http://www.hornady.com/story.php?s=759

http://www.hornady.com/images/2008_sell_sheets/450_Nitro.pdf

wadaya think?

ruger #1 on the way??? looks like it with that pic!

rechamber yer 45-70 #1's

______________________________________________
450 Nitro Express 3¼"
One of the greatest African cartridges ever developed.

Introduced by the John Rigby Company in 1898, the 450 Nitro Express 3¼" is the cartridge by which all other dangerous game cartridges were measured. Originally stoked with cordite and a 480 grain bullet, the original 450 Nitro Express ammo quickly replaced the massive 8, 6, and 4-bore black powder cartridges that were the standard of their day.

Hornady's new 450 Nitro Express 3¼" ammunition uses premium smokeless propellants to create a safe, accurate and affordable alternative to other dangerous game ammo on the market. Featuring a 480 grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 2,150 feet per second, Hornady's 450 NE offers two bullet styles to suit any dangerous game situation. The Dangerous Game Solid (DGS) is a non-expanding solid for deep penetration on the toughest, most dangerous animals in the world. And the 480 grain Dangerous Game eXpanding (DGX) expands to allow more energy to be transferred upon impact, while still delivering deep penetration and devastating wound cavities.

Hornady is manufacturing both bullets and cartridge cases in-house to the ultra tight tolerances that have made Hornady synonymous with successful Safaris. This in-house manufacture also ensures that there will be no shortage of this fine ammunition.

awesome...
i will now make my double a 450 ne 3.25, rather than 45/120 ,... if the dies are reasonable

Depends on what you mean by reasonable....they don't give them away...trust me .

Gary
DRSS
NRA Lifer
SCI
DSC

what is next??? 500/450?

Now, to get them to put a 26" barrel on the rifle!!

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

rcbs ---280 bucks for custom dies
hornady - sub 100 generally
then again, 45/120 rcbs dies for less than 50

Do you think this might be an indication that Ruger might bring out a No. 1 in 450 NE?

quote:

Originally posted by akriet:
Do you think this might be an indication that Ruger might bring out a No. 1 in 450 NE?

mucho si...

or pick up one in 45-70 and rechamber

This is great news for me, if Ruger puts out a #1 for it.

Thanks for the update, boom-dude. You need to drive up here this winter so we can go blasting @ five-dogs.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
what is next??? 500/450?

It's not over yet.

Guys, Hornady is doing a 30,000 square foot expansion to their plant here in Nebraska. Things must really be going well for them and I am assuming from this post that they are going to have a whole new line of "Dangerous Game" bullets. I hope there will be something in their line for my .404.

While I am not really on board with this whole .375 Ruger thing, this Ruger/Hornaday partnership is doing great things for us. First, the .375 Ruger and the 9,3X74. Then the 450/400 3" and now this! Wow! I may never be able to afford a double rifle but a No.1 in 450/400 is looking pretty cool right now.

Dave

I'd be willing to bet there will be a 450/400 3 1/4.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
I'd be willing to bet there will be a 450/400 3 1/4.

or just neck the brass down...

Sounds like good news from Hornady, but before we all rush out and rechamber our #1 Rugers, I believe it will require a barrel set back due to the thin rim on the 450x31/4 NE . The 45x31/4 (45x120) Sharps however has a rim similar to the 45/70, and should I think be a more easy conversion. The sharps ctg. should handle N.E. loads ok I think. Just my two cents worth. Looks like my lyman 45/70 #1 with it's heavy - long-barrel is in line for a rechamber. I do love the way those long rounds go "thunk" as the drop in the chamber. Cheers, Luke

This is a somewhat OT question but what are the US regulations on taking ammunition out of the country? The reason I am asking this question is that many of my friends in India have 450-400, 400 NE and other rifles from the Raj era for which ammunition has been a major problem so far. And, while India bans the import of guns by resident Indians, the import of ammunition is permitted depending upon a gun owner's license. An Indian citizen can buy ammunition anywhere in the world subject to local laws to take back with him and all that is needed in India is his gun license.

What I am not sure about is what the laws in the US are for taking ammunition out, hence this question. Several Indian match shooters get their ammunition from Gehmann in Germany because they seem best geared for this kind of thing, but a lot more Indians visit the US than any other country with the possible exception of the UK and prices here are very attractive compared to any other country in the world.

Thanks for this information in advance. It would be useful to a number of my friends who own nice old guns in India and who travel to the US often.

And just as I am about to order a 450 Nitro barrel for my TC Encore from SSK Industries...

I wonder when the Hornady brass will be available and at what price...

I heard from a friend of mine who is working abit for Hornady that Ruger will chamber some of the Nr 1 Tropical rifles in .450 NE.

Ihave a custom .450 NE and its a fine rifle, nearly .460 wby levels in energy with it, and it`s very rugged rifle and load. Next plan is 550 or 600 grain bullets to try them out in the ruger.

quote:

Hornady's new 450 Nitro Express 3¼" ammunition uses premium smokeless propellants to create a safe, accurate and affordable alternative to other dangerous game ammo on the market. Featuring a 480 grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 2,150 feet per second, Hornady's 450 NE offers two bullet styles to suit any dangerous game situation.

I'm interested in the .458" 480 gr bullet as a future component available for handloading. That seems like it would be a good one to try in my new (not completed yet) .458 Win Mag rifle.

-Bob F.

Hornady is not to quick to get their new brass onto the street...thats for sure. I waited quite a while for the 450/400 brass and only got 50 pcs. from a guy on gunbroker, and is likely I got that by some kind of mistake because the lady from Hornady told me all brass currently being produced is going for their own loaded ammo and brass to the street won't be available for some time. She must be right because I can't find any more anywhere. As far as the dies go, she could not even speculate when they might be available to buy. I wish Hornady would get their heads out of their asses and ramp this stuff up if they are going to advertise it...otherwise, wait until your ready to serve the public properly. Thats like going to a new pizza parlor and getting it delivered without cheese...because they don't have peope to put it on.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
what is next??? 500/450?

Easy to figure out if you stop and think about it.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

well 450/400 3 1/4" would be easy...

500/450 is cool though

quote:

Originally posted by Woodrow S:
Hornady is not to quick to get their new brass onto the street...thats for sure. I waited quite a while for the 450/400 brass and only got 50 pcs. from a guy on gunbroker, and is likely I got that by some kind of mistake because the lady from Hornady told me all brass currently being produced is going for their own loaded ammo and brass to the street won't be available for some time. She must be right because I can't find any more anywhere. As far as the dies go, she could not even speculate when they might be available to buy. I wish Hornady would get their heads out of their asses and ramp this stuff up if they are going to advertise it...otherwise, wait until your ready to serve the public properly. Thats like going to a new pizza parlor and getting it delivered without cheese...because they don't have peope to put it on.

That's pretty profound ignorance of the challenges they faced in getting this ammo to market. There's always some you can't please no matter how hard you try.
----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

a call to the custom die shop, a talk with lonnie, and exchanging some greenbacks will result in a set of dies in less than 6 weeks, at a reasonable cost.

that the "little guy" is a tad far down the DISTRIBUTION food chain is understandable, aint it?

Hell, I guess I could jump up and down and whine that there aint a box of 600gr .510 bullets in the states for sale... .. oh, wait, I buy 6 to 10 boxes a year, i don't even show up on woodlieghs radar

quote:

Originally posted by BFaucett:

quote:

Hornady's new 450 Nitro Express 3¼" ammunition uses premium smokeless propellants to create a safe, accurate and affordable alternative to other dangerous game ammo on the market. Featuring a 480 grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 2,150 feet per second, Hornady's 450 NE offers two bullet styles to suit any dangerous game situation.

I'm interested in the .458" 480 gr bullet as a future component available for handloading. That seems like it would be a good one to try in my new (not completed yet) .458 Win Mag rifle.

-Bob F.

Likely the cannelure will be in the wrong place for the 458wm, as it is on the 480gr Woodleigh. (Too far forward with too much bullet in the 458wm case) You can get more powder in the case with a 500gr Woodleigh than a 480gr Woodleigh. But you don't need to stuff the 500 for, say, 2150fps.

My bet is the 480gr Hornaday is set up for the 450NE's, as it should be.

JPK

Ruger is just as busy as Hornady and they got the rifle to me months before ammo was available and many months, who knows how long, until components become available...and this was a joint effort. Perhaps I am a little anxious to shoot a rifle I paid good money for, hell I guess I'm like everyone else...I want it yesterday. Jeffe, thanks for the advice on the custom shop for the dies and I'll call Lonnie and get them ordered.

Simply great but the bullets seem to be simple interlocks or something like that.

Flat nosed solids would be fine and tough softpoints, too.


I like my .450 N.E. 3,25!

quote:

Originally posted by Woodrow S:
Ruger is just as busy as Hornady and they got the rifle to me months before ammo was available and many months, who knows how long, until components become available...and this was a joint effort.

...and an American company making a rifle isn't anything like making ammunition that's going to be exported globally, and actually be examined and pressure tested by foreign government proof houses before it can legally be sold - that's one of the differences between SAAMI and CIP (industry standards vs law). Back in April or May, after 94 years of the same specifications for the cartridge, out of the clear blue Germany proposed dimensional changes for the .450/.400 3" (which is standardized only by CIP, never by SAAMI) to CIP. That threw everybody with .450/.400 projects (Hornady, Heym, Krieghoff, etc., as well as other commercial loaders of the cartridge such as Kynoch and Wolfgang Romey) back to "hurry up and wait". What did you expect them to do - manufacture ammo that's illegal to export? CIP shocked everyone by accepting the proposed changes in July. I saw some of Hornady's factory ammo in September or October, so they got it out pretty quickly.

If you were in that much of a hurry, ammo from Kynoch and Romey has long been available in the US, as has brass and bullets. Dies are easily available from Huntingtons or direct from RCBS.
----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

A few points to ponder....at least I'm looking to get some answers. I've been reading these posts with interest as I use a 500-450 dbl...not for just dangerous game but for elk as well. And given the chance I
'd use it for deer or pigs or whatever. The reason primarily is that I'm a fan of Teddy R. and his favorite caliber was the 500-450. And I get a lot of jokes around the camp with this rifle...all in good fun.

I use the dbl. because of the fun of carrying one and shooting it. I take it that the reason is the same for anyone who would own a single shot of similar caliber for hunting but...... a single is IMO NOT FOR DANEROUS GAME. Granted I've never been around to shoot a single but would think it's going to be not as quick as a bolt action in getting another round into the chamber. Not to mention you have to take your eyes off game to load a single shot.

So Ruger has this 450 out and there is absolutely no reason to come out with a 500-450.....to me they are one and the same. I don't have a new 450 to measure against the 500-450. So your thoughts would be appreciated.

quote:

Originally posted by idahochukar2:

A few points to ponder....at least I'm looking to get some answers. I've been reading these posts with interest as I use a 500-450 dbl...not for just dangerous game but for elk as well. And given the chance I
'd use it for deer or pigs or whatever. The reason primarily is that I'm a fan of Teddy R. and his favorite caliber was the 500-450. And I get a lot of jokes around the camp with this rifle...all in good fun.

I use the dbl. because of the fun of carrying one and shooting it. I take it that the reason is the same for anyone who would own a single shot of similar caliber for hunting but...... a single is IMO NOT FOR DANEROUS GAME. Granted I've never been around to shoot a single but would think it's going to be not as quick as a bolt action in getting another round into the chamber. Not to mention you have to take your eyes off game to load a single shot.

So Ruger has this 450 out and there is absolutely no reason to come out with a 500-450.....to me they are one and the same. I don't have a new 450 to measure against the 500-450. So your thoughts would be appreciated.

I'm not sure of your question regarding comparing the 500/450 to the 450NE 3 1/4" but the 500/450 is based on the 500 case, as are the 450/465, 470 and 500. The 450NE 3 1/4" is based on the 450 case. So you cannot form brass from one to make the other.

JPK

OK, I'll put it another way. Other than the fun of shooting a round that's most often found in a dangerous game rifle, why would you use a single shot other than just the fun of owning a rifle that is a big bore. By the original concept or purpose of a big bore, one would be handicapped with a single shot if hunting truly big dangerous game. More than one round being fired quickly is the point, even with a slower magazine rifle.

#2 There is so little difference in performance b/t the performance of the 500-450 and the 450 why would Ruger or any company come out with a 500-450 when the 450 is already there?

Mehul,

As I understand it, you can buy ammunition while here in the United States, put it in your checked baggage, declare to the airline ticket agent that you have ammunition in your bag, and do the same when you take the bag to TSA for x-ray before you go to the departure gate. Limitation by IATA rule is 5 kg (11 lbs) and properly packed.

My guess is you will need a license to bring it into any country on the sub-continent and may need to organize something in advance...

Regards, Tim

Tim,

The problem that I am concerned about is what kind of ID etc would be required for my friends who come from India to buy ammunition to take back and what the laws and regulations pertaining to this would be. They would have the Indian end covered because they would bring their licenses along with them (and an Indian gun license lists the quantity of ammunition the license holder can buy at a time) but I have no idea what they would need here, as they would be foreigners visiting the US on L1 or B1 visas, or, in some cases, even tourist visas.

What I want to know is what kind of ID they would have to show, what the rules would be for them as foreigners to check the ammunition in as unaccompanied baggage etc.

Ammunition of all kinds is so inexpensive in the US that those who travel here could save a ton of money if they bought what their quotas were every time they visited here. In India, for example, one round of 22 lr ammunition manufactured by the Indian Ordnance Factory (the worst crap made anywhere on earth) costs the equivalent of $ 1 US at today's prices and 1 shotshell would cost approximately $ 2 to 3.

Most of my friends in India are keen shooters and gun owners and that is why I posted this question here.

Thanks for any information in advance and good hunting!

quote:

Originally posted by idahochukar2:
OK, I'll put it another way. Other than the fun of shooting a round that's most often found in a dangerous game rifle, why would you use a single shot other than just the fun of owning a rifle that is a big bore. By the original concept or purpose of a big bore, one would be handicapped with a single shot if hunting truly big dangerous game. More than one round being fired quickly is the point, even with a slower magazine rifle.

#2 There is so little difference in performance b/t the performance of the 500-450 and the 450 why would Ruger or any company come out with a 500-450 when the 450 is already there?

Well, I sure did misunderstand your post.

In the past, many single shot NE rifles found there way to Africa and saw use on all sorts of game, including DG. I think the double rifle and the bolt ended up dominating because of the availability of more than one shot, as you suggest. And ultimately the bolt because it is much cheaper.

Unless Hornaday plans to bring out the 470, the 500/450 and 500 have no chance. But if Hornaday does decide to bring out the 470 then, since the basic case is the same, there is hope for the 500/450 and the 500. I'd have to guess that the 500 would come first. Not a whole lot of 500/450's around since in 1905? the Brits made the 450's illegal in India. Since the 500/450 was a proprietary cartridge of H&H, with few built by other makers, not too many were built compared to 450NE's, and H&H went to the 500/465 when the Brits outlawed the 450's in India. But the existance of basic cheap, good, readily available 500 basic cases would make the 500/450 easier to load for.

My 2 cents,

JPK

....I think it would make an amazeing light little LOW PRESSURE bear stopper in the 45/70 # 1.....But I mainly want the 480 gr bullets to buy as components to load for my win mag , lott , and 460 if and when I build one ...I have always wanted to use 480 gr bullets .. I don,t see much advantage to the 510 gr.......One of those little stainless #1s in 45/70 . essespecially if you could still shoot 45/70 in it after haveing the chamber reamed to 450 3 1/4 " ...That would be the Special loading

Thanks JPK,

We're running on the same tracks. BTW, I used to own a Hollis in 500-465 which was not to my likening at all. Not balanced worth a damn....extremely muzzle heavy and very awkard to shoot and/or carry.

I also didn't see any difference shooting wise b/t the two recoils....very redundant.

Thanks again.

quote:

Originally posted by mehulkamdar:
Tim,

The problem that I am concerned about is what kind of ID etc would be required for my friends who come from India to buy ammunition to take back and what the laws and regulations pertaining to this would be. They would have the Indian end covered because they would bring their licenses along with them (and an Indian gun license lists the quantity of ammunition the license holder can buy at a time) but I have no idea what they would need here, as they would be foreigners visiting the US on L1 or B1 visas, or, in some cases, even tourist visas.

What I want to know is what kind of ID they would have to show, what the rules would be for them as foreigners to check the ammunition in as unaccompanied baggage etc.

Ammunition of all kinds is so inexpensive in the US that those who travel here could save a ton of money if they bought what their quotas were every time they visited here. In India, for example, one round of 22 lr ammunition manufactured by the Indian Ordnance Factory (the worst crap made anywhere on earth) costs the equivalent of $ 1 US at today's prices and 1 shotshell would cost approximately $ 2 to 3.

Most of my friends in India are keen shooters and gun owners and that is why I posted this question here.

Thanks for any information in advance and good hunting!

Mehul,

Chatted with the State Dept Bureau of Political Military Affairs and have sent you a PM with answers.

Regards, Tim

Thanks, Tim,

Just replied to your PM. The information would be very helpful to my friends.

Good hunting!