I posted this already in the Wildcat subforum, but I wanted it in the Medium bore subforum. If I knew how to delete it from the first subforum, I would for clarity's sake. Mods, feel free to delete the Wildcat post if you want.

QUESTION: If Ruger were to develope the 358 Ruger Magnum and Hornady would supply the factory ammo, would you buy one?

Being an unapologetic 35 caliber fan, I own 35 Whelens and a 358 STA. I've always wanted a 358 Norma Magnum, but I'd rather have the above round.

Any other 35 caliber fans out there who would be interestd also?

I would cross my fingers and hope the loads were 225 grain (folks seem to like 225 grain bullets though I do not perso), 250 grain (common 358 bullet weight), and here would be the champion and deal maker for me 275 grain bullet.

I do not see them doing it. They would just under cut the 375 Ruger. With the down turn in Africa hunting and a few jurisdictions still holding to minimum cartridge, I just do not see the market.

However, if they would with a 275 or 270 grain bullet at 2660-2750 fps. Yes and thank you, can I get the rifle without a muzzle break.

I would have thought the Nolsar line of cartridges would have motivated Ruger to do a full line of standard length cartridges; nope. The RCMs failure came bc folks wanted full performance. The RCMs did not give full performance p, but near full recoil. Where is the advantage. The RCM failure scared the CEO and bean counters off. But I could be wrong.

Like you with the 358 Norma, I always wanted a 358 STA. But a SS Hawkeye African in laminated stock and 24 inch barrel would be perfect.

Forgive me for asking, but can we see your 358s.

quote:

I do not see them doing it. They would just under cut the 375 Ruger. With the down turn in Africa hunting and a few jurisdictions still holding to minimum cartridge, I just do not see the market.

This pretty much says it all.

A .375 Ruger necked to .338 makes a lot more sense.

The 275 grain 358 bullet has good ballistics at 2750 fps. I think the bullet is “superior” to the 250 338 or 270 grain 375 given equal design and construction. When I was in college, I thought I wa really smart whe I asked my history professor what he thought about such a cartridge based on a 8mm Rem. He smiled at me and told me to google the 358STA.

But folks have never accepted it. Bc the 338 on one side is almost as much and the 375 is as much on the other end. Then you add in that these calibers have decades of acceptance. While the 358 was relegated to short lever action cartridges with lighter bullets that especially with conventional bullet design were not up to bolt action snuff.

Even the 358 Whelen is not what a 358 should be. Now, what that created was a mild medium bore that was easily shooting and a good step up from the 30/06. But the 225 and 250 grain loads are not seen as superior to the 338WM.

A heavy 358 is just too close to the 338WM and 375 for the majors to take a flyer. Maybe a Lipsey’s run.

I want to be wrong.

35 Newton?

I would probably order it the day it became available!

Having a 35 whelen, 350 remington magnum and a 35 remington.... I think I am set.

yes -- and 338

would prefer it shortened for short action - stainless and good stock, irons and yeah,.. lets do that

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
35 Newton?

Forgot about that one. The Newton line of cartidges were ahead of their time. They by all accounts I have read are rare even when they were available.

Please do not shorten the case. If Ruger would have done a full line on the standard length case instead if the RCMs, we would have had something. I agree on your rifle lay out.

Surestrike check your PMs.

I forgot to mention on this thread (had it on the Wildcat thread), that I envisioned the 358 Ruger Magnum on the full length 375 Ruger case, to closely compete with (or better) the 358 Norma Mag.

LHeym500: I agree with much of what you wrote. I too want no muzzle brakes on any of my rifles. Just my preference. I too am only really interested in the heavier bullets; 250, 275/280, & 310. I am photo posting challenged, but if one of my AR friends would also like to see them and can post (like my friends Frostbit or RIP), I would be happy to share. I have too many Whelens to post, but only one 358STA. The STA is a Winchester Custom Shop, SS/synthetic. Don't know if you're interested in seeing such, or just nice walnut custom rifles. One of the Whelens is a Dakota Classic Deluxe with nice walnut, open sights, quarter rib, black forend tip, etc.

Boomie: Like you, I appreciate classic, old cartridges. You and I seem to have a love affair with the 350 Rigby as well, although I do not own one. Yet...
The reason I like the idea of the 358 Ruger Magnum (full length), is the closeness ballistically with the 358 Norma & the Newton, but with factory rifles and ammo, IF Ruger/Hornady did indeed decide to produce such. Brass, bullets, etc. would begin to appear on the market, although I am pretty happy with all of the available bullets in 35 caliber these days. However, I wouldn't mind if Northfork and Swift both made a 310!

VAPO and Jeffeoso: I agree! Why not a 338 also? More practical I suppose. However, this does not address the 35 caliber disease of which I seem to be afflicted!

35/375 Ruger reamers are available from 4-D rentals.

I like all good rifles, and that sounds just like how I would want a 358 STA. I understand about being photo challenged. I too rely on the good grace and kindness of others when it comes to photos.

So many good cartidges, ideas, places to go, things to hunt, too little money, and a whole lot less time.

I love the 375 Ruger case.

I know the Rifle Editor at Outdoor Life has had Montana Rifle Company build him a rifle in "his" 375 Ruger/300 wildcat. This on the standard length case.

Thanks Vapo for the reamer info. However, unlike the handy and intelligent members of AR that reload, I do not. Hence my hope for Ruger/Hornady to 'see the light' and make an intelligent move to produce said rifles and ammo in the glorius caliber of 35.

Where are all of the loyal and passionate 35 caliber fans out there?

Have you no lust?

In answer to your question; no I would stay with the 375 Ruger, but I already have owned and hunted with a 375 H&H for 40 years. A beautiful Sako from the early "50's built on an FN Supreme action.

I don't believe in "good calibers" or "bad calibers" and realize each of us has favorites but every time some gunwriter or hunter tells me his 33 this or 35 that is almost the same as a 375 I am tempted to ask what is wrong with it ?

quote:

Originally posted by surefire7:
Where are all of the loyal and passionate 35 caliber fans out there?

Have you no lust?

I have love and lust
I'd love a 35 Whelen with a 1 in 10 twist barrel but I lust after a 350 Rigby with the full Monty English style.

I think the 35 Newton was so far ahead of its time and is on a high pedestal for me.
I came up with the 358 Gremlin idea.
The 35 is one of the most versatile caliber ther is.
I pitty the fool who has no love for the Tres Cinco Ocho.

OK. Phil has the 375 pegged correctly as the queen of the medium bores. No argument. And with the 375 Ruger now on the scene, we can have the power of the 375 in a light, handy rifle like the Ruger African Hawkeye at 7 3/4 lbs. Fantastic! I bought three of them before they put on the muzzle brakes.

But the 35s and 9.3s keep calling to me like a beautiful Siren.

I have a CZ 9.3x66 in Wayne's shop right now getting the #3 package. It holds (5) in the magazine & (1) in the chamber. Love that. 286 gr. @ 2,550 fps.

But I also want a Ruger 358 Magnum! (Maybe I'll have to settle for a 358NM). Wouldn't that be the bee's knees? (I know you're biting your tongue Phil !!!)

So Boomie. When you gonna' put together that 35 Newton or Rigby? All it takes is money. Especially the picture of that original 350 Rigby you keep teasing me with!

who knows when I will ever have money again to build nice rifles. My next few guns will probably be for the kids.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
who knows when I will ever have money again to build nice rifles. My next few guns will probably be for the kids.

You're a good man Boomie. And dad!

Jeff

If you look at old history from one of the Aussie members, the 35 Sambar was done when the WSM cartridges came out about 15 years ago. It was a 35 cal short mag that gave slightly better velocity than the 350 Rem Mag. Not 100% sure.

I think the guy did a project of 10 or more wildcats using the WSM & WSSM cases & it was published in a local gun rag.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
yes -- and 338

would prefer it shortened for short action - stainless and good stock, irons and yeah,.. lets do that

I would most certainly be interested in a new .358 chambering based on the Ruger. I have enough .358 bullets to last my great grandson a lifetime that I have accumulated for my two .358 STA’s. I consider the later better then the 375 H&H and if I hunt dangerous game in Africa again my .416 Rem or Rigby will do nicely. I furnish my six grandsons all rifles and reloads for them and they are sure to supply more greats that will all need rifles that I can reload for. Good Shooting.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
The 275 grain 358 bullet has good ballistics at 2750 fps. I think the bullet is “superior” to the 250 338 or 270 grain 375 given equal design and construction. When I was in college, I thought I wa really smart whe I asked my history professor what he thought about such a cartridge based on a 8mm Rem. He smiled at me and told me to google the 358STA.

But folks have never accepted it. Bc the 338 on one side is almost as much and the 375 is as much on the other end. Then you add in that these calibers have decades of acceptance. While the 358 was relegated to short lever action cartridges with lighter bullets that especially with conventional bullet design were not up to bolt action snuff.

Even the 358 Whelen is not what a 358 should be. Now, what that created was a mild medium bore that was easily shooting and a good step up from the 30/06. But the 225 and 250 grain loads are not seen as superior to the 338WM.

A heavy 358 is just too close to the 338WM and 375 for the majors to take a flyer. Maybe a Lipsey’s run.

I want to be wrong.

Agree, we have a Rem XCR II we had rechambered from 375 H&H to 375 Weatherby. It weighs 7.25 lbs with a Leupold 2-7x Firedot scope and is accurate as all get out. It shoots 300g A-Frames at 2800 fps and 350g Woodleigh HD Softpoints at 2550 fps.

Not sure what I would need a 358 for unless it was in a BLR.



Best Regards,

Chuck

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
I don't believe in "good calibers" or "bad calibers" and realize each of us has favorites but every time some gunwriter or hunter tells me his 33 this or 35 that is almost the same as a 375 I am tempted to ask what is wrong with it ?

The great thing about the 375 is the recoil is about the same as my 30-06. My 338wm is much more violent.

If Ruger came out with the 338 Ruger Mag. on the full length 375 Ruger case, I'd buy one. But it will have to compete with the already well established 338WM. It would be faster than the WM, and without a belt, but it would still be fighting the over 60 year head start of the WM. And, even though faster than the WM, there are factory 338s even faster: 340 Weatherby, 338 Rum, 338-378 Weatherby, etc. Tough niche to enter.

On the other hand, Ruger could own the 35 caliber market. There are no fast 35s with factory rifles or ammo. There are fast 35s, but not factory fast 35s: 35 Newton, 350 G&H, 358 NM, 358 STA, etc. Ruger and Hornady would have zero competition with a 358 Ruger Magnum. There for the taking! Factory rifles & factory ammo.

The market for 35s may be smaller than the 33s, but Ruger would own ALL of it (fast 35s) for factory rifles and ammo.

Notice to Ruger Inc. : grab the golden ring before the next go around.

Almost. The 358 Norma did have rifles made and still has ammo from them the last I looked. Unfortunately the market has never been great for any one of them save a small amount for the 35 Whelen and a bit more for the 35 Remington.

Why not a .366/375 Ruger?

Long time availabel: 9,3x64 Brenneke

The medium bores seem to be the most abused or neglected category on the American/US market.

Look at all the small bore 6mm/6.5 cartidges that ate basically the same case, doing the exact same thing. Everybody has to have their own and no one minds. Same thing can be said for the 30 caliber. Winchester/FN even catalogs the 6.5 WM.

I say give them all to us; 375-323, 375-338, 375-9.3 375-358. What I love about the case is it gives near Weatherby performance in a non belted standard length case. Without the belt and bulbous shoulder you get three down without a big box or 4 w/slight whale belly. The slight drop down from the Weatherby gives less blast and recoil. It is a neat date I say clever case that is being ignored. I hate that.

I just do not think Ruger will do it. The RCMs flopped (in my opinion rightfully so, but others like the short 308 length rounds and stubby rifles). Ruger has not even done a 375-300. I thought the Nolsar line would motivate them, but it did not.

The 375 Ruger and Ruger rifles can be classified as successful. I own 3 of them. With that success how many forum post did you see condemning orthe cartidges as a gimmick to sell rifles and no better than the HH. However, I bet truth be known with the plunge big game particularly Africa and bear hunting has taken not many are moving. This all adds up to no 375-358 Ruger.