I'm looking for a high quality barrel in 7x64 for a Mauser '98 action. Where can I obtain one?

Thanks.

you mean pre chambered?? Lots of barrel makers will short chamber a turned blank for an additional fee

mcgowen, shilen, or pacnor .. FAST twist

Please name one, who has the reamer.

KB

i am indifferent between the 3 .. 8 twist

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
mcgowen, shilen, or pacnor .. FAST twist

None show the reamer on their available list, per their web page.

If it was that easy, I would already have the barrel.

With the 8" twist, you must be advising heavy bullets?

KB

rent the reamer and guages.. like 50 bucks .. the 7x64 is designed for 174 gr bullets in like 8.5 twist ... which is why its "better" than a 280... nearly interchangable other than pressure and twist, but not load data ...

hornady loaded ammo is CHEAP from grafs

Renting a reamer is perhaps an option. I will have to do some research on that, since I have no experience with it. So, that opens up some other questions.

For example, I'm sorta of the opinion that maybe it would be better to buy the reamer new, use it the one time, then sell it for $50 less. That way the specs of the chamber are certain.

Then the question of CIP or SAAMI, if there is a difference. Perhaps they are all CIP, with the long throat.

KB

i don't think there is a saami for it, as its a cip round.. i would go cip .. mine is.. dont have a reamer, sorry

Thanks for the suggestions anyway. Just looking for ideas and alternatives. I can always buy my own reamer, and perhaps it will work with any barrel. I was just looking for a quicker or easier way.

KB

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:
Renting a reamer is perhaps an option. I will have to do some research on that, since I have no experience with it. So, that opens up some other questions.

For example, I'm sorta of the opinion that maybe it would be better to buy the reamer new, use it the one time, then sell it for $50 less. That way the specs of the chamber are certain.


KB

One of the nice things about buying your own reamer, new, is that for a bit of extra money you can custom order the reamer to the throat length, neck diameter, and lead angles YOU prefer.

I wish I hadn't had to sell my lathe in prep for our move to here recently...I would have probably tried to work a deal with you to have Dave Manson make a reamer to dimensions you & I both could live with, then rent it to you for $50, with me paying the initial cost, and ending up with my holding the reamer as mine after you were done with it.

Good luck anyway. And as long as you are buying a new barrel anyhow, my advice would be to buy the highest quality one you can afford. I believe the old saying "Buy the best and only cry once" really applies to barrels.

Lothar Walther!

I'm pretty sure I have a Brno 98 barreled action lying around somewhere, if that interests you. 1990's production, on a large ring 98. Polished blue, iron sights, drilled and tapped, all factory.

PM sent to KurtC

Ok just curious why go to the trouble of a 7x64 when 280s are a dime a dozen? If it is the longer throat run a reamer in it.

Or is it the old "I just want to be different" ?

LW shows the 7x64 as an available chamber.

quote:

Originally posted by JBrown:
LW shows the 7x64 as an available chamber.

Showing it available, and it being a good choice, may be two different things. I dunno.

Do you know if the LW barrel is a good choice?

How 'bout if it's the last 7x64 barrel on the planet - is it still a good choice?

KB

quote:

Or is it the old "I just want to be different" ?

The 7x64 is probably the single most popular hunting cartridge there is, except in the US.

RWS has about 10 different loads for it, vs. only one for the .280. It has been in steady production almost as long as the .30-06.

quote:

RWS has about 10 different loads for it, vs. only one for the .280.

That is great if you live in someplace other than the US which I don't. My guess is they probably don't download the 7x64 like they do the 280.

Again my question if you live in the US and have easy access to the 280 why the 7x64? I can't see it brings a thing to the table. As to factory ammo in my case that is a so what. Not being a smart a$$ but I shoot 95% handloads anyway. Not saying it isn't a good round. But in Kalueway's case he is a handloader so throat, pressure etc should not be an issue.

I'm looking for a 7mm that shoots the 175gr bullets well. For that the 7x64 is better suited than the 280.

The contest for me is between the 280 and 7mm-08, and the latter is looking favorable, especially if I can put together or find a 7x64 shooter. I'll shoot 175gr in the 7x64, and 140-154gr in the 7mm-08.

KB

quote:

Originally posted by KurtC:
The 7x64 is probably the single most popular hunting cartridge there is, except in the US.

Wow! Is this true? I had no idea. I guess I would have guessed one of the other metrics(7x57 or 6.5x55 or maybe 8x57/64/68).

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:

quote:

Originally posted by JBrown:
LW shows the 7x64 as an available chamber.

Showing it available, and it being a good choice, may be two different things. I dunno.

Do you know if the LW barrel is a good choice?

How 'bout if it's the last 7x64 barrel on the planet - is it still a good choice?

KB

For a hunting rifle they are more than good enough. Especially in CM. Their SS barrels do seem to cause problems for some when it comes to machining.

About 10 years ago LW had a good following here on the form. Guys like Atkinson loved their barrels. FWIW

quote:

Originally posted by ramrod340:

quote:

RWS has about 10 different loads for it, vs. only one for the .280.

That is great if you live in someplace other than the US which I don't. My guess is they probably don't download the 7x64 like they do the 280.

Again my question if you live in the US and have easy access to the 280 why the 7x64? I can't see it brings a thing to the table. As to factory ammo in my case that is a so what. Not being a smart a$$ but I shoot 95% handloads anyway. Not saying it isn't a good round. But in Kalueway's case he is a handloader so throat, pressure etc should not be an issue.

Your point is understood however, the reason custom gunsmiths exist is to build what the customer wants. Most of what I build are wildcats but having something different is part of the fun of spending your discretionary income..

quote:

the reason custom gunsmiths exist is to build what the customer wants. Most of what I build are wildcats but having something different is part of the fun of spending your discretionary income

Hey Boss that I fully understand. That is why I shoot very few factory rds and spend so much time and $$ playing with my PDK wildcats and other off the wall chamberings.

If infact the 7x64 has a normal throat for a 175 and that is your plan if you can find a reamer great. If not take a 280 and simply cut the throat to match your 175 of choice. For a shooter in the US the factory 7x64 won't be of much help. However you can find 280s.

Hey if you simply want a 7x64 just because or because it is the most popular in the world that I understand as well. I was just trying to see if there was a PERFORMANCE benefit for a handloader in a rifle with a custom chamber for a 7x64 over 280. The answer to that one is still a no as I see it.

quote:

Originally posted by ramrod340:
I was just trying to see if there was a PERFORMANCE benefit for a handloader in a rifle with a custom chamber for a 7x64 over 280. The answer to that one is still a no, as I see it.

CUSTOM CHAMBER:
I am still amazed that the CIP long throats don't seem to have a negative effect on the accuracy (in a fresh barrel). Althought I have several, I'm still somewhat uncomfortable with them, because to me it simply looks like throat errosion in a factory chamber. Why cut away metal with a reamer, that will errode away in time with shooting? There is something about that which I just don't get.

Anyway, all things being the same - in a custom chamber - I doubt there will be any difference in performance between the two cartridges. The differences in the factory chambers, and twist rates, are a different discussion. SAAMI vs CIP.

Back to the custom chamber - Fast twist, throated for 175gr bullets. (not CIP or SAAMI, but custom throat) Everything same except the chamber specs - one for 280 and the other 7x64. Most likely the same results.

But I'm not talking about buying a custom chamber just yet. I'm talking about a 7x64 CIP chamber, twist rate and throat for a Mauser action.

With this cartridge in particular, I'm very hesitant to go second guessing Mr. Brenneke, by redesigning his cartridge. This is something that Remington took liberties with, hence the 280.

KB

quote:

Wow! Is this true? I had no idea. I guess I would have guessed one of the other metrics(7x57 or 6.5x55 or maybe 8x57/64/68

The 7x64 is more popular because it was never adopted as a military cartridge, which are prohibited in some countries. It was almost adopted as a sniper round by the Germans, but they decided to stick with an 8mm bore to keep things simple.

quote:

This is something that Remington took liberties with, hence the 280.

You think that Remington copied the 7x64 when they designed the 280?. I always believed that Winchester came up with the 270 why a longer neck than the 06 I have no clue. Then Remington decided to play off the success of the 270 but for safety sake moved the shoulder a touch forward so the idiots couldn't chamber it in a 270 and blow themselfs up.

Hmmm Or is the real story????? The US came out with the 06 in 1906 then in 1917 Brenneke made a couple changes to the 06 case necking it to 7mm and set up the throat for the heavy 7mm bullets peferred on the east side of the pond. Then with the huge success of the 7x64 Winchester in 1925 necked the 06 to .277 but for some reason made the neck longer like the 7x64. ?????

Let's face it. take the 06 case design with small changes it is the 25-06, 7x64, 270, 338-06 35W even 9.3x62. Yes I know the 64 & 62 are slightly difference head size but the general parent can lean back to the 06. So from varmints to leagal for Cape Buffalo all from a 06 basic parent.

quote:

Originally posted by ramrod340:
all from a 06 basic parent.

And the basic parent of the 06 is???

The 8x57,
with significant hang-up/predisposition to 30 cal (30-40 Krag)

Bingo

Once one understands that the US military brass copied the German stuff, then it's a pretty good assumption that Mr. Brenneke gave little thought to the 30-06, as a source of inspiration. Most likely the 7x57 was his source. Same with the 8x64B.

KB

quote:

I'm looking for a 7mm that shoots the 175gr bullets well. For that the 7x64 is better suited than the 280.

As "a Brit" living in Yurrup and owning a 280 I'd advise "hold hard"!

The reality is that actually in the US (and Yurrup) the 280 is CHEAPER TO FEED! Half the cost in fact for cases and factory ammunition cheaper too.

New Remington cases in 280 being less than half any of the European maker's cases in 7x64mm. In the US I'd imagine it even greater a difference?

Now there may not be a regular "off the shelf" 175 grain bullet in 280 Remington but there is a regular off the shelf 165 grain bullet...and the modern technology Nosler partition at 160 grains and Privi Partizan 158 grains Grom bullet more than redress that ten grains extra weight.

Now being in Yurrup I could have bought any amount of new or even "cheap" secondhand 7x64mm rifles. From Sauer to Blaser to CZ BRNO even to the odd Parker Hale.

I didn't. I held out for, and got, a Belgian artisan gunsmith (or "custom" Mauser 98K re-built as a sporting rifle) in 280 Remington). Despite all the difficulty of actually finding a bolt action rifle in 280 in Britain or Europe!

280 ammunition isn't a problem as on the continent, especially France, it is widely stocked as it is used in Remington pump and self-loading rifles as a driven boar rifle.

In fact I say that you'll maybe find THREE 280 Remington loadings of US origin to maybe FIVE 7x64mm loadings of European origin in most gunshops in France.

The old 175 grain 7x64 load is really "old school" and not that often used as you once would have thought.

Quite simply even here in Yurrup there's now a "better mousetrap" for that bullet weight....300 Winchester Magnum with the 180 grain bullet!

Or more modern bullet construction in a lighter weight as I've posted.

So unless it is a "tradition" or "old school" thing I personally FWIW think that in the USA you really would be better suited with the 280 Remington and order a twist rate for your barrel accordingly if you really do want those 175 grain bullets.

But, as said, Nosler and Privi both offer superior modern design bullets in the lighter 160 and 158 grain weights.

The 158 grain Privi Grom being extremely well received here. So unless you have some sort of logistics matter that mandates the 175 grain bullet in 7x64mm I'd go 280 Remington with either the factory 165 grain load or Nosler Partition or Privi Grom.

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:

quote:

Originally posted by ramrod340:
all from a 06 basic parent.

And the basic parent of the 06 is???

The 8x57,
Bingo
KB

i disagree-- one can't make 30-06 from 8x57 .. its that simple .. parent case must be able to MAKE "child cases"

long throats have NOTHING to do with accuracy .. forget about it, doesn't impact it ..

the 257 roberts also has a VERY long throat ...

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
i disagree-- one can't make 30-06 from 8x57 .. its that simple .. parent case must be able to MAKE "child cases"

I'm talking about the invention of the rimless case of std case head size, and using smokeless powder. Even the Springfield action was a bastard copy of the '98 Mauser.

I'm not talking about making one case from another, as the criteria for "parent". I'm talking about the shift from rimmed cartridges, to rimless, controlled round feed, staggered magazine box, and many other Mauser inventions.

KB

we disagree .. but neither opinion sways the issue.

My simple thought ignoring what came first the Chicken or the Egg. If you take a piece of 06 cylinder brass (allowing for the fact that the 62 & 64 heads are just a touch smaller but probably almost withing the slop of modern brass). By necking down to 257 or even smaller and leaving it at 9.3 or in my case 375 & 411 you cover everything from varmint to Buffalo legal in some countries.

Sorry Kablueway shouldn't have stepped on your post.

quote:

Originally posted by ramrod340:
Sorry Kablueway shouldn't have stepped on your post.

I don't think of it that way at all. I appreciate the input and discussion, even difference of opinion, from you and Jeffesso too.

Regards,
KB

quote:

even difference of opinion, from you

I thought you and I pretty much agreed. That the only real difference was if using a factory reamer the 7x64 could possibly give an advantage with a 175gr bullet. But with a custom throat on a 280 they were basically the same.

Since I wasn't there I have no clue what he was thinking when he came up with the 7x64 or even the 270 for that matter.

Jeffe and I are wildcatters. So when we think of parent we look to an existing brass and how we can change it. Not designing one from scratch. We ae past the process of how the parent was arrived at.

My final thought is I think anyone should build whatever they are happy with.

hornady ammo is 20 bucks for 20 .. loaded ammo cheaper than norma brass

quote:

hornady ammo is 20 bucks for 20 .. loaded ammo cheaper than norma brass

Hornady doesn't list 7x64 on their site?

If you actually check out 7x64 and .30-06 with a set of calipers, they have little in common. Just like 7x57 and 8x57. The .30-06 and 8x57 have a much broader shoulder than the 7mm's. The 7x64 even has a slightly smaller rim (#10 shell holder, instead of a #2).

the 7x64 can be described as just a longer 7x57, but because of the taper you can not rechamber from shorter to longer without creating a double shoulder.

quote:

http://www.grafs.com/retail/ca...oduct/productId/6954

Well crap. Wonder why it isn't on theri website. Or maybe I'm to old to see it. LOL

I hate prices like those. A Grafs close out on 358Norma led me to owning a 358 Norma Mag.

quote:

7x64 can be described as just a longer 7x57

Yes the shoulder dia of the 280 is .016 smaller in dia on the 7x64. I was suprised to see that the 7x64 did pretty much take the line of the 7x57. I don't know how good this picture will be. The black is a 280 the red the 7x64 and blue is the 7x57 body. Yes there is a small difference in the 7x64 and 280 but you would really have to stretch to say significant in my opinion.


Sorry that drawing stinks and doesn't show much except the two are about as different as the thickness of the line.