quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:
A picture of a wound channel in the off side rib cage of a large bull Elk made from a 440 grain flat point hard cast bullet at 950 FPS






How much more speed is needed????

mr linebaugh said his son dustin put i think it was 4 or 5 shots of the 500l through a bear at a distance that at impact it was going in the mid 800s

that seemed to be enough for mr elk there

quote:

Originally posted by nordrseta:

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
a 1.4" version of the 45-70 should do that fine with 405's.

what should that be called?

45-45????

The inventor of the the 45/70 1.4 inch, John Gallagher, called it the .458-400. See Handloader No. 187 (June '97) for details. The cartridge seems to do everything you have in mind.

hmmmm... iwonder why he called it the 458-400???

the 70 in 45-7o reffers to the amount of powder use so i guessed 45 was about right in proportion to the scaling down in charge.

using linebaugh brass through his 458-400 dies would be best i think and he said thats what some do or did.

the socom could probably get 500 grainers going pretty good.

45-70 brass and bullets are pretty cheap and at 1.4" the brass i think would last forever.

i wonder how short a cart you can have and still use 45-70 dies???

[QUOTE]Originally posted by boom stick:

45-70 brass and bullets are pretty cheap and at 1.4" the brass i think would last forever.

[QUOTE]

Boomie I had the first 475 Linebaugh that Hamilton Bowen built and hunted with it in 88..The 45/70 cases were not and are not as good as the commercial 475 cases made today.....

Boomie, the .475 seems to find its sweet spot with the 420 grain bullets. Seems there's a point of diminshing returns. I say those as I have heard that from several very reputable folks. Of course, I will have to do some experimanting of my own. jwp475 has been playing with the .475 L for a long time, so I defer to him and others like bfrshooter as to their pet loads for the .475.

Boomie Dustin Linebaugh took his Grizzly with a 475 Linebaugh with a 420 grain Hard Cast Flat Point at a muzzle velocity of 1200 FPS..Impact velocity may very well have been 800 or 900 FPS since he shot the bear at quite a long distance.

quote:

Originally posted by Whitworth:
A 1.4-inch 45/70 necked to .510 is a .500 Linebaugh......

Not following Boomie. What is it exactly that you envision here (your post isn't clear to me -- and I'm not being a smartass!).

Please clarify!

Whitworth: The 45-70 case can not be expanded to .510. The 500 Linebaugh is built on the 348 Win or 50-70 size case. (see Post #2 on page 1)

Boomy, You talk about reaming a 454 case to take .458 bullets, but you need to remember case wall thickness.
The case needs to be strong enough to crimp and hold the massive bullets and hold them from jumping a crimp.

I like the idea of 45-70 x 1.4"
Both Linebaugh and Bowen did some up in the 90's, they also did a 1.6" case on a stretched Ruger Max frame.
The 45-70 x 1.4" case was the original 475 Linebaugh case, but had a bigger rim than what is on the commercial cases today. So you could use 475 Linebaugh cases and just size down for a .458" bullet. A straight taper, no neck. You could call it the 475-45. Or do it on the 480 Ruger case and call it the 458 Ruger. Might get confused with the 375 Ruger x 458 though.

How's that song go?
"A little less talk and a lot more Action"

Let's see you put one of these ideas into action.
You could get a BFR in 454 casull and have the cylinder rechambered and put a new barrel on.
maybe Huntington would be the man for the job. An Octagon barrel would be nice. Do it 6" with Express sights. Maybe do the rear express island with one standing and one folding. A shallow V with gold bead front. Have the one standing sighted for 50 yards and the folding for 200?
The NECG front express sight takes interchangable inserts and is easily adjustable for elevation.

Then have a sling stud mounted on the bottom of the barrel and one on the butt so you could carry with a sling or put a lanyard on the butt.

Some minor engraveing on the side flats of the barrel. Leave room for the animals you take to be added later.

Maybe call it the 458 BS Express.

and as always, have fun.

just dreaming out loud...

458 ruger is neeto

not a wip (work in progress) but an iip (idea in progress)

i have two rifles to finish first.

ok...the tepo jitsu (?) guy says the socom is loaded to 35,000 psi so that is good for pistols. single shots have been done but he does not know of a revolver one yet.

Lar -- I was talking about necking to .475 -- not .510 -- I described the original methodology of making th .475 L......

jwp,

What did Jack make that .50 Alaskan conversion on? Inquiring minds want to know.

My 475 Linebaugh with 400 gr LFN's at 1100 fps is all I will ever need. Frankly, my Ruger 45 Colt's are probably all I will ever need....

My 50 Alaskan is made on a D-Max frame the pre-runner to the BFR frame. The D-Max frame is lighter than the BFR

quote:

Originally posted by Whitworth:
Lar -- I was talking about necking to .475 -- not .510 -- I described the original methodology of making th .475 L......

Don't you hate that when you think one thing and type another?
Just thought I'd throw that clarification in there to prevent newbie confusion down the road.

Lar -- I wrote a few posts before that about cutting the 45/70 down to 1.4-inches and necking to .475 and then, two posts later I wrote about cutting the 45/70 down to 1.4-inches and necking to .510! So, we were both right about what I wrote, but I meant .475!! My brain doesn't always keep up with my typing! Thank you for pointing that out!

I still think we're trying to reinvent the wheel here. You can load a Casull down to reasonable pressures with heavy bullets......

quote:

Originally posted by Whitworth:
Lar -- I wrote a few posts before that about cutting the 45/70 down to 1.4-inches and necking to .475 and then, two posts later I wrote about cutting the 45/70 down to 1.4-inches and necking to .510! So, we were both right about what I wrote, but I meant .475!! My brain doesn't always keep up with my typing! Thank you for pointing that out!

I still think we're trying to reinvent the wheel here. You can load a Casull down to reasonable pressures with heavy bullets......

Definatley reinventing the wheel.
I can understand the need to be different if a guy wanted to have a .458 instead of .452. It would allow you to load from 300-500gns with factory availible bullets of reasonable cost.
But then if you cast your own, you can make any size bullet you want for a very minimal cost once the mold and everything else is bought.

I still wish that Ruger would offer a 5 shot 480 in a stainless Bisley with 5.5" barrel.
If a guy shops Gunbroker you can come up with some good deals on slightly used pieces. I got my 475 BFR and 4" 500 S&W for under $700 each.
With the 500 S&W you can find cast bullets from 300-700 gns. So if you want bigger or biggest, there it is in factory form.
Well, except for Safari Kid's 50-110 BFR.

have fun.

quote:

It would allow you to load from 300-500gns with factory availible bullets of reasonable cost.

exacto!

ruger had to go 475 to sell expensive bullets that had few outlets to make money...dont blame them.

a 458 ruger makes sense to the reloader but not the manufacturer $ wise

Lar, I wish Ruger would sell any .480 right now! Does anyone know at least the official reason for Ruger no longer offering the .480? We've discussed this before, but I don't think we ever came to any satisfactory conclusions.

I can understand the desire for a cartridge that shoots .458 cal bullets, but there really isn't a shortage of the .452 cal bullets out there and as Lar has pointed out, you can cast your own.......

how many people have 45-70's???? bjillions
using cracked neck brass for your gandgun...perfect...brass gets a second life

its the bubba hand gun.

the 1.4" version 5 shot would be kewel...

Boomie, just get a Casull and be done with it!!LOL!

i am emotionaly invested in those last 6 thou

LOL, Boomie! You should get attached to the .475 instead!!

quote:

Originally posted by Whitworth:
LOL, Boomie! You should get attached to the .475 instead!!

Better advice could not be given.....

since i am gunna have a 470 ar and the 400 grain gold dots will be the go to load the 475 linebaugh is the logical choice.

quote:

Originally posted by Lar45:
I can understand the need to be different if a guy wanted to have a .458 instead of .452. It would allow you to load from 300-500gns with factory availible bullets of reasonable cost.

Seems to me Ruger created the 480 because they knew most folks don't enjoy shooting the 454 SRH at full throttle. I'll wager making a pistol that will accomodate a 500 gr .458 is nowhere even near their back burner. I imagine the MBAs at Sturm Ruger have have figured out the few of us who run bigbore Rugers to the firewall are an inconsequential yet potentially risky market segment compared to the cowboy shooters who buy pistols two at a time and are satisfied with collar button bullets at BB gun velocities.