We've literally beaten the xxx-06 issue to death and IMO the solution is not in the particulars of a given cartridge but in planning the correct battery.

THIS THREAD OMITS VARMINT RIFLES AND DANGEROUS GAME RIFLES PLEASE.

One is not equipped for big game with a single centerfire rifle. One might argue with the .30-06 for all and get away with but we all want at least a backup rifle

Big game means anything from steenbok (25 pounds) to Eland (1500 pounds) and ranges of 25 yards to 300 yards (practical) and yes farther too.

It means woods hunting for whitetails and prairie shooting for pronghorns and mountain hunting for sheep and elk and moose.

On a plains game hunt the variety of game is even more diverse and the ranges are the same....close to far away.

Picking the battery means picking the start point and end point and filling in as one seems fit. It's simply a matter of "HOW MANY" and for me the answer is two. Four in total.

I like the start point to be the .260/6.5 calibers and the end point to be the .375 H&H

After that it's simply a matter of picking two in between.

There's a great battle between the .270 and the .280 for one of the spots and the other spot is fought between the .30-06 and the .338-06.

Failure to do this kind of "battery" thinking has led to me owning a lot more unused guns than Carter has pills.....Strangely enough I still have nothing in the .270-280 class as a couple .30-06 rifles preclude the need. Maybe it's time to order a couple barrels in .280 and the other in .338-06.

Sorry whelen fans....it just don't fit in a battery at all.

The question is.....how many guns are needed between the .260 and .375?...three?...four?...more?

270 win & 300 win mag

'nuff said.

quote:

Failure to do this kind of "battery" thinking has led to me owning a lot more unused guns than Carter has pills.....

Me too...but I've always been a gun crank/trader.

ditto woods...I'm in the process of having two rifles built 270Win. and .300WM for my all american pair....

quote:

Originally posted by Sendero:

quote:

Failure to do this kind of "battery" thinking has led to me owning a lot more unused guns than Carter has pills.....

Me too...but I've always been a gun crank/trader.

ditto woods...I'm in the process of having two rifles built 270Win. and .300WM for my all american pair....

Sendero, you hit the nail on the head. Most of us are talking wants, not needs...........two different animals. No such thing as a correct battery, been there, done that. After all the collecting and playing around with various guns and calibres, I have come full circle and nine times out of ten I'm going to reach for the 30-06. One gun and one load for everything, hard to beat and it makes life a lot simpler.

Hmmm, between 270 and 375. Well a .270 to start (or a .280/7x64 if you want), a 7x57 just because it's a classic and kills very well, maybe a nice light carbine with Mannlicher stock in .308, a heavier longer barrelled rifle in '06, add a nice 338 Win. and that should cover normal hunting requirements.

Then for those days when you're only doing close range a 300 Savage in something classic like an open sighted Rem. 81 or Savage 99, and maybe a 7.65x53 with peep sights.

So I think you can easily fill that gap with 7-8 rifles.

I've pretty much gotten mine down to a 6.5X55, a .300 WSM (which I don't have yet, but will), and a .338 Win. As much as I'd like a .375, if I really need a big bore I'll move right up to a .416 Rem and call it good. Of course my 6.5 has a busted stock, so my .257 AI has recently replaced it with great results.

quote:

I like the start point to be the .260/6.5 calibers and the end point to be the .375 H&H

WHAT????
How can you skip over the quarterbores?
When considering a "battery" concept I like to start with the .257 Roberts and go up! It is the first step in my way of thinking, as it is very good for all the midrange animals, can be loaded with light, fast bullets for vermin when needed, and can still get the job done on the bigger four legged critters. I had a need when I was in my early teens. Since then it's been wants justified by "needs"!

I have two .257", one 7mm, three .308", one .338", one .50" that cover all NA with ease. There is still room for a couple more in my mind. Sometimes a certain rifle just fits the situation better than a do it all. Nate

I have a .280 & my .338-06. The majority of my hunting is/will be done w/ these two. I have a couple of #1s in 7mm Dakota & .338x74K for longer range work on bigger critters. I agree w/ you except, start @ .257BOB for deer/antelope (.243 is a good varmint round) & up to the .375 for Eland, moose, etc. I need a good .375h&h as a backup to my .404 for africa, but I hunt here more than their so?

quote:

WHAT???? Big Grin
How can you skip over the quarterbores?

Hey....as a guy that has put more deer on the wall with his .257 Roberts that was a tough decision.....but I had to start somewhere.

Two identical 308's, 30-06's, 300 WM's, whatever.

One Bullet, One Powder, One Trajectory.

KISS

quote:

THIS THREAD OMITS VARMINT RIFLES AND DANGEROUS GAME RIFLES PLEASE.

One is not equipped for big game with a single centerfire rifle. One might argue with the .30-06 for all and get away with but we all want at least a backup rifle

Big game means anything from steenbok (25 pounds) to Eland (1500 pounds) and ranges of 25 yards to 300 yards (practical) and yes farther too.

It means woods hunting for whitetails and prairie shooting for pronghorns and mountain hunting for sheep and elk and moose.

On a plains game hunt the variety of game is even more diverse and the ranges are the same.... close to far away.

Picking the battery means picking the start point and end point and filling in as one seems fit. It's simply a matter of "HOW MANY" and for me the answer is two. Four in total.

After that it's simply a matter of picking two in between.

Well, I'm not too big on pronghorns or sheep hunting (I've never done either and have no desire to) so that will affect my choices. I'm not much of a long range shooter, either.

A good metric battery using classic cartridges:
6.5x55 (or 7x57)
8x57JS
9.3x62
(I have this trio though the new 6.5x55 is still at the gunsmith's and I haven't fired it yet.)

A classic battery:
.257 Roberts
.30-06 or .300 H&H Magnum (or some other .300 mag but I like the H&H)
.35 Whelen or .375 H&H Mag

A very versatile battery:
.270 Win or .280 Rem or 7mm Rem Mag
.338 Win Mag

My two cents...
-Bob F.

Vapodog,

Your battery concept has some points but it all comes back to one point. How many guns do you carry in the field? Answer: ONE

Assuming I have only two eyes and two arms, and being the lazy SOB I am, I carry only one rifle in the field, and maybe have a sidearm, which I really replaced 10 years ago for a pair of binoculars, a canteen, a road flare, waterproof matches, a space blanket, and a day or two worth of light provisions. Yes I hunt in high country and remote wilderness areas and the odds of a bad fall, snowstorm, or similar issue are much greater than any percieved need for the sidearm.

With above payload in mind, I want one rifle that is flexible, for the game I hunt. Which unless I am late season varmit hunting consists of elk, black bear, and elk. Yup, I do antelope hunts and this does factor into my rifle selections.

However the battery selection really comes down to what rifle will I carry for the game species I intend to hunt. Which in the end means I pick a single rifle and go with it. Like the ARMY commercial, its a battery of ONE. My truck or camp is usually miles away, and whats on my shoulder is the only selection that matters, as by the time I am back to camp its either a new hunt ( 1/2-1 mile circling around the camp), or another day, as there isn't enough daylight left. I don't road hunt much.

Based on the selection of that particular rifle is very important to me, caliber selection definately factors in, but I have found there is way to much campfire talk about that issue, a less than ideal caliber I can compensate for ( again not talking DG hunts ), a crappy rifle is terminal. Specifics are in the same rifle it really doesn't matter if I a packing a 270, 280, 30-06, a flavor of 30 mag, or a 338-06 or the mag version, as long as the rifle is right all of these will fit the bill on my hunting trips.

If I could only have one rifle, and 90% of the worlds game was my target audience, there is only one best choice in my mind, some variant of a 30 mag. I like 30-338's, Allen and Ray A. like their 300 Win Mags, Ray A has a 300 H&H he is partial to. 300 Weatherby hits this list if it floats your boat, as does the 308 Norma.
If I was on the dark continent and really big and dangerous animals was regularly encountered I would substitute a 375 H&H. Yes where and what we hunt does influence our choices in rifles and calibers, add this to the mix its a three gun trio: small, medium and large.

We all have likes and dislikes, I have stated it before and I will repeat it here, I think 7mm's and 30 cal cartridges are the most flexible for my hunting needs. All the rest are toys for my personal satisfaction, which I definately engage in, but thats the fun part.

quote:

I'm not too big on pronghorns or sheep hunting

Don't know if you ever had pronghorn steaks, in my opinion it is my absolute favorite game animal, boy just thinking about a couple of chops seared in butter and garlic is making me HUNGRY.

To add to my varmint rifles up to 243 and fill the gap to my 375 H&H, I could get by with a 270 and a 300 Mag (Win or WSM).

BUT, I reject your reality and substitute my own. Therefore I will own a 6.5-284, 7 Rem Mag, 308, 300 WSM and 338 Mag.

6.5x55 and a 375-H&H or WBY

I think you can accomplish all you want with 4 rifles (which as a benefit covers varmints as well):
6mm Remington
7x57 Mauser
30-06
375 H&H

I don't feel too handicapped with my 7mm Rem mag and 338 Win mag. In fact, it isn't too often when it even matters which one I'm using.

I am working on the samething. What i now have,
22-250
30-06
375H&H
458 Lott
I know you ended with 375 but I couldn't help it. To good a deal.

Problem is the 30-30's 45-70 etc etc still here.
just can never seem to make it come out even.
Gene

I think the "caliber game" is vastly overrated.

Guys get so wound up with the idea that they need some big battery of rifles to hunt "everything" in North America (a tall order!), when in reality they need maybe a single rifle chambered in a single solid caliber to hunt the whole works, from the Brooks Range to the Sierra Madre -- maybe a 30-06 or a 300 Weatherby, or else a two-rifle 270 Win./338 Win. Mag. combination. Add a 223 Rem. varmint rifle and a 22LR and they've got everything covered.

I'm happy to hunt all of the world's big game with just a 300 Win. or 338 Win., plus a 416 Rem., a 223 Rem., and a 22 LR. For me, anything else is excess baggage and a burden.

Someone else can play the "caliber game". I've been there and I've done that, and now all I want to do is go hunting.....

AD

quote:

Someone else can play the "caliber game". I've been there and I've done that, and now all I want to do is go hunting.....

My sentiments exactly, bad news is I can fund the dollars for the toys, allocating the time to do it is just hell.

I am working on that real hard though, and my friends, family and work are getting the idea of how non negotiable I am on this issue.

I suppose everything that NEEDS doing with a hunting rifle can be done with a 22 rimfire, a 30'06, and a 375 H&H. It's the WANTING that makes for myriad choices, collections, batteries, and perennial newsgroup threads... Good hunting!

quote:

Originally posted by allen day:
I think the "caliber game" is vastly overrated.
AD

I shoot colony varmints and there are time when I will set up on one hill and shoot 300 rounds of ammo in 3-4 hours from 50 yards to as far as I want to.
That's when I love the caliber game. I'll shoot 223, 22.250 and 243 and rotate them until I have to let all three cooldown, then I break out the 308 and the 7 mag for some 500- 600 yard shooting with a couple of 375 H&H pop up shots at 100 yards for fun.
As soon as the 6.5-284 is finished it will get a turn at 1,000 yard shots.
I've taken 6-7 centerfire rifles and a couple rimfires (17&22) for one afternoon's shoot before and loved every minute of it.

Here's my bolt action NA battery:

Varmint Rifle: Win 70 HV .22-250 Rem
Light Rifle: Kimber 84M Classic .260 Rem
Woods Carbine: CZ550 FS 6.5x55
Prairie/"Meat" Rifle: Browning A-Bolt II 7mm RM
Heavy Rifle: CZ550 Safari Magnum .375 H&H

The 260 and 6.5x55 are roughly the same ballistically but I like 6.5s.

7mm RM fills my medium bore "meat getter" niche very well. A 30-06 could also be wedged into this category.

If I desire or need a bigger hammer, the .375 H&H gets the nod. I also have a 45-70 Marlin 1895 lever pinch hitting as a short range sledgehammer.

My wish rifle battery would be: .270 & .338WM.

However, all I have and use for all my hunting in Alaska is a Ruger (stainless) in .338WM, topped with a Leupold Vary-X III 2.5-8x scope.

I agree with Allen Day. One can do it all with one rifle or cartridge. In the lower-48 I could do it all with a smaller cartridge, but in Alaska the .338 is it.

I like the way Mr. Faucett thinks!

I'm a sort of a tinkerer/collector and based on what I've accumulated, built, or plan to build, here's my list:

6.5x55
30-06/.303 British/8x57JS
8x68s
375 H&H

It is my thinking that the most practical and enduring calibers were invented many years ago. That coupled with my love for the classics should be apparent by my list.

Tex

in the woods/brush 45-70 guide gun
i think the 280 is for those who want one rifle and not the 270 and 30-06 so...

45-70 guide gun
270/280 22" barrel
30-06 in carbine
30-06 22 or 24"
338-06 22" light rifle
375 h+h 22" barrel

i think 6 rifles will do

Being a certified gun nut, I have repeatedly pondered this question (and similar ones. i.e. If you could only own one gun for...)

Today my perfect two would be a .338 Win. Mag. teamed with a .280 Rem.

Last week it was a 9.3x62 and a 7x57.

Before that it was a .257 Roberts and a 30-06.

While its a lot of fun to discuss, the best part of this exercise is I don't have to make this decision- living in the U.S., I can choose to own them all...
along with a .22LR, .223, .416, 12ga., 16ga, 20ga, etc.

Is this a great country or what?

Holland&Holland had a good concept. The .300 and .375 Of course the .300 could be substituted with about 100 different cartridges but, you could get-r-done with these two and never be lacking.

Terry

Gentlemen

My "wish" rifle battery would be:
6,5X57
7X64/7mm Wby Mag
8X68S
9,3X64

For Africa: 404 or 416 Rigby

Cheers
/JOHAN

I disagree on the "need" for a battery of big game rifles. I could easily hunt any of the animals you mentioned with a good 30-06. Since my 14 year old has now called dibs on my old pre-64 Model 70 I've replaced it with a 7x57 and a .338 as my go to rifles. They suit my "wants" though, not my "needs".

Jeff

I have no choice except to consider one species of "dangerous game" in all my hunting; the Grizzly problems in B.C. are increasingly severe with one fatal and one injurious attack on hunters/bushworkers during the past week. Also, almost all of our Elk hunting is for legally mandated 6-pointers in relatively heavy forest cover, so, bigger is a bit better.

I think that a matched pair of good, CRF rifles with q.d. mounts, good irons and Leupy scopes are best here, the .338 win.-250 NP is my favourite choice and what I consider "best". If, you do a lot of late season, deep snow deer hunting, a .280 or .270 is probably the best choice as this requires carrying a rifle in your hands for hours in cold, wet, rough country and here, lighter is better.

I cannot help myself, I am a true rifle whacko and currently own 25 big game rifles and 5 other rifles, this after selling off several recently. I wish that I had the self-discipline to part with them and retain a pair of .338s, a .280, a .45-70 for backpack/fishing bears and my drilling in 9.3x74......I do, I do........but, I know it will never happen!

A 250-3000

and

Either a 6.5x57 or 7x57

and

Either a Whelen or 9.3x62

I limit myself, for various reasons, to shots of 300ish yds.

I recently scaled back my battery, most stuff just wasn't getting used, and that is a shame, if not a crime.

So now I do it all with:
.357 Mag (GP 100)
.17 HMR (Savage)
.30-06 (Montana 99)
.50 Cal. Smoke Pole (TC Encore)
XI Legend (my bow)

I guess I could throw my Dad's .270 win in there since I have access (and I gave it to him )

ps the XI Legend (bow) has taken more game than all my firearms combind!

quote:

Originally posted by kutenay:
I have no choice except to consider one species of "dangerous game" in all my hunting; the Grizzly problems in B.C. are increasingly severe with one fatal and one injurious attack on hunters/bushworkers during the past week. Also, almost all of our Elk hunting is for legally mandated 6-pointers in relatively heavy forest cover, so, bigger is a bit better.

I think that a matched pair of good, CRF rifles with q.d. mounts, good irons and Leupy scopes are best here, the .338 win.-250 NP is my favourite choice and what I consider "best". If, you do a lot of late season, deep snow deer hunting, a .280 or .270 is probably the best choice as this requires carrying a rifle in your hands for hours in cold, wet, rough country and here, lighter is better.

I cannot help myself, I am a true rifle whacko and currently own 25 big game rifles and 5 other rifles, this after selling off several recently. I wish that I had the self-discipline to part with them and retain a pair of .338s, a .280, a .45-70 for backpack/fishing bears and my drilling in 9.3x74......I do, I do........but, I know it will never happen!

Yes...that's me...until I discovered I have at least two decent African Safaris tied up in those unused guns......and for many more reasons I want to pare down to ten in total. This means planning the best battery.

Varmints and dangerous game aside It's my belief that I want four rifles....There's nothing majik about the number....but I just have to pick a number and manage to it.

Right now it looks like all but one on the old -06 case
6.5-06, 280 Remington, .338-06, and .375 H&H

I'd say if someone were buying a two rifle battery with your criteria an excellent choice would be the 6.5x55 and either a .338 Win Mag or .375 H&H.

My own battery for such purposes is made up of three Ruger bolt actions: an M77 in .243, a stainless/synthetic MkII in 30-06 and my RSM in .375 H&H. If I had to trim it down to two rifles I'd have a really tough time deciding whether to drop the .243 or the .375, but the '06 is guarunteed to be there without question.

I like my own "battery"

.257 Wby Mag
.300 H&H Mag
.338 Win Mag

The .338 isn't as heavy on the top end as say a .340 or .375, but I think balances out fairly well.

Oh, and I suppose I could mention my .22 semi-auto and my Winchester Model 71 in .348 Win.

quote:

Originally posted by Vapodog
The question is.....how many guns are needed between the .260 and .375?...three?...four?...more?

one the 300 magnum of some form or another

quote:

Originally posted by ElCaballero:

quote:

Originally posted by Vapodog
The question is.....how many guns are needed between the .260 and .375?...three?...four?...more?

one the 300 magnum of some form or another

I know you're working on a .300 H&H and that's a grand old round.

One more P-17 in .280 and you're set

quote:

One more P-17 in .280 and you're set

I can only agree with 1/2 of this statement Vapodog. The 280 part is great, the action
choice needs rethinking. I have always had a jaded eye when it comes to Enfields. There are better choices of actions for a 280.

My opinion and $.02

quote:

Originally posted by schromf:
There are better choices of actions for a 280.

My opinion and $.02

I think that Vapo would agree. I have a enfirld action I got from him and he is trying to sell me another one I think.