Thought I'd drop in and read the conclusion of this discussion. Just as I had anticipated, the self-righteous are silent and have not accepted the challenge offered. Apparently, their ability to locate a barrel isn't as developed as their ability to berate an innocent young man. Hats off to Jeffeosso and Eland Slayer.

Bobby B.

quote:

The same people who jump at the jugular of anything Texas-related seem to have no qualms about hunting over alfalfa in Montana or Canada, baiting bear, setting up over a waterhole in Wyoming, hunting grainfields in the midwest or over the many beanfields in the southeast. And I know for a fact that some of these folks have participated in such hunting, yet they loudly condemn any piece of land in Texas with a feeder or a blind on it.

One of these clowns (no, I won't name names as I don't stoop to that low of a level -- I do not want to be like them!) killed a zillion or so doves over grainfields that were baited with EXTRA grain in Argentina. But that's OK; that's not the "same" in his books.

Another of these clowns also keeps yapping for a Texas-only forum. Maybe, instead, we should clamor for a holier-than-thou forum. And I'd gladly nominate JB as the charter member.

As an aside, I'll tell a story I've told here before. It seems appropriate once again:
A couple of years ago, a "writer" had booked an unguided hunt with a ranch in the southwest portion of the state.

This is rough and rugged country -- unforgiving at times -- where cactus and catclaw carve up the unknowing, where rattlers can turn a dream hunt into a nightmare and where water is always in short supply. But his client asked no questions about the terrain, wanted no guiding assistance and was non-chalant about the entire affair.

The ranch manager had read his work before and knew that he had taken a couple of cheap shots at high-fenced operations in the past (this ranch was high-fenced and just over 20,000 acres). So he decided to have a little fun with him. Just after daybreak, he dropped off the writer near the center of the ranch near a bluff overlooking some promising hunting areas -- albeit in the most rugged and remote part of the ranch. He said "I'll pick you up at the gate 30 minutes after sunset. But if you get lost, just get to the fence and follow it back."

To make a long story short, the "writer" was not at the designated pickup point. Within minutes, the ranch headquarters phone rang, and a deseprate voice on the other end admitted he was hopelessly lost since around 3 p.m. and could not find his way to the gate OR EVEN TO THE FENCE!

I am not certain, but I do believe this "writer" visits AR on occasion, and if he wants to chime in, I'd like to know if his opinion of high-fenced ranches has changed. And for the record, he didn't bag anything while hunting alone; on the 4th day, with the added services of a guide, he did manage to tag a decent buck.

---

One last thing:
Some of the folks here think they are tigers -- but that's only because they can hide behind the anonymity of their computer screen. Put them out in the real world and they're nothing but a whining kitty that doesn't have the intestinal fortitude or the common sense to get down from the tree.

quote:

I have this feeling that you and a lot of the other folks that are so down on Texas and Texans, would enjoy setting around a campfire talking about this stuff in person with Texans, and I believe many of you would find out that while a lot of Texans don't really agree with all the high fencing going on and the way it has driven the price of hunting out of many folks reach, nearly all of us believe and will defend a land owners right to do as they choose with their land, and that as long as it is legal, the right of a hunter to hunt as they choose.

quote:

Thought I'd drop in and read the conclusion of this discussion. Just as I had anticipated, the self-righteous are silent and have not accepted the challenge offered. Apparently, their ability to locate a barrel isn't as developed as their ability to berate an innocent young man.

real texans of the old days must be spinning in their graves at all the pissing and moaning going on here.....



very nice pix, eland slayer, and i appreciate your posting them. your candor on the remainder of the discussion was much better than most, on both sides of the issue.

those who cried foul over an open discussion about hunting on a hunting forum need to toughen up.

Jeffeoso,

I didn't say anywhere in my post that the barrel would be easy to find. I was just making light of a stupid challenge that has nothing to do with hunting. No one is going to take up your challenge because it is irrelevant to the discussion. Try finding that barrel in the Frank Church Wilderness area in Idaho. You could spend your whole hunting life looking for it and may not even get into the same Creek drainage with it. Heck, there are crashed airplanes there that haven't been found for over 20 years.

I don't understand why you don't get out and use spot and stalk hunting on these ranches. I can see shooting animals for population control using the methods I listed but I would personally get a lot more satisfaction from hunting by spot and stalk methods. That doesn't mean I wouldn't hunt on a high fenced property. But I would leave my rifle home and hunt quail with my pointing dog and a shotgun.

465H&H

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:


I don't understand why you don't get out and use spot and stalk hunting on these ranches.
465H&H

465: I,too, much prefer spot and stalk, or still hunting, to sitting on a stand. But the fact is, there are many areas where still hunting, or spot and stalk just won't work.

You spot it and I'll stalk it.

Alan

Alan Mc,



Help me find my keys and we won't have to stalk, we can ride in the A/C.
GWB

i've got a better idea...

texas mobile deer stand:









now, all other disagreements and kidding aside, i will give y'all very high marks for originality, fun and style.

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:
Jeffeoso,

I didn't say anywhere in my post that the barrel would be easy to find. I was just making light of a stupid challenge that has nothing to do with hunting. No one is going to take up your challenge because it is irrelevant to the discussion. Try finding that barrel in the Frank Church Wilderness area in Idaho. You could spend your whole hunting life looking for it and may not even get into the same Creek drainage with it. Heck, there are crashed airplanes there that haven't been found for over 20 years.

I don't understand why you don't get out and use spot and stalk hunting on these ranches. I can see shooting animals for population control using the methods I listed but I would personally get a lot more satisfaction from hunting by spot and stalk methods. That doesn't mean I wouldn't hunt on a high fenced property. But I would leave my rifle home and hunt quail with my pointing dog and a shotgun.

465H&H

465
we do spot and stalk, how else could I possibly get back into the thick stuff?

Making light of a stupid challenge? You see, that's the issue, isn't it? Ya'll feel perfectly fine talling a texan what he does aint hunting, but resort to ridicule when presented with it. Then, of course, revery to the absurdity of hunting for it in a gaint place. hell, son, if YOU can't find it in 1100 acres, then how can ANYONE find it in 100,000?

So, in fact, I do spot and stalk, when its legal, as I also hunt in Louisanna quite a bit, where theis si ONLY still hunting most of the time.

Only a FOOL would spot and stalk on "public" lands in texas, as that is where you will get SHOT, as there is less public land, percentage wise, than ANY state in texas.

But, its nice for you to understand that its "okay" to hunt in high fenced property, at least for quail. However, nearly all native quail in texas have been killed by fireants, no joke. They are ground nesting, and fireants eat them and then the rotting eggs.

The long and the short of it that no big mouth, neverdid will take this as a challenge, as their minds are firmly made up and no ammount of facts will interfer with that.

Ya'll come on down and play find the barrel, there's a wager on the table, as ya'll raised the issue, that hunting in texas aint hunting.

tell ya what, we can go to my brother in law's place, 1200 acres, high fence on 2 sides, barbwire on the other 2, and you can "hunt" a free ranging barrel.

465, it's only as stupid as claiming that huting in texas is shooting pets.. and this one wont even move the whole time a fella is stalking it.

Step right up, boys and girls, be the first to find teh barrel and prove that your style and technique are far superior.

or, well, have a nice big glass of SU

jeffe -

you've done a great job of making your opponent's point for him.

quote:

Originally posted by tasunkawitko:

real texans of the old days must be spinning in their graves at all the pissing and moaning going on here.....



those who cried foul over an open discussion about hunting on a hunting forum need to toughen up.

Nah, man, we dont' mind you posting at all.
However, if you READ the posts made, you'll find the swearing, cursing, and ranting are almost always on the persons demanding that some how that (on a subject they know NOTHING ABOUT and have zero experience) Hunting in texas is all behind high fence and is "not hunting" and, oh, i love this one, that they need to be slapped.

My persepective is those that are just jumping jacasses abotu hunting, and are rude in forums, need some strong home training and behave as they would in public, present and face to face to the crowd that they are speaking.

internet badasses crack me up, especially those that think slapping crusher and calling him an f'wad is a great and acceptable action. Hell, I am 6'4, and 250#, and I would think long and hard before calling crusher anything along those lines, face to face. the man's got a handshake like a 6" cnc vice

quote:

Originally posted by tasunkawitko:
jeffe -

you've done a great job of making your opponent's point for him.

You are right, no bigmmouthed neverdid will nut up to the challenge.

jeffe -

i must have missed something in all these posts. if someone is giving it to crusher that hard and talking about slapping him around, then i can certainly see where some folks are going to get wound up over it. i will note however, that you deleted a very important part of my post when you quoted me.

i was referring to this constant trench attitude that some members from a particular state have whenever their practices are confronted with logic. for the sake of eland slayer's original posts, we can put that debate aside here and carry it on several other threads.

This is not the photo I wanted to post but the sides of the road give you an idea of what everything that is not a road looks like. 98% of that stuff has a thorn of one size or another on it and there is no stalking through it. There is no hunting that does not occur in a man made clearing of one kind or another. If the deer runs then tracking is done literally on hands and knees. I keep kneepads and leather, work gloves in the truck for such eventualities. Yes there are some natural openings but not nearly enough. The shadow cast is my blind. It is 20 ft tall and is 4' x 8' with a high backed swivel recliner in it. The deer know I'm there because I make a lot of noise and there is corn in the road. I can see 400 yrds in 5 directions and have 4 feeders working from July to February. I have killed 4 deer out of it in 10 years. A mature 4 point cull 2 years ago, a mature 8 point cull and a spike the year before that, and another mature 4 pt cull two years before that. I have shot several hogs from it as well. Actually the spike was not shot from the blind itself but from the ground under the blind as I drove up to it. I have about 30 pets that frequent the area on any given afternoon. They are reasonably sure that they are safe unless they are a cull buck. They will be feeding in the road and watch me walk up to and climb into the blind, open the windows, crash around, cough, spit and take a leak. They stand around watching me like a bunch of cows. There is not a high fence for as far as you can see (or farther) in any direction from my blind and yet these animals are by all reason behaving like domestic animals and would be easy pickings for someone that wanted to shoot them. Granted the larger bucks don't trust me too much which is probably a smart move on their part. There are a couple of does that I would not shoot under any circumstances. We have become friends and they know that they can come and go as they please.

The way these animals act has nothing to do with a high fence and their not being able to escape. Looks and pictures can be deceiving and what works in one place is impractical or impossible in another.

I have been in pastures that were under high fence which were in excess of 10,000 acres. I know that there were deer in them that had never seen the fence much less felt confined by it. I have read that in South Texas a high fenced pasture must be in excess of 5000 acres to maintain genetic diversity. I really don’t have a problem with these kinds of places. I do not like the 50 acre high fenced places that simply run deer through for clients to kill for a hefty fee. I don’t think it’s right and there are a great many others who feel the same and when enough people put enough pressure on “those who pay for such thingsâ€, (not on those who sell it) it will stop. Just because you see a high fence does not mean it’s a canned hunt farm. Just because you see a high fence does not mean it’s in Texas.

The son of one of my colleagues is in Range and Wildlife Management at Texas A&M Kingsville. They spent last week capturing, recording and “tagging†wild, unfenced deer. Just because you see an ear tag doesn’t mean it’s on a high fenced shooting farm.

When I want to go hunting I go to my blind or take a walk up the creek. When I want to go killing I go somewhere else.

Alan

alan - the explanation and education are much appreciated - thanks!

Jeffeoso,

Your sensitivity on this issue has lead you to put words in my mouth. Show me where in my posts above I said any of the following:
1. What you do "ain't hunting".
2. Your shooting pet deer.
3. That it wasn't okay to hunt on high fenced ranches.

Find where I said anything like that and I will apologize.
What I criticized was your challenge to find a barrel. The only thing that challenge will prove is that some areas of Texas have very thick cover. I don't see anyone arguing that point certainly not me. Believe it or not we also have areas of very thick cover in Idaho, Riparian areas, lodge-pole pine forests, the semi-rain forests of northern Idaho or the red-stem ceonothus thickets of north-central Idaho. We still hunt those areas. That is the challenge. To hunt that way you have to be prepared to face the fact that the animals will win most of the time. But if you always are successful then there is no challenge and is simply shooting.

Please list what hunting skills your challenge will test. Will it test the ability to track? The ability to understand the barrels behavior to exploit it's week spots? The ability to find and use scrapes or rubs to your advantage? The ability to locate by tracks bedding, feeding and travel corridors? No, none of the above. Your challenge is irrelevant as a test of hunting skills. Your test is as meaningless as a test of hunting skills as me hiding a barrel in downtown Boise and you not finding it. Would that test your hunting skills? No one in his-her right mind would take your challenge as a test of hunting skills. Offer a challenge of a one on one competition between you and another hunter where you each go into the thick stuff after a deer, boar or what ever and the winner is the hunter who takes the first legal animal. That would be a true test of hunting skills.


Finally I take exception to you calling me "son", I am not your son and I am probably older than you.

465H&H

465,
With respect, there are abotu 6 hot heads that turn every post about texas into a "texas sucks, high fencing aint hunting, you need to be slapped around, it's shooting pet, and I am better than you because I hunt like a real man."

The challenge is presented to those, that think hunting inside a fence is shooting pets, requires no skill, and the game will come right to you.

I applogise if you were caught in the collaterial damage with my reply, as I am tired to the point of frustration with jackholes telling me how hunting is unethical in texas, when no one has questioned how they hunt.

The challange is to those that think THEIR method of hunting (spot, talk, grenades, whatever) is so inherently superior that hunting ins texas is unethical. They go so far as to state that ANY fence and ANY sized enclosure is unethical, which begs to ask aren't oceans borders, creating enclosures?

To those persons, I have raise da simple challenge. Find a brightly colored barrel in 2 days of legal hunting hours, in a confined space. Come show me how easy it is to find any, especially something the size of the torso of an elk, painted an unnatural color.

Madgoat has gone as far as to call crusher an f'wad and demands that anyone hunting under high fenced needs to be slapped or better.

gent's, once again, I am a big boy, and can give as I get, but I wouldn't talk that way to that man's face. I am dead certain of the consequences, and then he's buy me a beer.

These petty BS name calling issues merey clouds the issue.

What would finding the barrel proove It would prove how easy, or not, it is to find a large object in a space. Since it is not moving, the searcher doesn't have to worry about making noise, other hunters, food or water. Since it is not moving, the searcher doesn't have to worry about it moving 20 feet on the other side, running and hiding, burrowing under a dead fall. In fact, since the searcher already has the predisposition that all texas hunters are lazy, it might be right out in the open.

In fact, it encompasses everything those people claim to be wrong with "killing pets behind a fence" ... and the offer stands,
Come on done, they can see what hunting in an fenced area actually is.

465, if you would like to come down and hunt, be my guest. We've got plenty of big bores to shoot.
jeffe

I think nearly 100 posts on a couple kudu and Texas is a bit much. But go ahead and keep barking at the fence.

I didnt call any one names until eland killer said I had my head up my ass.then the gloves are off.I reviewed all my posts on this thread,and didnt insult anyone ,with the exception of ES,after he insulted me,so get off my case.
So Im not going to jump through hoops to find your barrel, jeffe.1100 acres is a big chunk of unfamiliar ground to cover in only two days.
Your challenge is bs,like i said.I wonder how far off the road you would be willing to transport this barrel?not far Id say.Probably be 4 wheeler tracks right up to it.
I havent answered you till now,because I have a family to take care of.I dont sit around surfing every day.
I dont think Ive ever claimed to be a great hunter,you can claim the honor of greatest hunter,if it makes you feel better.I got my three deer already this year.They are going to be very delicious,thats one reason I go hunting.Come to think about it,Ive never heard anything about how these critters you guys have taste.Tasunkawinkto(?) has posted some recipes ( I love montana venison,got family there)and kstephens has commented on venison, but all I mostly hear about is antlers and thorn bushes and the size of my mouth.
Like Ive said before, on this post and some others,Im just here to have fun.I have my opinions,and Ill tell you if you listen,but who cares?You have your opinions,I have mine,that, and a dollar will get you a cup of coffee.

And gee dubya,Ill try to pm you later,after I get my deer cut up.

I havnt, or will I say anything bad about Texas or Texans ( unless in a joke) or if someone wants to hunt highfence areas. My PERSONAL feeling is one of being unsure... I dont like the idea that I could be placed in an area that the game is knowingly thin on, have been baited to a differant area, ect ect. I have hunted once on a highfence farm in SouthAfrica, and did see a fence, and have to admit, it bothered me, even with the several thousand acres to the next fence on the other side. Like the writer was it? that was dropped off in the middle of the property and told to go hunt ( yes he sounded like he deserved it) I just would never feel sure if I was being played or not. My feelings and mine alone.

quote:

I didnt call any one names until eland killer said I had my head up my ass.then the gloves are off.I reviewed all my posts on this thread,and didnt insult anyone ,with the exception of ES,after he insulted me,so get off my case.

Do you have the reasoning ability to understand it just might be the fact that you continually run your mouth off about how bad things are with hunting in Texas and how you keep pestering the Moderators for a Texas Forum?

Do you have the ability to understand that shit like that just might come across as an insult to most Texans?

Your constantly bad mouthing Texas at every opportunity, everyone that has followed ANY thread on ANYTHING about hunting in Texas knows your opinion.

I know for a fact, that many folks from Minnesota spend the money and come down here to hunt, and they don't seem to have a problem with the way things are done down here.

Why don't you just let it drop, or go somewhere else? You have made your opinion abundantly clear, and I would be willing to bet that Texans are not the only ones that wish you would get a life or die.

I would quit,why dont you?

dream


reality

Because I am open minded enough to not give a fat rats ass about how other folks hunt as long as it is legal, and you aren't.

Well, I'll have to admit we do things a bit large in Texas and that "thing" doesn't look a bit like my hunting vehicle cept for the four wheels. I have played the "What happens here stays here" card with my boys before but only about stuff like rattlesnakes and such stuff. I'd put it to them like this, "Guys, remember how your mama wouldn't let you play behind the store house cause there might be snakes back there?" "Yes Daddy", would be their reply. "Well what do you think her reaction is going to be when you tell her about this big old rattlesnake we killed under the camphouse?" They'd say, "Oh, she won't like that a bit, she probably won't let us come bac.............." "I see you boys are catching on. We're not going to lie about this big ole snake, we're just not goin to make a big deal about it." They seemed to understand better after the first time one of them slipped. Of course my feeble attempts at saying it had slipped my mind were futile.

I still haven't figured out why it's painted desert camo though.

Wild quail is probably becomeing one of the most expensive hunts in Texas these days. A lot of quail hunting operations are with pen raised birds. #1 son used to work as a guide on the "74 Ranch" in Campbelton. He said the biggest problem was keeping the hawks and the coyotes off of the birds long enough for the hunters to get to them. They have some high fence there but it is primarily to keep some extrememly expensive exotics that are not hunted at all from straying and I think there are some that have strict regulations regarding keeping them confined. They have giraffes and keeping giraffes must be a real pain in the butt. They even have to have a special barn built for the damn things. They are valued, at my last inquiry, at somewhat more that 100k American Dollars. They also have numerous other exotics that are hunted.

Now I don't think any of you know my #1 son and if you do you probably have a crooked nose and a few loose or missing teeth. A walk across a hay field turns into an adventure with that boy. He took one of the Unsers (of NASCAR Unsers) and they made the first ever Gemsbok bowkill on the 74 Ranch. I have never hunted Gemsbok but from what I have heard they must have ESP and they don't let anyone get within bow range. They hunted on foot through the brush, looking for a shot and fianlly got the bull they were after. Both of them looked like they'd been drug through hell when it was over.

These are not easy hunts by any stretch. The easy hunts are the doe reduction hunts on the free range parts of the ranch. The clientele of the soup kitchens in San Antonio eat very well courtesy of the 74. I know this boy very well and he does nothing the easy way.

Now, with that said there are some real goobers that have lots of $$$$$$ and abuse the privlege of hunting under high fence and cheapen it by their attitudes, but they usually have bad attitudes about other stuff too. There are also some of the finest gentlemen I have had the great good fortune to meet and know who are "sportsmen" in the highest sense of the term and they enjoy the hunts for what they are and they opportunities the afford.

If you are truely against hunting under high fence then by all means don't. You will probably not enjoy it at all. I know there are some things that I am truely against. I don't do them and I am very open in my stand agiants those that do. But if it's legal and if I can't change that, I leave the issue. If the monkey wants rope, let him have rope.

I think I've said it before (repeat myself more and more these days these days)that I've never hunted under high fence. I've never wanted a big deer that bad. There are guys who do want a big deer mount. They should be able to get one. Anyone who has spent any time in the woods knows how many 190+ Typical and 210+ Atypical bucks there are running around out there, so these guys aren't fooling anyone except those that are nieve or want to be fooled. I know that in the morning I will face my self in the morror, intact and I will have only God and my conscience to answer to for my thoughts and actions.

This thread started off great about some very good looking animals and a story to go with them. It turned into something else. I'm glad it did because it brought some controversial issues to the surface. Here they are, choose you rpoison.

Secretly I wish there were no fences, high, low, rock or wood. I wish the world was still wild and that I was the first one exploring it. I wish, I wish, beggars could ride.

What we got for sure is what we got right now. Make the most of it and stop bickering.

Alan

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
Because I am open minded enough to not give a fat rats ass about how other folks hunt as long as it is legal, and you aren't.

so you agree with me then?

jb,

I've never been to Texas and only met a couple of Texans outside those on this forum. Sure would like to see it someday and almost bought a ticket to go to Dallas SCI this year.

Never been to Minnesota, but have met quite a few Minnesotans as Alaska seems to be a popular re location for them.

I certainly have no dog in this fight. I have more wilderness to hunt than either state, so fences of any size or shape don't really figure in any equation for me.

After reading the post by others and you on this and other threads, I don't mind telling you that quite a few of the Texans posting here are more than welcome to contact me for free hunting or fishing advise in south west Alaska, you very specifically are not. Your behavior toward others is shamefull. I suspect quite a few of us on AR hope that you are wildly successful in Minnesota in all your pursuits and as a result never venture outside the state line.

You sir have the honor of being the first to be added to my ignore list

Hey ES, I enjoyed the flicks too. Great looking animals.

quote:

Originally posted by Bobby B.:
Thought I'd drop in and read the conclusion of this discussion. Just as I had anticipated, the self-righteous are silent and have not accepted the challenge offered. Apparently, their ability to locate a barrel isn't as developed as their ability to berate an innocent young man. Hats off to Jeffeosso and Eland Slayer.

Bobby B.

+1

I didn't read many of the posts, but it does seem when the money went on the line, there was a HUGE amount of back-peddling.

I do believe Jeff has tripped into come up with a very astute money making venture. Wouldn't need the cost of an Out-of-State License and folks could hunt the Barrel with no Closed Season.

It does appear the only Real Problem will be to get the nay-sayers to put their money where their mouth is.

I'd sure love to come down and "Hunt" the Barrel, but I couldn't afford the "time" it would take to "Pattern" that Barrel.

Very nice Jeff. And thaks again ES - fine flicks.

Good (Barrel) Hunting and clean 1-shot Kills.

Maybe the way to settle this is the first one to find Steve Fosset wins?

I can't believe I am posting to this thread, but anyway...

The vehicle was made by a speciality company.

Here is their website.

Most of us get by with more mundane hunting vehicles.

quote:

Originally posted by CRUSHER:
dream


reality

Reality ain't so bad though, is it? Your old beast could use a nice place to store the Scotch and water though...

reality has been good to me. will add drink holders to the list.

quote:

so you agree with me then?

Sorry, I do not agree with ANYONE that believes that everybody should hunt, to THEIR STANDARDS.

If you could ever just one time drop the you put out about how sorry Texas/Texans and hunting in Texas is things might calm down.

But you ain't got the guts or nuts enough to just ignore threads that are about hunting in Texas.

The only thing I might agree with you on, is that I like to hunt, and evidently, so do you.

I don't agree with your constant bullshit about how things are down here, unless you have been down here and hunted.

Have you done that?

You know, if someone had the sense of a 7 year old half wit and they were that ate up with much hate toward a certain group of people or the way they choose to do something, they would not look at those threads that upset them.

Another thing that amazes me is as I stated earlier, lots of Minnesotans seem to have no problem what so ever wuth coming to Texas and hunt, including on high fence places.

Why not instead of petitioning DRG and the other PTB's, for a Texan/High Fence Only Forum, you petition them for a forum where Texans and people that have no trouble hunting high fences are not allowed.

Thought about that?

Still no one gonna hunt the barrel? None of these great white ( or any colored ) hunters gonna make the TEXAN eat his words? I love it!

PUT YOUR MONEY WHERE YOUR KEYBOARD IS!!!!!

Has anybody heard that new song " I am such a great hunter on line "

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:
Has anybody heard that new song " I am such a great hunter on line "

Brad Paisley couldn't have said it better himself.

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:

quote:

so you agree with me then?

Sorry, I do not agree with ANYONE that believes that everybody should hunt, to THEIR STANDARDS.

And yet,your pissed off that I dont follow YOUR standard??????

ETHICS gents. This is, to me at least, a question of ethics. Not a question of difficulty or legality.

To all the "barrel stalkers" out there. I offer the following observation. I recently successfully hunted a whitetail buck in the swamps and river bottoms of Northwest Florida. I could probably hide a Sherman Tank in that area and a man would not be able to find it. That becomes a question of geography, topography and cover. Not a question of hunting skill or ethics.

Most of you have never lived where your right to hunt has been decided by popular vote. I have. Years ago in my home state of Colorado, an influx of displaced Californians living in Boulder began a petition to stop spring bear hunting, bear hunting with dogs and trapping. After getting enough signatures, it came up for a statewide vote. To the amazement of all, it barely passed and these time honored traditions became illegal in the state of Colorado.

In California, they have made it impossible to hunt Mtn Lion. Even though almost all the counties want to hunt them, they can not muster enough votes to overide Los Angeles, San Diego, San Francisco and Sacramento. So, the state has no Lion season. Because the Mtn Lion is considered a "special Concern" species, a person living in Calfornia can not hunt Lion elsewhere and legally bring the trophy into the state.

To all the Texans here, I can assure you that there are enough anti hunters and non hunters in Dallas, Ft Worth, San Antonio, Houston, Amarillo and your other big cities to strip you of your rights to certain hunting practices. All they have to do is get it on a statewide ballot. Your little towns and rural areas will never be ablt to over ride their votes.


When the non hunters begin to question the ethics of a hunting practice, they will make their voices heard via the voting machine. And you might be surprisd to find out just how loud that vote is.


For me, this is not about the difficulty of any type of hunt. It is not about any particular location of any type of hunt. It is not about the legality of a hunting practice. It is purely about the question of ethics, which is something each person must decide for themselves. Legality will be decided by special interest groups, see above examples, or by people with an axe to grind. Ethics depend on your personal views.

I do not see anywhere in this entire post where anyone attacked a particular state, even though the Texans here assume it is pointed towards them. Probably because most the high fence operations are located there. But they also exist in Florida, Missouri, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Maine, Oklahoma, Nebraska, Colorado and most likely several other states. I for one do not see high fence hunting as a positive thing for our sport. You might. I don't.

quote:

Originally posted by MAC:
...To all the "barrel stalkers" out there.

...To all the Texans here, I can assure you that there are enough anti hunters and non hunters in Dallas, Ft Worth, San Antonio, Houston, Amarillo and your other big cities to strip you of your rights to certain hunting practices. All they have to do is get it on a statewide ballot. Your little towns and rural areas will never be ablt to over ride their votes.

When the non hunters begin to question the ethics of a hunting practice, they will make their voices heard via the voting machine. And you might be surprisd to find out just how loud that vote is. ...

Hey MAC, You "might" be correct, but I really don't remember hearing about Barrel Hunting being "Voted Down" in any of the places I've ever hunted.

Haven't even seen an argument against Barrel Hunting until your post. But there probably is some Group out protesting for all they are worth against No Fence, Low Fence, High Fence, Super High Fence, Super Duper High Fence and Fence Wrapped Barrel Hunting.

Haven't seen any, "When they pry the Barrels from our cold dead hands...", NRA fund raising mailers.
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You sure about this MAC??? Any chance you slipped and got some head damage while Swab Jockeying???

Good Barrel Hunting and clean 1-shot Kills. Semper Fi

Mac,
First let me say that I went back through the 118 posts that make up this thread and re-read your posts. I appreciate the amount of time and thought you have put into your well thought out responses. Your line of reasoning has been very consistant throughout. I understand your concerns and they validate many of mine.
Like me, you've been coming to this forum for over six years. As a fellow once said, "the times they are a changin'. In fact we've seen numerous changes to and in this forum. Having been reading and posting on this forum for that amount of time you probably seen some bashing of Texans and the way hunting is done here, far more that any other locale. Without rehashing the whole thread, I think the point of departure was your response about animals doing well in a zoo. Probably not the most sensitive remark and guaranteed to get a response, which it did, and things went on from there.
Maybe this analogy is a red herring but I don’t believe I’ve ever heard it said that fishing out of an ocean vs. a large lake vs. a stock tank is un-ethical, yet each is circumscribed by increasingly smaller boundaries. I think that we as hunters as sometimes to harsh on other members of the hunting fraternity with our imposition of “hunting ethicsâ€.
My view may be to colloquial, but I believe the “anti’s†typically having no absolutes, have made environmentalism their religion and will never embrace hunting in any form, and they see no common ground with us.
I also believe that it is only a matter of time before we see our hunting heritage and rights usurped. I have five brothers and sisters, I am the only one that hunts. I have three children. One hunts the other two don’t. After 45 years we sold the farm where I and my children grew up hunting. We were paid 15 times what my dad paid for the land. My grandkids more than likely will not know the pleasures hunting you own land brings.
Anyway, enough ranting. I need to go do something productive. Good fortune and good hunting to you MAC. See ya in the next post.
GWB