Watching Trijicons wide world of sport video with Aaron Neilson I bought from a member. Pretty well done and decent Africa stuff as well as Australia Alaska New Zealand etc ( the desert sheep was timely) but every African hunt everyone African carried their rifles even while glassing muzzling the back of the person in front of them. They go on to extrude the dangers of the beasts they are after while to me it looks like the biggest danger is the other hunters. I saw one guy with a rifle slung in an African scene. Every other hunting local they sling their rifles but in Africa you have to throw it on your shoulder with zero muzzle discipline waving every which way.. I personally would not stand for it. And both times I went so far did not feel compelled to do it. Or in any other part of the world.

Any explanation besides some bravado or what? I can’t understand any advantage to the practice ?

Discussed a million times on AR.

Basically, with the African Carry, you know exactly where your muzzle is. Although it's carried muzzle forward, you are able to direct it off to the side and not point it directly at the guy in front.

Carrying on a sling, you have no idea where the muzzle is pointed many times throughout the day.

I just got back from hunting in Dande where you are constantly going up and down steep inclines, bending over in jess. I had my rifle slung over my shoulder in the traditional way most of the time, using a standard sling. I realized, as I do every time hunting in a group, that as I bend backwards, bend forward, go up, go down, the muzzle of the rifle, thought to be pointed straight up while using the sling, is actually being pointed in every direction imaginable and I have no idea if it is pointing at the guy behind me or not.

When I carry it via the African Carry method, my hand is on the muzzle and I am constantly aware of where the muzzle is, and I can constantly push or pull it off center line to avoid sweeping the guy in front of me.

If that is the case then everyone everywhere should be doing it? I saw the muzzle sweeping people the cameraman etc and no one was using such discipline. Personally I don’t buy it but I guess it is what it is. Sling the muzzle is up 99 percent of the time and if you bend over you unsling and control muzzle. Pretty safe I’d say. I guess in Africa things are different

In my case as well, the thick Bush was constantly grabbing at the rifle and I actually found the safety pulled off safe while slung up. The noise factor is what my PH’s have stressed with why they don’t use a sling as much.

Each individual is responsible for muzzle control. If folks are unsafe with African carry, odds are they will be with any other type. I’ve also been surprised by buffalo, elephant, and lion in the bush, and to me, I am much quicker getting the rifle deployed that way.

Different strokes for different folks.

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
If that is the case then everyone everywhere should be doing it? I saw the muzzle sweeping people the cameraman etc and no one was using such discipline. Personally I don’t buy it but I guess it is what it is. Sling the muzzle is up 99 percent of the time and if you bend over you unsling and control muzzle. Pretty safe I’d say. I guess in Africa things are different

Sounds good but in places like where I just hunted, the actual fact is following this method, you'll never have the rifle slung. It will aways be in your hand. It will NOT be up 99 percent of the time.

The camera angle often makes it look like the guy in front is being swept. Paying close attention prevents this. My experience is that using the African Carry method results in fewer sweeps.

Again, there must be at least a hundred threads on this topic on AR. I think it really comes down to the way you were originally taught to carry the weapon and a reluctance to break from the traditional way we here in the USA were taught. The African guys were taught the African Carry method. Both can work and be perfectly safe.

Just for an example, when walking in a line of people, you have your rifle slung. You go down a very steep hill. You lean back just a little to help your balance. What happens to the muzzle? It tips backward a few degrees. Do you know how close the guy behind you is? Probably not. If he's close on your heels, he is probably looking down your muzzle. If you have the rifle in the AC position, you can easily swing the muzzle to the left or right to avoid sweeping the guy in front and you definitely know where the muzzle is pointed in relation to him.

Look, not saying one is right and one is wrong. You asked "Why do they do it". I'm just pointing out the fact that there are considerations you may not have thought of that makes the AC method more safe in certain conditions.

I can understand carrying it in your hands in steep terrain but I’m still having a hard time understanding the logic. I watched 3 1/2 hous from Alaska Mexico New Zealand Australia Europe goats sheep bears deer elephants buffalo etc and only in Africa did they do this. I did not see this in Africa. I was wondering if it was for the video.? If you carried a rifle like this at my shooting range they would ask you to leave and not come back. I really don’t think you have more control of the weapon like this. Understanding there are times it may have some advantage but if so what does no one else anywhere on earth do it? In steep terrain you are more likely to drop your weapon it seems to me. Are you chambered when you do this?

This is an interesting thing for me being newer to African hunting. In Namibia, my PH wanted me to use the sling unless we were on a stalk.

His reasoning was he didn't like it when a client shot him in the leg many years ago with a .375. The trigger got pulled by brush while they were walking. No clue if the safety was knocked off, or never engaged.

We'll be in Zambia in August and I'm curious what the instructions will be.

Jeremy

I have been quite a few places now and I have never seen anyone carry like this personally. Did everyone in your group AC their rifles?

Do what you think is safe. Which to me is exactly what he said

quote:

Originally posted by farbedo:
This is an interesting thing for me being newer to African hunting. In Namibia, my PH wanted me to use the sling unless we were on a stalk.

His reasoning was he didn't like it when a client shot him in the leg many years ago with a .375. The trigger got pulled by brush while they were walking. No clue if the safety was knocked off, or never engaged.

We'll be in Zambia in August and I'm curious what the instructions will be.

Jeremy

One of the many threads. This one started in an almost identical way.

http://forums.accuratereloadin...551045791#2551045791

Another:

http://forums.accuratereloadin...461059081#5461059081

Hashed to death.

Can we talk about something new? Like SCI or Mark Sullivan?

Sounds like the best reason is “because we always did it that way” kind of like a company I work for lol.

Maybe in that thread there’s a logical definitive reason only select few in Africa carry that way. I’ll check it out

My PHs with their doubles didn't carry like that

Just for the record, I carry using a sling most of the time. But when the action gets going, I usually take the sling off and if there is a stretch of ground to be covered, I'll use the African Carry.

I've always found I have more positive muzzle control with the AC for those portions of time I have the rifle up on the shoulder.

I find that when I carry the rifle slung, I'm relying on the guy behind me to watch and avoid my muzzle at times as I have no idea exactly where he is (close, far, to my left, to my right, etc.). With the AC, I'm looking forward at anyone in front of me and making sure my muzzle is pointed off center away from them.

I don't doubt carrying in the AC method at a range would get you asked to leave. It goes back to what I stated earlier in that most guys at the range would be unfamiliar with the carry method and therefore uncomfortable with it. I doubt you'd get asked to leave an African range if you carried in the same manner as the guys there are familiar with the carry method.

Point being again, neither method are "SAFE". It's the guy carrying the weapon that makes the method "SAFE" by being aware of his muzzle. There are times each method is appropriate and times neither are appropriate. Just isn't a one size fits all blanket condition. That's all I'm saying.

My guess is it started because of heavy doubles. Then just carried on...

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Sounds like the best reason is “because we always did it that way” kind of like a company I work for lol.

My PHs with their doubles didn't carry like that

Of course, the exact same thing can be said for only being comfortable with the sling method. Because "we always did it that way".

EVERY PH I've hunted with that had a double carries via the AC method. I've never seen a PH carry a double with a sling.

I am more comfortable in not getting shot. Like I said why doesn’t anyone anywhere else in the world carry like that? Are you chambered and on safe while carrying a double like that? Credit where credit is due an Australian ph while slogging through a floodplain with his double broke open and emptied if while stalking a buff. Kudos to him

I really don’t think it is “unusual” to sling a gun, is that what you are saying? I think the opposite is more the truth?

Why does my 1922 and my modern double have sling attachments?

if the African is so safe and makes it ready for a quick shot, why is it never used in Alaska on Grizzly bear hunts
my guess is hunters going to Africa play the part just like the hunting shows

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
I am more comfortable in not getting shot. Like I said why doesn’t anyone anywhere else in the world carry like that? Are you chambered and on safe while carrying a double like that? Credit where credit is due an Australian ph while slogging through a floodplain with his double broke open and emptied if while stalking a buff. Kudos to him

I really don’t think it is “unusual” to sling a gun, is that what you are saying? I think the opposite is more the truth?

Why does my 1922 and my modern double have sling attachments?

The AC method is typically used when carrying a double rifle. It's very uncomfortable to carry a scoped bolt rifle with that method. So you ask, why is it specific to Africa? I'd say it's because double rifles are typically the domain of African Dangerous Game hunting.

I'm also not saying it's "unusual" to carry a gun slung. In fact, if you go back and read one of my posts above, I stated that I usually carry with the sling and only take the sling off and use the African Carry as action heats up.

That said, I have hunted with quite a few African PHs that use a double and I've never seen one us a sling yet. Sorry but that's just a fact of my experience to date.

I'm not sure I'd give anyone credit for carrying a double rifle broke open. Sounds like a great plan for getting a bit of dirt or trash in the action rendering it inoperable. And carrying a double for buffalo in Australia isn't the same as carrying in Africa for Cape Buff, mainly due to the possibility of running into an old ele cow that takes exception to your presence without giving warning.

No need to get upset over the issue GS. Just discussing the different perspectives and answering your question of "Why do they do it".

The big bores used on many African hunts are heavy. Putting them directly on your shoulder occasionally helps ease the burden.

And it does look cool

quote:

Originally posted by Joe-S:
if the African is so safe and makes it ready for a quick shot, why is it never used in Alaska on Grizzly bear hunts
my guess is hunters going to Africa play the part just like the hunting shows

Again, it's not a comfortable method of carrying a scoped bolt rifle.

Typically applies to carrying a double rifle or even an open sighted big bore. Neither of which are common for Alaska bear hunting. Therefore just not a method that developed a following here in the US of A.

GS, did any of the African PH's you hunted with carry their rifle slung upside down? Ie, standard sling, but with the wide portion near the butt and narrow portion toward the muzzle, resulting in the butt up and muzzle toward the ground when slung over the shoulder?

I've hunted with 3 PHs in RSA that preferred that method. I found it odd as all I could think of was if they had a discharge, it could hit them in the leg or foot.

I've seen others comment this method is the absolute most safe carry method, yet I'm unfamiliar with it and therefor uncomfortable with it.

Just wondering your thoughts on that method.

Main point is most if not all hunters are using scoped rifles in the videos so there goes that argument. I think a guy who unloads a gun while traversing dangerous footing is not stupid. Sure you are exposed a bit but how many people been shot on safari? Hell a ton from just on this forum and elsewhere. I do believe that I would find a sling more comfortable carrying my 11 1/2 lb double than having it grind into my shoulder all day AC. I agree when getting close I’d have that sucker in my hands not on my shoulder

Pretty sure it can be proven that there is no time advantage to presenting weapon from either method

QUOTE]Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
I am more comfortable in not getting shot. Like I said why doesn’t anyone anywhere else in the world carry like that? Are you chambered and on safe while carrying a double like that? Credit where credit is due an Australian ph while slogging through a floodplain with his double broke open and emptied if while stalking a buff. Kudos to him

I really don’t think it is “unusual” to sling a gun, is that what you are saying? I think the opposite is more the truth?

Why does my 1922 and my modern double have sling attachments?

The AC method is typically used when carrying a double rifle. It's very uncomfortable to carry a scoped bolt rifle with that method. So you ask, why is it specific to Africa? I'd say it's because double rifles are typically the domain of African Dangerous Game hunting.

I'm also not saying it's "unusual" to carry a gun slung. In fact, if you go back and read one of my posts above, I stated that I usually carry with the sling and only take the sling off and use the African Carry as action heats up.

That said, I have hunted with quite a few African PHs that use a double and I've never seen one us a sling yet. Sorry but that's just a fact of my experience to date.

I'm not sure I'd give anyone credit for carrying a double rifle broke open. Sounds like a great plan for getting a bit of dirt or trash in the action rendering it inoperable. And carrying a double for buffalo in Australia isn't the same as carrying in Africa for Cape Buff, mainly due to the possibility of running into an old ele cow that takes exception to your presence without giving warning.

No need to get upset over the issue GS. Just discussing the different perspectives and answering your question of "Why do they do it".[/QUOTE]

It is not occasional in the videos. It is 100 percent. I agree if humping 20 miles after an elephant you may need to change it up once in a while. But steel and wood grinding into your shoulder looks cool but hardly more efficient. And I’ll say safe depending on the participants and chamber condition

quote:

Originally posted by BuffHunter63:
The big bores used on many African hunts are heavy. Putting them directly on your shoulder occasionally helps ease the burden.

And it does look cool

Yes I have seen this in a few places. Shooting ones foot off os a far cry from blowing someone else’s brains out. Generally you will discharge into the ground if you screw the pooch. Which is a ok with me. Hope fully a person will be cognizant of muzzling one owns body part. Having personally seen people shoot themselves yes it can happen. Shooting oneself is a far preferable from shooting someone else, especially in a non vital area. People waving loaded chambered (or unknown condition) rifles around at head height makes me nervous. It would never fly at any professional military or private shooting school that I am aware of. Especially with basically unknown actors (skill weapons handling etc) yeah spec ops guys do it but that’s a different situation entirely

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
GS, did any of the African PH's you hunted with carry their rifle slung upside down? Ie, standard sling, but with the wide portion near the butt and narrow portion toward the muzzle, resulting in the butt up and muzzle toward the ground when slung over the shoulder?

I've hunted with 3 PHs in RSA that preferred that method. I found it odd as all I could think of was if they had a discharge, it could hit them in the leg or foot.

I've seen others comment this method is the absolute most safe carry method, yet I'm unfamiliar with it and therefor uncomfortable with it.

Just wondering your thoughts on that method.

What’s rule one with weapon safety according to Col Cooper? Never point a weapon at something you are not willing to destroy. This in fact a universally accepted firearms safety procedure

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Main point is most if not all hunters are using scoped rifles in the videos so there goes that argument. I think a guy who unloads a gun while traversing dangerous footing is not stupid. Sure you are exposed a bit but how many people been shot on safari? Hell a ton from just on this forum and elsewhere. I do believe that I would find a sling more comfortable carrying my 11 1/2 lb double than having it grind into my shoulder all day AC. I agree when getting close I’d have that sucker in my hands not on my shoulder

Pretty sure it can be proven that there is no time advantage to presenting weapon from either method

QUOTE]Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
I am more comfortable in not getting shot. Like I said why doesn’t anyone anywhere else in the world carry like that? Are you chambered and on safe while carrying a double like that? Credit where credit is due an Australian ph while slogging through a floodplain with his double broke open and emptied if while stalking a buff. Kudos to him

I really don’t think it is “unusual” to sling a gun, is that what you are saying? I think the opposite is more the truth?

Why does my 1922 and my modern double have sling attachments?

The AC method is typically used when carrying a double rifle. It's very uncomfortable to carry a scoped bolt rifle with that method. So you ask, why is it specific to Africa? I'd say it's because double rifles are typically the domain of African Dangerous Game hunting.

I'm also not saying it's "unusual" to carry a gun slung. In fact, if you go back and read one of my posts above, I stated that I usually carry with the sling and only take the sling off and use the African Carry as action heats up.

That said, I have hunted with quite a few African PHs that use a double and I've never seen one us a sling yet. Sorry but that's just a fact of my experience to date.

I'm not sure I'd give anyone credit for carrying a double rifle broke open. Sounds like a great plan for getting a bit of dirt or trash in the action rendering it inoperable. And carrying a double for buffalo in Australia isn't the same as carrying in Africa for Cape Buff, mainly due to the possibility of running into an old ele cow that takes exception to your presence without giving warning.

No need to get upset over the issue GS. Just discussing the different perspectives and answering your question of "Why do they do it".

[/QUOTE]



Seems like we are getting into a reading comprehension issue here.


I never suggested carrying using a sling was "unusual". Not sure where that comment came from.


I also never said anything about anyone being "stupid" for unloading a rifle traversing dangerous footing. I said I wouldn't carry a double broken open as the weapon type is susceptible to trash and debris that can render it inop. If one wants to unload a double due to unsure footing areas, no problems but I'd not carry it with the action open.

Yeah, if you say the guys in the video you referred to were carrying via the AC method with scoped bolt guns, I'd have to say I've tried it and don't find it comfortable. A double rifle or an open sighted big bore, sure, but adding the scope really makes it uncomfortable. Not sure why anyone would carry via that method in that case. Again, I also stated I normally carry, even doubles, with a sling, exactly because I find it more comfortable over a long haul. I only use the AC method when I've taken the sling off in close to the action and we have a bit of ground to cover. The sling, to me is more comfortable than the AC, the AC is more comfortable than carrying in the hands "at the ready", etc. I especially prefer using the sling when walking over dead ground back to the cruiser.

On the issue of time to present the weapon from the AC vs Sling, I'll take that bet. I guarantee I can bring the weapon into action quicker from the AC than from being slung. I posted a video on it sometime back. Can't describe it but can demo it. Not a big issue though. I've never been pressed to need to present the weapon in a matter of seconds to stop a threat. I'm sure some of the PHs can provide better prospective on that issue. Again, not a big issue as a client but yeah, it is faster from the AC position.

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
What’s rule one with weapon safety according to Col Cooper? Never point a weapon at something you are not willing to destroy. This in fact a universally accepted firearms safety procedure

Oy Vey!

I'm out.

Ja-sus, muzzle down sling carry works real well no matter which way you bend, etc, when walking. If you leopard crawl balance it in your bent arms/elbow area like a military carry. Eish!

Just don’t plug the bore if you jam it in the dirt seen that happen

Scary stuff gun safety? Everybody uses this including military civilian law enforcement NRA etc. Cooper is the one that coined it. Sorry but I actually believe it. I bet the Phs that got shot believe it too....

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
What’s rule one with weapon safety according to Col Cooper? Never point a weapon at something you are not willing to destroy. This in fact a universally accepted firearms safety procedure

Oy Vey!

I'm out.

I understand what you are saying. As for carrying the gun open I would guess to signify to everyone present the gun was empty. What is the other gun safety rule? Treat every gun as if it’s loaded. If a bolt is open or action broken much easier for others to tell the condition of the weapon. Obviously this has opened a can of worms. Just trying to understand if it’s fluff of has a actual stated purpose as no one else does it. Again my doubles have sling swivels and I intend to use them unless stalking or otherwise in an immediate use scenario

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Main point is most if not all hunters are using scoped rifles in the videos so there goes that argument. I think a guy who unloads a gun while traversing dangerous footing is not stupid. Sure you are exposed a bit but how many people been shot on safari? Hell a ton from just on this forum and elsewhere. I do believe that I would find a sling more comfortable carrying my 11 1/2 lb double than having it grind into my shoulder all day AC. I agree when getting close I’d have that sucker in my hands not on my shoulder

Pretty sure it can be proven that there is no time advantage to presenting weapon from either method

QUOTE]Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
I am more comfortable in not getting shot. Like I said why doesn’t anyone anywhere else in the world carry like that? Are you chambered and on safe while carrying a double like that? Credit where credit is due an Australian ph while slogging through a floodplain with his double broke open and emptied if while stalking a buff. Kudos to him

I really don’t think it is “unusual” to sling a gun, is that what you are saying? I think the opposite is more the truth?

Why does my 1922 and my modern double have sling attachments?

The AC method is typically used when carrying a double rifle. It's very uncomfortable to carry a scoped bolt rifle with that method. So you ask, why is it specific to Africa? I'd say it's because double rifles are typically the domain of African Dangerous Game hunting.

I'm also not saying it's "unusual" to carry a gun slung. In fact, if you go back and read one of my posts above, I stated that I usually carry with the sling and only take the sling off and use the African Carry as action heats up.

That said, I have hunted with quite a few African PHs that use a double and I've never seen one us a sling yet. Sorry but that's just a fact of my experience to date.

I'm not sure I'd give anyone credit for carrying a double rifle broke open. Sounds like a great plan for getting a bit of dirt or trash in the action rendering it inoperable. And carrying a double for buffalo in Australia isn't the same as carrying in Africa for Cape Buff, mainly due to the possibility of running into an old ele cow that takes exception to your presence without giving warning.

No need to get upset over the issue GS. Just discussing the different perspectives and answering your question of "Why do they do it".

Seems like we are getting into a reading comprehension issue here.


I never suggested carrying using a sling was "unusual". Not sure where that comment came from.


I also never said anything about anyone being "stupid" for unloading a rifle traversing dangerous footing. I said I wouldn't carry a double broken open as the weapon type is susceptible to trash and debris that can render it inop. If one wants to unload a double due to unsure footing areas, no problems but I'd not carry it with the action open.

Yeah, if you say the guys in the video you referred to were carrying via the AC method with scoped bolt guns, I'd have to say I've tried it and don't find it comfortable. A double rifle or an open sighted big bore, sure, but adding the scope really makes it uncomfortable. Not sure why anyone would carry via that method in that case. Again, I also stated I normally carry, even doubles, with a sling, exactly because I find it more comfortable over a long haul. I only use the AC method when I've taken the sling off in close to the action and we have a bit of ground to cover. The sling, to me is more comfortable than the AC, the AC is more comfortable than carrying in the hands "at the ready", etc. I especially prefer using the sling when walking over dead ground back to the cruiser.

On the issue of time to present the weapon from the AC vs Sling, I'll take that bet. I guarantee I can bring the weapon into action quicker from the AC than from being slung. I posted a video on it sometime back. Can't describe it but can demo it. Not a big issue though. I've never been pressed to need to present the weapon in a matter of seconds to stop a threat. I'm sure some of the PHs can provide better prospective on that issue. Again, not a big issue as a client but yeah, it is faster from the AC position.[/QUOTE]

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Just don’t plug the bore if you jam it in the dirt seen that happen

One would have to be awfully short for that to happen!

quote:

On the issue of time to present the weapon from the AC vs Sling, I'll take that bet. I guarantee I can bring the weapon into action quicker from the AC than from being slung

Honestly, practice makes perfect.

Todd you may have tuned out but are you saying carrying a rifle muzzle forward on you strong side shoulder AC holding bore(s) with strong hand is faster to employ than slung muzzle up (or down) strong side shoulder? Interesting. I’ll have to play with that. Is the gun upside down or right side up? Do you grab with left hand pull forward and rearrange into shoulder and acquire firing grip with strong hand? Pretty easy slung to grab with weak hand pull forward off shoulder raise buttstock and aquire firing grip with strong hand. Practice makes perfect in either method. I’ll put it under the shot clock sometime. I assume with AC the muzzle stays downrange the entire time mounting gun?

Not trying to piss anybody off but I am not the only one I have seen raise this issue just trying to learn here

My grizzly guide would kick me in the nuts if I did that I’m sure lol

According to Capstick the sling method of having the rifle to the front makes for a quick transition to the fire position.

He gives a pictorial demo in his book “Safari”.

My .416 Rem Mag bolt gun is fairly comfortable to carry resting on my shoulder with my hand helping balance everything by holding on to the barrel. The heavy barrel makes it work IMO.

I certainly wouldn’t use that carry with a light barrel Sporter.

BH63

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Scary stuff gun safety? Everybody uses this including military civilian law enforcement NRA etc. Cooper is the one that coined it. Sorry but I actually believe it. I bet the Phs that got shot believe it too....

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
What’s rule one with weapon safety according to Col Cooper? Never point a weapon at something you are not willing to destroy. This in fact a universally accepted firearms safety procedure

Oy Vey!

I'm out.

One last comment then I'm out for good on this dead horse topic.

Yep, I actually believe in the No. 1 rule as well.

I just don't know why you insist on believing the African Carry method violates the rule. My experience is that it's easier to observe the rule with the AC than with a sling as I always know where my muzzle is pointing and I'm in 100% control of it, therefore able to keep it from sweeping the guys in front of me where as with the sling, I'm not 100% certain the guy behind me isn't being swept from time to time as I can't see the guys behind me, can't see the muzzle, and don't have my hand on it at all times.

One last time to try and get the point across. It's exposure to a certain type of carry method or lack thereof that makes one comfortable as to the safety of carry method. You state you're not familiar with the AC method so have therefore deemed it to break the No. 1 rule of gun safety. It doesn't, not when performed correctly. I'm uncomfortable with the muzzle down method as it's not familiar to me, but I recognize there are those who are familiar with it and therefore know how to be safe with it.

That's all. Beat away but I don't think the horse is going to get up. But for a more in depth discussion on the matter, use the "Find" function.

I never said I wasn’t comfortable me with it. I could do it all day long. So the assumption is that everyone is as diligent and safe as you are? Do you trust people you don’t know to carry like that around you under stress? That’s my point. I am sure you are safe as hell. But Is the other guy? And can you guarantee 100 percent that carrying with muzzles level head highs you will have a lower chance of accidental muzzling? Anyhow understand your frustration. There is a reason that it is only allowed on safari under convention. We can agree to disagree it’s safer

I was always under the impression that the "African Carry" originated when no self-respecting European actually carried their own rifle but rather had a bearer with it walking in front with the rifle readily-available for the sport to reach out and take with no fuss.

I’ll buy that one. Pure convention

quote:

I am more comfortable in not getting shot. Like I said why doesn’t anyone anywhere else in the world carry like that? Are you chambered and on safe while carrying a double like that?

Any way one carries a rifle can be unsafe if the person carrying it is unsafe.

The AC has its advantages over customary slung carry which I assume stems from military traditions. Todd has given all the valid reasons I can think of and just to reconfirm, it should be carried diagonally across the shoulder with muzzles (DR) firmly grasped and pointing right and angled slightly downwards, for those who are right-handed.

Seeing I am suffering from memory lapse can anyone come up with figures of people getting shot from an AC situation; by courtesy of PH or by client?