Anyone else seen this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...ature=video_response

Wow. I'm no expert on lion hunting, but that cat was either someone's pet or it was drugged up real good. No way that was a 'free range' lion.

Canned hunt! That lion is like a house cat.

That entire scam is Bullchit. If that Lion wasn't drugged, then Bill Clinton inhaled. Look at the cat's eyes when they blink. He's so doped up he's lethargic. That is damn disgusting and shameful doesn't come close to describing this horse chit. That is......damn!

The "clip" has been posted before....

Not sure who I feel more sorry for, the drugged lion or the "hunter".....

Money can buy lots of things...but NOT respect

I've never thought this before while watching a hunting vid, but that was SAD!

Armbar.

quote:

Originally posted by L. David Keith:
That entire scam is Bullchit. If that Lion wasn't drugged, then Bill Clinton inhaled. Look at the cat's eyes when they blink. He's so doped up he's lethargic. That is damn disgusting and shameful doesn't come close to describing this horse chit. That is......damn!

The eyes tell it all. I have seen too may dogs and horses that have had a good dose of tranquilizers; they blink just like that. You could have killed that lion with a club!

I have my own blacklist of outfits NOT TO HUNT with.

Ras Safarai has been added to it.

The lion was definitley home grown, and set up for the killing.

And what adds insult to injury is the way that bowman was being handled by the so called PH!

Now, let us get back to reality.

If there was no market for them, these sort of "hunts" would not exists.

Makes you wonder...

Notice the arrow with about 4" of penetration in the shoulder. Looks like it was fired from above.
Really, really lame.

Rich

They sent out a promo DVD with either African Sporting Gazette or African Outfitter magazine some years ago. It was without doubt the worst "shooting" DVD I have ever seen. No taste and no respect. I guess this clip just caps it off.

If you think thats sad look at the hippo bow hunt...

I hadn't seen that one before...have seen alot of them though. It's just so frustrating to me that the safari industry hasn't policed itself better.

Any Joe Blow with a shakey handheld Best Buy bought videocamera can capture a hunting sequence through that viewfinder. But guys we have to leave the massive distribution of such hunting sequences to the pros.

It might be cool to watch yourself on YouTube or email a buddy vids of your dog doing stupid pet tricks, but an amateur hunting video should never be posted on YouTube. Never. Not by outfitters as a promotional tool. Not by Buck McNeeley in Botswana. Not by ElmerFudd who filmed HermanGlimpsher's first safari in Namibia, with his $89.95 camera from Photomart!

If you think you have something worthy of YouTube posting, send it to one of the pros to be screened. Then a second pair of eyes can pass judgment on your video. They're a good number of the pros who post here, who would gladly give your video a once over in the best interests of our industry.

The 24-hour Internet is simply too viral for someone to experiment whether his amateur hunting video is going to be a smash hit or not on YouTube.

I am not exxagerating when I say the following. Although I am a major proponent of first ammendment rights to free speech and a free press, I do believe the major hunting and gun associations should put ratings, as in "appropriate" or "non appropriate", on all commercially released hunting DVD's.

I'd like them even to go as far as stating in extreme cases such as the YouTube clip above, something such as a warning that says 'this video clip is not sanctioned by...such and such organization.'

Atleast the non-hunting public would see that we do have standards that we adhere to in the videotaping/production of hunting sequences.

I have seen other poor excuses of hunts from RAS SAFARIS on YOUTUBE.

Youtube and the crap people post on it will be the death of hunting. I really don't know why so many apparently intelligent people feel the need to post their crap on it.

As far as this particular one is concerned, take a look at the expression on the face of the plonker with the bow...... he obviously has no idea whatsoever of which way is up, let alone anything else!!!

The lion is obviously full of chemical dope and the guy appears to be just a dope but I'm not sure which one is the more dopey!

That poor bloody cat just wanted to sleep. Bunch o' wankers!!

PATHETIC EXCUSES FOR HUMANS.

I am proud of my career as a PH, and to watch crap like this, just makes me boil.

Last year i criticised a hunt report on AR of a cat hunt; had it been filmed would have brought a similar type of response as has been received on this posting.Although the cat was anything but drugged on that hunt though.

The abuse that i received via PM and an instance of identity theft using my name via email made it necessary for me to change my AR screen name and re register, this time using my full natural name.

At the time i said that there is need for an ethical standard for all hunters in Africa and hunters should have the right to constructively criticise and pull into line other hunters.My suggestion went down like a lead balloon on AR. Glad to see after the responses here that i am not alone

That's not hunting and a somebody who does this is not a hunter.
By the way Lion is one of the species you should hunt with a proper rifle and not with a Stick.

I happen to be a BIG fan of Buck McNelly...oh sorry, I just threw up in my mouth a little...

Had a colonoscopy once...the expression on that kitty's face was the same as mine as I came out of it...

Jeff

Do the AR members recall the hunt that Pat Lefemine....the owner of www.stickbow.com did for lion?

It was the same hunt. It is shameful.

Jeff:
oh sorry, I just threw up in my mouth a little...

Do you need the Heimlich Maneuver?


dale

Very sad indeed.

Hugo and Anton Ras, they don't operate in the North West of South Africa anymore due to this.

Ras Safaris name was also linked to the Rhino Poaching spectacle that occur in S.A a few months back.

I wish the lion would have been able to charge...

quote:

Originally posted by trophyhunter5000:
I wish the lion would have been able to charge...

So does the Lion.

Dale,

No I'm good.

Jeff

I could hear dogs barking in the background.

Disgraceful.


Best-
Locksley,R

Guys we need to think bigger than just what's discussed on this forum. Expand to the thought process of considering this entity as an influential body in the hunting community. Form an advisory board, and transition your private blacklist to a public "don't hunt with list"...a public "don't watch list."...a public "don't buy list."

If you're really as passionate about hunting as you express yourselves to be, do something about it, make change and strive to be influential. Think big!

Oddly enough, this is the first film I have ever watched of a canned hunt for a lion. I spent my life dealing with words but I am almost speechless with rage and frustration that such atrocities could happen. Several posters have noted the bow user. I can't wrap my mind around why such people are not smart enough to realize that a truly wild lion just doesn't behave that way - and you don't have to be an Africa veteran to know that. I have watched on film the charge of a wild lion -and it is heart stopping. (The twitching of the tail before Leo starts after what he intends to kill didn't make me feel that he meant nothing bad for the hunter) Why do such canned hunt operators survive? (As they plainly do) The gulf between the people who patronize such outfits and the true hunter clients of African outfitters is enormous -but, of course, the hunters will be tarred with the same brush of infamy.

Wow! Was that Angus Murray behind the bow? Looks like they could have accomplished the same result with a pen knife. DISGUSTING!!!!!!!!!!!

Man, when you love lions and lion hunting as much as I do, its hard to even know what to say?? As much as I think the PH and the operation are horrible, it wouldn't have happened if some "hunter" wasn't willing to do it!! The supply is always available, is someone demands it.

I couldn't watch it. After the first couple minutes it was apparent what was going to happen so I shut it off. I'm the first one to say if its legal I don't have a problem with it but that was beyond my tolerance level.

Mark

Gentlemen, I have read all the comments on this poorly done film, and all have merit. However many are strictly opinion, and some I agree with and some I don't, and that is MY OPINION.

That being said, here is my take on some of the comments. First I don't think the lion was drugged, but I do think he was not alarmed by the presence of humans around him, and I base that on the body language of that lion is exactly like one viewed in a zoo setting where a lion is viewed from across a deep pit from only 15 or 20 feet, and thos lions are not drugged. That lion was raised in a zoo like setting or is a circus animal, and fed daily by humans IMO. you can walk up to a caged lion and he may or may not even look at you, or if he does there will be no concern expressed on his body language, and will likely simply disregard your persents. This is because you are not percieved as a threat. IOM, that is the lion in this film.

It is evident the lion could see both the shooter, and the camera man as he glanced in two directions repeatedly, and simply looked like a lion that was used to lying around while folks took pictures of him.

The lion never even got up till the first arrow hit him, and thank God for the poor filming. The poorer the filming the less detail can be seen in a canned "HUNT".

In films that are well done with quality filming equipment, from a filming perspective, is not the issue we face here. Canned hunts can be well filmed just like proper hunts, and has nothing to do with the content of the film. The editing might be a little more complex however! You know, to get rid of the fence!

In the case of this film being released by the so-called "SAFARI COMPANY", with their copyright all over it, is simply self-portrayed evidence of their crime, and that is a good thing! It doesn't take CSI to find evidence of a crime here.

The so-called hunter in this film is not duped IMO, and knew what he was doing from the get go. The fact that people pay $20K for the "trophy fee" plus daily fees is incentive for criminals to do this type of thing. What we need at address is the content of the films, not the quality of the filming. There are well filmed hunting films that are sold by the thousands that show unethical conduct. Just about everyone on this website here can name just one that has been controversial for years. Those films are talked about every day both pro, and con, as to the ethics involved, yet they still sell, making the owner rich.

Personally I think a public list of hunting films should be on every hunting website, and in every hunting magazine as to the ethical quality of the content, and black list the bad ones. If offered we should make negative comments on the sights where these films are aired.

legal rules like this can be a slippery slope because who is to say which are ethical, and which are not? That might bite us in the butt if we get the wrong ctritic with an agenda. Everyone here knows of the real disagreements about the ethics of one filmmaker we all know, and we are far more knowledgeable than the general public. So our public condemnation,of a certain film,that is posted publicly, labeling ourselves as hunters,is very important.

I haven’t seen a positive comment for this film, and that is good, because this definitely not an ethical hunt, but you see even with one this blatant there are disagreements as to what the film actually shows. We are preaching to the chior here, but a legal rating system is sometimes a less than desirable thing.

Free speech is important, but not as important as law abiding citizens right to have firearms, and the right to free speech is guaranteed by the right of the people to have firearms. Who is the one group of people who own the most firearms? It is HUNTERS, and as MOJO says, if we don't police our own hunting members activities, I see a dim future for our sport, which will in turn effect our right to have firearms, and that endangers our right to free speech!

...............................This may be simple on the surface,but Knee-jerk is not the proper solution!

Did anyone feel a gag reflex coming on? And we wonder where anti-hunters come from.....

That cat stoned or what?

This is a good example of why I hate the entire practice with such a vengence.

I reckon anyone and everyone involved in the despicable practice deserves to be tied to trees for leopard bait.

I also reckon it's the biggest threat to sport hunting in Africa of all.

Shakari - The more I read your posts, and the more I see crap like that video, the more I tend to agree with you. I have never been opposed to High-Fence lion hunting, but never cared to do it myself. But man, if done in that sort of manner, I could be inclined to change my mind!!

quote:

I have never been opposed to High-Fence lion hunting, but never cared to do it myself. But man, if done in that sort of manner, I could be inclined to change my mind!!

If you allow high fence lion hunting how would you stop this "manner" of high fence lion hunting?

505 gibbs - As Mark Young stated, generally if its legal I am not opposed to it, but I may not be willing to partake in it myself. After watching the video, your comment is my point. Stopping it all together may be a better idea!!

Aaron,
Agreed, I have been a big proponent in the past of "if it is legal and thats what people want to do with their livestock" who am I to oppose? What is the difference in owning a cow and owning a lion? However, a video and incident like this raises the question of what is healthy for hunting in general? No doubt, a video like this could be used against the SPORT that we all love.

It's simply disgusting.......

I feel there is a whole generation of shooters (I can't call them hunters) that think killing an animal to bringing back what they think is a trophy animal is hunting. It's all about the size, never mind whether it was tame, bred, tied to a tree, fed hormones or hung from it's toes.

These people either have never been taught or do not care about the ethics or the traditions of hunting. All they care about is that they want a bigger animal than anyone else or so that their name can be in the record book.