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The latest issue of African Hunting Gazette includes an article by a PH who hunts crocs and also gathers their eggs for croc farms. If I understand him correctly, he claims that, based on his considerable experience, with equally well-placed brain shots, a croc that is brain-shot with an expanding bullet will sometimes survive a split second longer than one that is brain-shot with a solid. Long enough for a quick tail flip and lunge into the water. The result for him, he says, is that in one season he lost 35% more crocs when he brain-shot them with softs as compared to when he brain-shot them with solids. Not pure science, but he apparently checked any number of crocs that he had brain-shot with softs, but that had managed to get into the water before dying. All had been really and truly brain-shot. He offered no explanation for this phenomenon, but did advise that a solid be used for any croc at the water's edge or thereabouts. Can it be possible that the millisecond it takes for an expanding bullet to upset really gives the croc time to react? I have never shot a croc, but it got me wondering. All you croc hunters out there, does this make sense to you, based on your experience? Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | ||
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I am no expert. I have only shot two. I took both with softs. Personally, I would doubt the claim. However, I have no evidence to base it on. I am shooting with softs until someone can explain to me why a solid is better. | |||
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That sure is a puzzeling statement. I acn think of no reason for it to happen. 465H&H | |||
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Maybe the increased(?) shock of a soft causes an increased nervous system reaction that propels the croc forward into the water???? Just a WAG.. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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Not sure about that and do not know of any PH that recommends a solid for a head shot? ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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Mike, I can't comment on the lost crocs. The hunters comments don't make sense but it's his expereince. I do know if I shoot another croc with a brain shot I'm using a solid and pray for a perfect hit. A soft point just blows the top of the head to bits. Actually I think if I can I'll try the spine shot and an expanding bullet is perfect for this. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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I can think of two reasons this might happen, one has already been mentioned, the soft point causes much more commotion of the Central Nervous System. You see this on mammals also. Second issue might be better results w FMJ's that may hit waterline and richochet into brain more reliably than a SP? Andy | |||
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I'm sure that the guy believes it, but I don't buy it. I've always used expanding bullets on Croc hoping that a very near miss with a solid might turn into a hit with the expanding bullet and I think that is probably right. And, I doubt that the something less than a millisecond it takes the bullet to expand will give the Croc much of an edge on escape. Crocs are quick to be sure, but not that quick. When you get bored with life, start hunting dangerous game with a handgun. | |||
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Agreed! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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I'm puzzled at why people keep insisting on shooting at a Croc's brain  If you aim for the spine, anywhere from behind the smile to the front of the shoulder, you have a much larger target and hitting it paralizes them. Even a glancing blow will stun them long enough for you to get a second shot off. A PH friend of mine and Chris Troskie had a client shoot a Croc at 50 yards. The client insisted his .375 was just the ticket for a one shot kill. He shot and the Croc's skull cap went flying...so did the Croc, straight into the river, never to be found. We video'd my Croc two years ago. I shot him in the neck with a .280 at 136 yards. He didn't go anywhere. No brain shots for me and like Mark said, brain shots sure mess up a cool skull.LDK Gray Ghost Hunting Safaris http://grayghostsafaris.com Phone: 615-860-4333 Email: hunts@grayghostsafaris.com NRA Benefactor DSC Professional Member SCI Member RMEF Life Member NWTF Guardian Life Sponsor NAHC Life Member Rowland Ward - SCI Scorer Took the wife the Eastern Cape for her first hunt: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6881000262 Hunting in the Stormberg, Winterberg and Hankey Mountains of the Eastern Cape 2018 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4801073142 Hunting the Eastern Cape, RSA May 22nd - June 15th 2007 http://forums.accuratereloadin...=810104007#810104007 16 Days in Zimbabwe: Leopard, plains game, fowl and more: http://forums.accuratereloadin...=212108409#212108409 Natal: Rhino, Croc, Nyala, Bushbuck and more http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6341092311 Recent hunt in the Eastern Cape, August 2010: Pics added http://forums.accuratereloadin...261039941#9261039941 10 days in the Stormberg Mountains http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7781081322 Back in the Stormberg Mountains with friends: May-June 2017 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6001078232 "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading" - Thomas Jefferson Every morning the Zebra wakes up knowing it must outrun the fastest Lion if it wants to stay alive. Every morning the Lion wakes up knowing it must outrun the slowest Zebra or it will starve. It makes no difference if you are a Zebra or a Lion; when the Sun comes up in Africa, you must wake up running...... "If you're being chased by a Lion, you don't have to be faster than the Lion, you just have to be faster than the person next to you." | |||
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Maybe that's why they called it a croc story. ------------------------------- Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun. --------------------------------------- and, God Bless John Wayne. NRA Benefactor Member, GOA, N.A.G.R. _________________________ "Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped “Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped. red.dirt.elephant@gmail.com _________________________ Hoping to wind up where elephant hunters go. | |||
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As the English would say, this PH is talking codswalop! Pure, unadulterated bullshit. | |||
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What Saeed said!  Mike ______________ DSC DRSS (again) SCI Life NRA Life Sables Life Mzuri IPHA "To be a Marine is enough." | |||
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Agreed. I have not read it and don't know the author. However, I have to wonder if he is having a little fun with his readers. | |||
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Many crocs are head shot in the water. I prefer the neck shot but if the neck is partial obscured then it is a difficult one to call. Also many crocs are shot head on. I had two clients last year who wanted the skulls only and therefore these had to be neck shot and one of these hunters pulled the shot and hit the shoulder severing the spine there. So yes there are many advantages to the neck shot. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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Actually proper use of the English Language, however my political hero Mr. Limbaugh refers to it either as Bovine Excrement or as Pure Barbara Streisl... -------------------- EGO sum bastard ut does frendo | |||
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Croc of shit ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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I only have experience with one Croc. I shot it with a .300 Wby and I used a 200grn Accubond. I shot the Croc. in brain and blew half of his skull off. The Croc. moved upon being hit, not much but his tail swung to a side. Maybe the question should be can a nervous system reaction cause loss of Croc.? Sure, i guess it could, I was happy to see my Croc. in the same spot after the shot.  | |||
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Haven't yet read current issue of "AHG"...guess I will today for at least that story. My very limited experience, one, was basking on sand bar in Luangwa with 2 or 3 feet of tail in water. Quarteing toward presenting no spine shot or dead-on frontal. Chipman instructed my shot with 7mmMag, 160 gr hornadys. He flicked his tail only to one side. We ran down the bank and I put another in the spine even tho likely not needed. He did not react to second shot. My taxidermist did react to repair job he is currently doing on head! | |||
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As Andrew indicated, total "Croc of shit". Having shot several, and filmed several others being shot, all with softs. I do agree with Mark, in that from now on I will shoot them with solids, only because they do less damage to the head/skull. But to say softs kill crocs slower than a solid. My lord, some people will believe anything. | |||
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Have shot several, and filmed dozens. Have seen it all work, and fail. Solids do less skull damage for sure. As for me, I am really starting to warm up to the neck shot- very deadly. Hit on target, both softs and solid will do the job on any size of croc. I read the article and enjoyed it. He uses the shots and bullets he has faith in and it works for him. But from now on I will take the neck shot with a soft. Shot placement is EVERYTHING ! Dave Fulson | |||
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Personally I like the neck, neck, chest back slap congrats oh crap it's moving neck, neck, chest repeat approach. ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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Andrew, yes, I totally agree, sometimes we have no choice. That being said, hunting Crocs has taught me one important lesson...patience Grasshoppa, patience Cheers, David Gray Ghost Hunting Safaris http://grayghostsafaris.com Phone: 615-860-4333 Email: hunts@grayghostsafaris.com NRA Benefactor DSC Professional Member SCI Member RMEF Life Member NWTF Guardian Life Sponsor NAHC Life Member Rowland Ward - SCI Scorer Took the wife the Eastern Cape for her first hunt: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6881000262 Hunting in the Stormberg, Winterberg and Hankey Mountains of the Eastern Cape 2018 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4801073142 Hunting the Eastern Cape, RSA May 22nd - June 15th 2007 http://forums.accuratereloadin...=810104007#810104007 16 Days in Zimbabwe: Leopard, plains game, fowl and more: http://forums.accuratereloadin...=212108409#212108409 Natal: Rhino, Croc, Nyala, Bushbuck and more http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6341092311 Recent hunt in the Eastern Cape, August 2010: Pics added http://forums.accuratereloadin...261039941#9261039941 10 days in the Stormberg Mountains http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7781081322 Back in the Stormberg Mountains with friends: May-June 2017 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6001078232 "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading" - Thomas Jefferson Every morning the Zebra wakes up knowing it must outrun the fastest Lion if it wants to stay alive. Every morning the Lion wakes up knowing it must outrun the slowest Zebra or it will starve. It makes no difference if you are a Zebra or a Lion; when the Sun comes up in Africa, you must wake up running...... "If you're being chased by a Lion, you don't have to be faster than the Lion, you just have to be faster than the person next to you." | |||
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I have a hard time comprehending how a solid is more effective. But then again, what do I know. I wasn't there and really can't comment. He must feel confident enough to put it in writing for his peers to criticize. | |||
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Do like I did. A TSX got the best of both worlds. 16feet long a pass through shot 110yds. DRT Mike  | |||
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Wow Mike, that Croc blow'd up good, real good! Congrats again on taking a huge dinocroc. Pierre knows where to find some giants! Cheers, David Gray Ghost Hunting Safaris http://grayghostsafaris.com Phone: 615-860-4333 Email: hunts@grayghostsafaris.com NRA Benefactor DSC Professional Member SCI Member RMEF Life Member NWTF Guardian Life Sponsor NAHC Life Member Rowland Ward - SCI Scorer Took the wife the Eastern Cape for her first hunt: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6881000262 Hunting in the Stormberg, Winterberg and Hankey Mountains of the Eastern Cape 2018 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4801073142 Hunting the Eastern Cape, RSA May 22nd - June 15th 2007 http://forums.accuratereloadin...=810104007#810104007 16 Days in Zimbabwe: Leopard, plains game, fowl and more: http://forums.accuratereloadin...=212108409#212108409 Natal: Rhino, Croc, Nyala, Bushbuck and more http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6341092311 Recent hunt in the Eastern Cape, August 2010: Pics added http://forums.accuratereloadin...261039941#9261039941 10 days in the Stormberg Mountains http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7781081322 Back in the Stormberg Mountains with friends: May-June 2017 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6001078232 "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading" - Thomas Jefferson Every morning the Zebra wakes up knowing it must outrun the fastest Lion if it wants to stay alive. Every morning the Lion wakes up knowing it must outrun the slowest Zebra or it will starve. It makes no difference if you are a Zebra or a Lion; when the Sun comes up in Africa, you must wake up running...... "If you're being chased by a Lion, you don't have to be faster than the Lion, you just have to be faster than the person next to you." | |||
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FWI I Shot 2...both with .375 .300 gr. TBBC. 1st one was a brain shot, 2nd one was a spine shot. They both were dead on the spot. Of course, the brain shot croc wasn't pretty, but the taxidermist made it look like it was. Regards, D. Nelson | |||
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There's a lot a people here with much more experience than I on Corc's but if I hunt them again I'll continue to shoot them in the spine. Also I'll use a soft as they're more accurate than a solid and shot placement is critical on big lizards. | |||
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I have shot quite a few crocs, all with either Barnes X or our own Walterhog bullets. Trouble with hunting crocs is that one does not have a choice of his shot. I have shot ones broadside, I have shot ones that were facing me, and I have shot ones that were facing away. One has to take the shot that is available at the time. | |||
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Exactly!! | |||
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That's the way Mike and your taxidermist will sort that out for you. Even if a soft does not hit the brain maybe a fragment of it will. As you can see in this picture the shock has cracked the skull almost down to it's nose. Another consideration. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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This croc was seen lying up on a sand bank and the closest shooting distance was 120 yards (ranged). We went back sighted in the .416 at this distance, went over the neck shot and bullet placement. I always point out dead center (neck) and ask the client to shoot one cm below that mark. Makes the shooter concentrate better. The bullet holes are just above the white dots. First behind the smile which was not so funny for the croc. Second middle neck and two in point of the shoulder.  ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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I read the article last night. He based his "35% more lost with softs" statement after he had set up an experiment of shooting 100 crocs with solids and 100 crocs with softs. He analyzed shot placement with post mortems to make sure they were all truly brain shot. Sounds like he has a fair amount of experience. Have gun- Will travel The value of a trophy is computed directly in terms of personal investment in its acquisition. Robert Ruark | |||
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Sorry my subscription was pulled by AHG. Who is this so called expert who has practiced on 200 crocs? Are we talking reptiles or those funny slip on shoes here? ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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You owe me a keyboard.  ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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His name is Graham Cawood. He was culling crocs on Lake Cahora Bassa and the Zambezi below the dam. You should renew with AHG. Certainly one of the best African mags (or Gazettes?) Have gun- Will travel The value of a trophy is computed directly in terms of personal investment in its acquisition. Robert Ruark | |||
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Yes, indeed. Very good and often thought-provoking articles in every issue. Thanks, Blacktailer. Mr. Cawood has made a bit of a career out of crocs and has killed more of them than most of us will ever even see. Which is why his observations regarding the effectiveness of solids, as compared with softs, intrigued me in the first place. Here is precisely what he says: . . . I quickly realized that when hitting the brain with a solid, the crocodile doesn't move - so much that you sometimes think you've missed! When hitting the brain with a soft point, the tail always flicks, so much so that in some cases it generates enough momentum to propel the crocodile into the water. We've managed to grab most of these crocodiles and saw that the shots were spot-on target. It's clear to me that a brain shot with a soft point allows the croc more movement and increases the risk of losing it if water is close by. If there's only a short distance between the croc and the water - a yard or two - use a solid! . . . I frankly find it hard to believe, but hesitate to doubt anyone with as much experience as Mr. Cawood. Hence my general public question. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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You do not understand. I am blacklisted. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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Blacklisted? That might very well change my opinion of this publication. Can't help but wonder how that could happen. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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