braining it with a 577 or any double for that matter. My 577 dumped my buffalo last year with a frontal under the chin shot and I was sold on the power of it.
I was born too late, should have been in africa 100 years ago.

Edelweiss,

Since you're close to it already.. Why not go to the Vintagers shoot on the 22nd and hold/feel/shoot several big bores and see what spins your crank?

Theres a Searcy 577NE on gunbroker currently, and its a underlever too! (now the fine print---its left handed) I think the same seller also has a 500NE (lefty) He also has a 4 Bore muzzle loader, yep lefty too

quote:

Originally posted by Ed Scarboro:
I had a Merkel in 500NE that weighed 10.25lbs and I thought the recoil was pretty stout with full house 570gr loads. Can anyone give me an idea of how a 577NE of proper weight would compare in recoil?

That is on the light side for a .500 in my view. My Heym weighs 11 pounds and I would not want it any lighter. My .577 weighs 13 pounds 13 ounces. The recoil is noticeably more than the .500 but not to the point of being painful or uncomfortable just more. I think the key is making sure that the rifle is properly weighted for the caliber. So while some may prefer a 7 pound .450 NE double, I think that is not the ticket for most normal shooters.

quote:

So while some may prefer a 7 pound .450 NE double, I think that is not the ticket for most normal shooters.

The shooter I have in mind is ANYTHING but normal!!!

Would that be Ab? Ab Normal??

How about a second set of barrels in 577/500? Teddy Roo was a fan.

I have a Ruger No 1 in .577 NE, it weighs 12.5 lbs with 2lbs of mercury added to get the weight up. I load 750gn bullets to 2150fps and find that the recoil is very managable. I can't imagine that a double would weigh less than my rifle so recoil would only be more mild.

I say go for the .577, you'll kick yourself if you dont

Steve

Hmmmmmm I WANT a 577NE; but a 500NE or even a 470NE is more practical.....

Just "ballparking" some numbers--a 500NE will cost me something like $10,000 and a 577NE runs more like $25,000 plus. AND a 14 to 21day DG Safari will run something like $50,000(+/-).

A 500NE will be more than enough for elephant, hippo, buffalo; but theres the intangible Coolness factor of a 577NE. I place it in the "mine is bigger than yours" category.

Aaaaaaaaaagh! If I was only born rich instead of good looking, then I could be worrying about a 577NE vs 4 BORE....

A 500NE is plenty cool and absolutely practical. The 577 will get more oohs and aahs and generate a lot of conversation but that is about the only real difference. Cliff Walker owned and carried a .577 and eventually complained about the weight - and he is no skinny runt!

A number of PH's carry the 500NE but very few own or carry a 577. Not that you have to do what the PH's do but there are good reasons for doing so. With Hornady offering ammo i know that i would not hesitate getting the 500NE and spending the difference on a safari.

I seem to recall that there is a formula for calculating recoil based on a cartridge and weight of the gun. I know there are other factors like how the gun is fitted and shaped and the type of pad etc; but it would be nice to have a comparison between 500NE and 577NE.

Here it is:

RE = (½ x (RW/GC)) x (((BW x BMV) + (PW x PGV)) ÷ (RW x 7000))^2

Where:

RE = Free recoil energy in foot-pounds.
RW = Rifle weight in pounds
GC = 32.174 (the gravitational constant for earth in feet per second per second)
BW = Bullet weight in grains
BMV = Muzzle velocity of bullet in feet per second
PW = Powder weight in grains
PGV = 4,700 (a generally – although not universally - accepted constant for powder gas velocity in feet per second)
7000 = Number of grains per pound
^2 means "squared"

Knock yourself out!

Comes out to be 3.62 SH*TLOADS of recoil!!!!