There can be failures of any bullet as no one bullet is perfect but we have seen consistently poor performance in the field with clients using Hornady bullets, usually loss of bullet integrity to include shedding jackets and cores and fragmentation.

Hornady never could make a proper DG bullet, bless their hearts!
Common knowledge since forever!
They need to license another make of DG bullet for their excellent brass, or do some R&D proper,
since they have expanded so greatly beyond bubba ammo for NA deer and varmints.
They certainly know how to make excellent target ammo.
Pitiful neglect of DG ammo!
Steve seems to be oblivious, like his bean counters.

quote:

for their excellent brass

As a consumer my issue is that it appears that Hornady could very well be ignoring or denying the possible problem. History shows that type of action is usually an indicator of a company on the way to decline.

quote:

as no one bullet is perfect

But you are so wrong there is one perfect bullet for everything.

http://forums.accuratereloadin...=728100262#728100262

Ive shot a lot of Buffalo and PG with HOrnady bullets. At one time some few years ago they had as good a solid as Ive ever seen..I have not used the GMX or the monolithic, but how could anyone ruin a monolithic solid..For all the complaints here, there are thousands of folks that are happy with HOrnadys..but Ive heard the same thing about Woodleighs, Noslers, and most of the best bullets in the world..

Thank goodness we have so many good bullets these days, I have not seen a failure in many years now..Ya should have been around in the 40s and early 50s if you wanted to see bullet failure..Funny thing about bullet failure fact or fiction not sure which but they mostly killed the animal in my experience..So much is relied on those pretty mushroom pictures that are so cherished...Even in the bad days those failures killed the animal or we wouldn't have known they were failures..A lot of failures are misread or there is more to the story than is reported...

If a 400 gr. soft or solid at 2125 FPS out of a 450-400 just penetrated inside the skin and stopped, I would seriously doubt that, but would be inclined to pull the rest of the bullets in that box, probably bad handloads or very short of powder, it makes no since to someone who has used that caliber for over 50 years.

Ray,

you should know by now to come to Boise to shop for components. Once you get over the shock of driving on paved roads and traffic lights it's a pretty fun place to spend a weekend.

GMX

Can you tell us about the shot, Dogleg?

caliber
muzzle velocity
what distance
game animal
where you found the bullet

.284
3500
150ish
moose
Far side hide.

That bullet would be hard to produce if one tried to do that. Amazing.

Do you remember what kind of presentation or lie the bullet was in?
was there any evidence of keyholing?

It's even curious that the moose retained the 'flat-nose solid-equivalent' bullet with negligible expansion, if moving at 3500fps.

Was there any possibility of a squibb load at 60% velocity?

Tumbling would do it. Not that there was any evidence of tumbling.

seems the only ones promoting or liking the hornady bullets are the ones paid by Hornady ...

The early Barnes monolithic X bullets would do that from time to time. They've come a long way with the TSX and TTSX bullets.

I use a few Barnes bullets. Don't even remember buying Hornady in any caliber. Never had a bullet failure. Only my own shooter error. But I use lots of Lake City for ammo. I resize brass to 358 winchester and drop two grains of powder in the load. I also shoot non 7.62 based calibers. No Hornady bullets there either.

medved,
What planet do you live on, you don't know that anyone on this thread gets paid to pimp Hornady bullets, and the gun writers on this blog would not make up stuff to get free bullets, I call you post juvenile and ignorant.

RAy ray sorry if you think im juvenile or ignorant but you lost me the day you badmouth the 458 win mag lol ... happy those days are gone and you changed your tune ...

and Ray just read again that thread for posterity and your good advices ...

http://forums.accuratereloadin...588/m/9871046141/p/1

for info i step my feet the first time in Africa in 89 and can prove it ....

I've used Hornady brass exclusively for my 9.3 X 62 when it was purchased in 2011. I'm very satisfied with it.

However, it should be noted that that brass is made by S&B, as a lot of components for handloading are made offshore.

It is the only "Hornady" brass I've ever used. But I bought a bag of 100 Remington .35 Whelen brass a few years ago that was improperly headspaced -- they wouldn't fire until fireformed by seating a bullet to the lands. My gunsmith tested the chamber of that rifle and it was on spec as to dimentions.

But I have used some Hornady Interloc bullets for animals from deer to moose and they worked as a non-premium is supposed to do their job. Not the best there is but better than most non-premium C&C bullets.

Early on I started using Nosler Partitions and Accubonds in my 9.3 X 62 and have never had an issue with those bullets in Hornady brass. But I did finish off a wounded black bear (that was wounded by a young apprentice) employing a 286 Hornady SP-RP at close range with an MV of 2400+ and the bullet entered behind the short ribs and exited the spine just in front of the cranium taking out 3-inches of vertebrae in the process. The bullet was never found and no fragments in the wound cavity -- so I guess it worked OK. Taking off the hide revealed a lot of damage. But I'd not push that bullet much faster than that, whereas my load for the 286 Nosler is over 2600. And I've killed a 6'bear with it at 68 yards. It was a frontal chest hit and the bullet fell out near the right hip in skinning. But evidence revealed it had tumbled but still retained 71% of initial weight -- typical Nosler performance.

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

Partitions were made so that the rear section would hold together and penetrate on close shots at high velocity and still expand out to 600 yards or so. Wonderful bullets, the 150g partition in 270 is a thing of beauty. For my 500 Jeffery, I've been using 570g TSX's but am about to switch to 570g A-Frames. Nothing wrong with the TSX's, I'm just old fashioned about these things ...

Chuck,

You should at least try some of the 450 grain GSC bullets now that they are available in the USA. It is truly an all-purpose bullet and it too is a design of beauty. If you want to go 'mod' you can try the 360 tipped CEB lever-Raptors. both of these bullets are extremely accurate and stretch the range of a .510" bore considerably.

I am surprised that any of my friends here actually use factory ammo for hunting.

And as for bullets, I would never use any bullet with lead in it, as long as I can use mono metal HP bullets.

I have used Swift A-Frames in the past, and all have lost the lead from the rear end.

Ones like the Trophy Bonded Bear Claws and ones made by Jensen, which have a solid copper shank, work much better.

quote:

Originally posted by Dogleg:
.284
3500
150ish
moose
Far side hide.

That speed with no expansion I'd expect a pass through. Something went horribly wrong.

Medved,
I just don't think you should group All gunwriters in one group or everyone that likes Hornady bullets in one group..end of story.

Just read this whole thread via the link. All I can say is WOW.

quote:

Originally posted by medved:
and Ray just read again that thread for posterity and your good advices ...

http://forums.accuratereloadin...588/m/9871046141/p/1

for info i step my feet the first time in Africa in 89 and can prove it ....

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
I have recently shot Hornady brass in my 300 H&H and no problems, and Ive shot Hornady bullets for years in almost every caliber without any problems??? No I dont't get freebies nor do I even know them other than Ive seen them at SCI...

I use quite a bit of their brass and bullets because they are the only whore in town these days in Idaho, other than Norma who are high dollar whores.

I have not use Hornadys in any caliber larger than my 300 H&H and .338 Win. however, but have used the bullets on elk and deer and PG..The interlock has always worked for me.

Mr. Atkinson, it looks like you contradict yourself here... Either you use it in "almost" every caliber, or you use it in .30 and .338.

Otherwise-

I have read too many issues with Hornady bullets to really feel comfortable with them in anything I that would put more stress on the bullet than a cup and core would tolerate.

I recall a bit about Hornady making the really good steel jacketed solids that were more or less the standard for solids for a time, and then they made some changes and all the sudden there were failures...yet they had never said anything to anyone about making a change until after the fact. The part number was the same, but the bullet was not.

You may feel that you are not adjusting what you say as an author or consultant or whatever... But too many writers have made statements about how great x, Y, or Z is, and then after the fact the product is a flop. It may be that they were given preproduction samples and the preproduction worked, and the production models didn't (which to me is a blanket condemnation of the business involved), but it has caused many to view the sporting press with a very jaundiced eye.

Personally, given this, I really get annoyed by the money spent on giving writers free hunts, ammo, guns, whatnot and then getting the price passed on to me in the product, when from my point of view there is no marginal value to the gunwriter's involvement.

If Ivan is getting monometal solids from Hornady, why is he advocating Hornady ammo on his show when that is not what he is using (DGS)?

I have had two experiences with Hornady ammo both of which were bad.
1)139grain SST factory load in 7X57 the accuracy was great the terminal performance was shocking. the whole front end of the deer I shot was turned to soup!!!
2).458Lott bought two boxes for brass as no brass was available at that time. 34 rounds had split necks on first firing.(the Norma brass it was replaced with is still going after 8 firings)
won't be buying anything else from them any time soon.

Oh hell, Ive done gone and pissed some more people off on the internet, and without even trying!

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:


If Ivan is getting monometal solids from Hornady, why is he advocating Hornady ammo on his show when that is not what he is using (DGS)?

If he is being paid to endorse Hornady, he has to use Hornady. You can't endorse a product you have never used, and you can't say a product is terrific if you don't think it is (which would be the obvious conclusion if he used some other bullet).

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advic...at-people-are-asking

I've never used their DGX ammo so I can't comment to that. However working with my friend at the SHOT show we had a whole bunch of people who had many failures in Africa with the DGX ammo. One guy said he had shot a bull Giraffe 4 times with his Lott. The PH put it down. The pictures he showed appeared to great shot placement but failed to penetrate. He said the PH told him it wasn't the first time Hornady ammo failed.
My buddy told me he has heard thousands of the same stories from guys from SHOT show or the SCI shows.

The 375 Ruger brass that I have bought has so far worked really well. I'm on my third firing with it so far and no signs of fatigue. The 6.5 Grendel brass didn't fair so well. I bought it loaded and was only able to get one loading on about 75% of the brass. The primer pockets were larger than the Lapua brass I have. The factory ammo was accurate I will give them that.

CRBUTLER,
I don't see a contridictions there?? but I will try to clear that up:

I have used Horndays in most caliber up to and including 300 H&H and 375 H&H and thinking back I have shot the 350 gr. RN Hornady in my 45-90 some years back. It was back then, the best bullet for elk I could find in the 45-90 or 45-70..As I recall it was an interlock, and they are great bullets today IMO.

Bullets take a lick'en on these threads, and I don't doubt the posters, as any bullet under certain circumstances can fail..but over all I have had excellent bullet performance with most of the old cup and core bullets and the new stuff as well..Actually the only bullet that Ive fail in the last 20 years was BarnesX, and that's on of the most popular bullets out there, and obviously performs to perfection to everyone you talk to..Would I use them today, I would and do. One thing Im sure of is the bullet makers today have done themselves proud. I don't get discounts, free bullets, wish I did!

Only used it for plains game. I was not impressed.

In all honesty, when I had the 500 NE ammo that was out of tolerance, I was very impressed with their customer service. However, their response to the ammo that would not fire was the polar opposite. They could have given less than a damn.

Think I'll start an orphanage for all that bad and undesirable Hornady dangerous game ammo--

Just pack it up and send it to me--
I'll make sure it gets a good home--

and you can move on with your lives and find another source of discomfort upon which to vent

Hornady, like SCI, does not come here to explain or defend themselves. I find that interesting.
Cal

I use the partitions for most of my hunting. Used Northforks in Africa. Use a lot of Hornady for practice because it is cheaper.

Dave

I experienced bullet failure with Hornaday rifled slug ammo two years ago. I had returned home to NY state and a doe had presented herself broadside at about 60 yards. I was using a rifled Ithaca 37 that was scoped and placed the cross hairs on her shoulder and squeezed one off. All hell broke loose and I was sure I missed her. I kept an eye on her and managed to drop her after a few rounds as she was on the run. When I skinned her out I found the first bullet I fired laying along her shoulder blade, very slightly bent at its nose. Needless to say I was less than impressed with the performance.
Steve

I watched an episode of Pigman this week. He pimps Hornady incessantly.

They have cameras set up around a feeder. It was interesting as one could see a film FACING the shooter. In other words,the camera was on the opposite side of the hog from the shooter. I thought that might interesting as we could see the bullet exit.

Well, Pigman shoots this boar hog with a 300 Win Mag. It was a big hog but not that big. He made a good shot and dropped the boar hog in its tracks. However, the bullet did not exit.

Pigman was hooting and hollering extolling the virtues of Hornady. With the failure to exit, I had to wonder.

With a close range high velocity hit I wouldn't expect an exit....with most bullets manufactured by anyone.

200 Yards?