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In my experience, the number one thing you need to kill most African game is money

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Originally posted by Stephen Palos:

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Originally posted by shakari:
I can see a certain logic in that argument but I can see an awful lot more logic in taking it a step further by simply allowing the Chinese and whoever else wants the bones etc to farm the species themselves in their home countries and we have nothing to do with that and therefore no-one in the hunting industry can be tempted into dodgy dealings.

There's also the PR benefit of the hunting industry not only being squeaky clean but being SEEN to be squeaky clean.

Stephen, I have to ask who you are referring to when you say 'our'? do you mean some of the guys here or do you mean some kind of breeders association? - Sorry to ask that question but I'm a bit confused by your use of the word.

Steve, pardon my arrogance at the use of "our" in that respect. I am referring very specifically to the concept of "Conservation BY Utilisation" as against "Preservation by Charity" which I (perhaps arrogantly) believe to be the majority view here. Would be interesting to canvass perhaps?

Within that general view though, I do concede that there will be a myriad of lets say "sub-opinions" where individuals hold differing views on specific issues. This canned lion thing being a major case in point.

My opinion is an extra US$3000 just for bones per lion bred in SA buys a lot of cat food, which in turn means we'd have lions as part of our biodiversity for a long while yet.

The concern about the negative perceptions and the antis is not to be underestimated, but I'm of the opinion that the true antis are beyond any help so why bother model our entire existence around them?
We are labouring the subject of bad ethics so much that it is WE who are in fact perpetuating the connection. Do lawyers' forums focus on those that embezzle the trust account? Are doctors locked in a constant debate about medical malpractice? Of the MILLIONS of shots fired each year by hunters the amount fired at captive bred lions cannot equate to the tiniest smidgeon of a percent. Yes, there will always be guys like Derek Watts (SA TV Show, Carte Blanche) who will blow it all over the media, but I do not see myself even remotely associated to such practices so I don't see myself living in a state of perpetual vicarious apology.

I cannot see lion bone farming different from ostrich or crocodile farming. The added benefit for the farmer that some moron will come pay top dollar to come do the killing is no different from some middle class kid going to a kibbutz and landing the job of slitting chicken throats at the kosher abbatoir.