As you can tell I am trying to get the best bang for the buck in what would otherwise be trophies that I could not afford to hunt.

My bucket list of hunting was African Plains game which is doable. Yesterday, I found out that I can hunt cow buffalo.

This begs the question - do people hunt female sable?

Thanks again for all of your insight.

Jim

personally I would not hunt any female know matter what the animal. I consider it unethical. if you can afford the hunt you should be able to afford to shoot only males. especially something like sable why would you want a female sable????

Your question is also too vague because the game laws of many African countries actually forbid the taking of female animals OR females with dependent young.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
Your question is also too vague because the game laws of many African countries actually forbid the taking of female animals OR females with dependent young.

+1

I don't know: I have never understood the stricture against shooting females. Look at our Texas white tail deer: 10 million of them not much larger than a large dog. Since there are more females than males how could it possibly affect herd dynamics, by taking females as well as males?

If we were talking correct management practices there are (perhaps slightly arguably?) indeed good reasons for taking a number of females under some circumstances but I was talking actual game laws that are already in place.

quote:

Originally posted by ddrhook:
personally I would not hunt any female know matter what the animal. I consider it unethical.

Why do you consider it unethical If I may ask ?

Let me rephrase the question: Is it legal to hunt female sables (without young) in RSA?

Maybe I'm getting old or am just old fashioned but to me, shooting of females is culling whereas shooting of mature males is trophy hunting and I see the two things as very different.

quote:

Originally posted by Singleshot03:
Let me rephrase the question: Is it legal to hunt female sables (without young) in RSA?

Each Province has it's own game laws but it would be legal in most, if not all provinces, however, prices would probably still be pretty high simply because ALL sable prices are relatively high in SA.

If you're just looking for a cheap way to come to Africa and hunt then I'd suggest you forget the male/female thing and instead look for a deal that suits your needs, tastes and finances....... I'm sure you'll find something over on the hunts offered forum.

For example 375Fanatic has an incredibly priced deal here: http://forums.accuratereloadin...2100588/m/7401072241

A.Dahlgren,
Unless a female has been wounded in some way and is suffering without the chance of recovery. I think it is unethical to hunt females because with out females you don't get any more males!! survival of the species!
Obviously there are some exceptions. Population control to preserve the health of the animals and to prevent habitat destruction.
Like most subjects there is not a easy answer but for the majority of African animals with human population pressures and game numbers in decline in some areas. with some species taking healthy breeding females out of the population is not what we need to be doing IMHO

quote:

Originally posted by ddrhook:
. . . with out females you don't get any more males!!

Personally, I've never bred with a sable, but I think it takes males AND females to produce little baby sables.

Taking females from a herd as a management tool is perfectly exceptable and necessary practice. Balancing the male to female ratio is very important for trophy management and maintaining a healthy habitat. "Ethics" has absolutely nothing to do with it. That's just PC nonsense, on par with the old "If I can't eat it, then I won't shoot it mentality". Hundreds of thousands of whitetail, mule deer, elk, Pronghorn, geese, duck females are taken each year in the USA, trophy quality is better and herds are healthier than they've ever been. The same can be said of any other population of game animal. In many cases females HAVE TO be taken to maintain a healthy population.
A female sable would make a very nice Europeon mount, and tasty table fare.

Many places in RSA will allow you to take females, as a part of their management program. Check with the individual outfitter you are interested in. They are usually cheaper, as you mentioned, but you can also shoot management males in many, but not all species, that are just as cheap, if not cheaper. Do what you're comfortable with and have a great time doing it.
ps, sable is probably not one of those species. At least I have never seen it on the menu. With high value animals, like sable, the females are usually not on the menu. It is more likely to be seen with lower value, or more prolific types of animals that aren't as susceptible to predation while calves.
Good Luck and keep chasing the dream.

Singleshot03:

Another angle you might consider is to ask about the trophy cost if you do not export any of the skins and skulls. I've heard of operators in some places that will reduce the trophy fees by 40-50% if you do not plan to export the trophies. If you are looking for the experience without the cost of shipping, taxidermy, etc, this might be an option.

quote:

safari-lawyer

ya but just like in the inner city one male can breed 100's females and will in most case's

quote:

Originally posted by Jerry Huffaker:
Taking females from a herd as a management tool is perfectly exceptable and necessary practice. Balancing the male to female ratio is very important for trophy management and maintaining a healthy habitat. "Ethics" has absolutely nothing to do with it. That's just PC nonsense, on par with the old "If I can't eat it, then I won't shoot it mentality". Hundreds of thousands of whitetail, mule deer, elk, Pronghorn, geese, duck females are taken each year in the USA, trophy quality is better and herds are healthier than they've ever been. The same can be said of any other population of game animal. In many cases females HAVE TO be taken to maintain a healthy population.
A female sable would make a very nice Europeon mount, and tasty table fare.

Jerry:

What you say in your opening statement is quite correct and such a practice probably works well in the States and Europe.
In Africa and with direct reference to FREE RANGING game species, NOT the ones being ranched or behind a fence, is not catered for (as Shakari has already stated - there are set game laws in place) and to rewrite these laws to include females would require hundreds of parliamentary sittings
One also needs to remember that the majority of females of the various species don't have horns.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:
to rewrite these laws to include females would require hundreds of parliamentary sittings

Plus several very large and impressive miracles and to rewrite them so they were based on sensible and scientific policies would probably require the second coming!

Personally I think taking female buffalo and elephant has its own appeal because they are still dangerous game species regardless of their gender. On the other hand going to Africa to shoot female plains game animals seems to have limited to no appeal. As far as sable go I think it would be difficult to find a female you could shoot. In no big game are I know about would this be legal and on a ranch the owner is not going to let you shoot his breeding stock. I suppose there might be the off chance that an old dry female might be available but I would not plan on that.

Mark

[quote]I consider it unethical.
To keep the population of sertain animals under control! we must take females also!!and a hunt for a female buff is just as nice and dangerus as a male buff!and yes the meat taste just the same

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
Personally I think taking female buffalo and elephant has its own appeal because they are still dangerous game species regardless of their gender. On the other hand going to Africa to shoot female plains game animals seems to have limited to no appeal. As far as sable go I think it would be difficult to find a female you could shoot. In no big game are I know about would this be legal and on a ranch the owner is not going to let you shoot his breeding stock. I suppose there might be the off chance that an old dry female might be available but I would not plan on that.

Mark

The exception here Mark would be Cawston in Zim, they have a huge number of Sable and have females on quota.

So I'm off base and unethical because I shot a surplus female blue wildebeest in South Africa? Hmm, I thought I was being sensitive to management needs and frugal because I ended up with a nice rug at a much reduce cost. I hardly needed or wanted another skull, but the hide is quite nice. Ditto my shooting doe antelope in Wyoming, bad DesertRam, bad.

quote:

Originally posted by DesertRam:
So I'm off base and unethical because I shot a surplus female blue wildebeest in South Africa? Hmm, I thought I was being sensitive to management needs and frugal because I ended up with a nice rug at a much reduce cost. I hardly needed or wanted another skull, but the hide is quite nice. Ditto my shooting doe antelope in Wyoming, bad DesertRam, bad.

You should just top it with hunting a moose cow with hounds

I think the talk about ethics have gotten out of hand once again.

Seems like anything's for sale in RSA, so it wouldn't supprise me. Don't have any problem with shooting females if legal and in the best interest of the herd. That said a cow sable doesn't make a pimple on the butt of a big bull! Just not anywhere as beautiful or regal!

Brett

Here in the Eastern Cape, as an example, it is lawful to shoot bushbuck ewes. Some landowners will allow that, but, in the instance of the marjority of landowners, shoot a bushbuck ewe and that will be the last time such a hunter will be allowed or invited back. This pratice does not carry to springbuck, kudu, southern mountain reedbuck, blue/black wildebeest, impala and so forth.

There's a decided difference between hunting the females that will kill you as quick(or quicker) than the males--ie Dangerous Game--and the PG females. We are hunting(not killing) for pleasure. We should not kill something easy--what's the point? We'd be embarassed at having anyone know.
I know I could walk out my door and kill a doe within 30 minutes. That would be great if I were hungry. There are usually a couple of 8-10 pt bucks that live here that I see once or twice a year for about 2 seconds each. They show up on game cameras only in the wee hours. If I get them before nature does, then I will consider them to be trophies--something desirable that I have been smart enough or lucky enough to obtain.

The self-control involved in not having to shoot the first thing that moves is a part of becoming a mature hunter.

http://www.online-literature.com/keats/916/

I had a conversation once about sables with the game manager of a rather large Zimbabwe estate. I made the observation that there should be more sables on the estate than we were seeing. He agreed and said the estate could easily manage twice the current sable population that it did but for three reasons. First, the trophy males have a real bad habit of killing each other. Second the females have a real bad habit of putting the young into a "nursery" and then wondering off to feed for the day. If a predator comes upon the nursery and since there is no "guard" left behind, the slaughter could be significant. He said he once saw the end result of this. He once saw what a group of cheetah that came into such an arrangement could do, no survivors. Lastly, poaching of sable is rather lucrative and not all that difficult with dogs. A bull sable will stand to a group of dogs and then can easily be picked off by the poacher.

So perhaps sable is a bad animal to be killing off the females.

Last time I was in SA I was asked if I would be willing to shoot a couple Blesbok and Sprinbok ewes. Didn't cost me anything and I got to keep the horns and hides. If the animals need to be removed I don't see the problem. This year on our deer lease (under a state deer management program) we were asked to take 10 bucks and 26 does by the state biologist.

Have to agree though that with Sable they would be sold as trophies and not culling.

Well, nobody said African hunting was inexpensive.

But I'd rather have one good eland (or kudu or sable or whatever) trophy than a bunch of non-trophy males and wouldn't even consider shooting a female. Unless it was legal and for leopard bait or something like that.

Of course there is no comparison between a female and male sable in terms of the splendid trophy. The experience of a female sable hunt is probably going to be very similar to that of other african plains game so for the same money you may be able to shoot a trophy male antelope of a less expensive animal and end up with a very similar experience and hopefully a nice trophy. Of course you still won't be able to say you have shot a sable.

One of my toughest hunts has been for a cow moose in Vermont, that's the tag my wife drew. We hunted 6 days from dawn to dusk, up and down hills in bad weather etc etc. and we finally shot one on the last morning of the season. She is not pretty to look at but is now a shoulder mount, as it was a hard earned trophy and truth be told was a much greater overall hunting experience when compared to some of my better trophies including two 40" Oryx, a 58" kudu, 17" springbok amongst other big trophies that I have been fortunate to have shot, which all came far easier, to make a comparison!