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One of Us |
Just a heads up for those interested in joining the new Safari Rifles site. Be aware that if you have ever had any trouble on AR with some of the Moderators or Administrative staff of that site, you are subject to being banned without warning, simply by disagreeing with a Moderator or stating your opinion on a subject, even when done civilly. The site does have potential, but some of the stated premises as to the founding of the site, seem to have somewhat turned Draconian. The concept of civility seems to have taken on the aspect that no one shall disagree with anyone else, especially a Moderator and anyone that does will be immediately banned with no warning, no explanation, no independent opinions allowed. Even the rocks don't last forever. | ||
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The above is just unadulterated bullshit. It takes a hell of a lot more to get banned from AR than just disagreeing with a Moderator. You must either be disruptive, make threats against other Members, or repeatedly contravene the few rules Saeed has requested we follow. George  | |||
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George, not sure what got you stirred up, but I really think you mis-read my post. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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How so? Are you condemning AR or saying that the new site is worse in terms of heavy moderation and ban stick wielding? George | |||
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I am sorry, I did not realize that you are a moderator over on that site, did not mean to offend you. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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TIMMY!! xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Not TIMMY, Cartman! Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Woke up did you? Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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George, He is telling us the other site is not what it is supposed to be. I also got some PMs telling me at least one member on that site was banned from AR. And as everyone knows, it takes an awful lot of stupidity to get banned from AR. Not sure who the member is, but I was told he is a very opinionated individual who does not tolerate anyone who disagrees with him. Somewhat different than AR where tolerance is encouraged. | |||
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That narrows it down to the entire political forum. ______________________ Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else. | |||
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Yes, I am opinionated all to hell and gone, but contrary to some folks opinion or belief, I don't have any trouble with someone disagreeing with me, if they will just say they don't agree. Have no problem with that, when people start calling me stupid or an idiot, then is when I have a problem. I have had a 2 week vacation from this site and DRG has warned me a couple of times in the past about my behavior. Over there, there was no warning and the discussion wasn't even that. I believe the strongest word I used in the response that got me banned was gonads. But yes after hype about how great the new site was supposed to be, they seem to be taking the old song line, "And Never Was Heard A Discouraging Word" to a higher level of seriousness. Their level of civility is either extremely high or they border on elitism or they live by the commandment "Thou Shall Not Disagree With A Moderator, Ever"! Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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I was not going to chime in here because of the petty nature but evidently, some things need to be said. Firstly, I am a moderator over on SafariRifles.net. What Randall is accusing is not correct. All of the mods on SR are members of AR. Yes, one was banned previously. However, no one on the site has attempted to intimidate anyone here on AR in any way shape or form. No one has attempted to "Steal" anyone from AR to the exclusion of SR. It is simply another place to hang out and share views and stories. No one has been or will be encouraged to drop AR for SR. SafariRifles will have stronger moderation than AR. That is a given. Our intent is to encourage debate while attempting to avoid every discussion devolving into pissing contests. We are encouraging our members to remain respectful of each other, nothing more. Differing views and strong defense of opinions is encouraged, but without the name calling and personal insults. Randall, Your statement above is completely disingenuous. I debated whether or not to respond as I know how conversations with you go. But against my better judgement, I decided to go ahead and make a statement in response. You were not banned for disagreeing with a moderator. Quite the contrary. In fact, it is well known that a forum of any type cannot survive simply as a mutual admiration society of it's members. Disagreement and debate of opinions is what makes things interesting. At SafariRifles, airing of differing opinions is highly encouraged, but we believe this can be accomplished in a gentlemanly and respectful manner. Unfortunately Randall, you picked up on the new forum, right where you left off here on AR by starting numerous threads with confrontational undertones. Lets be honest sir, you did not simply encourage debate and discussion, but outright went looking for a fight; numerous times. We attempted to discourage you from this course, and even locked one of the threads before you went "all in" as your responses were escalating in tone. We even gave you an honorary title of "Professional Hunter" in an attempt to appease you in your quest to be recognized by the industry as such. Again, this was done in an attempt to de-escalate your behavior on the new forum. All to no avail. Regrettably, the decision was made to discontinue your membership when you escalated your responses to the point of issuing a personal challenge insinuating the threat of physical confrontation. I would be surprised if that type of behavior wouldn't receive the same response here on AR as there is no call for it. I want to emphasise Randall, that your banning was a joint decision made by ALL of the moderators, not just one. Again, we attempted to avoid this by subtle appeasements. In the end, we all were receiving private messages about your behavior and felt that the disruption was not going to improve. Saeed, I apologize for coming on AR to discuss SafariRifles. This is your forum and it is not our intent to interfere with AR. As stated, I wasn't going to comment publicly here on AR but the statements made on this thread, and a couple of others, namely Mac's deleted thread, really need to be addressed. I will do my absolute best not to make further references to our site here on AR. | |||
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Well, now we know. Is anyone surprised? xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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| Moderator |
I am not a Moderator there; i am not even a member of that site.
Read your original post; it was not clear that you were lambasting the other site. It was probably snarky comments like the above that got you banned over there. George | |||
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Todd, I have a hard time understanding how or why a question concerning what one rifle would a person choose to use if they were limited to one rifle only can be confrontational? I was not the one that said it was a stupid question and should not have been asked. I was not the one that decided to go into a diatribe about why the .375 H&H is not a Big Bore, when the question did not specify Big/Medium or Small bore, just what caliber a person would personally choose. Todd if anyone is stretching or contorting things it is yourself, because as you clearly mentioned in your response, you have made a judgement about my character and my intentions when I start a discussion. If you have a problem with someone, why not simply ignore them? You accuse me of threatening people, this is the internet, I never pm or email ANYONE making any threats, cannot say the same for others on this or other sites. You have a real problem of some kind and becoming a Moderator on the new site or any other site, gave you or would give you the power to do what you would like to do on here, and that is censor ANYONE that does not agree with your interpretations of how things should be. You are NOT the first person I have seen do such activities. You are not unique or any different than anyone else, you achieved a position where you could take revenge on someone that you have developed a grudge against. Why did I start all those threads, to try and get some activity started on that site. I thing the site has potential and that there is plenty of room on the internet for all kinds of sites. But I do believe that as long as new Moderators use their little bit of power to silence those they do not agree with such sites will stumble and have a hard time gaining members. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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| Administrator |
Todd, There is no need to apologize. What I meant what I said in the original thread. I wish you all the best in setting up the new site. I actually believe the more decent sites we have as hunters the better it is for all of us. Whoever owns the site can set their own policy. Ours here is really very simple. We do allow quite a bit more freedom for members to say whatever they wish, within reason. My belief is that the members reaction to whatever is posted will answer the poster, rather than us as Moderators. We believe we are dealing with grown ups, and hopefully they will bear in mind that although this is the Internet, one does not have to lower himself to the level of some of the idiots on Facebook for instance. Banning someone from here is a very difficult decision for me. It only happens after a lot of discussion with the relevant individual. We as individuals have different opinions of how to behave. We set up this site with an open door. Inviting all hunters and shooters to join us to discuss whatever takes their fancy regarding our sport. We treat everyone as a valued guest, and we hope everyone would return the favor and behave as a guest. It really is no different than going to another country. I have lived in several different countries for lengthy periods of time. I have always considered myself as a guest in those countries, and have always been treated accordingly. | |||
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Well said Saeed. You are spot on! Happiness is a warm gun | |||
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It is possible that you are correct in your estimation, but it is more probable, from actual experience that I am correct, you may have seen it, but I have definitely seen it on new sites especially regional sites. One member develops totally irrational animosity toward another member and then thru whatever orchestrations, gains the position of a Moderator, and the first action they take is to ban everyone they had problems with before. People want to believe they are open minded. People want to believe that they do not hold grudges. But in reality, damn few of us would not try to exact revenge upon someone we had problems with on an internet site. It is human nature, nothing more. Each and every person that participates on these sites has the exact same options. No one is forced to read every post or response. Everyone has the option of ignoring the individuals they have a problem with. Everyone is entitled to their opinion on any subject. At no point does EVERYONE have to agree on ANYTHING. Each of us has had different experiences during our life and hunting careers, and just because some says they have had a different experience, it Does NOT mean they are lying. A person standing by their opinion is not being confrontational, they just believe in what they are saying and are willing to defend their opinion. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Moderator |
i speak Texan, perhaps this will help Randall out of a pickle-- "Son, when you find yourself in a hole, stop digging." opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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What, is so wrong with a tag line if the person using it finds it amusing??? On another site, people got all upset, because I used the tag line, "I Understand, I just Do Not Care"! It was something I found funny, more so because it upset people. It is the internet. Why do people have to try and judge others over something as meaningless as a tag line on an internet forum????????? Also, and this is the truth, the folks that actually know me, do know me real well. The folks that do not actually know me or have never actually interacted with me, but use such things as an internet tag line to pass judgement on me, can go to Hell. I have a real hard time having been brought up the way I was, understanding the concept that words typed into a post or a response on an internet forum accurately show the worth/character of the individual typing them. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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| Moderator |
Sir, read the tag line quote in regards to your position that you are not being confrontational. Then back up a moment to where the mods (of a couple sites) are telling you that your actions exceed the bounds - and that you refuse to acknowledge that they JUST MIGHT be the people measuring the difference between polite debate and pugnacious confrontation. Then recall that YOU DON'T KNOW even 1/10 of 1 percent of the people of TEXAS (that would be about 26,000 people) much less that you know no measurable percentage of people in the world. Then, in fact, your tag line is telling 99.999% of people to go to hell. Hardly non- confrontational. opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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That whole line of reasoning makes no sense what so ever. The saying I use as a tag line has been round for decades, and that is all it is, a saying. Also, Sir, I was not using ANY tag line over on the other site, so that was not part of the issue. Talk about being confrontational, look at your entire response. That whole thing is confrontational listing all kinds of reasons why I am wrong for merely using a saying I find funny. I think, and this is just my opinion, that it would not matter to you or many other folks what I use for a tag line. You/they would find some reason why I should not use it, or some obscure reason why it was confrontational or why you think it is confrontational. Ninety-nine percent of the time, I never pay any attention to what a person uses as a tag line. It is their business not mine and if they are comfortable or happy with it, more power to them. I just wish some one could prove that conversations on internet forums are the most definitive manner of judging another persons character, ever invented. I feel you view all of what I said above as being confrontational. None of it is meant to be, but some folks seem to want to read things in to what another has responded with, and if possible they will censor that person if the chance arises. I can not prevent people from thinking of me what they will. No one ever achieves Universal acceptance or popularity, I accepted that concept years ago, it does not bother me. I learned a long time ago, there are people that simply do not have any use for a person and nothing that person can do will change that. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Damn Skippy, it takes some big balls to come in one site to get into a pissing contest about another site. Not a lot of brains but big balls.  Aim for the exit hole | |||
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I was merely relating my experience on the new site. Did you miss out on these discussions? This one went to 2 pages: http://forums.accuratereloadin...3611043/m/4851097981 And this one went to 4 pages. http://forums.accuratereloadin...1411043/m/6591096981 All I was doing was passing along a little information so people would be aware they might not be as welcome on the new site as they are being led to believe. Nothing more. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Those two threads only show that Saeed is a lot more tolerant than I am. For Saeed to allow that whiny, little pissant to make even one post is beyond belief. Aim for the exit hole | |||
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Believe me, on regional sites here in Texas at least, you mention anything about joining another site your banned. If the PTB's of the site your on even find out you have been lurking on another site, your banned. Been there done that one and saw it done to a lot of other folks. I am not saying that there are not some good folks on the other site, I am just saying they are not as open minded as they are claiming to be, and that anyone from AR that has had any less than friendly interactions on AR with some of the folks that have became Mods over there, the person is subject to getting banned over there with no explanation. Good Grief, it is the internet. Internet anonymity already causes enough problems as is. Expecting anyone not to exact revenge on someone they have irrational animosity toward is ludicrous at the minimum. I have witnessed it on too many sites. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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| Administrator |
That sounds a bit draconian! Whatever for? Being a member of a website does not mean you are married to it! When members asked a while back if they could include their website, company address and phone number to their signatures, I told them they are welcome to do so. In fact, on our FREE Outfitters Forum, we actually insist that all the contact details are included. And the only benefit we at AR get is for our members to enjoy their favorite sport without much interference from us. Have you all noticed also that we do not have a sort of "mission statement" telling everyone that our site is the best in the world? Simple really. I personally do not believe in "best in the world" of anything. That judgment all depends on the individual concerned, not someone else telling who is the best. That old term "beauty is in the eyes of the beholder" can be applied here too. Visit as many sites as you wish, enjoy all of them, and just have fun. | |||
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No, not at all. Arguing just takes up to much energy. I generally stay out of the political forum except for the occasional hit and run. Learned that from Saeed.Crazyhorse, get over it already. Have fun, enjoy the site for all it offers. ______________________ Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else. | |||
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| One of Us |
It is hard to enjoy a site, for me at least, when some people simply can not just state that they disagree with someone's posts or responses, without name calling or making disparaging remarks about a persons intelligence level or their financial status. Internet feuds/hatreds/animosity/grudges all are unnecessary. As has been stated by many folks, the majority of the members of any site would and could probably get along just fine in face to face interactions, but because of the concept of internet anonymity people say stuff that does no one any good. There are sites I have stopped visiting or rarely visit simply because they are dull and boring. Only a small percentage of the sites members ever post or respond and they have developed a clique and it is more of a mutual admiration society, than a place to actually discuss anything. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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The name calling, especially if it starts at the onset, is USUALLY because the poster has no knowledgeable information or has a sterling example of one that he has expanded into a doxology that must be defended. A case in point would be the poster that sez xyz bullets are shit 'cause he made a perfect heart shot on a xxx which ran off never to be found. Then, of course, some shit stirrer that has never shot an xxx is gonna chime in that the shooter needs more practice, not some magic bullet. And so it starts. With each pretending to be something they're not. One would think, CHC, that you're long enough in the tooth to recognize threads like that and avoid them as often as possible. I've posted before that if I were to say: "Mother Teresa was a nice lady", they'd be someone that would pop up and say she wasn't. Then, however, if you ask for documentation for their position, they haven't any. Aim for the exit hole | |||
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Yes, I can recognize, and usually do not get involved in such conversations. The odd part is when a conversations is going smoothly and someone slides in from left field and starts crap simply because they can. I don't think anyone likes having something that is important/serious to them turned into a  contest by an individual that has some irrational hatred toward the person making the post/response.Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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[/QUOTE] Yes, I can recognize, and usually do not get involved in such conversations. The odd part is when a conversations is going smoothly and someone slides in from left field and starts crap simply because they can. [/QUOTE] That's true but some folks just cannot stand to have a conversation going on that they can't get into. They bring nothing to the table but they just got to have everyone looking at them. It's just the nature of the beast and you nor I bitching about it ain't gonna change it. Mainly 'cause they don't realize what they're doing. Aim for the exit hole | |||
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You are a much better man than me Gunga Dihn. If a person does not agree with me on a subject, I accept that. I will however defend my opinion. It is just part of life for folks to not agree with another's opinion. When folks start with the name calling, the personal attacks concerning things they have no actual knowledge of, I have not progressed to the point of being able to not be offended. Wished I could, but I do not see it ever happening, especially when the comments and accusations are being made by individuals with no actual first hand knowledge of the kind of person I am. I envy your self control. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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It's not a matter of self control it's really a matter of not letting people that don't matter matter? Aim for the exit hole | |||
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I am still working on that one, maybe someday before I die I will get a handle on it but I ain't holding my breath on that. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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