Kamboko Safaris: Truck Follow Up

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09 November 2010, 04:17

butchloc

well guys - i followed up on a wounded lion with jumbo in zim. it was dark, the grass was chest high and the lion was extremely unhappy about being shot. We ended up on foot, but i would have gladly taken a tank. don't criticize until you have worn those shoes. and jumbo did take a 102x101 pounder for am Argentinian client recently. along with 2 other that weren't far behind

09 November 2010, 06:19

Charles_Helm

quote:
Originally posted by surestrike:
When this happens to me I strip off my shirt grab a knife between my teeth and charge in. No need for caution I am an internet ninja.

09 November 2010, 07:05

Saeed

As mentioned above, we hunted buffalo up on mount Gelai.

The way to hunt them there is to get to a high ridge, then glass the area below you.
This area is normally about 300-500 wide, and very thick in bush.

We saw a an old bull, and went after him. Leaving our trackers at the top to look for him if he moved.

We got to where he was, right under the tree where he waslying, no more than 8-10 yards away from us.

We could not see him.

We looked at our trackers up on the ridge, and from their hand signal we knew that the bull was still lying down where he was.

We walked straight towards him, safeties off and ready to fire.

A couple of steps closer, and he took off. We were unable to take a shot, as we could not see him.

All we could see was the bush moving as he ran through.

We thought this might have been an ideal place for Mark Sullivan to try one of his chest thumping "look-how-brave-I-am-with-my-600-nitro-express-in-front-of-a-charging-buffalo"

THAT's a video I would like to see him produce.

09 November 2010, 07:11

Saeed

quote:
Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Wouldn't it be safer to just stay home and watch the video here? And a lot easier and cheaper to boot.

Why would you hunt DG in the first place if there were a chance of getting hurt?

Rich

Do it anyway you wish.

I will do it my way, and could not care less how anyone else thinks of how I hunt.

I hunt because I enjoy hunting. And have never felt I am in any real danger while hunting, because I have enough confidence in my own ability and the ability of the PH I hunt with.

If I really wanted to prove how brave I am, I would use a knive and go after a wounded lion or buffalo.

And let the rest of intelligent hunters realize how stupid I have been.

09 November 2010, 07:37

SGraves155

8 yds in the other direction is a mess.
High grass is a whole nother MF'er

09 November 2010, 08:06

jdollar

quote:
For ISS - Rich, once again you speak of that which you have no knowledge. Go hunt your first Lion and then come tell us there is no adrenaline rush on follow-up in a truck. Big Grin A wounded Lion can get into the truck with you whenever he wants. Oh, and they don't need NVGs to see in the dark. jumping

that's nothing new or different. to risk the lives of multiple people in order to get an adrenalin rush is just plain stupid. once you have to follow up a wounded and dangerous animal, ANYTHING THAT MAKES IT SAFER FOR ALL CONCERNED IS JUST PLAIN COMMON SENSE.

09 November 2010, 08:35

Saeed

Nothing seperates the real hunters from the keyboard hunters like this thread

09 November 2010, 08:42

Idaho Sharpshooter

Nobody here wants to tell the truth, or answer my question.

Answer me, why would you pay ten times as much to hunt a Lion as an Impala?
Disregard for a minute, if you can, who asked the question. Think, and tell me why.

Why?

09 November 2010, 08:50

Alaska Hunter

It looks like those of us who have gone after lions that have been shot all agree that a truck, if available, is the answer. Those that haven't had this experience seem to think it's wrong.
I've gone after one with a flash light after dark and it has to rank as one of the dumbest things I've ever done. It's not dangerous, it's suicidal. I'll take the truck every time I can on wounded lion.

09 November 2010, 09:05

crbutler

I haven't had to go in after a lion, but have done it with Buff and Brown Bear.

If you have to do it, you man up and do it, BUT-

If I had a truck, I would use it.

Putting the entire team at risk for your adrenaline rush is just wrong.

It is a dangerous undertaking in the sense if you mess up badly, you (or one of your fellows) may have to pay the price. As to the "cost", well, if there were as many impala on quota as lion, maybe they would be worth several thousand dollars and the hunts would be expensive as heck. Look at a Bongo or Lord Derby Eland hunt. Supply and demand... that's where the cost comes from.

ISS, if you want to recapture your military days, I'm sure Blackwater, or Xi or whatever they are calling themselves now would allow you to pay them to run patrol. Price supposedly "emigrated" to Dubai. I'm sure Saeed could get you in to meet him if you really want to risk your life foolishly.

09 November 2010, 10:14

fairgame

For those who have never hunted Lion.

A wounded cat is a PH's worst nightmare, not Elephant nor Buffalo. A Lion will kill you a Leopard will not.

I follow up by employing what ever advantage I can. It is just common sense and besides it is now my call. Often a vehicle is no help as Lion will seek deep cover but if a vehicle can be used, and is especially helpful at night or in long grass, then I will use it to help diffuse a potentially dangerous situation. It offers good visibility and added security.

A Lion can cover exactly 45 yards before you or I can say it. If there are any here who want to willingly step into the long grass after a wounded cat then please state it before you hunt with me.

And bring along an up to date copy of your will.

09 November 2010, 10:38

.458Aubs

ISS you are arguing for the sake of arguing on a topic you know nothing about, your posts in general show that all to clearly -Another one to my ignore list

09 November 2010, 12:50

ozhunter

quote:
Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Wouldn't it be safer to just stay home and watch the video here? And a lot easier and cheaper to boot.

Why would you hunt DG in the first place if there were a chance of getting hurt?

Rich

I enjoy DG hunting just like I enjoy Climbing rock or mountain. BUT will always try to minimise unnecessary HIGH RISK.

09 November 2010, 12:55

ozhunter

quote:
Originally posted by fairgame:
For those who have never hunted Lion.

A wounded cat is a PH's worst nightmare, not Elephant nor Buffalo. A Lion will kill you a Leopard will not.

I follow up by employing what ever advantage I can. It is just common sense and besides it is now my call. Often a vehicle is no help as Lion will seek deep cover but if a vehicle can be used, and is especially helpful at night or in long grass, then I will use it to help diffuse a potentially dangerous situation. It offers good visibility and added security.

A Lion can cover exactly 45 yards before you or I can say it. If there are any here who want to willingly step into the long grass after a wounded cat then please state it before you hunt with me.

And bring an up to date copy of your will.

09 November 2010, 14:56

larryshores

I was once forced by circumstances to walk out in the dark surrounded by angry lions (cattle killers). We knew there were at least 3 that were unhurt. There were 3 others that we thought were dead but did not know for certain. Our large lights has failed. We had 2 minimag flashlights.

Gentleman, let me tell you that that words like scary, frightening and nightmare do not even begin to describe the feeling. I felt 100% certain that one or more of us were going to but the farm that night.

We moved in unison like a ball of bait fish. Our back to each other and the locals holding the light while I covered one side and the ph covered the other.

Without a doubt, the single most dangerous thing I have done in my life, other than getting married!

09 November 2010, 15:12

shakari

quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:

Without a doubt, the single most dangerous thing I have done in my life, other than getting married!

I've sat in blinds with lions all around me for hours on end and enjoyed the experience but changing a flat tire when you have a dead buffalo or two, dripping blood in the back of the truck and hearing lions all around you ain't quite so much fun.

09 November 2010, 18:07

ddrhook

quote:
Originally posted by .458Aubs:
ISS you are arguing for the sake of arguing on a topic you know nothing about, your posts in general show that all to clearly -Another one to my ignore list

yeeep the ignore button is a great thing

09 November 2010, 19:19

ledvm

quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
Nothing seperates the real hunters from the keyboard hunters like this thread

09 November 2010, 19:39

MacD37

Having read the whole thread, I went back to the clip, and watched it again to take some mental measurements.

First I agree with the utilizing of the hunting car as I did before, the watching of the film a second time, only affirms my first opinion!

That lion, already wounded, unclear, by how many hits. At the first shot in the film gave plenty of time for another shot before starting the charge. At the charge, he made at lest 15 yds before going down with two more shots. If this lion had been in long grass, and the same situation took place,on foot, someone would surely been mauled, or killed, because the first shot on him would have been the LAST before he got to the hunters. Additionally if the three shots didn't stop him in this film, I'm sure that lion would have been in the hunting car with these two guys, with some dire results.

Gentlemen why the piling on Rich? He is entitled to his opinion just like the rest of us, and simply because it is not lockstep with the majority here, or even anybody here, is no reason for name-calling, and ignore buttons. I think the whole thing Rich is trying, unsuccessfully, to get across is that we hunt dangerous game "BECAUSE" it is dangerous, and that is true, at least in my case, and I want to get in close for the first encounter but if I fail to get the job done properly, I still have done what I was supposed to do with a dangerous animal and my conscience is clear when finishing the job the safest way possible for everyone involved. The use of the car in this case was the right decision, IMO, and if I were the only one here who believed that, it would still be the opinion I would post, agreement be damned!

.............................

09 November 2010, 19:52

ledvm

Mac,

I count Rich as a friend and a Patriot

...seriously. I defend him all the time. I am NOT piling on. But NOT using the car in this instance would be the same as choosing to ride in a NON-armoured personel carrier when traveling down an IED laden road in Iraq. Just does not make good sense.

09 November 2010, 21:48

ledvm

Rich,

Why not just suggest a simple name change for the company.

Kamboko Safaris ==>> Kam-bakkie Safaris.

Problem solved!

09 November 2010, 22:41

shakari

Of course, the other issue this should raise was discussed here: http://forums.accuratereloadin...043/m/7831022341/p/1

We really are our own worst enemies.

10 November 2010, 05:11

ivan carter

as a PH i guess i have a different perspective - part of our job involves stepping up when the options are limited !!

1/ i agree 100% its the smart thing to do to use everything you have to your advantage once a cat or any other dangerous game is wounded - prior to being wounded though i agree 1005 with saeed , if the buffalo , or ele or cat is in thick brush , - leave him or in you go !!

2/ after the first shot the truth of it is often there is no choice but to go into thick bush and make the followup - as discussed on a thread earlier in the year i will often give the client the choice weather he wants to come or not - the nature of the best bait spots is that they are close to cover - and guess where the cat goes when he is wounded !!

with regards to lion i have had two incidents in the last two or three years that got my "full undivided attention"

in one instance 10 minutes from last light jim hall shot a male lion , he ran into the very thickest of brush where the females were growling and carrying on - i had a choice , wait for the truck - by which time it would be pitch dark and we wouldnt be able to drive into the thicket anyhow or 2/ follow now while there is still some light albeit very little - the cat was dead but i was on all fours 20 yards into the thick brush by the time i found him - the girls were not all that pleased that i was there but with sokme shouting and attempt at looking brave and scary , i managed to chase them out of there

looking back at that scenario there was nothing else i could do - crawl through the brush and find the lion or ???

the second instance involved a charge in some high green thick grass into which the wounded cat had dissapeared - i had shot him in the rump and that stopped him but didnt kill him , as i got to about 7 yards he came like a steam train , as soon as i made out his body i aimed centre mass and pulled (you dont squeeze in that scenario!!!

) i carry two softs in my belt - the first had gone into his rump and i had reloaded my right barrell with a solid-the solid bullett went in below his chin and exited his rump - he turned , went around a small bush and came in , i shot him on his final leap in the face - in looking back there could not possibly have been anything else i could have done to retrieve that cat except follow him in -

now the point i really want to add is great cudos to the cameramen - both instances they caught the whole scene , both times rock steady with no gun and a whole lot of angry cat sounds !!!

but back to the thread , i will always use all and any advantage available to me to follow up a wounded animal especially cats -

10 November 2010, 05:19

ivan carter

quote:
Of course, the other issue this should raise was discussed here: http://forums.accuratereloadin...043/m/7831022341/p/1

We really are our own worst enemies.

agreed steve , putting a lion being shot from the back of a truck on your homepage is possibly not the best in light of that thread - editing it to just show the charge - passable

10 November 2010, 12:02

Idaho Sharpshooter

They used to take us for helicopter rides back in the day; all one way.

My question to finish this, what if the friggin' Lion jumps in the truck? Then he gets all their asses, and every African's dream: a truck to cruise around in.

Rich
call me foohardy if you wish, my PH and I go in on foot.

10 November 2010, 12:48

fairgame

quote:
Originally posted by ivan carter:
as a PH i guess i have a different perspective - part of our job involves stepping up when the options are limited !!

1/ i agree 100% its the smart thing to do to use everything you have to your advantage once a cat or any other dangerous game is wounded - prior to being wounded though i agree 1005 with saeed , if the buffalo , or ele or cat is in thick brush , - leave him or in you go !!

2/ after the first shot the truth of it is often there is no choice but to go into thick bush and make the followup - as discussed on a thread earlier in the year i will often give the client the choice weather he wants to come or not - the nature of the best bait spots is that they are close to cover - and guess where the cat goes when he is wounded !!

with regards to lion i have had two incidents in the last two or three years that got my "full undivided attention"

in one instance 10 minutes from last light jim hall shot a male lion , he ran into the very thickest of brush where the females were growling and carrying on - i had a choice , wait for the truck - by which time it would be pitch dark and we wouldnt be able to drive into the thicket anyhow or 2/ follow now while there is still some light albeit very little - the cat was dead but i was on all fours 20 yards into the thick brush by the time i found him - the girls were not all that pleased that i was there but with sokme shouting and attempt at looking brave and scary , i managed to chase them out of there looking back at that scenario there was nothing else i could do - crawl through the brush and find the lion or ???

the second instance involved a charge in some high green thick grass into which the wounded cat had dissapeared - i had shot him in the rump and that stopped him but didnt kill him , as i got to about 7 yards he came like a steam train , as soon as i made out his body i aimed centre mass and pulled (you dont squeeze in that scenario!!! ) i carry two softs in my belt - the first had gone into his rump and i had reloaded my right barrell with a solid-the solid bullett went in below his chin and exited his rump - he turned , went around a small bush and came in , i shot him on his final leap in the face - in looking back there could not possibly have been anything else i could have done to retrieve that cat except follow him in -

now the point i really want to add is great cudos to the cameramen - both instances they caught the whole scene , both times rock steady with no gun and a whole lot of angry cat sounds !!!

but back to the thread , i will always use all and any advantage available to me to follow up a wounded animal especially cats -

Any other PH would like to confirm that?

10 November 2010, 12:53

fairgame

quote:
Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
They used to take us for helicopter rides back in the day; all one way.

My question to finish this, what if the friggin' Lion jumps in the truck? Then he gets all their asses, and every African's dream: a truck to cruise around in.

Rich
call me foohardy if you wish, my PH and I go in on foot.

I sort of know what you are trying to say but you say it so bloody badly.

10 November 2010, 13:19

Saeed

quote:
Originally posted by fairgame:
quote:
Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
They used to take us for helicopter rides back in the day; all one way.

My question to finish this, what if the friggin' Lion jumps in the truck? Then he gets all their asses, and every African's dream: a truck to cruise around in.

Rich
call me foohardy if you wish, my PH and I go in on foot.

I sort of know what you are trying to say but you say it so bloody badly.

Yep.

It is the same old story.

"...I have fought in a war. You did not. So I know what is dangerous. You don't..."

It is immaterial that whatever Rich is talking about is totally irrelevant to the subject at hand. He just has to keep reminding us he knows better.

10 November 2010, 13:48

fujotupu

quote:
Originally posted by fairgame:
quote:
Originally posted by ivan carter:
as a PH i guess i have a different perspective - part of our job involves stepping up when the options are limited !!

1/ i agree 100% its the smart thing to do to use everything you have to your advantage once a cat or any other dangerous game is wounded - prior to being wounded though i agree 1005 with saeed , if the buffalo , or ele or cat is in thick brush , - leave him or in you go !!

2/ after the first shot the truth of it is often there is no choice but to go into thick bush and make the followup - as discussed on a thread earlier in the year i will often give the client the choice weather he wants to come or not - the nature of the best bait spots is that they are close to cover - and guess where the cat goes when he is wounded !!

with regards to lion i have had two incidents in the last two or three years that got my "full undivided attention"

in one instance 10 minutes from last light jim hall shot a male lion , he ran into the very thickest of brush where the females were growling and carrying on - i had a choice , wait for the truck - by which time it would be pitch dark and we wouldnt be able to drive into the thicket anyhow or 2/ follow now while there is still some light albeit very little - the cat was dead but i was on all fours 20 yards into the thick brush by the time i found him - the girls were not all that pleased that i was there but with sokme shouting and attempt at looking brave and scary , i managed to chase them out of there looking back at that scenario there was nothing else i could do - crawl through the brush and find the lion or ???

the second instance involved a charge in some high green thick grass into which the wounded cat had dissapeared - i had shot him in the rump and that stopped him but didnt kill him , as i got to about 7 yards he came like a steam train , as soon as i made out his body i aimed centre mass and pulled (you dont squeeze in that scenario!!! ) i carry two softs in my belt - the first had gone into his rump and i had reloaded my right barrell with a solid-the solid bullett went in below his chin and exited his rump - he turned , went around a small bush and came in , i shot him on his final leap in the face - in looking back there could not possibly have been anything else i could have done to retrieve that cat except follow him in -

now the point i really want to add is great cudos to the cameramen - both instances they caught the whole scene , both times rock steady with no gun and a whole lot of angry cat sounds !!!

but back to the thread , i will always use all and any advantage available to me to follow up a wounded animal especially cats -

Any other PH would like to confirm that?

Confirmed.

10 November 2010, 14:21

ozhunter

quote:
Originally posted by ivan carter:
as a PH i guess i have a different perspective - part of our job involves stepping up when the options are limited !!

1/ i agree 100% its the smart thing to do to use everything you have to your advantage once a cat or any other dangerous game is wounded - prior to being wounded though.

but back to the thread , i will always use all and any advantage available to me to follow up a wounded animal especially cats -

That sounds like a rational decision.

10 November 2010, 16:25

J D

quote:
Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
They used to take us for helicopter rides back in the day; all one way.

My question to finish this, what if the friggin' Lion jumps in the truck? Then he gets all their asses, and every African's dream: a truck to cruise around in.

Rich
call me foohardy if you wish, my PH and I go in on foot.

Any combat tested vet know's there is no such thing as a fair fight. You rode a bird in ,the vc had to walk, your m16/m14 carried more rounds than the sks did, and was quicker to reload, you had better air support than they did. Does any of that change shit when it comes down to it, you still had to man up, you either had it or you did not! You took every advantage you could to make it back home.

Hunter pays big bucks , makes poor shot, He wants every one else to put it on the line because of some notion of how things were done by real men in years past! I don't think so! You walk in, get close, but after the first shot , the gloves come off and you take every advantage you can!

I will bet the house that the old timers would tell if they could ,they would use any atvantage they could of.

The reason they went in on foot is because they had no elephants to ride etc.

JD

10 November 2010, 20:24

Idaho Sharpshooter

The very notion that the truck was that close strikes me as odd, or planned.

I have no beef with y'all. I just had never heard of anyone calling for a vehicle to do a sweep in force before. I wouldn't unless the PH insisted. I have had a couple PM's from PH's that basically said "we go dig him out on foot. You, me, and the trackers..."

Maybe this PH did not trust the client to pull his weight.

We will just agree to disagree on this one.

Rich

11 November 2010, 06:45

jdollar

quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
quote:
Originally posted by fairgame:
quote:
Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
They used to take us for helicopter rides back in the day; all one way.

My question to finish this, what if the friggin' Lion jumps in the truck? Then he gets all their asses, and every African's dream: a truck to cruise around in.

Rich
call me foohardy if you wish, my PH and I go in on foot.

I sort of know what you are trying to say but you say it so bloody badly.

Yep.

It is the same old story.

"...I have fought in a war. You did not. So I know what is dangerous. You don't..."

It is immaterial that whatever Rich is talking about is totally irrelevant to the subject at hand. He just has to keep reminding us he knows better.

once again, Saeed hit the nail on the head.

11 November 2010, 07:37

Aaron Neilson

quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
I might get some flack from this, but I really do not see anything wrong with following a wounded lion in a truck, especially in high grass or thick bush.

Only a fool would follow a wounded lion on foot, unless he had no other choice! JMO.

11 November 2010, 08:17

Frostbit

quote:
Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
I have had a couple PM's from PH's that basically said "we go dig him out on foot. You, me, and the trackers..."

Rich

Care to name the PH's?

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11 November 2010, 08:27

Bill C

quote:
You, me, and the trackers..."

Rich, notice how YOU are first in line?

quote:
Originally posted by fairgame: I follow up by employing what ever advantage I can. It is just common sense and besides it is now my call.

What we as visiting sports hunters say we would do is irrelevant, as Andrew points out, he's the PH and it's his call. Andrew, feeling responsible and wanting to clean up my own mess, I indeed might be foolish enough to go into the long grass...if you ever have the occasion to talk me out of it, please do!

11 November 2010, 08:59

Bwana Moja

Rich: I'm kinda late to this party over here...have had my hands full with another thread down the way. You still up over there in Idaho. And do take note as you respond to me. It will be post number 12345 for you.

I have one curious question for you. Why would these guys put that lion video on their home page? And by the way, the Bears are 5-3.

11 November 2010, 09:18

Michael Robinson

I have followed wounded lions on foot.

We somehow managed to find and kill them.

I would not turn down a truck ride under the wrong circumstances.

11 November 2010, 09:23

jdollar

quote:
Originally posted by Aaron Neilson:
quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
I might get some flack from this, but I really do not see anything wrong with following a wounded lion in a truck, especially in high grass or thick bush.

Only a fool would follow a wounded lion on foot, unless he had no other choice! JMO.

oh, come on Aaron, if you were the world's foremost slayer of man and beast, the little matter of a wounded cat in tall grass wouldn't even raise your heart rate. after all, they aren't carrying AK's( and therefore not worthy of consideration). just because your trackers are out front- well, who really cares if they get hurt or killed as long as your ego is fed. you just press on and "dig them out".