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Originally posted by Dave Fulson:
I thought I would jump in again. During the last couple of years of very intensive elephant hunting all across Africa,with out team filming several dozen bull elephant being shot from different angles and with a wide variety of calibers I, we(Boddington, Carter Fulson, and Danklef have had our eyes opened quite a bit as to the "stopping power" of the big bores. We have had several of the big boys on the scene .500, .577 .600 and .700 and all have been used on frontal brain shots on bulls from Tanzania to Botswana. Each of the above calibers was filmed on frontal brain shots on elephant bulls, several with some of them, that missed the brain. Some missed by less than six inches. The only''stopping" I saw was a bunch of startled bulls that stopped standing around and ran like hell for cover. I'm talking Kentucky Derby type running. No dropping to shock, no staggering around, no back end sitting down, I mean they spun the tires leaving. Have bulls been knocked out by close misses? I am sure they have, but I am here to tell you that I am no longer willing to believe in the ability, or better said, Probability that your, or my, big heavy will knock down a bull, especially a pissed off and incoming bull with "bullet shock" that missed the brain. Hunting always has exceptions, and I am not saying that it never happens, but I am saying that our team has spent one hell of a lot of time hunting Ele bulls and the film, of which I have plenty, does not lie. If you have confidence that your big hitter will knock a incoming bull down with"the'ol somewhere in the face shot"then I hope you have your affairs in order. I know I now place a lot more priority in placement than I do Knock out value. Like your "willy", bigger is only better if you know how to use it

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but a near miss(<< 1" )with a 500 produces considerably more effect than a 375.

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Close would be 6mm or less.No one imagines that any calbre can compensate for a complete,wild ass miss of the brain (ie 6" away) but a near miss(<< 1" )with a 500 produces considerably more effect than a 375.

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thus a conclusive statement that a .500 is better than a .375 can be realistically made.

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Originally posted by Jeff Wemmer:

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thus a conclusive statement that a .500 is better than a .375 can be realistically made.

TYPEO: "can NOT be realistically made"

JW

....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1
DRSS Charter member
"If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982

Hands of Old Elmer Keith

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Originally posted by Jeff Wemmer:
My limited experience is that animals react to bullet impacts in as many varying ways as there are calibres to shoot them with. No specific calibre will generate the same results from animal to animal, thus a conclusive statement that a .500 is better than a .375 can {not} be realistically made.

JW

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Saeed

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Originally posted by Macifej:

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a colostomy bag

Either that or some chicken livers in a Zip-Loc for good luck ...???

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Originally posted by kibokolambogo:

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Originally posted by JohnDL:
As regards buffalo, there MAY not be any such thing as a "stopping rifle."

I do not think that is true for lion and elephant however.

Stopping power is a colloquial term used to describe the ability of a firearm to cause a penetrating ballistic injury sufficient to incapacitate the target where it stands.
Some sporting arms are also referred to as "stoppers" or "stopping rifles". These powerful calibers are often used by DG hunters (or their PHs) for stopping a charging animal like buffalo or elephant.
If the shot is accurate enough to penetrate the brain it would clearly floor and instantly kill the animal. Should it miss the vital and intended target area, in most instances the impact would be sufficient to floor, divert or generally slow it down sufficiently for a following shot to be taken, hence the introduction and popularity of NE double rifles (.400 +)
A shot to the leg of a charging buffalo will unlikely produce the desired effects.

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Originally posted by Don In Colorado:
I recall a report published by a South African agency a few years ago discussing injuries associated with animal charges. As I recall this report established two critical parameters for determining whether someone was injuried or not: the first being distance at which the charge started and; the second the caliber used.

If the charge was noticed when the animal was more than 30 yards away the charge was always successfully stopped with no injury to the hunter(s)regardless of the caliber used. However, if the charge started at a distance of less than 30 yards then stopping the charge was entirely dependent on caliber.

Again, as I recall, 12 charges (again startig under 30 yards) involved a "375-class" rifle. None (that is right, NONE)of the charges were successfully stopped and in all cases a hunter or hunters were injured or killed.

There were 8 charges that involved a "470-class" rifle with 5 of these charges being successfully stopped, but with 3 still involving injuries.

Three more charges involved "500-class" or larger caliber rifles with all three charges being successfully stopped without injury to the hunters.

A few years ago when this report was released I commented on the comparative statistics of these results and while it is a limited sample population I think that nonetheless the results can be used to conclude that in tight cover one is better off with a 500 caliber rifle than something smaller.

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Originally posted by john.d.m:
Bit of a silly question really,
My 22-250 stops magpies brilliantly, my 30-06 stops deer, plains game and Leopard too, and my 458 wm stops Buffalo.
Basically if you can use your rifle and put the shot where it counts it will be a "stopper"

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