The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting SCIF Donates $217,000 in last fiscal quarterGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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Sorry no disrespect but does your money just land at your feet. We all take monies from someone and it is either earned or received as a gift. It is like breathing either you do or you don't. | |||
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SCI specifically takes money from the hunting industry, and some might say in a rather unpleasant way, claiming that they are the ones at the forefront of conservation. A statement which far from the truth if we look at how much they pay back to African hunting. | |||
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It is easy to get into a disagreement here over money that one has, and the source and how it is obtained. I do not mean to do that. I worked hard all of my life to get to where I am now. Nobody ever gave me a dime. Nobody! Ever! I started out washing dishes at my house for a dime a sinkful. I was five that year. At eight my Father entrusted me with the family lawnmower and I started a lawn service business. It got better. The bottom line here is: SCI is the only group putting their money down. Those of us who choose to belong to SCI contribute to that goal. Those who do not... Nobody but the individual knows there. It seems ill-considered to state in public that they do not do enough and then admit to doing nothing oneself about the situation. That's just my notion of fair. Rich DRSS | |||
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With all due respect, I've gotta say I reckon it's bang out of order and extremely bad taste to criticise Saeed of all people.  Not only does he pay all the not inconsiderable costs of this hosting all of us on site, he almost certainly donates to appeals/prizes etc here AND he very kindly takes people on safari....... and I'd bet he also does other things we don't even get to hear about. He deserves thanks not criticism. | |||
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Absolutey so !  | |||
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Whenever the board goes into one of its SCI rants I often wonder which deadly sin is not expressed along the way, maybe lust and gluttony. | |||
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Here is an update. I contacted other board members of the SCI chapter that I am a member of. It was agreed that we would donate $200.00 to the John Greef relief fund. It is not much, but we only have 35 members and are working hard to increase membership. Thank you Saeed for providing such a great forum to communicate with other members in the hunting industry. Where else does an everyday, run of the mill hunter (only speaking for myself of course) have the opportunity to communicate with many people that are in the upper echelon of the international hunting community. Martin | |||
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I reckon Saeed is incredibly generous and I'm simply stunned that any member here could be so bloody rude as to criticise him so unfairly..... so perhaps my deadly sin was wrath and perhaps what caused my wrath was the envy that seemed apparent in the comment that triggered that wrath?  | |||
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I think that's fantastic news..... thank you and the chapter!  | |||
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Next step is an email to the regional rep. If all of us SCI members follow suit, the negitivity of this thread will turn into an absolutely positive thing for both John Greeff and SCI. Martin | |||
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375LVR, what are you smoking Steve etc will never change their mind about SCI . | |||
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While studying for my Phd at the School of Hard knocks, I have learned that I can't change anyone but myself  What I can do, is continue to look at the good side of things and try to help where I can. I think that at a SCI chapter level or any other club chapters, great things do and will continue to happen. We can't change the Corporate mentality over night, but what we can do is work with what we have until a better alternative comes along. Send emails to the SCI board and regional directors. Tell them what you think needs changed. May not change a thing, but at least you won't regret the fact that you didn't try. Just my rose colored view of life.Martin | |||
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AT the end of the day, SCI has still donated $217,000 in the past quarter to conservation projects and somebody is uncomplimentary RE that fact. Y'all need to put some chapstick on, before you get blisters. Rich DRSS | |||
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Rich, I think you are missing people's concerns... At the end of the day, mafia Don's donate lots of money to local charities and churches...so I guess that makes all their behaviors ok. Now, before I start hearing the bitching, I am not comparing the SCI to the mafia. However, many people believe SCI is full of hypocrisy as it relates to hunting ethics and donating money to conservation doesn't absolve SCI from questionable behaviors in many people's mind. Mike Legistine actu? Quid scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I just got the most recent copy of the Wild sheep Foundation Journal. In it on page 27 they have listed the amount of dollars donated to various organizations during FY 2009-2010, It is too long to quote the whole thing but here is a sample of funded projects.; Arizon F&G $221,240 Alberta Hunter Ed $230,400 Baja Sur Desert sheep Program $42,550 Cal. F&G $80,000 Montana FW&Parks $247,500 Wyo G&F $74,475 Two property purchases in Idaho $79,330 Conservation Force $25,000 Wild Shhep Disease Research $75,000 Total donations made during this FY was $2,669,286 That gives a much better idea of where our dollars went. Why can't SCI do the same? 465H&H | |||
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One wonders why it wouldn't be that simple; could it be that easy to be transparent? ...hmmm Antlers Double Rifle Shooters Society Heym 450/400 3" | |||
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Mike, What ever SCI contributes, it's never enough. SCI is not very efficient, neither is the NRA, neither am I. Neither are most of you out there. When this thread dies of sheer inertia, or is locked; the bottom line is SCI put $217,000 out the last quarter. SCI connects hunters with outfitters and PH companies. Besides this forum, where do you get to compare? Personalities and opinions aside, that is the number. $217,000. I always suggest that when you criticize someone else's efforts, your next sentence should be about how much of your time & $$$ went out for similar programs. If that offends some of you, I can live with that... Rich DRSS | |||
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Agreed, I was given a membership to SCI. I think it is a great organization. It has its quirks, but so do you and me. Those who knock it, what do you donate and with whom do you send it? I think a DU based organization would be nice, as it could be localized in spending, but then you loose the perks of SCI. | |||
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I am not sure how SCI has the ability to take anything from the hunting industry. I recall comments regarding SCI requiring outfitters to make donations in order to attend the convention. I do not know if this is true or not. But if any outfitter did not think they would benefit from attending and donating why would they come? Every outfitter is in the business to make money. If donating to SCI did not allow them to make more than they spent why would they play the game? NRA CRPA DRSS | |||
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rhromm, whoa on the comparison to DU (I assume you mean (Ducks Unlimited). Here are the facts the local DU chapters are required to purchase most if not all of their sale items from DU, second all funds are forwarded to DU and then when a local chapter wants to do a project they must apply to DU for Funding. Now SCI offers items to chapters for sale but does not require the chapter to buy from them also most chapters get some donations from members attending the show in Reno and requesting donations from vendors and get donations and bargain items from other vendors. Secondly SCI requires the local chapter to remit 30% of profits to them and the remaining 70% is retained locally for the chapters projects. I am not sure but I think most of the org i e RMEF, NRA etc are like DU. This was one of two reasons I got involved with SCI Allegheny Mt Chapter. We are able to do our own thing i e support youth outdoor activities ie hunting and fishing. rhromm, when you renew your SCI membership you can ask SCI national to credit your membership to a local chapter, they will receive no funding for it but it will help in maintaining their membership level, You can also contact your local SCI chapter and become a member, some of the larger chapters have their own dues and activities thru the year. Our chapter is very small less than 50 members with about 8-10 members on board to do the annual banquet and raise (times are tough) about 20+25,000 in the evening, that is down from 30-35,000 a few years ago. | |||
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Could I ask a couple of Genuine questions which hopefully wont get me shot down in Flames. 1/ Is SCI run by duly elected members or is it run by commercially appointed people. Obviously I refer to the managing board, or Committee, not everyday staff. In a nutshell, is POLICY set by elected members or appointed staff. 2/The Booth allocation method and Cost of exhibitor space etc, as well as use of funds etc creates huge amounts of controversy every year. Has there ever been any effort by members current or past to have the "Club" affairs audited and made public?? As a Club, with paying members, accounts should be a matter of public record if I am not mistaken. 3/ Is there currently , or has there in the past been any sort of Committee in place to investigate just why there seems to be so many disenchanted members and ex Members?? If there has been, what were the results?? and was any action taken to address these problems I am a fence sitter on this issue as I beleive, like almost everyone on this forum that SCI has good people at Chapter level and indeed all the way through its structures. However I can also see that there are good people who unhappy with many facets of the organisation. I asked my first question as there is a distinct difference between a Member driven and controlled CLUB and a Commercial entity to which people pay to belong, but in effect have no control despite monetary contribution. I sincerely hope that my questions do not offend anyone and I ask them in the hope of receiving genuine honest feedback to put me in the picture | |||
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DU was funded across the water from where I live. The money raised in my county, stays in my county. It is a high percentage of the money that is returned to the ducks, more than 70 percent. Not knocking SCI, just stating. | |||
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Your chapter must have a direct line but they sure don't keep what they raise, they may be able to get it back but it goes to DU first. They have done projects here but they had to apply for the funds. | |||
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All, This illustrates the difference yet again between a grass roots organization and a political lobbying organization. DU, TU, RMEF, OVIS, FNWS, WF, NWTF, RGS, ect, ect are grass roots organizations. Grass roots projects are sexy. They win hearts and minds, but they don't win court cases or key votes in congress. SCI and NRA are NOT grass roots organizations. The are political lobbying organizations. They privide briefs and attorney's for court cases. They lobby congress. They donate to like minded candidates. Like the NRA a small part of SCI is grass roots (SCIF). I understand that people want to see more grass roots, but that fact is that's not what SCI is about. That doesn't make SCI a bunch of horrible people. It just means they aren't a grass roots organization. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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If SCI operated on a local grassroots level, not a penny would ever get to Africa. The money gets raised in America and goes to Africa. That "raised here, stays here" stuff works for ducks, not Cape Buffalo. Does anybody here know how much money DSC spends on Africa? I have heard their $$$ stays in the States, but have never read or heard anything. Rich DRSS | |||
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IS, interesting, I don't know the answer, but if they spend no funds in Africa what does Saeed and Steve etc have to say about that. Personally I think both do good jobs. Posted above and then went to web site and found two African conservation org donated to and one African education project amount of funds donated not listed. I did see donations to Quail Unlimited and DU. The one conservation donation was to a project apparently headed by Chifuti and HHK. This is informational not trying to start an AR war vs DSC. | |||
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Good luck in getting answers for these relevant questions  | |||
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The bottom line is that folks like SCI and the NRA are the ones constantly in court to try to keep the fascists from total control. If you think that's wrong there are probably some chambers still around in Germany. No organization is completely pure, whatever that is, but to do nothing by not supporting those that do, you are going to get what you deserve. ------------------------------- Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun. --------------------------------------- and, God Bless John Wayne. NRA Benefactor Member, GOA, N.A.G.R. _________________________ "Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped “Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped. red.dirt.elephant@gmail.com _________________________ Hoping to wind up where elephant hunters go. | |||
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SCI gives 4.4 million to the SCI foundation where the real work is done it seems but drops almost 1 million (not including their rent) on "office expenses". Hmmmmmmm.....I hope the coffee in their break room is TOP SHELF! | |||
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10D - That is really not a lot of $$ when you figure they have main headquarters in Arizona, along with a fabulous Museum , and office in DC, nothing is cheap there and a few more offices scattered aroung the World, including AFRICA I believe. Maybe your Hmmmmmmmm indicates you could provide all of this to them for less?? I am sure they would be glad to see a proposal from you showing how much YOU could save them? Didn't reallize you were in the "office management" business? Larry Sellers SCI Life Member
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That is actually a ridiculous amount of money (of course they may be misclassifying expenses which raises other concerns). Salary expense was $4.34 million and office expense not including rent and information technology was $947K. That is a burden rate of 22% just for office expense. In 15 years of doing cost management work off and on, I have never seen an office expense to salary expense ratio like that. They only spent $275K on lobbying. Mike Legistine actu? Quid scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Good luck in getting answers for these relevant questions [/QUOTE]Saeed. My point is only that if everything is above board and clean/transparent then these answers should be known to every SCI member and many of those who are not members. If they are not public knowledge, then why the secrecy?? | |||
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Saeed. My point is only that if everything is above board and clean/transparent then these answers should be known to every SCI member and many of those who are not members. If they are not public knowledge, then why the secrecy??[/QUOTE] It has been awfully quiet from the SCI cheerleeders corner lately. It seems any time they come up with an answer, that answer raises more questions. | |||
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Saeed, I think some of us just get tired of arguing. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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Brett, I for one is certainly not arguing. All I have asked for was some answers of where the money collected from the African outfitters and PHs goes. Very simple really, but so far we have had no answer. | |||
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It has become BORING after many many many years and many many many strings. A dead horse can be beaten only so long and finally the bones becaome dust. | |||
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Why don't YOU tell us where the money goes, as it seems you have better connections than any of us. | |||
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I think it is very relevent as to exactly where the money goes. I have limited dollars to donate to my favorite conservation organizations. If I have a choice,I am going to donate to the org that puts 90% of every dollar I donate on to the ground versus one that only gets 30% of my donated dollars on the ground. 465H&H | |||
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That is the boring part of this string, I don't have any better connections than anyone else, I have just gone to the web site and transferred info contained to this string and past strings. That info does not satasify some posters here. Thus the above statement. It is like me asking you where does your country spend all its funds. Since I buy products I am sure some of these funds end up in the hands of your government. It may be many steps but probably less than 5. of course I would never expect a detailed accounting. | |||
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BAB & DOJ - Like I said above, not even fun stirring the pot with the predicted participants and predictible rants anymore. Same old song, different verse and still nothing but bash, bash, bash, with no end in sight or positive feed back. Seems we who give $$ and support don't have a problem at all, it's the outsiders who give nothing but negative narrative and no support are the crybabies? One would think that non supporters wouldn't really care one way or another? Larry Sellers SCI Life Member | |||
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