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Originally posted by Echoanne12:
Scott,
Since when did making a poor shot on an animal contained behind a high fence and then taking two days to find the animal qualify as "fair chase hunting"? Is that really your definition of hunting - Fair Chase or not?

For example, every year the Arizona Game and Fish Department in their hunting regulations booklet publishes the definition of Fair Chase. It closely resembles what I've posted, what the B & C Club says, and what The Wildlife Society and other professionals trained in the field of wildlife management believe. It makes no mention of Fair Chase being associated with the time it takes to find a wounded animal. So is the Arizona Game and Fish Dept. wrong and you are right when it comes to what classifies as Fair Chase hunting?

Since when did the "if I believe it is then it must be" philosophy become the basis of forming one's opinion? If I believe the earth is flat and the moon is made of green cheese does that mean they are?

I'll stick with expert third party professionally trained wildlife managers to formulate my position on what constitutes Fair Chase hunting.

I've been on so called "large" high fence hunting ranches in Namibia and hunted right beside some in Texas. Never lowered myself to go on those places and attempt to shoot or kill animals. The only one that is ignorant is the guy who thinks he is "hunting" on a high fence property in south Georgia that is fenced soley for the purpose of reducing the chance of poaching.

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but to each their own

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Originally posted by ted thorn:
Jorge

Congratulations on a successful elk trip to the Broadmouth Canyon Preserve.

I'm glad you had a good time and the end results were a handsome elk of your liking.

This type of trip is not really my cup of tea but I can understand why folks stand on two sides of this discussion

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Originally posted by Echoanne12:
Scott and Larry,
Not my opinion - just fact from recognized authorities in the field of hunting much smarter than you or I! Larry, maybe I can recommend you drive about 90 miles southwest of your home in Orlando to Lecanto, Florida and "hunt" at a place called Ross Hammock Ranch. It is all of 1600 acres and advertises itself as "fair chase hunting". Pick out what you want to "hunt" from a menu. Hell they even advertise on their web site "fair chase hunting".
But at least I know that you two guys have more knowledge than the Boone and Crockett Club and The Wildlife Society. Keith Warren in Texas and Ted Nugent would be proud of you guys as are all the anti hunters who decry and publicize for their financial gain all the "merits" of high fence killing!

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Originally posted by jorge:
Maybe I should add a "find-a-fence.com" for all the Jeremiah Johnson purists?

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Originally posted by jorge:
Thanks, some more views of the place.

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Originally posted by larryshores:

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Originally posted by jorge:
Thanks, some more views of the place.

What is that white thing in the bottom there ?

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Originally posted by Kamo Gari:

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Originally posted by larryshores:

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Originally posted by jorge:
Thanks, some more views of the place.

What is that white thing in the bottom there ?

That's the pen holding the elk they're about to release, silly.

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Originally posted by jorge:

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Originally posted by Kamo Gari:

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Originally posted by larryshores:

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Originally posted by jorge:
Thanks, some more views of the place.

What is that white thing in the bottom there ?

That's the pen holding the elk they're about to release, silly.

Over here now are we? Coming from a Massachusetts yankee, that's rich. IT's the maintenance yard for the heavy equipment. The place is way off the grid and when winter comes, lots of digging out is required.

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Originally posted by Bigasanelk:
What's the point of this thread? On their website Broadmouth Canyon clearly states that it's a high fence operation. The elk are ordered as if off a menu and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what goes on inside the fence. Not exactly my "cup of tea" but who am I to tell someone else how to spend their money. What did the OP expect?

The 'Antis' don't care about "fair chase," they are opposed to hunting in ANY form.

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The elk are ordered as if off a menu

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Originally posted by jorge:


Over here now are we? Coming from a Massachusetts yankee, that's rich. IT's the maintenance yard for the heavy equipment. The place is way off the grid and when winter comes, lots of digging out is required.

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Originally posted by jorge:
Check mine carefully, you're not the only one that can bust chops... Yes, I know you've been here a long time, just never saw you post on one of my threads before, at least not here.

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Originally posted by Echoanne12:
That's the Yeti, Sasquatch, or Big Foot penned up and dyed white in advance of Scott Powell's upcoming high fence shoot or kill.

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Originally posted by Poyntman:

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Originally posted by Echoanne12:
That's the Yeti, Sasquatch, or Big Foot penned up and dyed white in advance of Scott Powell's upcoming high fence shoot or kill.

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Originally posted by justanotherhunter:
jorge, glad you had a good hunt. I do have a question though, as I too had read on their site that the herd is self-propagating. How many hunters/bulls per year do they take off that property? From some of the numbers I've seen, I don't think a truly self propagating herd could possibly support 1/3 or 1/4 the harvest that seems to go on for that size of place.

And I ask in large part because I am considering this hunt for my wife in the next couple years, so not in any way as a dig on the enterprise.

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Originally posted by Skyline:
I haven't read the whole thread, but didn't I read somewhere that Broadmouth Canyon Ranch had some problems with chronic wasting disease recently? I believe they had a number of elk test positive and the state of Utah Game and Fish department had gotten involved.

Addition:

Just looked it up on the net and it seems Broadmouth bought 11 bulls from another elk ranch. The ranch they bought the bulls from ended up having some elk test positive for CWD and then one of the bulls that were bought and released at Broadmouth came back positive for CWD. I gather the rest of the bulls were killed and the game department was also going to kill the wild deer and moose on the ranch to test them as they had been potentially exposed.

I could be wrong of course, but that certainly sounds like Broadmouth has been buying bulls to release them on the ranch to kill. It is pretty common, as most ranches just aren't big enough to crank out a large number of trophy bulls every year that are born and raised on the ranch.

They is undoubtedly more information out there, but I just thought that was interesting based on what I have found and read so far.

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Originally posted by Atkinson:
I think we must take into consideration that most of South Africa is high fenced hunting and that seems to be acceptable to most. Much of the USA is high fence hunting and that seems not to acceptable to many..In many cases the high fence is to keep out poachers as opposed to keep in game, such as in So. Africa wherein they are surrounded by tribal land. I have seen the same in Texas on ranches that border Mexico, but to a lesser extent.

I believe if the land parcel is such that an animal can escape, then its probably fair chase such as the above 40 mile fenced hunt.

The bottom line however is if its legal, if the hunter is oK with it, this is America and we do have free choice.

I think we should take into consideration that everything has boundreys...Even Tanzania, the last vestage of free chase hunts, has concession that limit hunting space, is that free chase. I think so..

IMO, such decisions should be left to the guy that's spending his bucks on a hunt and how he feels about it..most judgements are just that, nobodys business but the hunter or shooter, whatever the case may be. I personally have done a few fenced hunts, and its not my preference, but neither is blind shooting and certainly that's acceptable but I see little difference in bushwacking a buck over corn than shooting him on walking hunt behind a wire fence!

We need to be careful about judgements, most live in a glass house has been my opine based on years in the hunting business..Those who condem the loudest usually have a skeleton in their closet, holy'er than thou is easy to post.