The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting SCIF Donates $217,000 in last fiscal quarterGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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SCI Foundation Contributes $217,000 To Big Game Wildlife Conservation Washington, DC – Safari Club International Foundation (SCIF) today announced that it had distributed over $217,000 in the final quarter of its last fiscal year to fund five critical conservation projects in North America, Asia and Africa. Specifically, SCIF has dedicated the funding to managing sustainable wildlife conservation programs that expand research into the complex interplay between predator and prey species. “These funds will go a long way to help expand SCIF’s efforts as we continue to fund, support, and manage worldwide programs dedicated to wildlife conservation, outdoor education and humanitarian services around the world,” said SCIF President Larry Rudolph. “A better understanding of predator-prey dynamic will facilitate best management practices around the world for continued sustainable wildlife conservation and management.” Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | ||
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Let's guess who will comment about this....   | |||
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I'm betting at least one person will carp about that not being enough money. Rich DRSS | |||
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I'm waiting!!! Where are you guys? Larry Sellers SCI Life Member | |||
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NOT ENOUGH TO AFRICA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!         | |||
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Larry Rudolph sure seems to have been out-and-about!!  A day spent in the bush is a day added to your life Hunt Australia - Website Hunt Australia - Facebook Hunt Australia - TV | |||
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Go on then, I'll bite. Glad to see they're doing something at least but should point out that $217K divided equally between 3 continents works out at about $72333. Not exactly a great amount but better than a kick in the nuts. I do have a couple of genuine questions. Can someone tell me what the difference is between SCI & SCIF or are they the same? Also, does anyone know what the money was spent on? I genuinly don't want to dig up the dead horse to flog it again but would like to know the answer to my questions. As Matt points out a new man at the helm might be making a difference! | |||
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Once more Steve, SCI is an lobbying orginazation with great fund raising capability. The SCIF is the charatable arm of SCI and also does fund raising, the foundation does the donating to various causes. The basic reason for the distinction is the US Tax code. Like it or not SCI is based in the USA and operates under the laws of our country. | |||
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I understand the tax thing but how does SCIF get it's funding and how does the link between the two organisations and their BoD work? | |||
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It is very simple Steve. SCIF gets a bit of money to give to good causes so SCI can bragg about it. SCI, however, gets most of the money to spend on politicians and the top boys who run SCI. Nothing has changed, but I suspect they are showing that they are doing someting positive because they have been getting a lot of bad publicity of where the money goes. I still think this pittance compared to the amount of oney they black mail out of Africa!  | |||
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I feel better; The circle is complete. | |||
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Saeed, I understand that also and without wanting to resurrect the dead horse, agree with you but what I genuinely don't understand is the links and funding between the two organisations. For example, are the same people on the BoD of both organisations and how does SCIF get it's money?.... or more accurately, is it funded directly from SCI or does it raise it's own funds from elsewhere? | |||
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How much did it donate the other quarters of the year? I know very little about SCI and frankly I'm not losing any sleep over them. All that said, in the big scheme of the world, 800-900k per year donated to the field (assuming this was an "average" quarter) isn't very much money in the big scheme of the world. I would have thought SCI was a more aggressive supporter at a financial level then that. I have no insight to how they run, so this number may be HUGE to them and they may pour every last cent that is logical into the field, just seems low at first glance. | |||
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Steve, They are fundamentally the same organization as other members pointed out. The difference is really a "paper" difference for tax purpose and legal separation issues. The SCI Board has 13 members...the SCIF Board has 14 members. Eleven of the members are currently the same between the two boards. Both organizations can raise money on their own. I suspect that the majority of donations to third parties probably come out of the SCI Foundation if not exclusively. Most likely, when SCI wants money directed somewhere they first give it to the SCI Foundation who then makes the contribution. Often in these types of arrangements the non Foundation entity takes all of its "excess profit" above what is allowed to keep in reserves at the end of the year and then transfers that money as a contribution to the Foundation to maintain a tax exempt status. The other likely reason why the two organizations exist as separate groups is protection from the membership and other parties. If I am a member of SCI and SCI "harms" me in some way, I can sue SCI. Especially, if SCI has a set of by laws and I can prove discriminatory practices. For example, Mark Sullivan could try to sue SCI because maybe he thinks they tarnished his reputation by kicking him out of the convention. SCI has lots interactions with many people/entities. They conduct conventions, they sell awards, they make political contributions, they have by laws and charters. All of these activities can annoy people and have people want to exert control over SCI and SCIs money or sue SCI. As soon as I create a separate entity called the SCI Foundation and if it does only 1 thing which is write checks not a lot of people are going to be able to sue the Foundation. So as money comes in to SCI and then it is moved to the SCI Foundation the money is now more protected. The Foundation is also insulated from the membership becuase the membership is part of SCI and not part of the SCI Foundation. The above info is just directionally correct...US tax laws are quite complicated and we have differences between "not for profit" and "non profit". For all intents and purposes the two entities operate as one but are legally separate. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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damn, it went almost 36 hours before the dead horse flogging started. that's probably a NEW RECORD!!!! of course once it did, the usual players took the field. Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… | |||
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If anybody is interested here is the link to SCIs Tax Return. http://www.scifirstforhunters.....09_SCI_FORM_990.pdf In round numbers: SCI generated $14 million in revenue Disbursed $4.6 million in grants/donations Spent $5.2 million on salaries and other compensation Spent $6.0 million on other expenses A couple of notable numbers: Of the $6.0 million on other expenses $1.7 million was on production expenses, I am assuming that means making videos and similar materials. Of the roughly 11.2 million in expenses about $8.3 million is categorize as Program Service Expenses and about $2.9 million in Management and General expenses. Salaries to Officers, Directors, and key employees was approximately $.5 million all other salaries totaled $3.8 million and other benefits/payroll taxes etc totaled $.9 million. SCI was about $1.7 in the red last year. I have never been a huge fan of SCI but I also don't hate them just not my cup of tea. I am little surprised that SCI spends $11.2 million (about $275k was lobbying) to give a way $4.6 million. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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A wage packet of 5.2m out of 14m? How many people does this organisation employ? | |||
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Yep, the circle is now complete. Same old players singing their same old song from afar. Their responses are getting so predictable that it's not much fun anymore even getting them stirred up. Maybe someone can come up with another diversion to spice thing up a little? If some people are so intent on knowing the inner workings of SCI/SCIF maybe they should join the organization, get involved and find out first hand rather than blowing smoke from across the pond?? Larry Sellers SCI Life Member | |||
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Apologies for blowing smoke from across the pond. Had I realised my question was so indiscreet I would not have asked, I therefore will remain privately curious as to the answer. | |||
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i havent read the overwrought expostulations of our other respected members, but thats a decent amount to help our aims. | |||
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Oh indeed, but I thought the issue raised by some of the other respected members was one of, ah, efficiency. I may however be mistaken. | |||
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LOTS - Office staff, convention staff, field staff, publications staff... dont know the exact numbers but it is quite a large number.. A day spent in the bush is a day added to your life Hunt Australia - Website Hunt Australia - Facebook Hunt Australia - TV | |||
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Thank you for having a stab at the question Matt. Regards, GH | |||
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I am going to see if I can research some other oraniztions to see what their percenatges look like. The gross numbers still indicate that SCI spends about 70 cents for every 30 cents it donates. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Charity Navigator rates them: LINK | |||
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Compared to Ducks Unlimitedat the same site. From the SCI Form 990 it appears they generate $7 million+/- from "Fundraising Events" {The Convention?]. And they donated $4.4 million+/- to SCIF for projects. | |||
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Interesting... I can tell you that in taking 15 minutes to double check the SCI numbers that there appears to be some serious issues with the validity of the information this rating service is using. My numbers are 2009 the rating service is showing FY 2008. If you look at page 1 of SCIs IRS FY 2008 filing (the year the rating service last covers) it would seem this rating service is either a) not extracting the correct numbers or b)relying on self reported numbers from the charities. Page 1 of SCIs own IRS filing (FY 2008) indicates revenues of $17.4 million and total expenses of $16.7 million Of the $16.7 million $13.2 were for Program Expenses. Program Expenses (found a few pages back) include the donations to various conservation groups. Of the $13.2 million in Program Expenses only $3.9 million were grants/donations. Of the $3.9 million $3.8+ million was a single operating grant to the SCI Foundation. The above equates to about 75 cents on the dollar going to expenses and 25 cents going to actual grants and donations. Amazing what is in these forms. I highly encourage anybody interested to actually read the IRS fillings. By the way, I would like nothing more than for someone form SCI to contact me and explain if I am misinterpreting the numbers. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Mike the Listing in the Charity Navigator is for SCIF not SCI. I assume because SCI is not a charity? Just a non-profit? Anyway mixing apples and oranges. Les | |||
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Yep it is the SCI Foundation on that link. Interestingly enough a quick review of the SCI Foundation expenses do not look much better. SCIF has about $2 million in salary, benefits, and payroll taxes. But I would need more time to look at them. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Mike I think you have pick out the "Prior Year" revenues vs "Current Year" Revenues of $14 million. Of which they spent: $6.4million supporting the chapters and the 54000 members, as well as publishing mothly an bi-monthly magazines. $2.2million on Advocating for hunting and hunters rights [which is the stated purpose of SCI] $4.5million donated to SCIF for Conservation and Scientific studies. So almost $13,000,000 of the $14,000,000 spent doing what the "Club" does. Being a club, advocating,and conservation and related activities. Les | |||
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Your right about grabbing the wrong revenues numbers, the revenue number is $14.0 million. Your analysis points out my specific concern with SCI: $6.4 million of $14.0 millions goes to "running" the club. I am not sure how you are defining "supporting" because it does not seem that the $6.4M contains donations to chapters. Others may think the above is okay. I don't see the data for the $2.2 million in advocacy. Can you tell me where that information comes from? I look at the numbers differently. I see $14 million in revenues and only 32% ($4.5M) of it donated to conservation and science. Even if I add in the $2.2M I get to less than 50%. If I then look at the SCIF they spend about another $1.8M on payroll or 32% of the monies they received. My preference is for the percentage of money spent on conservation to be a lot higher. I fully admit, some people look at it completely different and think that use of the funds is just fine. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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May be that is because SCI is up to their usual tricks! Which are so predictable as well. Those who question SCI performance might change their tune once they see that SCI is no longer following their so predictable, unacceptable as far as many members hunters are concerened, path? | |||
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Very well, now this horse has been beaten for 2010. Can we wait until 2011 for the next rant on SCI. Now I need to get to the Canned Lion rant for 2010.. | |||
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Mike and others, Thanks for the info. I guess I'll never change my mind about SCI until I see them changing the ways they operate and frankly, I can't see that happening anytime soon. In the meantime let the dead horse flogging begin. Hopefully without too much of my input.  | |||
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Steve it is good to see nothing can change your mind. | |||
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The right facts and figures possibly could as could scrapping the policy of donations but I'm sure neither of us expects that to happen. Other than that, I'll be very surprised if anyone can convince they're worthwhile. | |||
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Cant convince you that a hunting club, that you have had next to ZERO to do with, is worthwhile??? Weird!! A day spent in the bush is a day added to your life Hunt Australia - Website Hunt Australia - Facebook Hunt Australia - TV | |||
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Hold on mate..... I was a member of several years and have been in the African hunting industry for slightly more than 30 years now so although I might not know everything about them, I do have a reasonably good working knowledge of them. I just choose not to support them which is my perogative. I'd also hardly call them just a hunting club..... if they were just that and nothing more, I wouldn't criticise them. | |||
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So if it's not a club;what is it? | |||
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Gentlemen the key word is "right" and the word "right" is as defined by Steve. dinsdale you are just plain uninformed becaus Safari Club International is not a club they only call themselves a club and of course that would be their definition not Steve's. From what I have been able to gleen from Steve's discourse they are (in my words a bunch)of glory hounds and theives. They rip off all the african safari operators who by the way attend their convention of their own free will. I have not read a report that any operator had a gun held to their head and forced to attend the show. The SCI provides a venue and determine how they charge for space allocated and the location of that space. As Steve claims he was a member and chose to drop his membership apparently because he was not getting a just return for his membership fee. This is just fine just as I would chose to not hunt with his operation simply because we differ on this subject and since it is my money I am spending I can chose where to spent it and that would be with outfitters that support SCI. Not to confuse anyone the SCI support is only one of the critiria I use in choosing an outfitter. Some may agree some may differ. | |||
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