What is your take on the Blaser (or any other straight pull action rifle of adequate caliber) as a DGR?

Regards.

Riaan

I am shopping for my 1st SxS Big Bore DR and have RULED OUT Blaser. Negatives: auto-safety, clumsy to reload quickly, "looks" don't suit me.

A Blaser R-93 does not have an auto saftey. The straight pull, while different than what most of us are used to, actually requires less arm movement than the traditional bolt gun, which should give it an advatage to those that are used to using it.

Lots of guys like the Blaser R93 for hunting in Africa, but a few have reported problems when they got dirt down into the bolt fingers (i.e., the bolt won't lock up). There is no question that Blasers are accurate and the takedown feature makes them convenient to travel with.

I got to sit down at one of the shows recently and talked to the rep and tech guy from Blaser for about an hour. They were great in instructing me on Blaser Rifles. They let me disassemble and reassemble one multiple times, and really took the time of going over anything from barrel construction, bolt design, and stocks to rings to etc.etc..... I really like there design on the straight pull concept. I am going to buy one in a 6.5 x 55 or a caliber close to that for deer, pigs, whatever else.

I don't thing I would buy one in a DGR caliber though. While they gun has a great setup, I still am a fan of the large claw extractors on a 98 style action.

Two. I am very used to the safety features and the lift the bolt pull straight back function of a standard bolt rifle. I have been shooting bolt guns since I was 5, and changing to the straight pull design will take some time to learn. With a DGR, I want something that is familiar. Even if I spent the time with a Straight pull, I still don't think I would use it since they are not common in Africa. Yes I would probably bring an extra bolt for them on safari, and extra rings/bases. But I want a gun that barrels and stocks stay permeantly on a rifle. There straight pull design is all about switching.

I also don't like how they use a polymer mag box even for there bigger calibers. Even though polymer is super strong, I still worry about it cracking. (Especially with cold temperatures)

One thing I think that could effect the performance is opening and closing the bolt on the rifle. The whole action is out in the open to the elements when fully open. Since the bolt rides on rails, African Dust could possibly build up, and lock up the action?????? I don't know if this could happen but am thinking things through. The action does seem susseptable to aquiring dirt in it though if the bolt got opened compared to mostly rails on Winchesters, MRC actions and such.

Maybe my thoughts are unfounded?? I don't know?
I WILL buy one of there rifles in a medium caliber, I would rather spend the money and get a Mauser style bolt rifle for DGR mostly because I am familiar with it.

The Blaser S-2 double rifle is an interesting concept. It gives the Dangerous Game a much more fair chance to make a corpse of the hunter. Fair is fair.

The S2 Double Rifle also has some weird rubber thing between the barrels and I would be afraid of it dry rotting after a few years in the field.

The S-2 470 is also 3 pounds heavier than my Searcy 470.

Riaan,

I used a Blaser R93 in .416 Rem Mag in the Selous Game Reserve Tansania in 2004 on a 21 day hunt. I took eleven animals including lion, leopard, and buffalo. Would of taken elephant but though we followed up several bulls we did not locate any that were legal. The Blaser performed beautifully. I couldn't have asked for a better performing rifle. Extremely accurate, superb trigger, lightening bolt flick, and utterly reliable. One of the PHs has used an R93 in .416 Rem Mag since 94 (?) and had absolute confidence in it.

Very fine rifle and system.

Tom

To the gentleman worried about the Blaser magazines not holding up in cold weather: I hunted Greenland in March in daytime temperatures between -30 and -40 degrees Celcius (-22 - -40 F). It was pretty cold. My Blaser stayed outside the tent the entire hunt - not to experience problems with condensation when bringing it into a heated environment. No problems with the rifle in general or the magazine in particular.

My friend who attends these Greenland hunts regularly (mayby every year for about 10 years) is a "Blaser-phobic". I can rest assured I would have been told, if ANY Blaser had experienced a magazine failure. It would have been right up his alley. Thus far, that particular problem has not popped up on the radar, and there are a lot of Blasers taken every year.

I don't necessarily disagree on the issue of keeping the locking mechanism clean on the R93. It is easy to imagine the problems a grain of sand could cause in that mechanism. That said, a German Hunting magazine (I believe it was "Wild und Hund"??) made a test, and tried every conceivable way of getting an R93 to quit working in a "sand enriched" environment. I don't know to what extent such tests are realistic, but the testers sure did their best to have the tested guns stop working. The Blaser came through with flying colours. So although I try to keep my Blaser clean (every evening, tooth brush for the gun - as well as for myself ), perhaps this particular issue is not as pressing as we may believe.

- mike

Don't use a Blazer as a DGR. Most of my clients are German and many use Blazers in 375 H&H or 416 Remington. Some of them work fine but I have seen five seize up on safari. Seize up so badly that we had to carry a piece of firewood with us to hammer the the bolt open so we could put extract empties and in more cartridges to finish the safari.

Blaser explains this away saying hot reloads are the reason but for sure at least three of the rifles I saw freeze up were using factory ammunition and I suspect all five.I didn't start looking at the cartridges until two had the frozen action problem. I have also seen Model 70 Winchesters (cocking piece and shroud swing out of place) and Remington 700's fail (spring extractor breaks) but I have never seen a 98 Mauser fail.


VBR,


Ted Gorsline

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Gorsline:

... I have also seen Model 70 Winchesters (cocking piece and shroud swing out of place)...

Ted, can you further describe the M70 failures? I have not heard of the problem. What caused the failure? Is there any preventive action I can take?

I do already have a spare firing pin, spring and cocking piece assembly fit up and ready to go, but your problem sounds different to me.

I do not have a Model 70 in front of me but what happened is the whole assembly on the rear of the bolt that includes the cocking piece, safety and shroud spun over 90 degrees to where it made closing the bolt and thus reloading impossible.

This took place while shooting at a buffalo, that had taken an unprovoked run at us under the mistaken impression we were a lion in the grass. The ticks birds warned him of danger and as it turns out he had just been mauled by a lion, and so he came for us without warning but when he saw we were people he swerved off. Once he was down we saw the recent lion damage. One testical had been ripped off.

The Austrain client shot him but then was left helpless with an unusable gun and a wounded buffalo in front of him so I shot the buffalo.

I have also had the same assembly on a Mark V Weatherby move slightly the same way so that the cocking piece caught on the rear of the reciever as the assembly slid foreward but it was not enough to keep me from reloading the rifle. Its my 460 Weatherby so I filed the point where the cocking piece enters the steel groove at the back of the reciever a little wider and now it works fine.

I suspect there is a ball bearing that goes into a detent to keep the bolt shroud from turning and the shroud is likely held in place by a spring but that is pure speculation on my part not having a rifle here to examine and I am not a gunsmith. The example, I saw was from a post 64 Winchester in 375 H&H but Nigel Archer, a very good hunter from Kenya tells me he has had the same thing happen with his pre-64 model 70. His is a real pre.64 and not the more modern re-invention of the pre-64.


VBR,


Ted Gorsline



Regarding Blazers a friend named Peter Swales tells me 9 people in Europe have had the side of their faces blown off while using Blazers but I am not sure why. Maybe the barrels were plugged with mud or something like that. Maybe it wasn't the fault of the rifle. I do know that a man who owns the Haribou Gummi bear Factory in Germany is or was recently involved in a law suit regarding Blazer rifles.


VBR,


Ted Gorsline

I would not hesitate to use a Blaser R93 on dangerous game. My Blaser rides in an open top jeep for several months in powdery dusty conditions. It has never failed to work one time. And as far as safety. What could be safer than a gun that remains uncocked until you are ready to fire. I know people worry about a different type of bolt operation but I think this is nonsense. I grew up using conventional bolt actions and switched to the Blaser with no problems. The scope mounting system is as solid as any on the market today. You can travel with the gun broken down and put it together on arrival and it will be spot on! I guess it boils down to the people who use them and love them and those who never have don't.

Riaan, talk to Dr Lucas Potgieter at the Powder Keg (Kruitvat) in Randburg. He stocks Blasers and knows quite a lot from clients' feedback on these rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by Riaan:
What is your take on the Blaser (or any other straight pull action rifle of adequate caliber) as a DGR?

Regards.

Riaan

I would not do it, but to each his own. To me being butt ugly is enough not to buy one regardless of its benefits.

Blaser rifles are by far the most popular hunting rifle in Europe and many clients bring them on safari and most work. Many clients love them. They are also the major gun advertisers is all German gun magazines.

But I have myself seen five failures out of maybe 100 Blaser rifles used and I strongly suggest that if you hunt with them in a hot climate that you take along a rubber hammer to make sure you finish your safari.

They work fine as a single shot and your pH will follow up any wounded game that needs following up. So no worries.

The other thing to do is put the bolt into some kind of hard case. Airlines like you to store the bolt separate from the rifle and if you put it in your clothes and the rails get bent you won't be able to assemble the rifle after arrival.

I have a gunsmith friend who worked in Germany as a gunsmith for Korth pistols and who was later fired from a German gun magazine because of his views of Blazer rifles. I will dig up his e-mail address and post it as he now works in the USA and he is honest.


VBR,



Ted Gorsline

Blaser - German engineering gone awry. Blaser proves that art and engineering can collide.

My suggestion to anyone interested in Blaser - get a nice bolt rifle.

For an independant view of Blazer rifles contact David Moses at david@interordnance.com.

David was the only American employed as a gunsmith in Germany. He worked for Korth Pistols which handgun fans will realize are very well made. He later worked as advertising manager for one of the German gun magazines. It was in his vested interest to not notice things to get gun ads but as I say he is a gunsmithj and does notice things.

But he is a moral man and so I suggest that if you want to get an independant view of Blaser rifles you contact him.

Failing that just make sure you have a rubber hammer on your next safari.



VBR,


Ted Gorsline

The answer to the question is yes.

But of course, I have actually used the R93 on dangerous game multiple times, quite successfully, and without the slightest problem of any kind, so I may be prejudiced by actual, first hand experience.

I too have used a R93 on a 21-day hunt, a 12-day hunt, and soon another 21-day without any sort of problems. I use mine regularly here at home and just don't see where the critics come up with this stuff. Yes, the guns look and operate differently than our other bolt guns, but that certainly doesn't mean they aren't up to the task by someone that is familar with them.
The guns are durable, extremely accurate, great triggers, reliable, and certainly versatile. I also enjoy a double rifle as part of my arsenal (not a Blaser) and feel very good about any challenge I might encounter in Africa.

Thanks for the discussion on the M70, Ted.

I will copy your comments to a new thread in the Gunsmithing Forum, to see if there is any preventive maintenance IU can do.

Don

[QUOTE]Originally posted by mrlexma:
The answer to the question is yes.

"But of course, I have actually used the R93 on dangerous game multiple times, quite successfully, and without the slightest problem of any kind, so I may be prejudiced by actual, first hand experience."

I guess I suffer with the same prejudice. Mine worked perfectly. I had reduced the barrel length to 21 inches and the length pull for the stock to 13 inches so the total length was 37 inches. Handles like a dream, kills like the hammer of Thor, utterly reliable, extremely accurate,totally user friendly, beauty is as beauty does, but otherwise I guess it sucks.

Tom

Ihave had some clients with Blasers hunting water buffalos in swamps it can take a lot of mud water and horseback to get a buffalo they never failed but i prefer mauser trypes or doubles.Juan

Hello All

Here is my two cents worth,

First when I saw the Blaser 93 , Glock Pistols, I was abhorred, I started wroking an one of South Africa's busiest gunshops at age 12 !! Either it was a Mauser, Colt 1911 or FN Browning or you did not own it, out came these radical ideas.

And of course the diehards9including me) tried
too bash the new radical designs.

It is now a lots of years later, and having guided a helluva lot of European clients in South Africa,

I have decided I would love too ow a Blaser in 375 H & H, they were all accurate, dependable , and trust me the Spaniards do not keep their rifles clean, they always functioned without a problem and they sure as hell gives your the fastes three shots out of a Bolt ? action

i probably have photos of 95 clients with their Blazer rifles smiling happily beside dead buffalo and lions. But I have had five who were really pissed off with their Blazers.

I have seen many other types of rifles fail for one reason or another but it has usually only been one of type.

Craig Boddington once wrote about a muscle bound relative twisting a 98 Mauser into an inoperable condition during a moment of stress which is something I have never seen nor can I even figure out how he did it.

But seeing five Blazers fail in the field was quite noticable to me. I think it had something to do with the heat. It was some kind of pressure problem seizing the things up. Maybe the housing acts like an oven in 100 degrees temperatures.

I also know about many many positive Blazer tests being published in German hunting Magazines. I have had both Andreas Rockstroh, editor of Jagen Weltweit and Gunter Menching his assistant editor on Safari.

But my experience has not jived with the reports.



VBR,


Ted Gorsline

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Gorsline:

Regarding Blazers a friend named Peter Swales tells me 9 people in Europe have had the side of their faces blown off while using Blazers but I am not sure why. Maybe the barrels were plugged with mud or something like that. Maybe it wasn't the fault of the rifle. I do know that a man who owns the Haribou Gummi bear Factory in Germany is or was recently involved in a law suit regarding Blazer rifles.


VBR,


Ted Gorsline

Ted,

I don't know about all the Blasers you mention that blew up, but I do know that the one that blew up in Norway did not have it's barrel plugged up with mud in any way (it was a 300wby if I recall correctly).

Ps. Pete's a good man, and usually knows what he's talking about.

quote:

But seeing five Blazers fail in the field was quite noticable to me. I think it had something to do with the heat. It was some kind of pressure problem seizing the things up. Maybe the housing acts like an oven in 100 degrees temperatures.

I doubt temperature would be the problem. I have used mine in dusty and hot conditions. We have temperatures that reach 110 plus.

Perhaps you should encourage your clients to become familiar with their rifles before going on safari. What type of ammunition were they using? Some powders are more temperature sensitive than others. While prarie dog hunting we have even stored our ammo in coolers with ice due to firing rapid strings in very hot temperatures. And of course we all know that only a Blaser will lock up with a high pressure load. That is if the bolt doen't come back through your face.

I would love to own one, I think the unique setup with scope mounted directly to the barrel, helps eliminate potential beddding problems. I feel they are way over priced I might bite if the wood models where under 2k and the synthetic model under $1200. also another problem is the barrels are 6 bills plus 2 more bills for a scope mount, you have $800 tied up in each additional barrel essentially, thats 2 entire rifles or 1 nice rifle. for each barrel you have.

Sorry, I mistook your TITLE to be referring to double rifles, then I only "scanned" your opening post before writting my own.

Here is soemthing I have seen three times. It doesn't pertain to Blazer's or 98 Mausers as Mauser made them but rather to poor workmanship. I have seen three 98 mauser bolts ripped right off the rifles when the welds broke.

Sometimes when gunsmiths weld low slung bolts on 98 military mausers, to clear scopes, and they botch the job, and once the bolt has been polished and blued you don't see it.

Its something top keep in mind when chooosing your gunsmith and when buying a used and converted 98 Mauser for dangerous game.

VBR,


Ted Gorsline

It is an ugly push feed that doesn't like African dust! I'd have no problem useing the 93 for hunting non-dangerous game, however! That is,if I could stand to look at it!

Does anyone have a websource for all these R93 blow ups or is it all just anecdotal? It’s my understanding that the Norwegian and German blow ups were ammo related. I believe I remember reading an article in Magnum Magazine where they investigated these incidents thoroughly and arrived at that conclusion.

I don’t instruct for Blaser and have no financial interest whatsoever. I simply have had a magnificent experience with the gun. As I mentioned in a previous post one of the PHs with JML Safaris used one in .416 Rem Mag. while guiding in Tanzania for over 10yrs. Jerome Latrive, one of the owners of JML, responded recently to an inquiry from me.

Dear Tom,

Frederic was very happy with his blaser, no complain.

About 20 % of the hunter come with blaser R93 375 HH or 416.
We never had any problem and clients are all very happy with it.
It is a good rifle for Africa. Not heavy, accurate and very safe.

regards

jérôme LATRIVE

I am not tryin to change anyone’s mind who doesn’t like the asthetics of the gun but my experience with it along with that of much more experienced professionals has been totally positive.

The gun is not perfect, the barrel was too long for my taste and there was no recoil pad and it had some serious hard edges. I addressed both of these issues at the same time by have the barrel shortened to 21 inches, a Sims Limbsaver was installed and the length of pull reduced to 13 inches.

Regards,

Tom

I will contact Peter Swales when he returns from Argentina and see if I can dig up the details. I am pretty sure I saw something on a web site including photos and I will see if I can dig it up.

VBR,


Ted Gorsline

Thanks Ted

I just talked to David Moses of Interordnance of America in Monroe, North Carolina. David worked as a gunsmith in Germany for about 15 years and can both read and write German fluently. He knows more about German guns, who makes good German accessories etc. and the politics of the German gun business better than any other American to the best of my knowledge. I strongly suggest anyone wanting to know about Blazer rifles or any other German gun product call David at 704-225-8843 or send him an email at david@interordnance.com. He is an excellent contact and a nice guy to boot.

VBR,


Ted Gorsline


VBR,


Ted Gorsline

I noticed on this web site that the twist rates for Blaser barrels are less tight than the average rate of twist is for other rifles.
For example on a .308 Win the Blaser twist is given as 1:14" whereas normal .308 Win's twists are 1:12" and quite often as tight as 1:10".

Does this mean that a Blaser of a specific calibre is designed to fire only the light weight (shorter) bullets in that calibre range?
(The longer [heavier] the bullet, the tighter the twist need to be.)

If this is true on the larger calibres then it seems as if a Blaser rifle is not suitable for DG.

Can anybody help with this?

T russel,

My PH last year and this year was Herve Houdebine in the CAR who is guiding with Jean Michel Latrive and Jerome Latrive in Tanzania too. j m l safaris
Sure he doesn't like the Blasers (have You ever seen a PH with a Blaser?) but he told me something évident :
A PH won't discourage a client, particularly by critizing his client's rifle.... bad manners.
As far as the PH i using a serious rifle, he can backup the sloppy client. Herve is using either a 460Wby or a 458Lott Heym double.
Moreover, he explained me that the Blasers often haven't the time to fail, they won't fail after shooting 20 rounds or in 3 weeks. Thus, let the client be happy with his Blaser It might be the Latrives' policy as well.

Most of my partners in Europe have Blasers and I saw many fail. My hunting partner in Africa is my cousin Luc, he used his 416RM Blaser once and understand immediately that his life and the staff's life was in jeopardy, the next four times in Africa he has been using his irreproachable 416 Rigby CZ 550.

So, if the client is happy................

I follow these threads about Blaser's pretty closely. There seems to be a trend. The only people to have problems of any kind with the Blaser's are Europeans.

Is it possible that the R93's being sent to the U.S. are different, better quaility, or something? Does it have something to do with cleanliness and maintenance? Could it be cleaning products or procedures?

For some reason I'm thinking that there's a plasic ring toward the front of the bolt on the Blaser. If people are using harsh chemicals to clean their rifles (most of us do), but are not taking care to keep the chemicals off of specific parts, those parts could be damaged by the chemicals I would imagine.

I don't know, I'm just trying to come up with a logical reason for failures in general and/or figure out why the problems seem to be isolated to Europe/Europeans.

Saeed, give us your glowing opinion!