Naki,

Was wondering if you had considered using the GS Custom projectiles for your Rigby?

Regards,

Michael.

No. I have enough options now that I have CEB, TSX, Banded solids & Woodleigh.

I was at the range today & shot 18 rounds - 3 groups of 5 shots at 50 meters - off hand. One group was 4 inches & the other two were bigger. All were 400 gr Hronady at about 2350 fps.

I also shot a 3 shot group at 25 meters - 3 inch group.

What I am finding is that most of my shots are low - about 6 inches lower than when I use sticks.

I would appreciate any comments from the more experienced people about shooting a large bore off hand. Is it common to pull shots down because of the weight of the rifle, recoil etc.

Are you adjusting your stance until you achieve a natural point of aim?

Tanks - I do not understand your question. I take a balanced stance leaning into the shot and allowing the recoil to rock me back so that I move with the rifle.

Naki, I take it you are now doing all your shooting with the scope on?
Where did you end up with shooting a 400gr over the iron sights?
Are you loading to iron sight POI and adjusting your scope to the same POI with the same load.

What I did when I acquired my 404, was to get it shooting into a 2" bull at 50m over iron sights with the factory ammo that came with the rifle, 400 gr solid and soft, both at advertised 2225-2245fps muzzle velocity. This gave me my fixed reference point for reloading using the iron sights, a single point green dot sight and then the 2x Leupold scope I eventually fitted (started at 25m to get close while adjusting the open sights, needed to make a higher front sight blade).

When handloading with a 400gr RWS Solid I worked up charges until I got the same POI as factory with the iron sights, same thing with some 347gr SP projectiles I acquired. Then with the same loads set my single point sight, succeeded by the scope, to the same POI. Likewise when loading cast, the heavier loads around 1800fps hit close enough to the 'factory' POI and even the squib loads are just a little low at the bottom of the bull at 50m.

Nowadays I shoot off a bipod at the range hold holding the fore-end as I would when using a pack or a rest in the field or off my knees, a favourite of mine. I have never shot my 404 at 100m at the range but I come away from the range satisfied that the rifle, ammo and scope all do their part to group well at 50m (when I do my bit). If the rifle groups well at 50m it will at a 100m and for me has done so on animals too. I have rarely practiced shooting off hand with any rifle but I have been very successful over all my years of hunting shooting off hand with a very good success rate on running game. I have often said that IMHO 90% of good shooting is having 100% faith in your gun, ammo and grouping at the range on a target. The other 10% in the field is something you don't have a whole lot of control over as it will be the luck of the environment, the animal and you on the day.

My thoughts on why you are shooting low offhand is likely through differences in how you grip the fore-end and maybe anticipation of the recoil is causing you to pull down on the fore-end?

Thanks mate. Great tips.

I agree with your last comment about shooting low. My thoughts exactly. I guess I need to make a conscious effort to not pull down but pull into my shoulder.

Your other points are appreciated very much.

Thanks once again.

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:
Thanks mate. Great tips.

I agree with your last comment about shooting low. My thoughts exactly. I guess I need to make a conscious effort to not pull down but pull into my shoulder.

Your other points are appreciated very much.

Thanks once again.

Time will fly for you now with September coming up before you know it I am positive that you will get it all sorted and head off to Africa with the skills and positive attitude to have a successful safari, to my great envy but I will toast your success

Here is a photo of my ammo slip & belt I got custom made by Les Matheson. Thanks to Ozhunter for the lead.

I have not got it in my hands yet. This if for he 416Rigby. I am having 2 made for each caliber. The other pair will be for the 9.3X62.

I thought the bottom corners are a bit sharp and may dig into my groin or thigh & so I have asked Les to round them off a bit.

Nice,

I would also be tempted to turn it upside-down on the belt and see which way worked best for me, for comfort and function.

Got the belt & 1 slip in hand & I am very happy with the quality & look. Feels comfortable to wear.


Waiting for the rest ..... & then off to the range.

The rifle is all set to hunt with - 3 loads in one composite group at 50 meters off sticks.

Similar group at 100 meters off the bench - 2 inches high.

The strange thing is that at 200 meters off the bench it is 8" low with the TSX doing 2700+ fps! That is not what the books tell me.

Why is it? Am I holding low with the 5X scope & fine cross hairs?

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:
Got the belt & 1 slip in hand & I am very happy with the quality & look. Feels comfortable to wear.


Waiting for the rest ..... & then off to the range.

Naki

Are you left handed?


If not i would recommend switching your ammo carrier to your right side

I am right handed and that first photo was just a quick one in front of the mirror! You can actually see part of the mobile phone.

I will have the solids on the left side.

Gotcha--

My PH had me plan on follow up shots as solids--

so I put them right side--

but there is no one answer--if it works for you go for it.

I know you are close to departure date--hope you have a great hunt

I am now set up for CEB Raptor 325 gr & Solids 350 gr for less than 100 meters. I also have TSX 350gr for longer shots on PG - all of them shoot to same POA at 100 meters.

All of them are loaded to around 2700 fps & should work like solids in terms of penetration.

Yes I leave on the 19th but yet to finalise some arrangement!

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:


The rifle is all set to hunt with - 3 loads in one composite group at 50 meters off sticks.

Similar group at 100 meters off the bench - 2 inches high.

The strange thing is that at 200 meters off the bench it is 8" low with the TSX doing 2700+ fps! That is not what the books tell me.

Why is it? Am I holding low with the 5X scope & fine cross hairs?

You should probably get out to the range, discover, and fix whatever is going on.
A bullet that is 2" high at 100meters does not drop to -8" at 200meters, unless it is going very slow.

If these are different bullets, then they are leaving the barrel at different speeds and nodes of barrel whip. If different shooting set up then one of the setups is probably bouncing high off of a hard surface.

Speaking of shooting odd sticks, was watching a hunting show yesterday and the "show host" was shooting off sticks at about 150 yds with the barrel resting solidly in the "V" of the stick and the forend just short of but not touching the sticks.

Seemed very odd to me as I was taught hand on forend with backside of hand against any rest or forend against the rest but never never rest the barrel against anything...

Thoughts?

Tanzan

All the bullets are around 2700 fps.

I have been focusing on 50 meters and 100 meters as this will the key range for buffalo & most other game.

I checked it at 200 meters only with the TSX (BC 0.340) just to see how it shot. The lower BC in the CEB will make it drop even more.

My 9.3X62 is zeroed at 200 meters with 250 gr TSX and it shoots 1 inch groups at 100 meters - 2" high.

Jim - yes I would never rest my barrel or the fore-end directly on a hard object. The shot will definitely go high by up to 12 inches!

Naki,

I think that you need to reshoot your 200 meter/yard range. Something is not right, something is not being accounted for, and you don't want to discover that when presented with a beautiful, meat on the table, 200 meter, rock-solid rest, completely open shot on a big, comfortable bull buffalo, minding his own business, unalarmed, but 200 yards from the nearest cover. (Yes, that situation can happen, though rare.)

Ditto for hartebeest. An 8" drop versus a 0" drop is simply too much of an unknown for a shot at 200 meters, where the steadiness of the rest, a little breeze, and distance estimation will only add uncertainty to the shot. Now is the time to remove that 8" drop from the equation.

This can be rectified with one or two range sessions, probably 10 shots or under, each session. This is a desideratum, a must do.

First, reshoot the 200 meter distance to verify the drop. At 2700fps and 2" high/100, the TSX should only average about a -1.5" drop. From a bench and soft forearm rest, your group should be within a 0" to -3" vertical, about the same horizontal, or slightly wider if shot with a little breeze.

quote:

My 9.3X62 is zeroed at 200 meters with 250 gr TSX and it shoots 1 inch groups at 100 meters - 2" high.

That is approximately what your 416 rifle needs to do, and it will, if your are shooting TSX at 2700fps with a 2.7" high zero at 100. With a more recommended 2" high at 100 yards, 2.1"/100meters, your 220 yard/200 meter drop will be about -1.5".

The distance and conditions at which a 4"-8" group can be shot is probably a good maximum limit for any buffalo shooting. for most, that would limit offhand shooting somewhere between 40-100yards. Less, if out of breath and excited. That's one of the reasons why PH's ask hunters to shoot from sticks.

Thanks Mate. I'll have to do another session. My friend with the farm has gone on a holiday & wont be back before I leave. I'll have to make other arrangements for a range session.