I read these two articles and thought they were pretty good. I do not own a big bore rife but was hoping to get the thought on the rifles picked by those who do.
The Top Cartridge Of The Last Century
12 Key Rifle Cartridges

Question:
Who's article do you agree with more on the big bores? If you feel your choice better please tell me why?

Choices:
Chuck Hawks (.416 Rigby & .45-70 Gov)
Layne Simpson (.375H&H & .458 Win)
Your Own Personal Favorite

 

Although Simpson got the date of the .375H&H's introduction wrong (it came out in 1912), I agree with his two choices.

While the .416 Rigby is a fine round, Hawks' selection of the .45-70 disqualifies the tandem.

George

My vote is based solely on the usefulness of the 45-70 which I consider not to be a DG cartridge but as a fun round and more a cowboy round or even a toy for the masses.

Not that it's not useful for many hunting tasks but that it just isn't in the same league as the 375 H&H, 458 Win, or 416 Rigby.....

I think for big bores you really can't go wrong with any of the 3 (375H&H/416 Rigby/458 Win Mag). They are essentially the caliber standard by which all others are judged. I would feel confident with any of the three calibers in my hand and not think twice about my decision.

375/300 @ 2600
416/400 @ 2400
458/500 @ 2150

Has been the recipe for success for years.

quote:

Although Simpson got the date of the .375H&H's introduction wrong (it came out in 1912), I agree with his two choices.

While the .416 Rigby is a fine round, Hawks' selection of the .45-70 disqualifies the tandem.

George

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
My vote is based solely on the usefulness of the 45-70 which I consider not to be a DG cartridge but as a fun round and more a cowboy round or even a toy for the masses.

....

The 375 H&H's date of release was not the only mistake in this poll, the 45-70 didn't come out in the last certury at all, but was introduced in 1873, and was discontinued in all factory rifles by about 1920. The big thing that brought it back was the popularity of the COWBOY SHOOTING GAMES. Marlin was the first to bring out a factory rifle for the 45-70 in modern times, and it wasn't too popular till the COWBOY thing. I've always had a couple of rifle so chambered, but they were simply play guns to me!

The 404, and 416 Rigby should have been in the 375H&H-458 Win Mag group! Anyway I voted for the 375H&H group, as the best big bore spread for the 20th century!

I don't think that highly or either author.

If you don't have much big bore experience, the 375 H&H is a fine choice due to mild recoil.

If you want the ultimate in a dangerous game hunting round balacning out shootability and power, the 40 caliber is king.

If you like to experiment with various loads from sedate to attention getting and like reasaonbly priced components, you cannot beat the 458 Lott.

I voted for the Simpson article because the .45-70 doesn't fit the dangerous game bill in a lever action design. The.416 Rigby of course is legendary.

While the .500 Nitro is not of the last century I would prefer a .500 Nitro double & .375 Weatherby bolt.

Buliwyf

I voted for me 375 H&H and 458 Lott.

a 45-70 and 458 lott...hunt the world! keep it simple

I get two rifles to hunt the world with:

1. Searcy Best Grade .500 3" Nitro Express. If it bleeds the old 500 has killed it, usually with one shot.
Like Dial Deodorant Soap...takes the worry out of being close Like American Express...don't leave hunting
camp without it.

2. That gorgeous Searcy/Dowtin 375H&H in the clasifieds. Erotica...in steel and walnut.

There, I got all my Christmas fantasizing done in one building...at one time.

Rich
DRSS

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
a 45-70 and 458 lott...hunt the world! keep it simple

The only thing simple about the 45-70 is it's ability to shoot farther than an arrow.....but not much.

arrow + deer...70 yards max
45-70 + deer...250 yards max (95% of deer range)

My personal combination choice would be .375 H&H and .404 Jeffery. If forced to choose between Hawkes and Simpson I would vote for Layne.

Layne was off a little bit alright, 1912 not 1925!

He was not so bad on the cartridge selections.

I would pick a .375 Weatherby and a .458 Lott. That way I could swipe Layne's ammo in a pinch, and still out perform him if MY ammo was available, i.e. not lost in transit.

375H&H and 458Lott

Keith

Man there are some 45-70 haters here.

For me I am thinking the 375 ruger and the 45-70 will be my big bores for nasty stuff. (nothing nastier than brown bears anyway).

Looking forward to the ruger african when it comes out. Would prefer a more weather resistant rifle but won't go to a 20" barrel to get it.

I think my next 45-70 will be the marlin xtr.

quote:

Originally posted by RMiller:
Man there are some 45-70 haters here.

Not really, 45-70 is not a Big Bore, it just has a big hole in the barrel. I do not hate the 45-70, I have had an 1881 Marlin, a Ballard #5 Pacific (Pre 1884), and a 1895 Marlin. I still have a Davidson's, Limited Ediition III, octagon carbine/short rifle. It is just fine for shooting pigs. Anything big and mean gets the 458 Lott. Later on my 375 H&H will be finished and may get the nod.

Keith

guys that downgrade the 45-70 have never had a strong actioned rifle to work with...my old Siamese Mauser would stand there with just about anything.
416 Rigby, 400gr bullet a 2400fps...45-70SM, 405gr bullet at 2300fps...26" barrel. Give me some of the 450gr bullets the .458" boys rave about here in a 458WM, and watch how close I get in the old 45-70.

regards,

Rich DRSS

I found the 45-70 to be plenty big bore.

I shot the 400 at 2000 fps which is plenty for anything on this continent.

According to all the brown bear that get killed around here every year with the 45/70 ....Most very authoratativly......Even tho it doesn,t have the seemingly requisit 2 tons muzzel energy its a big bore.......I think the 416 rigby provides a good action for its owner to have rebarreled to the 416 whby round with a 10-12 " twistBetter preformance and by the time you shoot a thousand rounds you made up the cost difference in the brass.....

Pieter Olivier's rating in order of preference:

1) 9,3 x 62 mm
2) 9,3 x 62 mm
3) 9,3 x 62 mm


He would not discuss it with me any further.

Chris

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
arrow + deer...70 yards max
45-70 + deer...250 yards max (95% of deer range)

Not a thing wrong with the 45/70, in it's place. Let' chat about the "normal" 45/70 for a second.. marlin lever gun, iron sights, 18-24" barrel, very light weight gun is one. ruger #1 or #3 is another.

marlin safe loads are certainly good enough for anything in north america, to 150 yards or so, even.

rugre #1/#3 loads can be loaded very much higher, and might add another 50 yards, with scope, to the effective range.

in an enfield or siammese mauser, it no longer shares anthing with the 45/70 except the case.

So, for what you can buy off the shelf kind of things, the 45/70 is a big hole in the barrel, and works very well, inside it's envelope.

However, it is not a DGR, which is what most of us in bigbores mentally shorthand a big bore to. For example, the 50BMG is a bigger bore, and has it's own forum, as it's NOT a DGR or, in most utility, a staking/hunting/canoe gun... works GREAT from a stand though!!

416 rigby and 458 lott are probably the best factory stuff.

the 470mbogo, without a doubt, is the best practical hunting big bore... the 470AR is his little brother

the 550magnum makes all other stopping rifles obsolete

jeffe

"Which left an opening for the venerable .45-70 to round out our dozen cartridges. The oldest rifle cartridge still regularly produced, the .45-70 is just about ideal for woods or brush country hunting of heavy game and the big predators. The .45-70 is the most popular big bore caliber according to the readers of Guns and Shooting Online and is simply too good to leave out."
By Chuck Hawks

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He simply states that it is ideal for heavy game and large predators.

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416 rigby and 458 lott are probably the best factory stuff.

the 470mbogo, without a doubt, is the best practical hunting big bore... the 470AR is his little brother

the 550magnum makes all other stopping rifles obsolete

Or you could just get a 375 and be done with it. (referring to Saeeds use of the 375 caliber).


Noone made any mention for the 45-70 to be used in africa. That is why the 416 rigby is listed.

I simply believe that the 45-70 is a big bore. And that a cartridge does not have to an elephant round to be a big bore.