So on Monday's episode of American Guns they built a .458 Lott or a guy from a 7mm Rem and buggered up the chamber in the process. What do you think caused the problem?Pay attention!This is at least instructive for folks interested in such caliber changes. -Rob

No idea how they buggered up the chamber. Lovely rifle (other than that folding rear sight) but scary that the owner fired a single shot and found it adequate for dangerous game. Hopefully he did not get anyone injured on his hunt.

I missed the show do you have a link to a video?

Rob

I missed the Show, but I can tell you doing 458 Lotts from 7mm and 300 Winchesters on Winchester M70s from different production dates is a pure BITCH of a project!!!!! I had Brian do 5 of these things from various M70s that I had laying around, could not use them for any B&M projects, so I got the bright idea that the world needed 4 more Win M70s in 458 Lotts, so here we go! We had one hell of a time getting these guns to RETAIN. Feeding was not an issue, but getting them to stay in the magazine was, and I am a pain in the ass about that. Brian wore out many many dummies getting them to retain, different production dates did not help, as different magazine parts in different years and so forth, getting the right ones in the right gun was a pain. Then, rail work as well. Brian and I sent these back and forth between us several times before we got them right!

Lesson learned? Yep, any of those left over 300 Winchesters I am putting them on the block as is!

We did manage to get them to retain, put some nice XX English stocks on them from Accurate Innovations, I have them for sale, and now it seems no one wants a 458 Lott! HEH HEH....... I think I have more in them than I will ever get out of them, maybe I should have a sale?

Michael

I'm not a machinist or gunsmith, but I will take a stab. Did it have something to do with him cutting the last bit of the chamber by hand?

That was the first time I had ever seen that show. $4,000 seemed pretty steep to me for what he did to that rifle though.

Adamhunter- I missed the price of 4K. Wow. That was what 3.1 K too much? No I don't think the final headspacing by hand was the problem. Carefully look at the screwed Lott case. Whats instructive as Michael 458 so correctly points out, is that here are general gunsmiths trying to build a DGR for obviously the first time and really basic stuff goes very wrong.
Guys- This episode is still on so if you get a chance watch it. I'ts on the discovery channel 182 here every monday. Overall its an interesting show and promotes firearms.
Their gunsmiths are a hoot too! Check out the "pursuader" approach to barrel removal!! I like the guy who test fires the .458 Lott holding the barreled action in his bare hands. Good grip!-Rob

If you paid attention, even though they continually spouted how they were converting that Pre-64 action to 458 Lott, the end result was that they used a Montana Rifle Co action on the build.

I thought it hilarious when the owner says at the end, "I can't believe this is my rifle"... No kidding, it isn't your rifle.

When they were trying to get the action removed, did anyone else notice how loose that wrench was around the receiver? It just flopped around after each strike of the hammer. I bet they planned on using the original Pre-64 action, but ruined it removing the barrel.

CasII- We were laughing our butts off over the "removal of the action" phase. It never dawned on those geniuses to use a cheater bar either. -Rob

Cutting the follower to correct size can be tricky..I have dummy follower and I glue slivers of wood on its sides and use it a bit then if it works I cut the next follower to those specs, if not I sand off wood or add more or different slivers until it works 110%

I did this out of necessity as 99% of the gunsmith don't do it right and it has to be a perfect fit..

From past experiences, I now put a heavy spring in the floorplate latch. When you go from a 7mag or 300 to a Lott or even a .404 I have learned you have problems and that "ping" can be a sickening sound under the right, rather wrong condition..Looking a buff in the eye with an empty rifle is a concern I have.

As to feeding, that is a matter of doing it right the first time, then polish it out and I use a magic marker or inletting black to see where the cartridges are hitting, and on the bolt itself to slick it up..Time and patience is the key IMO..

I do these things on every rifle I own, factory or custom, my work or someone elses..These guns are the only thing between you and death or injury, they must work...

Roger Bieson built me a 458 Lott on a 30-06 Pre-64 action. It never failed to feed anything I put in it including 458 Win ammo.

465H&H

When they were first trying to get the barrel off, they were actually tightening it. Then one of the two suggested turning the action upside down, and they switched sides and finally got it off.
I too noticed that the gun brought in and put on the counter was a pre-64 M70, in what appeared to be an original "Weatherbyized" stock by the addition of the diamond shaped inlays.

Righty tighty, lefty loosey, taught to me by a master Gunsmith- Rob

The best part of the show is a show where kids are getting into guns.
There are not enough younger role models when it comes to guns. They are just told my the media to fear them and that bad people have them. The father is a bit over the top but we can never have enough gun shows. I hope kids ask their parents for guns for Christmas instead of the latest modern warfare video game. Hell I tried to take my 5 year old nephew to the range but they said he had to be at least 6.

chuckleheads

Gunsmoke is right in my hometown.
The show is a bit over the top, but I am inclined to think that it is at the behest of the producers. They need to put on a show after all.
One thing I must say is that Rich Wyatt is about the most enthusiastic and active proponent of responsible firearm ownership and Second Amendment rights that you will ever meet.

HMMMMM, but spot on Rob..

Any TV show about guns is a winner in my book! However, most of you are not answering my question. what do you think was the real reason for the screwed up chamber?-Rob

I've got a Ruger M77 7 mag stainless that I really want to rebbl to 458 win...

I didn't see the show but sounds close to what I wan't done wo difficulty...

If I have bbl company (prob pacnor) swap their bbl how much feed function work needs to be done???

Rails opened...feed ramp...follower???

Not trying to poach thread but may be trying to do this soon

Following the rebarrel and chambering, maybe some feed ramp work and rails optimized for the .458 win.. Box should work as is. You just have to make some dummies up with the bullets you want to use and see how it feeds. Follower, rails, ramp and spring all have to work together. The biggest issue is mounting open sights on the new barrel. If you contour the barrel like they did on American Guns you might want to watch how deep and where you drill the new holes for a sight island too.-Rob

Trophyhunter, I have a 22.5" barrel chambered in 458 Win mag already to go for a Ruger M77 MkII. I didn't have to do anything to my Ruger to get it feed the 458 rounds. It was originally a 338 Win mag though, but I don't think that makes any difference. Anyway, if you're interested let me know.

I thought I heard them say something about a bad reamer. I think they also said they got a new barrel AND a new reamer.

Thnks for replies...

Maybe selling some guns soon to fund 700...

I came across that Ruger in my safe and thought would make neat little beater in 458...but don't want to have mess with it too much...kinda defeats purpose of raising capital for new gun project...but whenever I'v got a new rifle in the works I start coming up with a 100 other projects I'd like to do...

Hopefully it would be like steph's and not require too much feed work...

Rob did American Guns go with light contour bbl???

Ed has got me converted to heavy contours for the most part just not ultra long like he likes...no ultra lights for me...

Prob go 20 -- 22.5" to keep ot short OAL...

Steph are you selling just bbl or complete rifle what finish...?

They did say they contoured the barrel and I have no idea what profile they used. They also said they had to replace both the barrel and the reamer. I've seen Reamers with chunks missing on a flute still cut good chambers. I also noticed they mounted a african sight Island and screwed it on. The looks of the case really bothered me. Kinda wrinked and buckled but just at the end of the case where the chamber ends. A bad reamer would leave a terrible looking chamber finish everywhere. I thought he over=loaded the reamer with chips and in that situation it would be easy to ring the chamber, but not cause what they found. They could have broken a flute too if they had alot of chatter. You'd think they would notice that though.
My best guess is that after contouring fitting and chambering they drilled the holes for the rear sight island in the wrong place( didn't think it through and account for the metal removed during the contouring and went too deep and hit the end of the chamber, maybe not all the way through just enough to buldge it. They may or may not have then tried to fix it with the reamer and broken a flute in the process. In any event it would account for the case looking as it did. You'd think he might feel some resistance to chambering but maybe not I've chambered a heck of a lot of guns and never saw anything like that ever! But then, I have much better tools than they do. So I'm very curious and this is my best explanation. Lets hear some other ideas!-Rob

Jeeeeze louise, this sounds like a Chineese air raid drill..Gun butcher 101...

Trophyhunter, I am selling just the barrel. It is blued steel without sights and with a barrel mounted recoil lug.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Jeeeeze louise, this sounds like a Chineese air raid drill..Gun butcher 101...