quote:

Originally posted by Bent Fossdal:
Hey boom,
Either you bring back the original with .408's and rebated rim, or you make a brand new wildcat. Can't make a cat and call it original, just because it recembles. But the cat is a good one, by all means.

wellllll you have a point there but i think it needs a little tinkering. i dont like rebates nor do guns

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Boom,
When you get a reamer made let me know.

the great thing is reamers are already there...

just grind off the rim and regrind the front.

Boom

Why don't you build it? You spend so much time here dreaming of work for others, why not buld it yourself?

Alf

Very interesting pictures and discovery. Any more info on the rifle? A Rigby? I wonder why a Rigby?

Similiar to the original 600NE that would appear to have been made 3 years before Jeffery records indicate.

/

Could 45 acp bullets be swaged down to use in a .423" .404 Jeffery?

So ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,The 10.75x73 Nitro Express,, should become what length????? And use what diameter bullet???Is it supposed to become a 450/400 but in a bolt rifle or will it use .423 bullets.......Why hasn,t anyone glaumed onto the 10.75x68 any way.... When was It invented... Now that brass is available for it... I would like to get an original Mauser and see if it will jam on me.......Boom ,, I think you should side step the 470 and build the 395.... The 395 Belted Scout Cartridge......Barring that,, the 395 RUSTICK

mickey 1

i would love to...

i have a few rifle irons in the fire i have to finish first

i have thought about this idea over the holiday and thought there is no reason to give it a rebate unless you are trying to save money on a bolt face mod. giving it a .532 vs .544 (there is reeeeely no point in going under .532) is only 12 thou ond not worth quibbling over and anyone who might build one can either do a rebate trying to go with the spirit of the "original d.g. bolt gun" or not to enhance rock solid feeding. the issue over neck length is negligable too. it is the diff. of a 375 h+h action or a 416 rigby length action though and a matter of prefference.

to me the main issues are using the original case/ case shape and bullet dia. if someone wants to do a rigby length one and a rebate...go for it and good onya

i would have to call my version the 400 jeffery s.i. (slightly improved )

i could live with a slight rebate but "i" would limit the length of brass to 2.85" to keep it in a smaller action.

so a handfull of hours on a lathe for a lifetime of brass

use a slightly altered 450/400 reamer

use a 375 h+h or a rigby length action

a new barrel and the usual tinkerings and you will have the original d.g. bolt gun and a heck of a versitile one at that.

now that we found out it is an actual historical cart (thank you alf!) it is no longer a wildcat but a snooty monocular pith helmet wearin' honest to goodness throwback to the dark continent days cartridge

can anyone spare a 450/400 case so i can make a dummy round to post? i will be happy to reimburse the cost..

here is my photoshop version of an unrebated 2.85" version or 400 jeffery rimless rebateless

so i went to bed early and i woke up early...i was up at 5am just sitting there in bed and my thoughts wandered to the 400 jeffery. i had an epiphany about making the brass or in other words a
D'OH! moment...

actualy several small D'OH's...

yes turning a few hundred 450/400 cases can be burdensome...to ease this i think the best way and help me if i am wrong is to take stamped or prefferably unstamped 375 rum brass, expand to 416 or 423, do the fl sizing die of the 450/400 and either trim at 2.85" or shoot it till the brass stretches enough to 2.9"ish or the desired length. this will only work for those who would want the rebate and easy cheap good strong brass. the hornady 450/400 brass could be used for hunting overseas where headstamp issues apply.

soooooooooo the longer version could be made by rebarreling a 550 cz with a 532 boltface and the 2.85" can be done on any cheaper used ultra mag action ect.

this should satisfy the extended pinky crowd as well as the hillbilly bolt trash.

any thoughts?

Boom, to much pondering!

Man, if I vere to make this, I would make it as practical as possibly. Forget original measurements - the original has a rebate almost as bad as the .425WR, and is unnessesary long anyway.

I'd go with the .411 bullet, since that is your wish, but also because the bullet selection is so much better for the velosity this cartridge will give.

So, trim off that rim with no rebate. Shorten it so much that you can use a RUM length action, you will still have an almost caliber neck.
This means grinding of reamer, die-set can be used as it is, but you might have to trim the inside of the neck, because of the larger diameter bullet.

No free lunch, but what is?

Like I said, let me know when they are ready.

A stupid question perhaps and totally off topic. I read above of cutting extractor grooves, removing rims etc etc... on an existing case ... that's fair enough. In custom rifles we alter magazine boxes or fit aftermarket boxes, we alter receivers and feed rails, open bolt faces, modify extractors etc etc ... so why why why is it so damn impossible to built a bolt rifle that will reliably feed a rimmed case????? The Brits and US once mass produced them (No4 Enfield and P14s) ... the M98 could in the Siamese Mausers.
So why cant someone build a 450/400 bolt gun?? What voodoo makes the rimmed case such an engineering hoodoo in rifles?
Cheers...
Con
PS: Sorry for the rant ... found another nice M17, this time in 444Marlin, that wont feed for squids.

it would be a bolt action 450/400 and that is part of the charm...

But it is not a 450/400 bolt action. If it was then you would be able to load the magazine and chamber and fire 450/400 rounds.

Mike

a few months back i made a 68 mm 404 jeffe dummy round and liked it...the idea has been done before but i thought of it independently...

with that looooong neck you can do a 2.65" or 68mm version (short neck but do-able) a 2.85" version and with a 416 550 cz the 2.9ish version soooo you can have this cart work on all three size actions! the 2.9" version on the cz will recoil like a 4 year olds best shot

obviously the 2.85" version would be the best and easiest.

another easy way to form is just use 404 brass and the 450/400 fl dies to get the non rebated version without the lathe work. maybe just restamp the last 4 into a 0

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Like I said, let me know when they are ready.

it just takes money...the idea is good. use a seperate neck throat reamer and ream to the desired depth.

if you are inclined you could be the first with me chearing you on

Sorry, not for me.

All I need to de is neck down the 404 Jeffery to .408, .410 and I'm there. But then you already have the 404 Dakota, right?

rusty...

the charms of the 400 jeffe rimless would be the bolt action, the slick feeding, the 411/410 bullets(read cheap pistol bullets) and the 400 jeffe nostalgia...

the 404 dakota is cool in its own right but i like this'n

above is the 450/400 3 1/4" (top) and 3"...

thanks to tomo577 for a couple pieces of brass the 3 1/4 jeffe has a shoulder

that is further back and is ideal for either a 2.65" version or a 2.5" version with a sub cal neck.




i found the specs for the jeffe3" above finaly

so both cases fill a purpose to make a form of the 400 jeffery bolt action

i'll post pics of the 450/400 3 1/4-2.65" dummy round version soon.

the rim thickness diff. is huge.