quote:

Originally posted by DLS:
One thing about this whole debacle, as far as I'm concerned. If Adam Bronson did in fact turn Larry in, he'll never get a single dollar of my money, ever.

I think it is beyond chicken-shit if Adam Bronson turned him in. And I intend to directly ask Bronson about this.

Yup. Especially if he gets a tag because of it.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by drummondlindsey:
Everybody is entitled to their own opinion and should be able to express those opinions without fear of a malicious google search in an attempt to discredit them because of minor mistakes made in their youth.

Aaron is somebody I consider a friend and I’ve hunted with him a bunch and I’ve never seen him break a game law and I’ve seen him chew peoples asses for things like not wearing orange in the truck when driving to and from hunting areas or not knowing exactly what legal shooting light was on that particular day. Is he capable of making a mistake? Absolutely, just as we all are, but to try and dig up dirt from 20+ years ago in attempt to discredit him and win an internet argument is ridiculous

Nobody said each of us can't have our own opinion! Your comment about doing a google search to discredit a person was not what happened on this thread. I knew of his previous violations before this thread ever got started from another thread on a hunting website many many years ago. My comments were not made other than to show why Aaron made those stupid comments about Game Departments being corrupt and nothing more. I'm done with this thread because nothing more needs to be said.

They say in Africa when two bull elephants fight it is the grass that suffers.

And someone gets a lump on the head....

Reminds me of Kirt Darner who was poaching his entire life. I remember see a back page ad in one of the hunting magazines and he had all these monster mule deer bucks on a barn wall. How does anyone kill that many boomers in a lifetime? We found out. I can see after a lifetime of deer hunting maybe a couple or three toads like those were but every year.

quote:

Originally posted by Paul C:
Reminds me of Kirt Darner who was poaching his entire life. I remember see a back page ad in one of the hunting magazines and he had all these monster mule deer bucks on a barn wall. How does anyone kill that many boomers in a lifetime? We found out. I can see after a lifetime of deer hunting maybe a couple or three toads like those were but every year.

How on earth does this topic remind you of Darner?
Read this entire thread then explain to me the similarities because I don't see it.

Snellstrom: How on earth does this topic remind you of Darner? Read this entire thread then explain to me the similarities because I don't see it.[/QUOTE]

I'm glad you said that because when I read his post I shook my head and wondered what in the hell Kirt Darner has to do with this!

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Do you mean Aaron?

Yes, I meant Aaron. Sorry about that!

Don't worry about it, it was just a simple mistake.

I know Aaron and have been on safari with him and his clients many times.

What I do know he is a keen ethical hunter and adopts the highest moral standard whilst hunting in Africa.

He is not a mate and we do not exchange Christmas cards or pretend to be the best of friends but I simply found him to be a good honest man.

From the little I have read here it would seem the laws in the USA seem to promote complication and where I come from a poacher is a well armed scary individual who would not hesitate to put a bullet into the very heart of law enforcement.

Just my 2 cents.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
I know Aaron and have been on safari with him and his clients many times.

What I do know he is a keen ethical hunter and adopts the highest moral standard whilst hunting in Africa.

He is not a mate and we do not exchange Christmas cards or pretend to be the best of friends but I simply found him to be a good honest man.

From the little I have read here it would seem the laws in the USA seem to promote complication and where I come from a poacher is a well armed scary individual who would not hesitate to put a bullet into the very heart of law enforcement.

Just my 2 cents.

In Alaska we had a drawing for wild buffalo with no preference points .Guess who's family got tags every year the game warden there .They even got them.every year after they retired .Their are friends of mine that applied 25 years never drew a tag ! They now limit each person.to once every five years .Don't ever think these things are not fixed !

quote:

Originally posted by dgr416:
In Alaska we had a drawing for wild buffalo with no preference points .Guess who's family got tags every year the game warden there .They even got them.every year after they retired .Their are friends of mine that applied 25 years never drew a tag ! They now limit each person.to once every five years .Don't ever think these things are not fixed !

If that wasn't investigated by an independent third party then you guys are suckers. I find that story hard to believe.

quote:

Originally posted by Paul C:
Reminds me of Kirt Darner who was poaching his entire life. I remember see a back page ad in one of the hunting magazines and he had all these monster mule deer bucks on a barn wall. How does anyone kill that many boomers in a lifetime? We found out. I can see after a lifetime of deer hunting maybe a couple or three toads like those were but every year.

Larry Altimus and Kurt Danner could not be further apart. If Altimus reminds you of Danner; you, sir, are clueless. Larry Altimus is a hard core sheep hunter, period. Kurt Danner was a self-aggrandizing fraud, period.

quote:

Originally posted by DLS:
One thing about this whole debacle, as far as I'm concerned. If Adam Bronson did in fact turn Larry in, he'll never get a single dollar of my money, ever.

I think it is beyond chicken-shit if Adam Bronson turned him in. And I intend to directly ask Bronson about this.

I assure you he did, he testified to that in open court!

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
I know Aaron and have been on safari with him and his clients many times.

What I do know he is a keen ethical hunter and adopts the highest moral standard whilst hunting in Africa.

He is not a mate and we do not exchange Christmas cards or pretend to be the best of friends but I simply found him to be a good honest man.

From the little I have read here it would seem the laws in the USA seem to promote complication and where I come from a poacher is a well armed scary individual who would not hesitate to put a bullet into the very heart of law enforcement.

Just my 2 cents.

Andrew - and I you! I'll always consider you a friend and a fine PH....cause I have seen your ethics and hunting ability first - hand. Fact is.....here in the USofA, we run on a different system my friend. You are guilty until proven innocent - and the game dept is NEVER your friend.....period!!!

Guys....I have nothing to hide, period! I have made mistakes and tried to learn from them as a young man - growing into an older man. One thing I have learned though, is game officers are not there to serve / help you the hunter, or the wildlife. They insist / believe every hunter / guide is committing a crime, period. You can agree / disagree....that's your free will. But I am disgusted by their actions more and more often. one look at the NM game and fish dept in 2017 outlines that clearly!!!

Many guys here have hunted with me, know me, and know my intentions in the field. I always try to be law-abiding and ethical in my hunting endeavors. Its important in my opinion to know your "rights" and understand them clearly. If you need to, refer to the constitution of the USofA and local laws regarding game / fish LE obligations!!!

You are "not" obligated to answer questions.

You are "not" obligated to incriminate yourself.

Law enforcement officers are "NOT" your friends or there for the "truth". They are there to write a ticket / arrest you if possible.

If you have a "hunting" license, you are obligated to show them said license, and "any benefit" you gain from said license (if you have a deer in the back of the truck - they can inspect it for legal take / tagging, etc). Otherwise they are "NOT" allowed to search your vehicle, your weapon, etc, without a warrant. Unless they suspect you of a crime - and can with "reasonable / articulate" probable cause "tell" you what crime you are suspected of - they cannot act beyond this. KNOW your rights, know the law, and hold them to it.

If a LE approaches you in the field - take out your cell phone and record the entire interaction - that is your "right" as obliged to you via the supreme court ruling of 2010. Never assume they are there to "help" you, they are not. They too want / need revenue, like LE stopping your for speeding.

Always know your rights, know the law to the best of your ability, and know you have the "right" to remain silent and not answer questions of any kind. Like "Hot-Dog / 3006", they are the investigators - let them figure it out. Do not incriminate / cooperate in anyway! Any attorney will tell you that...period!!! You did nothing wrong, don't let them convince you otherwise!!!!!

I certainly do not have a dog in this fight. For one thing I am a Canadian. But I have to agree with Aaron 100%...

Game wardens (in Canada) are there because ... 'you are guilty of something and I just have to figure out what it is.' That is an actual quote from a game warden to a friend.. I have experienced that many times in my lifetime.

That horrible attitude.

The idea of handcuffing a young man who does not have a hunting license is bloody criminal in my opinion. I can see why your friend was taking it so poorly ..

Years ago an old couple were fishing on a lake and a game warden came by to check licenses. The old lady said that she was not fishing and did not need to have a license. The game warden told her to shut her f$#%$% mouth until he was ready to talk to her.

An extreme example to be sure of. It turned out that the old man was the Member of the Legislative Assembly for the province of Alberta. The government in power.

The fish cop was fired, of course.

Abuse of power should never be tolerated.

To me ... it looks like they threw the book at that hunter and the penalty was beyond extreme.

I think that he should have walked .. along with ol' Aaron all those years ago ..

Not that anyone asked me ...

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:
I can't believe the BS that you're still putting out Aaron and now a couple others commenting on how all LEs are out to get you! ..................................................................................................................................................................!

Topgun .308 no one is listening to you no matter how loud you yell.
Rather than take up your "problem" with Aaron you choose to try the underhanded internet assassination trick, nice move for a dirtbag!
Just so everyone here knows old Topshot here PM'ed me and tried to run Aaron down in a PM, I let him know he should leave it alone and stop contacting me but he proceeded to PM me repeatedly and in the end accuse me of being a criminal as well, I bet he was one hell of a crooked cop in his day. He forgets "innocent until proven guilty " is the American way but that doesn't fly with old Top cop he is the Investigator, Judge Jury and arresting Officer, just ask him!

I think both side here are extreme.

There are bad LEOs. The system as it exists with regards to fish and game does not have the same legal rules as the rest of our jurisprudence.

That said, most conservation officers are trying to do right. Treat them politely and they usually reciprocate it. Face it, they are knowingly approaching folks in the field who have loaded weapons and are generally somewhat proficient in their use. That has to put some stress on them.

In my last 4-5 interactions with US F&W officers (as opposed to Africa) I got one warning (deserved) and one case where an office worker had no clue what the field folks need to do so refused to sent a officer over illegal shooting- but when I finally talked to the warden, he even gave me his personal cell number to get him if that happened again. The rest, they checked me, and wished me a good day.

I have been harassed by a "fish cop" in the past and was ticketed wrongly. Im not going to claim there are no bad apples or guys having bad days... Strangely, when I decided to fight the ticket, he didn't show in court either time, but that is really the exception and not the rule, at least here in MN.

Nothing "underhanded" was done and Snellstrom doesn't seem to have a high enough IQ to understand that Aaron brought this on all by himself. When he came on dissing every person that is in LE like he's been doing I "dished out" a little bit of his past to inform why he has such a jaded slant on LE people. FYI Aaron and I have settled our differences between the two of us and if you hadn't C/Pd that last post of mine it would have already been deleted, so here's an offer for you. I've gone ahead and deleted that last post, so why don't you also delete yours and we'll all gone on with life!

Topcop you won't get far insulting my IQ then asking me to do you a favor by deleting your insults.
Your arrogance is beyond belief.

quote:

Originally posted by Snellstrom:
Topcop you won't get far insulting my IQ then asking me to do you a favor by deleting your insults.
Your arrogance is beyond belief.

You are dumber than a stump, so there is another one regarding your IQ, LOL!! FYI I wanted you to delete that post like I did after talking with Aaron so there is nothing up in regards to what I mentioned about him in that one---DUH!!!!! PS: I also didn't accuse you of being a criminal, but I guess maybe you could have taken it that way based on your IQ!

Guys, I think its only fair for me to mention my correspondence with Top Gun this morning. It was very cordial, and we both said our peace! It would be unfair of me to lump all game/fish LE into one bunch, and TopGun made a good point of directing me to that conclusion. Regardless of our differences, he too deserves our respect for his 30+ yrs of LE service, and I definitely respect his devotion. I did apologize to him for any derogatory comments I made to him personally, that's not appropriate in any forum / public or private.

We all form our own impressions based on personal / life experience, I would be amiss not to say that in most cases my contact with LE has been very respectful, just as I am sure most of you would agree. We are not criminals, we are people that sometimes make minor mistakes, be it speeding, etc.

Regardless, I do believe every person should know their rights - but always do so with respectful demeanor when dealing with LE. They too have a job to do, and in many cases they are simply trying to uphold the law to the best of their ability as well.

Kind Regards,

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by Snellstrom:
Topcop you won't get far insulting my IQ then asking me to do you a favor by deleting your insults.
Your arrogance is beyond belief.

You are dumber than a stump, so there is another one regarding your IQ, LOL!! FYI I wanted you to delete that post like I did after talking with Aaron so there is nothing up in regards to what I mentioned about him in that one---DUH!!!!! PS: I also didn't accuse you of being a criminal, but I guess maybe you could have taken it that way based on your IQ!

That strikes me as a pretty damned childish post for a 30 year LEO to make (if that's really the case and I doubt it).

ismith: "That strikes me as a pretty damned childish post for a 30 year LEO to make (if that's really the case and I doubt it)."

Not childish at all and I wasn't a LEO!! I was an Investigator for the State of MI for over 30 years and didn't even carry on that job, although some of the places I was in I probably should have. Sorry, but I tell it like it is and don't mince words with anyone about anything. I like to deal with the same type or people who don't hide in a closet and if they have something on their mind then lay it out on the table. I see you haven't even been on this site for a month yet, so you'll need some time to read what others say to know the truth. PS: I retired on 7/1/2002 and am now 70 years old and still speak my piece and let others know what's on my mind whether they like it or not. I'm also like that face to face and not just out on the net in case you're wondering.

Thanks for posting the article Larryshores.

This POS wants to end the IWVC? Screw him. He got off easy. He should have been banned for life.

quote:

Originally posted by Navaluk:
Thanks for posting the article Larryshores.

This POS wants to end the IWVC? Screw him. He got off easy. He should have been banned for life.

In his capacity he sure knew what he was doing, especially after one reads the article posted above showing the timeline of applying after renting the house, drawing the tag, and then moving back to AZ within several weeks. ANYONE who says this was an honest mistake by someone with that many points even if they are a good friend and say he's such a great guy are barking up the wrong tree!

Who knows what he thought/intended. In the final analysis, he was convicted in a jury trial. That speaks volumes as does the fact that he does not want to appeal.

The guy who turned him is of questionable character in my opinion. He will never get dollar from me.

Interesting blog post on Eastmans today regarding the hacking incident(s)

http://blog.eastmans.com/youve...6-9211f7e036-9858541


In the last 18 months at least four western state game & fish licensing or park systems have apparently been hacked, along with Kentucky and another state the hacker claimed but didn’t identify. No evidence has surfaced of personal information taken or tags illicitly obtained. So, no worries, right? How secure are you that your identity and years of saved points are safe?

If you live in Idaho, Oregon or Washington, you’ll remember the September 2016 hacking of their systems. A hacker going by “Mr. High” posted that he had gained access to personal information in five Game and Fish sites or their licensing vendor, which in ID, OR and WA was Active Network.

Idaho and Washington suspended all license sales while they investigated, and Oregon suspended online sales. It turned out that the weakness only allowed access to information for those who had first started applying before 2006 or 2007. Active Network offered free identity repair services and according to the Idaho Statesman, claimed that it had patched the weakness “within 15 hours” and hired a “top-tier cybersecurity firm to conduct a review.”

That hack was disclosed by the hacker. But, what has been undisclosed or undiscovered? After all, there were 100,000 incidents hacks in 2015.

What if some tags are not going to the fortunate but to the nefarious? Would someone pay a full-time basement-dweller to hack their way to a bighorn sheep license without the auction price tag or many years of waiting?

Do wildlife agencies manage and pay for their own cybersecurity out of austere budgets? Can they detect every instance of unauthorized access? Are they able to go back and examine each bit of the draw, discover if any assigned random numbers were changed or check every applicant’s history to see if points jumped? Confirm every residency claim? If so, are those part of the process or just done for cause?

I just read a frightening Oregon Secretary of State audit report summary on their cybersecurity. They surveyed 13 state agencies, including ODFW. They found that three agencies “did not have sufficient network monitoring tools in place to identify potentially malicious traffic,” and one “had an older wireless network that allowed access to internal resources without appropriate identification and authentication.”

The report also found that “user management issues are pervasive,” “security patches are not always applied…Security staffing was generally insufficient, and critical security functions were not always performed.” The final scorecard – “more than half of the agencies had security weaknesses in six of the seven fundamental security controls reviewed.” Oregon is now working on centralizing data security.

I have heard or read several reports lately of clandestine breaching of Fish & Game websites and boasts of what was done. Whether they are true, I can’t say, though charges have been filed in one case.

On the other side, several states have new, probably more secure systems. I was very encouraged with CPW’s cybersecurity after discussing process and monitoring with people in Denver, including the draw coordinator. Still, like rust, hackers never sleep.

We’ve seen some high-profile big game poaching cases lately. So, what do you think? How likely is electronic poaching or ID theft?

Very possible.

Dumb asses like me wouldn’t have a clue how to go about it. However, I am confident that there are some who know how to go about it.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Who knows what he thought/intended. In the final analysis, he was convicted in a jury trial. That speaks volumes as does the fact that he does not want to appeal.

The guy who turned him is of questionable character in my opinion. He will never get dollar from me.

Are you saying that you wouldn't turn people in like he did if you know someone has violated the law? If that's what you're saying, it speaks volumes about you too from my perspective! If not, I apologize in advance!

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Who knows what he thought/intended. In the final analysis, he was convicted in a jury trial. That speaks volumes as does the fact that he does not want to appeal.

The guy who turned him is of questionable character in my opinion. He will never get dollar from me.

Are you saying that you wouldn't turn people in like he did if you know someone has violated the law? If that's what you're saying, it speaks volumes about you too from my perspective! If not, I apologize in advance!

That isn’t my point at all. I have personally witnessed the antagonism between outfitters in Utah. It is beyond ridiculous. This case seems to be on the edge at best. So when one outfitter reports another in that state for something less than a clear cut violation AND gets a tag himself in the process, I have to question that. If the sheep was shot out of season it would be a different story.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Who knows what he thought/intended. In the final analysis, he was convicted in a jury trial. That speaks volumes as does the fact that he does not want to appeal.

The guy who turned him is of questionable character in my opinion. He will never get dollar from me.

Are you saying that you wouldn't turn people in like he did if you know someone has violated the law? If that's what you're saying, it speaks volumes about you too from my perspective! If not, I apologize in advance!

That isn’t my point at all. I have personally witnessed the antagonism between outfitters in Utah. It is beyond ridiculous. This case seems to be on the edge at best. So when one outfitter reports another in that state for something less than a clear cut violation AND gets a tag himself in the process, I have to question that. If the sheep was shot out of season it would be a different story.

Antagonism or not between the outfitters and whether it borders on the ridiculous is not the point. The guy was turned in because the person knew he was not a legal resident of Utah to draw that tag, so it was a clear cut violation, and whether he got anything for turning him in is also not the point. ANYONE who knows a person cheated to get an almost impossible to draw tag or for any other significant law violation should turn the person in is the point! The sheep may as well have been taken out of season because it was taken illegally, poached if you will and that is why the penalty is so severe, including his loss of privileges for ten years in almost all of the states and then he has the ball to say the Wildlife Violator Compact between the states should be revoked, LOL! That alone tells me he's not a true sportsman if that is his comment about the outcome.

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Who knows what he thought/intended. In the final analysis, he was convicted in a jury trial. That speaks volumes as does the fact that he does not want to appeal.

The guy who turned him is of questionable character in my opinion. He will never get dollar from me.

Are you saying that you wouldn't turn people in like he did if you know someone has violated the law? If that's what you're saying, it speaks volumes about you too from my perspective! If not, I apologize in advance!

That isn’t my point at all. I have personally witnessed the antagonism between outfitters in Utah. It is beyond ridiculous. This case seems to be on the edge at best. So when one outfitter reports another in that state for something less than a clear cut violation AND gets a tag himself in the process, I have to question that. If the sheep was shot out of season it would be a different story.

Antagonism or not between the outfitters and whether it borders on the ridiculous is not the point. The guy was turned in because the person knew he was not a legal resident of Utah to draw that tag, so it was a clear cut violation, and whether he got anything for turning him in is also not the point. ANYONE who knows a person cheated to get an almost impossible to draw tag or for any other significant law violation should turn the person in is the point! The sheep may as well have been taken out of season because it was taken illegally, poached if you will and that is why the penalty is so severe, including his loss of privileges for ten years in almost all of the states and then he has the ball to say the Wildlife Violator Compact between the states should be revoked, LOL! That alone tells me he's not a true sportsman if that is his comment about the outcome.

Top gun, that's a pretty far stretch, as far as I'm concerned. Altimus didn't poach a ram, he took a sheep on a tag issued by the State of Utah. Had he not drawn that tag, someone else would have and they'd have shot a ram too. The only extra sheep I see being shot here is if Adam Bronson was awarded a tag. Also, I'm betting that if Altimus had continued to live in Kanab through the time of his hunt and then moved back to Arizona, there would have been no violation. So, is he guilty of poaching a ram or just moving out of Utah too soon?

In either case, a 10 year suspension is beyond extreme. That is punitive vindication, nothing else.

quote:

Originally posted by DLS:

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by Topgun 30-06:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Who knows what he thought/intended. In the final analysis, he was convicted in a jury trial. That speaks volumes as does the fact that he does not want to appeal.

The guy who turned him is of questionable character in my opinion. He will never get dollar from me.

Are you saying that you wouldn't turn people in like he did if you know someone has violated the law? If that's what you're saying, it speaks volumes about you too from my perspective! If not, I apologize in advance!

That isn’t my point at all. I have personally witnessed the antagonism between outfitters in Utah. It is beyond ridiculous. This case seems to be on the edge at best. So when one outfitter reports another in that state for something less than a clear cut violation AND gets a tag himself in the process, I have to question that. If the sheep was shot out of season it would be a different story.

Antagonism or not between the outfitters and whether it borders on the ridiculous is not the point. The guy was turned in because the person knew he was not a legal resident of Utah to draw that tag, so it was a clear cut violation, and whether he got anything for turning him in is also not the point. ANYONE who knows a person cheated to get an almost impossible to draw tag or for any other significant law violation should turn the person in is the point! The sheep may as well have been taken out of season because it was taken illegally, poached if you will and that is why the penalty is so severe, including his loss of privileges for ten years in almost all of the states and then he has the ball to say the Wildlife Violator Compact between the states should be revoked, LOL! That alone tells me he's not a true sportsman if that is his comment about the outcome.

Top gun, that's a pretty far stretch, as far as I'm concerned. Altimus didn't poach a ram, he took a sheep on a tag issued by the State of Utah. Had he not drawn that tag, someone else would have and they'd have shot a ram too. The only extra sheep I see being shot here is if Adam Bronson was awarded a tag. Also, I'm betting that if Altimus had continued to live in Kanab through the time of his hunt and then moved back to Arizona, there would have been no violation. So, is he guilty of poaching a ram or just moving out of Utah too soon?

In either case, a 10 year suspension is beyond extreme. That is punitive vindication, nothing else.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on everything you said because when you take an animal illegally, which he did, and was prosecuted and found guilty by unanimous decision by the jury, it's a major violation whether you want to call it poaching or anything else that suits your fancy. Your comment about the person who turned him in is also ridiculous because whether he got a tag or not he did the right thing IMHO by turning in a violator. Yes, the penalties were severe and should be when you look at the difficulty of a NR drawing that tag in their lifetime!
Then Altimus comes along and cheats the system and all hunters who were trying to draw a sheep tag in Utah to kill another sheep of which he already had many under his belt along with his wife before he chose to do what he did. I have absolutely no sympathy for him doing what he did and getting caught. Then he has the balls to say that the WVC should be revoked. No, it's because of that Act that will possibly be more of a deterrent to stop shit like this and other major violations. It should stay like it is and the few other states that aren't in it should join!

I find the conversation between Aaron and TopGun regarding LEO's most interesting. Let me relate a recent chain of events I personally had to endure:

I belong to a hunting club in Clayton, AL and hunt there for deer every January during their rut. We lease over 1500 acres of land, and the president of our club is the Circuit Court Judge for Montgomery County, AL. Most of the 12 or so members are attorneys or well respected local businessmen from southern Alabama. One morning, I was sitting in a box blind overlooking a food plot when a very large black man approached me and identified himself as a Game Warden. He asked for my hunting license, which I gave him. He asked me if I was using corn for bait, and I told him that since that's illegal, I didn't. He walked all around the blind, polluting the area with his scent, which ruined my hunt for that morning. I came into our clubhouse for lunch and went back out to a different ladder stand about ¼ mile from my morning stand. at 3:00 PM, a different warden walks up to my stand and asked for my license and if I was using corn. He ruined my afternoon hunt, so I bagged it and went back to our clubhouse. The very next day, I was driving on a public dirt road leading out of our clubhouse and the same warden from the previous afternoon stopped me. I told him I still had my license, and if he wanted to search my car for corn, he was welcome to. That same afternoon, the same black Game Warden drives up a private dirt road on our lease right up to the box blind I was sitting in. I greeted him by name, and said that this must be some kind of record: a law abiding hunter stopped FOUR times in two days for doing absolutely nothing wrong. He proceeded to walk the entire perimeter of the 400 yard X 100 yard greenfield I was sitting over, looking for evidence of corn. When I asked him why I was singled out for such treatment, his response was..." we got a report of baiting with corn in this area." Obviously, he was lying because our club would never break the law regarding illegal baiting. I sarcastically thanked him for ruining two whole days of hunting after I had driven 825 miles one way to hunt on my club. So I empathize 100% with Arron regarding LEO's.

quote:

Originally posted by Bud Meadows:
I find the conversation between Aaron and TopGun regarding LEO's most interesting. Let me relate a recent chain of events I personally had to endure:

I belong to a hunting club in Clayton, AL and hunt there for deer every January during their rut. We lease over 1500 acres of land, and the president of our club is the Circuit Court Judge for Montgomery County, AL. Most of the 12 or so members are attorneys or well respected local businessmen from southern Alabama. One morning, I was sitting in a box blind overlooking a food plot when a very large black man approached me and identified himself as a Game Warden. He asked for my hunting license, which I gave him. He asked me if I was using corn for bait, and I told him that since that's illegal, I didn't. He walked all around the blind, polluting the area with his scent, which ruined my hunt for that morning. I came into our clubhouse for lunch and went back out to a different ladder stand about ¼ mile from my morning stand. at 3:00 PM, a different warden walks up to my stand and asked for my license and if I was using corn. He ruined my afternoon hunt, so I bagged it and went back to our clubhouse. The very next day, I was driving on a public dirt road leading out of our clubhouse and the same warden from the previous afternoon stopped me. I told him I still had my license, and if he wanted to search my car for corn, he was welcome to. That same afternoon, the same black Game Warden drives up a private dirt road on our lease right up to the box blind I was sitting in. I greeted him by name, and said that this must be some kind of record: a law abiding hunter stopped FOUR times in two days for doing absolutely nothing wrong. He proceeded to walk the entire perimeter of the 400 yard X 100 yard greenfield I was sitting over, looking for evidence of corn. When I asked him why I was singled out for such treatment, his response was..." we got a report of baiting with corn in this area." Obviously, he was lying because our club would never break the law regarding illegal baiting. I sarcastically thanked him for ruining two whole days of hunting after I had driven 825 miles one way to hunt on my club. So I empathize 100% with Arron regarding LEO's.

So you're saying that because of two GWs that said they were acting on a tip that there was illegal baiting going on ruined your hunt had to be lying since none of your people would ever violate the law, LOL? News flash---First, there was no reason to throw in that one was a big black man unless maybe you're a racist. FYI there are GWs of both sexes and various races just like LEOs in the PDs throughout our country! Second, I guess you also aren't aware that the professions you mentioned have just as much of a percentage of law violators, alcoholics, etc. than blue collar workers! Third, unless they were disrespectful to you on any of those encounters, and you didn't mention that they were, then it sounds like they were just doing their job. Fourth, did it not occur to you that just maybe they felt that since they checked the place one day that a person would figure that they wouldn't be back such that said person would then put out corn the following day? Fifth, did it also not occur to you that if the members are who you said that just maybe one of them pissed off someone in court who then called in that tip to get back at them? Sorry you had that happen, but it doesn't make all LEOs or GWs bad fellows like it sounds you are intimating just like Aaron did earlier in this thread and then apologized for making that improper accusation!