Damn I an getting a bunch of messages and seeing some video of unrest in Zim. It doesn't sound good. How much more can these people take?

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Damn I an getting a bunch of messages and seeing some video of unrest in Zim. It doesn't sound good. How much more can these people take?

“Political Unrest” or unrest related to say the huge spike in gas Cal posted etc (assuming more than just gas prices spiked)

I read that the President is in Russia right now and that the VP doesn't have the authority to call up the Army........and the Army is divided on what to do anyway. Tripling the price for petrol overnight seems to have been the trigger. My understanding is that the US dollar price remains the same but the bank note price has tripled or something like that...it is confusing. Our Zim operators who have access to US dollars would probably be okay but the average Zimbo is screwed....again.

I have seen a few pictures of crowds destroying police cars. Burning police cars and the like. Various other incidents of violence.

Whodathunkit ????

Wasn't "the crocodile" Mugabe's finance minister at one point ???

Different president...………….same politicians...……...same result.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I have seen a few pictures of crowds destroying police cars. Burning police cars and the like. Various other incidents of violence.

Check out Ira Lariver’s posts on Facebook. He has posted numerous videos of the riots and violence. It’s bad and involves not just Harare but also Bulawayo.

Did anyone honestly expect anything else?

Replacing a deranged criminal by one of his best supporters?

This whole shibang would never have happened if Harold Wilson and his government - supported by the Western world - did not cave in and hand over a thriving country to terrorists!

In a very sad sort of way, what used to be Great Britain is falling apart, by their own doing!

I was in England a while back, and that country is just a sad shadow of what it was 50 years ago when I was there!

Saeed: Absolutely! +1!

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Saeed: Absolutely! +1!

Yes. +2

Saeed you are 100% correct

Out and about this morning, just to have a look. Harare and suburbs are shut down, and military police are guarding key fuel stations, but it seems very quiet.

The wild card is VP Chiwenga. He is acting president, and as such there is nothing to stop him calling out the army, which I'm sure has been done overnight in the trouble areas. He is also less disciplined than Mnangagwa.

It's raining hard in Harare, which will probably dampen any serious protests. My call is that things will gradually quieten down from here. If you're thinking about coming here on a hunt, do not be put off by what's happening - it won't affect you.

As for Mnangagwa (he was never minister of finance, but held security, defence, justice and housing portfolios), he is an improvement on Mugabe. After 37 years of Mugabe's misrule, our swamp is a lot deeper than yours. ED has a plan, but he needs some investment and support to pull it off. The West has made a mistake by not engaging a little more. It's telling that ED's in Russia right now instead of China, but rather than gaining an ally in southern Africa, we're helping the Chinese and Eastern Bloc take it.

It was reported an hour ago here in SA that social media has been shut down in Zim. Trying to contact friends there but to no avail.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Damn I an getting a bunch of messages and seeing some video of unrest in Zim. It doesn't sound good. How much more can these people take?

Why Larry you are posting this before DSC ?

quote:

Originally posted by mboga biga bwana:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Damn I an getting a bunch of messages and seeing some video of unrest in Zim. It doesn't sound good. How much more can these people take?

Why Larry you are posting this before DSC ?

Because I just got the messages.

quote:

Originally posted by mboga biga bwana:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Damn I an getting a bunch of messages and seeing some video of unrest in Zim. It doesn't sound good. How much more can these people take?

Why Larry you are posting this before DSC ?

What has Larry got to do with all the problems in Zimbabwe?

It is reported on several news media, and kindly brought to the attention of the members here, who should know about it.

I would not let it stop me going to hunt there if it was me.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Did anyone honestly expect anything else?

Replacing a deranged criminal by one of his best supporters?

This whole shibang would never have happened if Harold Wilson and his government - supported by the Western world - did not cave in and hand over a thriving country to terrorists!

In a very sad sort of way, what used to be Great Britain is falling apart, by their own doing!

I was in England a while back, and that country is just a sad shadow of what it was 50 years ago when I was there!

Worth repeating to add: And with the FULL and active support of Jimmy Carter and the democrats...

The way I heard it, Andrew Young threatened Smith with military action. Another brilliant piece of US intervention in other nations' affairs. At least that one didn't cost us a trillion dollars.

Saeed

It all depends on perspective.

70 years ago the UK was virtually bankrupt. The 2nd world war had put an end to most of the extravagant lifestyle of the aristocracy. They could no longer afford to maintain the colonies. They had sucked the colonies dry and did not have the funds to keep up the infrastructure. (Remember the millions of Indian soldiers who fought for the British and got little recognition.)

That was the gloss and polish on top of the rot underneath. The poor in the UK were always there. The illiterate or semi literate were always there. The slums were always there.

If you really look at British history, the glory was all about colonialism. There was no real honour there. Again it is dependent on perspective. If you are a Brit or pro Brit, you could rejoice in the Colonial glory.

Most former colonials see the other side of the coin.

More and more of the former aristocratic manors and castles in the UK are being sold to foreigners from the Middle East, India, Asia and the Americas. Some have become hotels or museums etc.

Many British industries have also gone the same way. Land Rover, Jaguar etc are now owned by TATA of India. British steel companies are also foreign owned.

Yes many of the former colonies are a mess now. That does not mean that the people there would be better off under the British.

Look at the US. Native Americans are not better off even today. Their rights and lands are still being taken away. They are still treated mostly as second class citizens unless they merge with main stream Americans. Same in Australia, Brazil, Indonesia or India. Indigenous people are not thriving.

NZ seems to be a bit of an exception. The Maori here are doing relatively well and their culture and heritage is getting more protection (revival) since the mid 1980s.

Another perspective - What was Dubai like 50 to 70 years ago? In your own lifetime? Was the Middle East better off under the Persians, the Ottamans or the British or French?

I am sure some will disagree with me and have some other perspective.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Did anyone honestly expect anything else?

Replacing a deranged criminal by one of his best supporters?

This whole shibang would never have happened if Harold Wilson and his government - supported by the Western world - did not cave in and hand over a thriving country to terrorists!

In a very sad sort of way, what used to be Great Britain is falling apart, by their own doing!

I was in England a while back, and that country is just a sad shadow of what it was 50 years ago when I was there!

I was chatting with a PH today in Zim and he said the internet is down; not sure how long it has been down...

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:
I was chatting with a PH today in Zim and he said the internet is down; not sure how long it has been down...

Not to be a smart ass, but how were your able to chat, with the internet down?

quote:

Originally posted by WLW:

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:
I was chatting with a PH today in Zim and he said the internet is down; not sure how long it has been down...

Not to be a smart ass, but how were your able to chat, with the internet down?

It is called WhatsApp. But I could have called his number as well.

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by WLW:

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:
I was chatting with a PH today in Zim and he said the internet is down; not sure how long it has been down...

Not to be a smart ass, but how were your able to chat, with the internet down?

It is called WhatsApp. But I could have called his number as well.

I use whatsapp, but it thought it was internet based.

Email just now from Zim.
13 killed in Harare
Schools closed until Monday--maybe longer
Army seems to support the riots
internet is down in the cities
internet is up in rural areas
Cal

I have a large number of friends in Zim. I have been going since 88. Without counting, my guess is that I have been more than 15 times.

I got a bunch of messages from friends. The one that bothered me the most came form a young black man. It read as follows:

"I'm safe. Can't leave home though. Dangerous situation."

If i was booked there this year, I would still go. This is nothing compared to the unrest in certain years that I have been. Just don't do stupid things.

quote:

Originally posted by WLW:

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by WLW:

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:
I was chatting with a PH today in Zim and he said the internet is down; not sure how long it has been down...

Not to be a smart ass, but how were your able to chat, with the internet down?

It is called WhatsApp. But I could have called his number as well.

I use whatsapp, but it thought it was internet based.

You are right; his email provider is down.

Don't know why they are rioting. They got the land that they wanted, right?

What did LBJ say shaking his head while watching the riots on TV ?

" But I gave them everything they wanted . ."

Have booked a buffalo hunt for April. Now I don‘t know whether I should cancel... Of course none of you can provide me with the right answer, just want to mention my thoughts.

Agreed! Very sad indeed

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Did anyone honestly expect anything else?

Replacing a deranged criminal by one of his best supporters?

This whole shibang would never have happened if Harold Wilson and his government - supported by the Western world - did not cave in and hand over a thriving country to terrorists!

In a very sad sort of way, what used to be Great Britain is falling apart, by their own doing!

I was in England a while back, and that country is just a sad shadow of what it was 50 years ago when I was there!

8 confirmed fatalities; rumour mill puts it higher. Larry is correct, though, this will not affect hunts.

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:
Email just now from Zim.
13 killed in Harare
Schools closed until Monday--maybe longer
Army seems to support the riots
internet is down in the cities
internet is up in rural areas
Cal

Key Questions answered about corruption in Africa (Zimbabwe), factional politicsand the poweful cartel (Oligarchy) controlling Diamond, Gold, Fuel, Grain(Command Agriculture), Basic Commodlties and Foreign Currency trading.1. *Who is Queen Bee?x-Queen Bee is colloquial name for the most poweffuloligarchy/cartel in Zimbabwe.

The group is heavily connected to senior politicians,the army, intelligence, the judiciary, permanent secretaries and directors ingovernment, commercial parastatals including RBZ, MMC! NOCZIM, ZIMM & ZESA.It has links at AFREfiMBANK too. The caftel controls imports of foreign currencyand its allocation by RBZ.

It controls imports of key commodities such as Fuel,Wheat & Maize and their subsequent distribution in Zimbabwe. It also cont\ols Goldand Diamond marketing. 12. *Who is in this cartel or oligarchy?*-The most powerful bosses in the caftel areChiwenga, John Bredenkamp and Billy Reutenbach. Their front man is KudaTagwirei. Silent paftners include Simon Rudland, Obert Mpofu, Nic Van Hoogstraten,Happyton Bonyongwe,Ozias Bvute, Supa Mandiwanzira, Joram Gumbo, SB Moyo,Perrence Shiri, Elson Moyo and Anselem Sanyatwe.

Other prominent membersinclude Frank Buyanga,John Mangudya, Mirirai Chiremba, Norrnan Mataruka,Gresham Muradzikwa, Aaninandava Saburi, Genius Kadungure, Wicknel Chivhayo,Aaron Chinhara (Glow Petroleum), Farai Munyawarara (KreamornInvestments),Phillip Chiyangwa, Derrick Chikore, Francis Gudyanga, WillardManungo & Tafadzwa Musarara (Grain Millers). Lebanese, Indian, Chinese & IsraeliBusiness moguls in Zimbabwe are also involved through mineral exports.3, *When did this caftel start?x-The origins of this poweful caftel dates as far backas 1998 when Zimbabwe interuened in the DRC War. The rationale behind theintervention was to shield Diamond & Cobalt Mines controlled by the cartel frontman John Bredenkamp & Billy Reutenbach.

The rich white moguls roped in VitalisZvinavashe, Emerson Mnangagwa, Solomon Mujuru, Constantine Chiwenga,Perrence Shiri and SB Moyo among others giving them contracts to supply goodsand seruices to the Zimbabwean Army during the war. Mugabe too was in thegrouping for personal reasons. From that time, the army has played a key role inthe Zimbabwean economy in transport, mining, arms deals, foreign currency, loansand connections to foreign investors. Their hand was strengthened when they savedMugabe after losing to Tsvangirai in the 2008 elections. The cartel pushed behindthe scenes to get their men in key positions in government parastatals, cabinet andintelligence gradually becoming influential.

The army became a ZANU PF extensionand coined the phrase, "Chinhu Chedu" meaning a self-enrichment system of powerand business deals.4. *Who was behind the November 2017 Coup?*-The power behind the coup wasnqt ED but this cartel including prominent business tycoons (white & black) frontedby Chiwenga, SB Moyo, P. Shiri & Elson Moyo. They could not have one of their ownto take over as it would show the world that it was a real coup de tat so they choseEmerson Mnangagwa (civilian face) to lead the country. The coup was planned asfar back as 2004 through ZANU PF structures, then 2007 through the PresidentialGuard and after Mugabe unilaterally merged diamonds in Chiadzwa through MinisterChidhakwa (His cousin) in 2015.

Hence they pushed ED not to appoint him in cabinet. The push came throughMupamhanga and Charamba (Cartel inside men in ED's office). ED reasoned withMutsvangwa and appointed his wife instead to appease his former advisor.10. xWho is controiling government right now?x-Chiwenga is the man running theshow in government for the cartel since his appointment. They want him to takeover as president in 2023, then hand oYer to SB Moyo in 2028.

They have asuccession plan for any eventuality even'impeachment for ED or death.11. xWhy did ED invite obseruers despite Army warnings that he would lose theelections?*-ED wanted to create a centre of power around himself and a few of hisloyalists who were chased from ZANU PF by Mugabe. He too wanted to get rich butwithout outside influence as he had seen on Mugabe. He wanted credibility andcontrol as his own man to break away from the past. His plan was to invitetechnocrats and skilled Zimbabweans in Diaspora to run government so as to openlines of credit and investment.

His plan fell after he lost to Nelson Chamisa in theJuly 30 elections.12. xHow did the cartel capture ZEC & the judiciary?x-At 3am on July 31, almyintelligence had gathered through Provincial Presiding Officers that Chamisa$ MDChad crossed the 2 million mark and was set to win by at least 560lo of thepresidential vote according to ZEC voter turnout figures. The cartel met anddiscussed plans with Chiwenga. It was agreed that it was easier to get ED in andeliminate him midway through his term than to get opposition in power.

Chiwengaordered ZEC to stop displaying V11 forms outside polling stations for all strategic,constituencies deemed ZANU PF strongholds and those remaining polling stationswhich were over 25o/o of the"total polling stations of the election. The army tookover ZEC by threatening Chigumba and falsiffing Vl1 forms. The cartel then offeredhuge perks to at Ieast 5 judges of the Constitutional court who sat on the casebench to get ED sworn in.13. *Did ED want a GNU?*-After losing the elections, ED was briefed by PV Sibandathat it was ideal to get in a GNU as the public favoured it. He warned ED of thepower behind Chiwenga and his motives.

The plan would involve negotiations withopposition figures which PV Sibanda was willing to do. ED advisers in the OPC alsowarmed up to the idea as it guaranteed them safety. The cartel rejected this ideaoutright and threatened PV Sibanda.14. xWho was behind the White City bombing?x-The cartel felt that ED wassabotaging them by inviting international obseruers to an election he was likely toloose.

He was also crushing Chiwenga on various pronouncements which includedthe firing of CIOs Ioyal to Mugabe, Police chiefs and allowing opposition a free reignin campaigning. They felt ED was becoming too soft to a dangerous opposition andpovefi stricken public which would create room for an uprising similar to the Arabevents. The decoy was to apportion blame to Grace Mugabe or G40 remnants. Itwas an inside job to injure or eliminate ED and Mohadi.15. *How did ED sideline some cartel members or dump them in the new cabinet?*-The cartel had long suspected that some of its beneficiaries and members werespying to Mugabe against Chiwenga and ED.

They quietly pushed ED to wield theaxe on a few figures including Mandiwanzira and Mpofu but these would getministerial packages, contracts and business through the cartel as they would ingovernment even if deployed to ZANU offices. However the cartel crossed swordswith ED after the failed to give posts to its members who were on Chiwenga's list ofcabinet candidates. The list included the likes of Bvute (Local government),Chiwenga (on Defense), Rugeje (Transport) and Tagwirei (On energy) among otherretired generals. ED flexed his muscle and appointed his friends from Lacoste erawho helped him fight in ZANU PF during tough times such as July Moyo, Biggie The caftel tried to get Mugabe to hand over power to ED in return for businessdeals. Their plans were thrown off the rail when Mugabe went after Bredenkamp in2A07 on flimsy passport charges.

The nail was hit when Mugabe sent intelligence tokill Chiwenga in September 20t7. When it failed, Mugabe fired ED from governmentand planned to fire Chiwenga as Army General after his China trip. The coup wasinitiated as the last resort to save the oligarchy. Furthermore Mugabe had shown nosigns over time of giving power to their man (ED). Intelligence showed Mugabewanted to hand over power to Sydney Sekeramayi who was to be deputized byGrace and Mphoko. The balance of power was shifting towards Grace and a fewloyalists close to Mugabe and his family who were deemed hostile to the caftel'sbusiness ideology in Diamond Mining, Gold and Fuel.

The group composed of youngTurks in ZANU PF who were starting to get favourable treatment from Mugabe atthe expense of the cartel. The caftel tried to recruit Grace but realized Mugabe hadspies around her because of her infidelity past. They sponsored various trips toChina and other intelligence meetings behind the doors among other donations toZANU PF. The cartel was shocked after Mugabe fired ED in a show of force and itpushed Chiwenga to voice their displeasure to Mugabe. The ZANU PF centrai\committee was captured to push for impeachment in case Mugabe did not resign.The cartel used public anger for Mugabe to push people in the streets of Harare insupport of their cause. They had found a common goal with opposition leaders too.That is why the coup was quickly sanitized.5. *Why did they not kill Mugabe?*-They could not kill Mugabe as it would show theworld it was a power grab.

Moreover the information could leak on their identity asMugabe had a lot of Ioyalists within the ZANU PF party, in government, intelligenceand internationally. ED howeVer, promised to reach out to Mugabe for them andensure peace.6. *Is ED in control of the country?x-Like Mugabe who lost elections in 2008 butwas kept in power by the military in 2008. ED is under the influence of this cartelbecause they funded over $300 million to sponsor his campaign in the July 2018elections. He is their product promoted to lead the country and he was involved intheir deals through command agriculture as VP in 2016-17.

He was furtherweakened after losing the July elections where again the caftel reversed the popularvote in his favour for their business interests.7. xWhy is ED failing to control price increases, fight corruption or push forreforms?x-The caftel that installed him as president survives on tenders andunderhand deals with Parastatals in a closed economy. Any transparency or auditinto government deals cuts off their revenue supply. Price increases are a show ofpower that the cartel controls the economy and can sabotage ED's plan foreconomic growth. Reforms being pushed by Mthuli Ncube such as 2olo tax, civilservice and government expenditure cuts including command agriculture will be shotdown because the caftel is still to cash in on its 2018 elections donations.

Mthuli issupposed to be alienated in his policy thrust or be captured slowly, if he resistscapture the caftel will push for his resignation from cabinet on corruption charges.8. xWhy is Mutsvangwa exposing Kuda Tagwirei and the cartel?*-Mutsvangwa feltthat ED was pushed not to support him publicly in the Norton elections. He realizedthe cartel had a hand in his loss to Mliswa.

However Mutsvangwa is fronting for acompany from South Africa called MOGS which intends to build a Fuel pipelinelinking Botswana and Mozambique through Harare which has the capacity to carry 5times more fuel than the Trafigura/NOCZIM pipeline. It's a personal flght. He is thebrains behind Lumumba leaks9. xWhy was Mutsvangwa not appointed Minister?*-The cartel knew of his MOUwith MOGS, his dislike for Chiwenga and abrasive behavior through the War Vets.

Difficult to read unless I edit it......this is how the email was sent to me, so it's a " copy and paste".

Saeed, please delete if you feel its inappropriate.

I tried to open it up a bit and make easier to read.

Thank you for posting.

quote:

Originally posted by Sunshine:
Have booked a buffalo hunt for April. Now I don‘t know whether I should cancel... Of course none of you can provide me with the right answer, just want to mention my thoughts.

First you need to speak with your outfitter.

Unless they tell you something different, by all means go. Don’t do stupid things like being in or around large groups of people, taking pictures of police/military activity, etc.

Remember, none of this is in the bush.

A letter from Zimbabwe where the country is in total shutdown.


16 January 2018.

We are now in our third day of complete shutdown throughout the whole of Zimbabwe. Banks are closed, schools are closed, roads are closed in and out of the main towns and transport systems have shut down.

There are no newspapers to be bought, the Internet has been shut down by the government and everything is at a complete standstill.

People are too afraid to move around as a result of the burning of vehicles by vigilante groups and the complete dearth of any updated information or warnings due to the total social media blackout. This means that no WhatsApp messages or photos can be sent, no one can access Facebook or Messenger, and the situation is very tense.

In some centres it almost feels apocalyptic. We have heard gunfire, and before the Internet was closed down, saw pictures of dead and wounded people. It is unclear how many people have died but before the media blackout, it was reported that there had been five deaths and more than 200 people had been arbitrarily arrested.

Elements of the police and military are also involved in ensuring that there is a complete shutdown. People in civilian dress armed with AK-47 rifles have been seen in some areas. It is clear that these are military personnel.

Amnesty International has condemned the military crackdown and has called on the Zimbabwean authorities to ensure restraint by security forces and respect the public’s right to protest.

Zimbabwe Lawyers for Human Rights reported prior to the blackout that they had received reports of soldiers and police breaking into homes in townships overnight and assaulting suspected demonstrators.

Contacts in the diplomatic corps and the political opposition are also completely in the dark, along with the rest of us.

This morning I spoke to Nelson Chamisa, leader of the opposition Movement for Democratic Change (MDC) Alliance, and it is clear that no one knows what is going on because the entire country has been effectively silenced.

I have also spoken to lawyers regarding the arrest once again of Pastor Evan Mawarire who inadvertently triggered the highly successful #ThisFlag social media protest action in April 2016 because he could no longer afford to pay school fees. This led to his arrest on trumped up charges and his high profile court case. Since then, his activities have been under constant surveillance.

Police officers arrive at his flat this morning in central Harare and took him to the Law and Order section, charging him under a false charge of incitement to commit public violence.

The crisis was precipitated on Sunday (January 13) by President Emmerson Mnangagwa when he announced a shock increase of 200 percent in the fuel price – this in a country with more than 90 percent unemployment and where the struggle to survive escalates daily. Mr Mnangagwa promptly left the country for Russia and has not returned. Reports say that he has gone there to “discuss Russian assistance to modernise the military”.

Right now the situation remains eerie and uncertain. If this goes on for much longer, the humanitarian crisis will escalate. We cannot buy food because the shops are all closed and transport systems have closed down. Most of the hospitals are without essential medicines and also staff because doctors and nurses can’t even get to work.

This is an unprecedented situation in Zimbabwe and internationally. Even in wartime Europe, the people could get newspapers, transport systems operated, retail outlets were still open and people could communicate.

I cannot send you an e-mail or a photograph – it is a very weird situation.

The only thing we can do at this point is to ask for your prayers as we face this time of escalating fear and uncertainty.


Harare, Zimbabwe

Sunshine:

Perhaps you should take the name and organization off of your post. Could be problematic to the person who wrote it.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Sunshine:

Perhaps you should take the name and organization off of your post. Could be problematic to the person who wrote it.

Done, you are right.

At least WhatsApp is up again. I spoke with Gary Duckworth a number of times last night.

What is the status of Robert Mugabe or is wife? The last I saw they wanted to try his wife, but she might have made it to Namibia?

Assuming the reports of the Army joining the riots is there any fear of a coup of the coup?

Even if that is unreasonable, can someone answer what the status of Robert Mugabe and his wife are?