Whatever happened to H&H's 400 and the larger caliber. Sorry I can't even remember the name now! I dont see anyone making custom rifles or any ammunition! Guess they didnt do a good marketing job....and it really did not solve any problem!

400 and 465 Holland and Holland

My smith Julio acum owner of express rifles just made a matching set for a client 400&465 if possible ill have him send photos to post

Some of us here on the board have made 400 H&H rifles but I haven't yet heard of any 465s. I don't think Holland's cares much about how many rifles are produced in these calibers outside of the ones they can produce. Ditto for the ammo they will sell you.

But Quality Cartridge has head-stamped cases. The main thing to worry about with the 400 H&H is that there are numerous wildcat dies and reamers out there named "400 H&H" from all the tinkerers who did this before Holland's decided to make it in-house. Neck and shoulder dimensions are all over the place between the various individual efforts. So anyone wanting one in the factory H&H configuration needs to be double-sure the right parts are used.

I guess I can add that it is a very sensible design, too. The H&H sloping shoulder design may be a hold-over from Cordite and sticky extraction but it also makes for easy feeding. Case capacity is more than enough reach 2350 fps with 400 gr bullets and without the high pressure of the 416 Remington. I like the 416 too, there just aren't any flies on the 400. Holland's stated purpose for the round was to give their clients the familar performance of the 450/400 in a magazine rifle. If that was the true purpose they suceeded pretty well.

The 404-375HH is a better design IMHO.
No shoulder.
Same 375 taper.
Use 375 brass.
400 @ 2300 should be easy.

But I do like the 411/410 bullets.
The same no shoulder 400 thing could be done with the 411 bullets by using 300HH brass that has more taper but a custom reamer and dies are needed to continue the taper and eliminate the shoulder for a continuous body taper, no shoulder, cal length neck 400-300HH cart. Would have about the same capacity as the 416 Taylor/411 KDF but a slick feeder though.

LOL -- at least one still SEES wsm rounds on the shelves

(RUN AWAY)

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:
Case capacity is more than enough reach 2350 fps with 400 gr bullets and without the high pressure of the 416 Remington.

Huh?
I really like the .400 H&H, but there is no way it will give lower preassures with same bullet weight than the .416 RemMag. The latter has larger diameter bullet and larger case capasity, giving lower preassures with same bullet weight and velocity than the .416 RM, no matter what any commercial says.

Gee Bent, didn't you know that H&H is so great that they can violate the laws of physics?!?!?! Seriously, there is no way this cartridge will do anything that the .416 Rem won't....except keep the word "Remington" off H&H rifles which will only please those snobby (or "aesthetically minded") enough to give a damn.

Let me re-phrase that, Bent. It is specific to my rifles and maybe not to all. It gets 2350 with less powder than my 416 did. 73.0 grs of Rel 15 vs. 78.0. And I'm using the same lot of Fed 215 primers, used the same 416 brass initially reformed to the H&H. The 400 primers have much rounder corners after firing. I had hell getting a full 2400 from my old 416 with a 24 inch barrel; I had to run up to fully flattened primers. May be an individual rifle thing, maybe not. There is a usable capacity difference of 2.8 grains between the two (of water and after bullet seating). Not much difference and yes, the larger bullet has more piston area (.13260 for the 400, .13584 for the 416), but again not much.

One of the things I things I think I've noticed after years of playing with Ackley Improved and other wildcats with very similar capacities and/or diameters is that maybe in the case of two this closely matched, the smaller accidently falls into a perfect size for a particular powder and has a slightly better efficiency than its larger near-twin. I've got no way to quantify that but it is possible that the variance in powder performance could be greater the the dimensional differences. In other words, the increased volume and piston have to be a sufficient increase to overcome a certain powder's peak performance. Again, just a theory from a lot of years of casual observation.

Tendrams, I guess in your view anyone who continues to shoot a 375 H&H instead of running out to buy the latest 375 Ruger in that caliber has the same shortcoming? There's nothing snobby about curiosity.

Not wanting to step on toes or argue with anyone, I've had zero trouble makeing 2400 FPS. in my 416 Rem. guns. Actually exceeding it very easily, I generally chuck my brass after 3-4 fireings but it goes there no sweat. Could be our cold climate up here.

That mirrors me somewhat; my brass was usually done after 3-4 firings. I think that indicates max pressure given the brass is within normal specs. I have brass that goes 5-7 reloadings or more in other high-intensity calibers. I'm on 5 times with the 400 H&H I'm using for load work-up.

A sample of one like mine doesn't mean a whole lot. That's why I pose a question as to whether there are case designs that hit a "sweet spot" on a certain powders or burn rate that allow them to perform outside the normal assumptions? I would put the 250 Savage in that catagory. Does anyone think there are others?