quote:

Originally posted by ramrod340:
My answer to that is "MAYBE" I've seen some shoot some wouldn't. I wouldn't spend my $$ on them. Many do and are happy.

With the right reloads you should be able to make it a MOA rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Tailgunner:
They can be accurate enough, if the smith doing the work takes his time to make the chamber, threads & crown as "true" as possible.
The one I spent time around shot acceptably, but it also fouled like a pig (5 shots would turn the inside of the barrel orange with copper, that took 3 days of cleaning to remove)

quote:

Back in the day, they were the best target barrel money could buy. If you stick them in the ground just right, they will withstand several bullet strikes before you have to go down range to reposition them for the next volley.

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:

quote:

Originally posted by Tailgunner:
They can be accurate enough, if the smith doing the work takes his time to make the chamber, threads & crown as "true" as possible.
The one I spent time around shot acceptably, but it also fouled like a pig (5 shots would turn the inside of the barrel orange with copper, that took 3 days of cleaning to remove)

Well, I just got off the phone W/Dennis Olsen.(of Plains Montana)

He said he will thread the barrel, fit it to my VZ500 M98 action, chamber in 6.5X55, open the bolt face & crown the barrel for $175.

That will have me W/$255 for the whole job including the shipped barrel.

He seems to have a good reputation & when I sent him a M98K take-off barrel for a (custom)re-contouring a while back, he did the job exacly as I had spec'ed & had it back to me in less than a week.

As far as cleaning the copper out, Wipe-Out will get the job done in short order.

I wonder, since these barrels have a reputation for copper fouling, if lapping the barrel before I send it out to him would be a good idea.

quote:

Originally posted by plainsman456:
You will find that there are folks that won't use a barrel that costs less that 600.00.
I have not had a problem with Shaw barrels,when chambered right and the same with the crown.

quote:

Originally posted by mstarling:

So, is E. R. Shaw all bad? I tend to doubt it. Would I put one is a high dollar custom ... probably not.

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:
It looks like most of the posts from people that have actually OWNED & SHOT E R Shaw barrels are positive while most of the detractors are basing their opinions on conjecture.

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:
These are probably the same folks that say that a military barrel is not worth fooling with. I recently had Dennis re-contour a M98K take off barrel & it shoots sub MOA groups W/the right reloads. Actually it has shot sub MOA W/all the hand loads I tested, it shot sub 1/2" MOA W/the best

Of course not having a high $$ barrel on my rifle will preclude having the bragging rights associated W/having spent a ton of cash on my project.

I really don't give a rat's A$$ who is impressed. All I want is a rifle W/good hunting accuracy. If it will hold all the shots into a 1" group @ 100yds, I can still hit the lungs on a buck @ 400yds & a bit beyond. That's all the accuracy I need.

Aut vincere aut mori

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:
It looks like most of the posts from people that have actually OWNED & SHOT E R Shaw barrels are positive while most of the detractors are basing their opinions on conjecture.

Yeah, that pretzelled barrel on my lathe is pure conjecture. Since you mention Military barrels, I'll add this: I have recontoured dozens of take off 98 barrels and never had one warp as a result. The amount of material taken off that Shaw was miniscule in comparison.

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:
These are probably the same folks that say that a military barrel is not worth fooling with. I recently had Dennis re-contour a M98K take off barrel & it shoots sub MOA groups W/the right reloads. Actually it has shot sub MOA W/all the hand loads I tested, it shot sub 1/2" MOA W/the best

Of course not having a high $$ barrel on my rifle will preclude having the bragging rights associated W/having spent a ton of cash on my project.

I really don't give a rat's A$$ who is impressed. All I want is a rifle W/good hunting accuracy. If it will hold all the shots into a 1" group @ 100yds, I can still hit the lungs on a buck @ 400yds & a bit beyond. That's all the accuracy I need.

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:
It's not about money, its about quality, repeatability, dependability. But when a barrel lets you down without even the benefit of one shot down the bore.....well....

No one says you have to buy the most expensive barrel out there but, as with bikes, at least use quality components.

Ultimately, the proof is in the pudding. If it shoots, great. But given how much time, effort, and resources we put into a hunt, I sure as hell don't want the success of that hunt to come down to whether or not I can depend on a chintzy barrel.

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:
I've also found that those barrels which seem to foul quickly and demand lots of cleaning tend to take a while to settle in after each cleaning. Me, I prefer a barrel that will put that bullet right where I want it, each time.

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
Can anyone say why some of these Shaw barrels have problems.

1. Is it the quality of the steel they use.
2. Is it the manner in which they contour the barrel.
3. Is it in the manner they rifle the barrel.

Just what is it. What do they do differently than another barrel maker that causes them to have the problems they reportedly have.

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:

quote:

Originally posted by mstarling:

So, is E. R. Shaw all bad? I tend to doubt it. Would I put one is a high dollar custom ... probably not.

Nor would I.

Many here seem to think we all have unlimited cash reserves.

My financial situation dictates that I have to work within my limited budget or not build rifles @ all.

Aut vincere aut mori

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
Can anyone say why some of these Shaw barrels have problems.

1. Is it the quality of the steel they use.
2. Is it the manner in which they contour the barrel.
3. Is it in the manner they rifle the barrel.

Just what is it. What do they do differently than another barrel maker that causes them to have the problems they reportedly have.

quote:

Originally posted by CAS II:
The cost of machining and installing a crappy barrel is the same as the cost of machining and installing a good barrel.

The action costs the same whether the barrel is good or crappy.

The stock costs the same whether the barrel is good or crappy.

The scope and mounts cost the same whether the barrel is good or crappy.

Ammunition costs the same whether the barrel is good or crappy.

Travel time to and from your shooting place costs the same whether the barrel is good or crappy.

Couple all that with the fact that the barrel machining cost is sunk, and I see little incentive to skimp on the quality of the barrel.

Any cost savings of a cheap barrel get eaten up pretty quickly when you have to pay twice for a barrel install if the first barrel is a dog.

quote:

Originally posted by plainsman456:
You will find that there are folks that won't use a barrel that costs less that 600.00.
I have not had a problem with Shaw barrels,when chambered right and the same with the crown.

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:
I own several and they do a fair job in the accuracy and repeatability depts. As was previously mentioned you will get your exercise cleaning them. I have a 6.5x55 with a Shaw light hunter barrel and it will do MOA with the right load. It is mounted in a Steven 200 action with original trigger and Tupper Ware Stock. My last one was a 22PPC Bull barreled Shaw ,same action ect., and it can and does shoot some tiny tiny groups but not bench rest competitive. roger

quote:

Originally posted by mstarling:
Interesting ... I bought a Mark X barreled action for the action with the intention of making it into a boomer. Happened to be in .264 Win Mag and the barrel an E. R. Shaw.

For the heck of it, I loaded some 125 gr Nosler Partitions and took it to the range. Darned if the thing didn't shoot sub MOA.

So ... as .264 Win Mag has a reputation as a barrel burner ... I figure I just use it up before mounting a new barrel.

Have also noted that a number of well respected providers of AR15 barrels use Shaw blanks.

So, is E. R. Shaw all bad? I tend to doubt it. Would I put one is a high dollar custom ... probably not.

quote:

Originally posted by the jigger:
I can only speak for the one Shaw that I own.
I put a varmint weight 26" in 220 Swift on a Savage 12fv, Chambered, crowned and threaded by Shaw. It shoots minute of prairie dog out to 400yds on a "Quiet" day.
When I was "breaking in" the barrel I used JB paste every second cleaning. Currently cleaning it is no more difficult than any of my other rifles.
GOOD LUCK and GOOD SHOOTING!!!

quote:

Originally posted by mad_jack02:
I just barreled up a 220 Swift for a friend, and he supplied an E.R. Shaw barrel. We took it to the range and it shot a .230" group @100 yards, with factory ammo. For now it shoots, I just hope he gets a lot of use out of it before the accuracy goes south.

quote:

Originally posted by FOOBAR:
Every barrel I've ever used with the exceptions of hand lapped benchrest barrels, button rifled or hammer forged were rough and needed to be lapped to get the best accuracy and least fouling...BAR NONE.

I've used 3 ER Shaw barrels, many A&B and a few McGowen since my income doesn't fit my tastes anymore. I think McGowen are the better choices as they are smoother and require the least amount of lapping, but even the cheapo A&B's shoot well under 1 MOA without much load workup...and DON'T foul any more than any other cheapo barrel that hasn't been "fondled".

I've had "BAD" high dollar benchresters in the distant past, but in todays machining world I think most of the BS about "bad" barrels is repeats of dim memories if you bother to really think about it, or repeats of what has been read before and NOT actual experience. "One dog barks at a shadow and a 1000 dogs bark at the sound"

I don't blame a barrel maker if he stands behind his product. Jezzz...he POUR the steel and he DOESN'T make the barrel blank, for the most part...he probably only separates the wheat from the chaff, stress relieves, lapps the bore and maybe the contour, chamber and crown. You pay the high dollar for all the hand work that goes into the lapping, checking, stress relieving etc...the barrel blank price is chump change compared to the labor and handling costs. If Dan Lilja just sold his barrel blanks as they came from where ever he gets them the you ***** would be cussing HIM and calling him names.

Gimme a break...some of these arguments are ludicrous.

I may wish to be able to use $300-600 dollar barrels so I can drop all the names and strut around, but reality leaves me AND most other humble servants in the cheapo bracket, and those barrels, with a little sweat equity, will shoot very well indeed.

Besides the fact that maybe 80% of all the shooters out there are happy with hunting accuracy and are clueless when it comes to what to do to really "accurize" their favorite shooters.

We don't all have deep pockets or afford a $10,000.00 custom made "perfect" rifle, and I guarantee a deer shot with a $275.00 Savage will taste just as good as one shot with some gold encrusted, engraved, premier wooded example of "conspicuous consumption".

Luck.

quote:

Originally posted by rolltop:

quote:

E R Shaw Barrels Any Good?

It's a fine hunting barrel. The only problem is it don't cost a lot so some folks don't like them.

If the same barrels was sold by "Olmquist precision" at a price of $800, they would be loved.

quote:

Originally posted by Idared:
I have used four or five barrels from E.R. Shaw over the years and all were acceptable to me. One was exceptional and still is to this day. In my lifetime I have used 20+ barrels from Flaigs, Federal, Hart, Shilen, Douglas, Shaw, Adams Bennett, and three or four from other small barrel makers. I have used more Shilens than any other brand. I had one Shilen barrel that absolutely would not group. It was replaced by the smith who put it on with another which turned out to be fine. Most other brands gave more than acceptable service and a few were exceptional in the accuracy dept.

It has been my experience that more accuracy will be gained, or lost, by how well the barrel is installed rather than the type of barrel used. I have seen barrels, some rather expensive ones, taken off that would not group and when they were installed properly the accuracy turnaround was phenomenal.

I have had Dennis Olson install several barrels for me and he will take as many pains with a Shaw barrel as he will a Lilja or Pac-nor, which are among his favorites. I would be very surprised if the rifle didn't shoot well when he got through with it. He put an Adams-Bennett in 6.5X55 on a rifle for me and quite frankly the weak link in the accuracy department is usually the shooter rather than the barrel. In other words it is a very accurate rifle when the shooter does his part.

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
Guess I am just lucky...

all the Shaw barrels I have purchased have been better shooters than the factory barrels that came on the rifle...

the worst one was a 223 barrel, that didn't seem to give groups to brag about at the range at all..but seemed just acceptable..

however I take it out and shoot at sage rats the size of a pop can or 20 oz soda bottle.. and the "poor quality" Shaw barrel will still nail moving targets that size out to 250-300 yds as well as my most accurate varmint rifles..

The Most accurate rifle I own, is a 6mm Rem with a barrel on it that was a PacNor factory reject that I got mega cheap..

I'm not going to knock what barrel a guy uses, whether it is cheap or spendy

the 223 Shaw barrel I speak of, is mounted on a Model 70 action... and it does whatever I ask of it in the varmint fields..but still it won't impress anyone at the rifle range...

and in the field is where I wanted it to perform..and it does..

quote:

Originally posted by ron vella:
In 1978 I built myself a rifle chambered for the .264 Win Mag for long range hunting in Wyoming. I used a 26" ER Shaw barrel on a P-14 Enfield action. I shoot a Nosler 140 grain Partition at 3200 fps. That rifle is and always has been a tackdriver. It's probably killed 50 pronghorns and mulies, 5 of which were beyond 500 yards(accurately measured with rangefinders).
A few years later I built a second one for a friend who admired mine...same results.
I also built myself a .458 Win Mag, ER Shaw barrel on a Rem. Model 30 action, to use on Cape Buffalo. That rifle is like a .45 calibre varmint rifle and will put 3-500 grain Hornadys in an inch and a half at 100 yards, all day long.
Also, I have never seen any indication of excessive fouling with any of these three rifles.
Obviously my experiences are at odds with many others here but the truth is the truth.... is the truth....

quote:

Originally posted by Papa 260:
I would not use a Shaw barrel for a custom build. Krieger is by far my favorite barrel maker, followed by Bartlein, and Lilja. Having said that I do have one rifle with an E.R. Shaw barrel. It is an AR 15 chambered in 6.5 Grendel. I bought it as an assembled flat top upper with a float tube and a 2 stage N.M. trigger from J.T. Distributing out of Kentucky. I knew it was coming with an E.R. Shaw barrel and I wasn't happy about it but I didn't want to wait 6 months for a barrel to do a custom build. When I got the upper before I ever shot it I took it to my smith (he is no fan of Shaw barrels} for a look see with the bore scope. He said it was the best looking Shaw barrel he had ever seen.

I took my time breaking the barrel in. After 70 shots I called it good and started load develeopment. I may have got lucky, but this barrel is consistently shooting between the .4's and .6's for 5 shot groups with three different bullet weigths. The barrel cleans easier than any factory tube I have shot.

So yes I am very pleased with it. Would I intentionally put use a Shaw barrel for a build, no I would not, but this one shoots very well. I just don't want to press my luck if I don't have to.

PaPa 260

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
I dont know if it's true or not, but I have an old Star barrel, it's as nice a tube as any I've ever had. It's in a 240 gibbs and shoots 3/8" groups with as little fouling as you could ask. I heard, ER shaw uses Star's machinery. If so, Shaw doesnt put the effort into their barrels Star did. I've shot a couple Shaw barreled rifles, they were OK, about factory rifle average it seemed.

quote:

Originally posted by Tapper2:
If you want to use a cheap barrel get an Adams & Bennett. They cost less and are of the same quality. I'm not so sure they aren't better. Both foul quickly, but A&B seem to be more accurate on average. I have only used 4 or 5 of each, so it's a small sample. Many customers are happy, understanding they have to clean more often.......Tom

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:
So, how many posts are on this thread by people that are unhappy W/their E R Shaw barrel?

So far, none that I see.

Aut vincere aut mori

quote:

Originally posted by FOOBAR:
We don't all have deep pockets or afford a $10,000.00 custom made "perfect" rifle, and I guarantee a deer shot with a $275.00 Savage will taste just as good as one shot with some gold encrusted, engraved, premier wooded example of "conspicuous consumption".

Luck.

Aut vincere aut mori

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:
Any manufacturer can turn out a bad barrel, it happens. It's just that with better quality barrels the occurances are far less frquent.

quote:

E R Shaw Barrels Any Good?

quote:

Originally posted by FOOBAR:
Every barrel I've ever used with the exceptions of hand lapped benchrest barrels, button rifled or hammer forged were rough and needed to be lapped to get the best accuracy and least fouling...BAR NONE.

I've used 3 ER Shaw barrels, many A&B and a few McGowen since my income doesn't fit my tastes anymore. I think McGowen are the better choices as they are smoother and require the least amount of lapping, but even the cheapo A&B's shoot well under 1 MOA without much load workup...and DON'T foul any more than any other cheapo barrel that hasn't been "fondled".

I've had "BAD" high dollar benchresters in the distant past, but in todays machining world I think most of the BS about "bad" barrels is repeats of dim memories if you bother to really think about it, or repeats of what has been read before and NOT actual experience. "One dog barks at a shadow and a 1000 dogs bark at the sound"

I don't blame a barrel maker if he stands behind his product. Jezzz...he POUR the steel and he DOESN'T make the barrel blank, for the most part...he probably only separates the wheat from the chaff, stress relieves, lapps the bore and maybe the contour, chamber and crown. You pay the high dollar for all the hand work that goes into the lapping, checking, stress relieving etc...the barrel blank price is chump change compared to the labor and handling costs. If Dan Lilja just sold his barrel blanks as they came from where ever he gets them the you ***** would be cussing HIM and calling him names.

Gimme a break...some of these arguments are ludicrous.

I may wish to be able to use $300-600 dollar barrels so I can drop all the names and strut around, but reality leaves me AND most other humble servants in the cheapo bracket, and those barrels, with a little sweat equity, will shoot very well indeed.

Besides the fact that maybe 80% of all the shooters out there are happy with hunting accuracy and are clueless when it comes to what to do to really "accurize" their favorite shooters.

We don't all have deep pockets or afford a $10,000.00 custom made "perfect" rifle, and I guarantee a deer shot with a $275.00 Savage will taste just as good as one shot with some gold encrusted, engraved, premier wooded example of "conspicuous consumption".

Luck.

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:

quote:

Originally posted by wildcat junkie:
So, how many posts are on this thread by people that are unhappy W/their E R Shaw barrel?

So far, none that I see.

Um, I was. Unhappy that is.
And, if you include my customer, that would make at least two.

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
This is another thread that has accomplished not one damn thing. I don't know where the $300-$600 barrel prices come from. Sounds like talk from the shooting range guys.
The better barrelmakers buy heat treated steel in very large lots. They are sawed to length. They are faced on both ends and centers are machined on both ends. They are gun drilled and then reamed. They are lapped to remove any tooling marks. You button or cut rifle the grooves. It is lapped again. Some contour before stress relieve and some after.
Butch

quote:

Originally posted by Tapper2:
If you want to use a cheap barrel get an Adams & Bennett. They cost less and are of the same quality. I'm not so sure they aren't better. Both foul quickly, but A&B seem to be more accurate on average. I have only used 4 or 5 of each, so it's a small sample. Many customers are happy, understanding they have to clean more often.......Tom