The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Guns, Politics, Gunsmithing & Reloading The Political Forum What on earth is Israel doing?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
One of Us |
I actually don't know anyone who disagrees with you. I certainly agree. But, there are several hitches i think. 1) Israel is opposing the Islamic Terrorists that oppose the West. I don't believe there's anyone here that would claim Gaza/ the Palestanians/ Hamas dont intend to do to the West what Israel is doing to Hamas. 2) changing the rules or the support or the entire game in the middle of a fight is self defeating. I and I think everyone else would welcome a re evaluation, a reconsideration of the USA's support of Israel, a re negotiation of our alliance in times of peace. We all agree it was horrible for Trump to back off support for Ukraine after our nation spent billions defending them yes? We agree that historically Ukraine has been on the top ten list of " most fucked up ever nations" yes? Right or wrong, we did jump in with Ukraine, rightly we did go against Vlad and we should solidly see it thru. Israel is no different and we also should see it thru there. 3) and definitely not last, where is the responsibility in all this held by Hamas and Palestine and Islam? More than 100 posts just in this thread laying the blame at the Jews feet?  Hamas and Gaza still harbor Islamic Terrorists, still hold civilians hostage and still refuse to negotiate and agree to a ceasefire and peace. I think Reagan said," we don't negotiate with Terrorists"? This is why the West looses over and over and over. LHeym500 is the easy example of why the West snatches defeat from the jaws of victory. Not only do we refuse to defeat our enemy but we cut our allies off at the knees while giving aid to those intending to destroy us. Mind blowing. Stay the course, finish the job, defeat the enemy and if! Just if we should do it differently next time consider it and maybe do so. Or continue to tell ourselves and everyone else in the room that the Wests ideal will be accepted the world over and if we just continue to bash ourselves in the head with the "Introduce Democracy" hammer long enough it'll finally influence them.  | |||
|
| One of Us |
https://www.npr.org/2025/07/29...te-israel-hamas-gaza The U.K. will recognize a Palestinian state if Israel doesn't agree to a Gaza ceasefire Updated July 29, 20256:34 PM ET https://www.newsweek.com/uk-pa...asefire-gaza-2105827 UK Set to Join US Allies in Recognizing Palestine Published Jul 29, 2025 at 12:09 PM EDT Updated Jul 29, 2025 at 1:37 PM EDT ************* “Those who control the present, control the past and those who control the past control the future.” George Orwell, 1984 https://www.google.com/search?...sclient=gws-wiz-serp Degenerate 1:1 1 Then Trump said, "Let Us re-make a Nation in MY Image, after My likeness, to rule over everything in the Nation, and over all the earth itself and every creature that crawls upon it". Degenerate 1:2 2 Then Trump said, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay on your behalf." Degenerate 1:3 3 "My Kingdom come, My will be done." "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis O.J. Trump aka Trumpism's Founding Farter, aka Farter Martyr. “When the rich rob the poor, it's called business ... When the poor fight back, it's called violence.” - Mark Twain "Be careful. When a democracy is sick, fascism comes to its bedside, but it is not to inquire about its health." - Albert Camus | |||
|
| Administrator |
The UK have blood on their hands! They started this tragedy! | |||
|
| One of Us |
There's blood everywhere on this. Saeed, I'm not as keen on the history of this as you are. I have read up on it lately. It could also be that the history I read is not the same as you believe. Wasn't it Great Britain who recommenced the two state or set it up that way? If so, the articles I posted indicate consistency with that. Why did that plan fail? Why would it not fail again and again? The answer, IMO, seems to be Hamas and Israel are intolerable neighbors. Why is that? Religious belief. I could go on. I have read, but not studied, some sources of info. Here's a sample: The Balfour Declaration, issued by the British government in 1917, https://www.google.com/search?...IBxg&sclient=gws-wiz ************* “Those who control the present, control the past and those who control the past control the future.” George Orwell, 1984 https://www.google.com/search?...sclient=gws-wiz-serp Degenerate 1:1 1 Then Trump said, "Let Us re-make a Nation in MY Image, after My likeness, to rule over everything in the Nation, and over all the earth itself and every creature that crawls upon it". Degenerate 1:2 2 Then Trump said, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay on your behalf." Degenerate 1:3 3 "My Kingdom come, My will be done." "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis O.J. Trump aka Trumpism's Founding Farter, aka Farter Martyr. “When the rich rob the poor, it's called business ... When the poor fight back, it's called violence.” - Mark Twain "Be careful. When a democracy is sick, fascism comes to its bedside, but it is not to inquire about its health." - Albert Camus | |||
|
| Administrator |
They recommend the 2 states solution. The Zionist Occupiers refused. I see your ORANGE DICKHEAD threatening Britain as they said they would recognize the State of Palestine! France have announced they would too, Norway and Denmark as well. The world is closing in on the ILLEGAL OCCUPATION of Palestine! | |||
|
| One of Us |
I borrowed this from another thread: His (Trump's) statements on the Israeli hostages suggested both a lack of understanding and a deeply disturbing flirtation with mass-casualty logic. “When they give [the hostages] up, they no longer have a shield… Some people would say, ‘Well, that’s the price you pay.’ But we don’t like to say that… You could also say speed might be better for the hostages… You go through, you know, with speed, you may have a better chance.” A sentence later, he reversed course again and praised Netanyahu’s caution, claiming, “Israel has a lot of responsibility… they’re hampered by the fact that you still have 20 hostages.” ======================================= I don't see Israel being "hampered" at all. And if hungry starving Palestinian children begging for food aren't a shield, then what are 20 Israeli hostages? ===================================== Remember what Trump said to John McCain: Donald Trump Says "I Like People Who Weren't Captured", Calls John McCain "Loser" ************* “Those who control the present, control the past and those who control the past control the future.” George Orwell, 1984 https://www.google.com/search?...sclient=gws-wiz-serp Degenerate 1:1 1 Then Trump said, "Let Us re-make a Nation in MY Image, after My likeness, to rule over everything in the Nation, and over all the earth itself and every creature that crawls upon it". Degenerate 1:2 2 Then Trump said, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay on your behalf." Degenerate 1:3 3 "My Kingdom come, My will be done." "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis O.J. Trump aka Trumpism's Founding Farter, aka Farter Martyr. “When the rich rob the poor, it's called business ... When the poor fight back, it's called violence.” - Mark Twain "Be careful. When a democracy is sick, fascism comes to its bedside, but it is not to inquire about its health." - Albert Camus | |||
|
| One of Us |
Arab states calling on Hamas to disarm and relinquish power in Gaza. Very interesting. Maybe there will be some progress. https://www.cnn.com/2025/07/30...mas-gaza-israel-intl | |||
|
| One of Us |
Probably the best discussion ive seen on this so far. Its long but first third covers the key points. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN2WGZZG-x0 | |||
|
Moderator |
malnourished kid? NYT is retracting the story https://www.foxnews.com/media/...emaciated-gaza-child opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
|
| One of Us |
you re right jeffe nobody is starving in gaza ... thus the reason spain, jordan, france and uaw are dropping foods ... you are always trying to find the good in trump and his minions ... despite you claiminig not voting for them ... you are supportinh them at any cost soon you will explain that israel did not kill any civilians ... https://www.aljazeera.com/news...tion-worsens-in-gaza | |||
|
| Moderator |
reading is hard -- i provided a SINGLE example, that everyone is kicking around as THE horror -- do you have a hard time reading even the beer label? opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
|
| One of Us |
sorry contrary to you i do not drink ... | |||
|
| One of Us |
Great news. | |||
|
| Moderator |
Well, that just sad, with as bad as your malfunctions are... pot? Lsd? Closed head injury? You have a strongly reinforced habit of using the "misquote, distort, and exaggerate" family of lying tactics. This post is an example. Nowhere did I say you drank, I asserted you had a hard time reading of the simplest topic to be read.. you flipped into a drinking question Ah, you've been reading Maggie's manifesto and confessions on are to troll opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
|
| One of Us |
funny coming from the best troll trump can ever dream of lol | |||
|
| Moderator |
Ah, on to deflection and lies, with a heavy dose of changing the subject. You have been studying maggie. It's cute opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
|
| One of Us |
If this is done and completed, I wouldn’t be surprised to see an insistence by the rest of the west (US included) that Israel return some of the land they have expropriated. I get the concern the Israelis have after the October attack that they want safe borders, and a frontier of sorts provides that, but the Palestinians living there do hav some rights as well.
| |||
|
| One of Us |
Tell us what rights does a Palestinian that has never personally harmed an Israeli citizen not have? Israeli citizenship rights notwithstanding. | |||
|
| Moderator |
They don't wear uniforms, dude .. have we learned NOTHING about GWOT that the bad guys don't wear uniforms... some even wear women's cloths (burka) to hide -- had Israel given Hamas a week's deadline to return the hostages, and WIPED OUT Hamas leadership, then done the same as now, within say, 6 weeks, no one would have complained a bit .. 1200 innocents, killed, raped, HIDEOUSLY murdered, including babies put in an oven, and swift retaliation on, hmm, what's you emotive word, Regime, the world would have applauded Had Hamas not built military installations in playgrounds and hospitals, and had not ALL of the MSM not been against retaliation, the whole world would have cheered, less about 1.2 B people, the LIBERATION of the Gazans under the dictatorship (idiocrasy) of Hamas Shall we taken about the Biden Pier? that SANK.. TWICE? There was a ceasefire, Hamas broke it .. there were additional cease fires, Hamas broke the terms -- I feel for the Gazans that didn't escape -- But, hey, you know who's lucky, in gaza, to get a cup of water an a pita? (if there are any still living) The Hostages Ya'll are over-reacting to being subjected to MANIPULATED news -- i'd have thought some of you are intelligent enough to recognize the smell Do you think the citizens of Dresden faired ANY better? Tokyo? Manilla? Nanjing? Do you think war is clean? you need to understand that this isn't a video game Recall, Texans are still pissed off, 190 years later, About the Alamo opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
|
| Moderator |
oh, bless your heart .. the things you can't tell from your fantasy and reality -- but, there you go, changing topics to get the spotlight off you -- You've been corrected, repeatedly .. i guess we can add "slow" to "illiterate" opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
|
| One of Us |
Yawn, average Palestinians who have done no harm to Israeli citizens are not terrorist. So, my question remains unanswered. And according to at least two S. Ct., cases non uniform enemy combatants in YS Custody or de facto U.S. Custody got a whole bunch of rights you just ignored. As always, I have provided those cases many times. As usual, you have read nothing. | |||
|
| One of Us |
one day you will discover that you were wrong on your analysis of the palestine issues like many others but what will do you? admit it or continue to live the dream of the freeman lol | |||
|
| One of Us |
he has not interests in the truth if it is not fitting his own agenda ...and the one of the supreme leader of course ... | |||
|
| One of Us |
[QUOTE]Originally posted by LHeym500: [QUOTE] Yawn, average Palestinians who have done no harm to Israeli citizens are not terrorist. .[/QUOTE) And that would be who? Can you help us point them out? Is it the "average Palestinian" that aids and abetted Hamas using hospitals and kindergarten classrooms for terrorists stockpiles? Is it the "average Palestinian that aids and abetted the kidnapping of hostages from October through today? The "average Palestinian" hasn't removed Hamas, hasn't turned them over to Israel, hasn't stopped giving aid and comfort to Islamic Terrorists. For some reason I'm reminded of the notion that that all Germans weren't Nazis, all Afghans weren't Taliban, all Syrians aren't ISIS etc,.... yet the nation's and cultures lined up uniformly. If the "average Palestinian" refuses to disassociate with Hamas they're not terrorists? As usual I'm missing something. | |||
|
| Administrator |
You have become the modern ADOLF HITLER! He blamed ALL THE JEWS to! | |||
|
| One of Us |
Your opinion would carry a little weight if the Palestinians you so zelously defend didn't advocate the extermination of the Jews. | |||
|
| One of Us |
and as of today this the jews killing and exterminate the palestinians with the whole support of your country ... a genocide and you have no shame ... | |||
|
| Administrator |
Common sense and decency dictates we should stand against any crimes against innocent people, no matter who is the perpetrators! Sadly, too much guilt is felt by certain individuals and countries, notably Germany and America. They are supporting the whole sale genocide being done by the New Nazis, the twenty first century version are called ZIONISTS! | |||
|
| One of Us |
Truth! | |||
|
| Administrator |
NitanHitler is actually do it. Exterminating the Palestinians! With the help of his puppet. THE ORANGE FUCKWIT MAGA ARSEHOLE! Putting America to SHAME in the eyes of the whole world! I wonder how it feels to be the tail being wagged by a human rights criminal. Actually indicted by an international human rights court! A MAGA FELON says HOW HIGH when his master says JUMP! BOMB IRAN you little DICKHEAD! We have all Epstein’s files. YES SIR COMMANDER NITANHITLER! IMMEDIATELY SIR! AT YOUR COMMAND!  | |||
|
| One of Us |
Just to circle back..... Nothing that Hamas has done justifies the intentional starvation of the civilian population in Gaza by Israel. We should put a stop to it either through direct intervention or by stopping aid and arms sales to Israel. Israel exists because of us and Netanyahu flipping us the bird whenever he feels like it isn't something we ought to put up with much longer. | |||
|
| Administrator |
We have been telling you for years. YOU BELONG TO THE ZI0NISTS! THE NEW NAZIS! | |||
|
| One of Us |
I’ll give Saeed one small point to support, in part, his point of view. The 1956 War w Egypt was not initiated by Egypt. It was initiated by Israel, France, and UK. The Euros wanted a reason to take the Suez which has been nationalized by Egyptian President Gamal Abdel Nasser’s regime. Nasser’s regime did this bc the U.S. and UK had removed funding for the Aswan High Dam project. The U.S. and UK withdrew this funding bc Sec. Dulles never liked Nasser’s regime. Dec. Dulles did not support the deal, but was leveraged into it by other Eisenhower Cabinet members. Sec. Dulles cited difficulties in arranging the financial details of the U.S. grant with the Egyptian government, but his real motivation was Nasser’s unceasing attacks on Western colonialism and imperialism and Egypt’s continued dalliance with the Soviet Union. Some think Sec. Dulles just wanted to kill the project hurting the Nasser Regime. Nasser was a dangerous, nationalist. Sec. Dulles s took actually angered the British government because it created a void to be filled by the USSR in Egypt. France, UK, and Israel attack Egypt. I do not know what overall war goals were. I know the Euros’ goal was control of the Suez. This whole side show of a war instigated by the not Arab state nearly caused US-USSR confrontation. President Eisenhower became directly involved. President Eisenhower told the uppity children (UK, France and Israel by the U.S. and Egypt for the USSR) to withdraw. UK, France, and Israel do so. Now, how many of us learned of this incident in U.S. schools. This event illustrates 1) the cancerous tumors of colonialism, 2) the unforeseen (at least by Dulles others hit the nail on the head concerning Soviet and Egypt cooperation), and aggressive, conspiratorial aggression by Israel and Western governments to attack an Arab state. This is why the U.S. traditionally did not view Israel as a strategic partner. The U.S. approach to Israel and the Middle East was one of third party, fair broker. Nor have GOP presidents with any critical thinking skills backed, supported, empowered. Israel aggression. Palestinians and the Arab states are going to have to accept the state of Israel. However, Israel needs to relearn that they are a part of Middle East and world community. If it wants to act like a pariah state, it would be internationally treated as one. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Well, to be fair, you're leaving out one little detail: Nasser took the Suez Canal and the canal authority by force of arms after it had been built and administered by the Brits for decades. That said, it was a vestige of colonialism that needed to come to an end. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Oh yes, I agree. The Suez was being administered by a joint French and British Company when Nasser took it. I think the French actually built the Suez. The assertion of infrastructure by the new political power post tossing off colonial yoke tends to happen. The U.S. did not let the Brits keep any. Nasser nationalizing it was a response to loosing funded by the West. I think he would have eventually done it anyway. I do think some sort of mutually agreed buyout, transition could have happened but for Dulles poisoning the well. Oh, and the damn got built and opened. The U.S. won on this because 1) The US hegemony over the West played out. We told the little powers to go home while staring down the Russians. Everyone listened. 2) The US was not brought into a conflict that would have turned into a major crisis. Unlike, the Great Euro powers of yesterday. The U.S. was able to bend the hand of time to peace versus striking major war that seemed to plague Europe as regional conflicts bloomed into major war to maintain position. 3) The US learned the responsibility of leading the West necessitated restraining the West at times. That last lesson we lost along the way. The great game revolved around isolating one’s geo political adversaries. Germany failed to isolate France in the lead up to WWI. Japan in the First Sino-Japanese War internationally isolated China. Japan obtained a treaty w British given them a limited scope and time block to build empire by Korea at the expense of China. The war went so well, the Commanded of Japanese forces wanted to do regime change. The Japanese Civil Government stopped him, recalled him, and got out of main land China. Why? 1) The limited war aim of creating a sphere of influence in Korea joining the imperial global powers was accomplished. Anything more or longer would have aligned China to the Euro powers. This would have turned a limited and internationally acceptable war into a major, multinational conflict Japan could not win. Russo-Japanese War, Japan again internationally isolated Russia. The war goals here are starting to get too grand, but still obtainable if Japan can get out. Had the U.S. not negotiated a peace when it did, and Russia launched one more major offensive, Japan would have lost. Russia had over 100k troops, professional troops coming. More important, they could get these troops to the war at this point. That sane general who in the First Sino-Japanese War had to be reeled in because he wanted to take it all told his government, “We have to put out the fire.” President Roosevelt had personal relationships with high Japanese officials. President Roosevelt told Japan to seize some Russian territory off main land china to have as a bargaining chip. The reason Japan does not obtain a big war indemnity from Russia is because Japan knew that would be rejected, Czar Nicholas would return to war, and Japan would lose. The First Sino-Japanese war indemnity was used to fund the Russo-Japanese War. The next generation felt Japan did not get enough, particularly the war indemnity. They used this to come to power as they came through military. Finally, making the civil government subservient the military. In the next war, the big one, Japan is unwilling and unable to isolate its geopolitical adversaries. In fact, Japan intentionally multiples them. We know the result. If Israel wants security, not peace as peace is a false illusion, it must isolate its geopolitical rival. Let us identify that as Hamas. Its war goals need to be limited and not bring other nation states in. Israel’s behavior is doing the opposite. 23 Middle East nations today support an end to Hamas. Saudi Arabia is begging Israel to just acknowledge a two state in principle for Saudi Arabia to continue diplomatic relationship. Since, this war Israel has drove Saudi Arabia to restart diplomatic discussions with Iran! The war goal of ending Hamas is here. Make peace, form the state to conform with 1967 boundaries. That is what the US has always maintained in sensible times. Have the government with 20 something Arab nations recognize Israel. We can ban Hamas as a party. Will there be 1k years of peace. No, but there won’t be this. What Israel is doing is counter factual. They are isolating themselves. The isolation that MAGA sells to the masses. That the Texas contingent marks out for is a death sentence. Restrained, principled, international engagement prevents major conflicts. Why not invade Twain if you are China when: 1) You are isolated from the international community and have no economic restrictions upon such a military intervention. Or 2) Twain is internationally isolated with no foreseeable consequences to military intervention. The First Sino-Japanese War where Britain in treaty gave China over to Japan’s limited war aim of making Korea a sphere of influence. Instead of isolating our geo-political adversaries or restricting them with economic power. We are isolating ourselves and our former allies to be picked off until it may go too far. Yes, we are big. That bigness carries responsibility. Economic Isolation of the YS imposed by the U.S. turned a crisis into the Great Depression that became the oven for Nazis Socialism’s rise. The Nazis were always going to be there. The economic environment for their virus to feed on would not have been. Yes, we are big, but the EU plus Japan has peer GDP. | |||
|
| Administrator |
America was ruled by a decent man then. Not AN ORANGE FUCKWIT PUPPET to NitanHitler ! | |||
|
| One of Us |
Yes, our Chief Executive was. | |||
|
One of Us |
How many of them wish this? I could easily find US citizens who wish the same. Specifically how many of those who you say do so in Gaza have had children, fathers, brothers or whatever killed in Gaza, or are watching their young kids slowly starve to death, or have kids who are now missing limbs or are blind. How many have seen their young daughter shot by a sniper who then also shot the nurses coming to her aid? And yes, I know its the fault of Hamas etc, etc ... You get where Im going with this ... and I know you advocate "total war" for want of a better phrase, where its victory despite collateral damage and irrespective of the consequences to the civilian population, but how did that work out for Russia in Afghanistan? How about the Chechen war in the 90's, how is it working out in Ukraine, or Syria or Mali? Russia doesn't give a shit who or how many they kill, but they still lost (or are struggling to win). Respectfully, things are not as simple or black/white as you feel they are Scott. | |||
|
| Administrator |
You no longer have a CE. You have A MAGA ARSEHOLE PUPPET! NitanHitler’s PUPPET! | |||
|
| One of Us |
I generally agree. | |||
|
| Powered by Social Strata | Page 1 2 3 4 5 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
Visit our on-line store for AR Memorabilia