Outdoor Wire snippet:

The U.S. Forest Service is imposing travel restrictions on off-road vehicles across the country, reversing a principle that said areas were considered all areas open "unless designated closed". The new regulations seem to establish that all areas should be presumed "closed unless designated open."

The net of the ruling means that off-road vehicles will only be allowed on trails marked on new travel maps currently being drawn up for each national forest. Those new maps, we're told, will exclude some very popular existing routes.

The reasoning behind the decision is the burgeoning popularity of off-road vehicles. Land managers say they can't adequately handle the network of illegal trails created by ATVs. In fact, the land managers say there are thousands of miles of illegal ("user-created") trails in the national forests.

And ATVs continue to grow in popularity with hunters, anglers and recreational riders who have purchased more than 10 million four-wheelers and dirt bikes since 1995. That number of ATVs, officials say, even if only 1-2 percent stray off-route produces a cumulative impact that is tremendous.

The maps are being created today, and will gradually be phased in over the next two years at which time all routes will be either open or closed. ATVers caught on the closed routes will be ticketed.

Today, there are complaints that the maps - available at only a few locations - aren't really much help. Critics say they're printed in black and white and don't show any landmarks, making navigation difficult.

The federal travel rule isn't really new. It was established in 2005 but has only been applied to a few national forests nationwide.

The changes in each district become official as soon as the maps are available, with some not expected until 2010, creating the potential for varying rules across boundary lines. At this point, however, the Forest Service has closed 2 million acres that have been open to cross-country travel.

Ultimately, the Forest Service says it is seeking to restrict motor vehicles to designated routes on all 193 million acres.

Conservationists are praising the decision, and as you can imagine, some ATV proponents are livid.

But not all.

Jack Welch, of the motorized users advocacy group Blue Ribbon Coalition, says most people he's been in contact with think the decision "appropriate." But both sides have admitted concern over which trails make lists of "official" routes.

Tony
Thanks for the update; to me there is nothing worse than spending the time, money and effort to get into a "roadless" area for a quality hunt only to have cheaters on ATVs come roaring in. It's happened to me in CO, WY, VA and MT.
Very aggravating. Like poachers, illegal ATV users are the problem, not the amount of open/closed roads. The illegal guys don't care what's open and what's not. A clear designation of where you can and where you cannot ride would go a long way toward keeping honest ATVers from making mistakes, and forewarn walk-in hunters about where not to try to hunt.

Walt

It's about time. I wish they would have restricted the things long ago. I don't mind if somebody old or crippled uses one to get into the country, but there are way too many of them running around in the backcountry.

I've had more than 1 stalk ruined by somebody blasting over the hill on one of these noisy contraptions. What ever happend to stalking and hiking? We should be emphasising those type of skills rather than teaching the youth to ride around on a gas fume belching machinen with a rifle slung over their back.

If it was up to me, I'd outright ban the things during the hunting season with the exception of the old and handicapped.

Mac

Thank God.

I dispise the f*cking things. I'd like to burn every one of them I see. Of course what you DON'T SEE is one that's parked with no one on it.

They've ruined one of the most productive public land bull elk hunts in AZ with those damn things. Extra roads cut everywhere now. Trails cut right through traditional elk bedding areas. Elk long gone...

Don't get me started....



Ban 'em for good!

Lazy bastards, hike or don't f*ck'n hunt! OK, the 1 to 2 percent of handicapped hunters, go for it, heck ya, use them. BUT the rest of you lazy f*n slobs, learn some f*n ethics!

Whew, OK, I feel better...Prozac's kickin in again...

I bet that'll get some replies!

I agree with this completely. I had a perfect hunt get messed up last season on a really nice buck just to watch it run down the canyon right before I got in position to shoot. I quad came running up the road and spooked the deer out of his bed.

I did find his quad Slowpoke slim. It was parked down the ridge and It was hard to resist doing anything to it but I left it alone and called the sheriff so they came and took and made him walk out.

It's about time. Only the manufacturers are to blame with there completely a**hole ads showing people tearing up the landscape.

Might ought to be careful what ya ask for. I'm not to happy with ATVers myself but this is a bigger issue. This is a US Gvt entity restricting access to public land. More government restrictions that will surely fall on all of us in time. There are too many activist groups ou there watching these kind of actions and will use them to stop all hunting if possible. There needs to be a better way to control them than by denying access. Public land needs to stay just that.

That's the whole problem with multiple use management; hunters end up on the short end of the stick. The government has no problem telling me where I can and cannot hunt, then by the same token I expect (demand) that other users of public land have the same constraints; if we are to share the land and resources then it has to be handled equitably. If we're going to have ATV trails, horse trails, foot trails, roadless areas, open access areas, wilderness, etc etc then respect the users that pay for access (hunters, as far as I know, are the only ones required to buy a "use stamp" for National Forest access)and give us a break by restricting other uses during the time of the year we are on the forest, and for Pete's sake hire qualified biologists that recognize where non-hunting access has the potential of damaging wildlife resources. I would love it if the govt would put things on a paying basis and stop bowing down to the non-paying tree-huggers; if hunters are the only ones paying for access, then hunters should be the ones that decide how that access is handled.

quote:

This is a US Gvt entity restricting access to public land.

Why? Don't you have access to a good pair of hiking boots or a horse? The number #1 group responsible for limiting public access to PUBLIC land in Wyoming is private land owners.

I say piss on ATV's!! They are a good tool if used responsibly, but NO ONE DOES!!!

Be sure to watch out for those black helicopters flying around 30378....

MG

378,

Nobody has said anything about restricting anyone's right regarding the accessing of public land. What is addressed is just the way it is accessed. No different than making areas designated Wilderness Areas or walk in only. These things are destroying a lot of habitat and it is past time to do something about it.

Bottom line is that the people that use them, for the most part anyway, show absolutely no respect for others in the wood. I admit that statement does not include everyone in the country, but most people I've seen with them are abusing the privilege. I'm willing to cut some slack to someone that is handicapped and old, but too many of our youth are learning to hunt by methods that, in my opinion, are borderline unethical.

I've spent my entire adult life hunting the Rockies and I can count on 1 hand the number of times I've seen an ATV parked. Every one I see has somebody riding around with a firearm/bow looking for game and riding the trails. A sign listing an area as closed to motor vehicles doesn't mean much to a lot of the people riding them, they just go around the sign and keep going. Every season I find ATV tracks along trails on public land that are clearly posted as closed to any motorized vehicle traffic. This usually runs the game onto rpivate property and then nobody can get to the game.

Used to be, we saw a lot of horse trailers being towed into the mountains during the hunting season. Now, it is trailers full of ATV's. Nobody seems to want to walk or earn their game the old fashioned way with sweat and shoe leather. And that speaks very badly to our future. Remember one very important fact, if the right to hunt was put up to a national vote right now, we would probably lose that right. And it is our image that will kill us.

Leave the things at home and come experience the majesty of the high country the way it should be experienced.

Mac

Totally concur with this ruling. Too many hunters, both in-state and out-of-state, use the ATVs to actually chase after herds. The normal rider is 25 or younger, not the elderly who really could use one at times. Also, from what I've seen, it is not the few who are causing the problem for the majority, but the majority of ATVs causing problems for the few who use them properly.

I despise ATVs and the people who abuse their privileges with them, so I say "THANK YOU!" for the enactment of the ruling.

It's about time.

I have health issues and could benefit from one, but I don't even think about it. As a whole, those things -- and their oft-thoughtless occupants -- do far more harm than good.

I think only to be fair they should ban horses and mules as well. I've been fortunate to not have hunts blown by ATVs but, I've had plenty of idiots ride all around me on horses spooking everything around. If you are going to ban one, you should ban all IMO.

Can you imagine the quality of hunts in public areas only accessable by foot....

Reloader

Reloader,

With all due respect...

Most of the people I see on ATVs hunting could certainly use the extra excercise offered by 'walking'. I'm all for banning the use of ATVs for hunting all together but then I don't hunt where they are allowed anyway.

I wonder how long before they pass rules agains firearms, after all, they are noisier than ATVs and people are just annoyed by hunters, especially conservationists.

John

That's a pretty "interesting" leap in logic there Boar Hunter...

I think that when they CATCH an ATV'r using one across country, or area designated no motor-vehicle/off road access, whether they are a hunter or not, they should immediately confiscate the ATV and MAKE the violator WATCH THEM BURN IT to the f*n ground!

Then give them a ticket for the offense, and a bill for the damage to the habitat, and clean up from the burn!

I despise the things. They tear up the natural world that I like to hike into. The fools cross and re-cross streams, sending dirt down into a formerly clear stream. ATVers seem to believe that they have the right to create new roads through MY wilderness. Some places aren't nature anymore, they're a criss-cross of wheel tracks. Where I like to go, those tracks/ruts are almost forever. A few riders are responsible, but very few.
Footprints and hoof marks leave the area just fine, ATV's destroy.
I fail to see that anybody has a right to turn MY wild Idaho into a trash heap.

quote:

Originally posted by Reloader:
I think only to be fair they should ban horses and mules as well. I've been fortunate to not have hunts blown by ATVs but, I've had plenty of idiots ride all around me on horses spooking everything around. If you are going to ban one, you should ban all IMO.

Can you imagine the quality of hunts in public areas only accessable by foot....

Reloader

I also put horses in with atvs also.

Dang, when I saw this thread I thought I'd be in minority. I'm glad to see them go as well. ATV's are fun for one but too often they impede on other's fun. Maybe if they'd impose this in Miss. they would get taken off the "fat" list. LOL

quote:

Originally posted by prof242:
Totally concur with this ruling. Too many hunters, both in-state and out-of-state, use the ATVs to actually chase after herds. The normal rider is 25 or younger, not the elderly who really could use one at times. Also, from what I've seen, it is not the few who are causing the problem for the majority, but the majority of ATVs causing problems for the few who use them properly.

Couldn't have said it any better myself!

friar

I AM SO OFFENDED AT ALL OF YOU!!!!!!

How in the world is a 400# chain smoking, "Scent Lock" wearing, boom box blasting, Cabelas cowboy like myself going to get out an enjoy the outdoors and hunting unless I'm perched atop my 600cc, 4x4, independent axle, blah blah blah atv?

Especially you Madgoat, you suggest I use hiking boots while hunting?!??!?!?!

Outrageous!

I need some more Oreo's.

Good one Scott,

You've opened my eyes to a different point of view. My opinion's changed completely now...

There is a place for ATV's in hunting in my opinion. We use them to retrieve game. I only use my ATV on my land and for getting older hunters in and out of stands and the woods. So there is a place for ATV's in the hunting world.


But I don't think ATV riders should be able to go where they want. There should be limited access during hunting season.

On one's own land, use them where, how, and when you want. On Public land, they should be confined to roads or marked trails, or to hauling camp supplies or game--but not allowed to hunt from, ie, no loaded weapons while on an ATV. And obviously, none on "designated wilderness" areas. My $0.02 worth.

I truly hate these things but there is a potentially bigger problem. The Forest service is a government agency which will claim to be under staffed, lazy, and not into law enforcement (You ever see one of these people outside of a green truck?). Their approach to this problem here in Colorado is to just close off whole areas to all vehicles, even established 4wd roads. It is much easier to close it all off where the pavement ends, than it is to go into the woods during hunting season and actually catch those that are behaving badly. So what this means is that if the road you have used for the last 30 years fails to make the magic list of designated trails it may get bulldozed. The FS also uses this tactic when their budgets get cut: "We don't have the budget to maintain the area..." so they just close it.
What they need to do is get some folks on the ground and burn some of these idiots, then maybe the word would get out, but don't hold your breath.
C.G.B.

It appears to me that all of you have overlooked the real problem here...enforcement. How are new rules gonna work when the old ones didnt. There is nothing more infuriating than having a hike, stalk, camp out or wade screwed up by someone else incoincideratness but applauding new laws GOD FORBID when by yalls own admissions the old ones dont work. You guys are pissing in the wind. Write letters for more enforcement, tougher penelties, etc. Start a "minuteman" group for this problem.

Perry

quote:

Originally posted by perry:
There is nothing more infuriating than having a hike, stalk, camp out or wade screwed up by someone else
Perry

a wade ???

quote:

Originally posted by Slowpoke Slim:
That's a pretty "interesting" leap in logic there Boar Hunter...

When our government issued Social Security Cards, they promisd us it wouldn't be used as a national ID card too. Hmmm, can't work without one, can bank without one, and they ask for it on almost everything financial these days. My point is, you bet that our days for hunting forest land are being numbered. If you don't think there isn't a group of people out there not wanting to do away with firearms and hunting, you are being naive. First will go the OHV vehicles, then camping, then hunting, then the lands will be totally off limit to humans to preserve the natural habitat of the norwegian tree grub. It is coming, and everyone is cheering so long as they think they are immune.

John

So Boar Hunter,

I'm curious on your take on this...

Do you think this doomsday will come faster, or slower if we continue to allow assholes on ATV's to destroy natural habitat and treat the wild lands as their personal dirt track?

What say you?

jb,
I spend a lot of time wade fishing on the Texas coast. You'll be fishing and some @$$hole will pull in a 100 yards down from the direction you are wading ruining your "wade". They typically have no idea how to fish so they wait to see someone catching fish and slide in on their action, really frustrating. Same mentality as someone tearing up trails for their own pleasure with complete disregard for others that will come after them.

perry

quote:

Originally posted by Slowpoke Slim:
So Boar Hunter,

I'm curious on your take on this...

Do you think this doomsday will come faster, or slower if we continue to allow assholes on ATV's to destroy natural habitat and treat the wild lands as their personal dirt track?

What say you?

Some folks just can't play well with others.

John

snowmachines are just as bat at tearing up the lands as atv's. i see there trails from the air flying from village to village . atv's are the main means of transpotatain up here in the summer! the atvs are limited to the roads,boardwalks and trails around the villages. atv's have a place in the woods it's called the roads and marked tails that are open to them .