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Interesting picture of the aftermath of firing a 165 grain 308 load in a Savage 25.06. The action contained the pressure and the case welded itself to the bolthead. The barrel had to be pulled to get the bolt out and the extractor fell out of the bolthead. This was not me, thanks for the PM's! Some more information: No one was hurt and the Savage handled the pressure/gas perfectly. The shot felt normal to the shooter and he didn't notice a problem until he couldn't get the bolt to open. The .308 bullet after swaging down to .257 hit the target 5" left and 3" low.  Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | ||
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Fjold...had that been a CRF action the result would have been a blown up action with possible serious injury to the shooter and bystanders. Thanks for the story. /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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My step son did the same thing. He shot a 308 Win in a Browning high wall chambered for 25-06. Two kinds of ammo on the bench at one time. He might have been unhurt except he was resting his left hand on the eyepiece of the scope. Lost a good chunk of his thumb. I don't think the scope was ever located as it departed for parts unknown. The rifle was a write off. stocker | |||
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A local guy pulled the .308 in the .270 rifle trick a while back. Gave the destroyed M700 action to the local gun shop after he got out of the hospital. From what I heard it wasn't pretty. | |||
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I’ve never been able to comprehend how someone loads the wrong ammunition in their rifle...especially a bolt action with a magazine box. Having said that though, I recall reading all the wacky tests that Gen Hatcher and his gang did on 1903 Springfields and a few other CRF actions of the day by stuffing every type/size of round they could find into the chambers and firing them off. Lots of broken and deformed bolt heads and extractors, and lots of destoyed/split barrels, but I am still amazed at what those rifles were able to digest without being turned into a million pieces. | |||
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How many times has the .270 in the 7mm Mag been done? From the stories I hear, that is the most common mixup. Hunting buddy of mine was shooting at the range with his brother-in-law. Finished with the .270 and he was casing it in the truck when he heard the other rifle go "boom" in a strange voice. When he got to the bench, the floorplate was trashed, but no other apparent damage to the rifle or the shooter. Rifle Ruger 77 Mk II) is at the gunsmith's as we speak being evaluated for further damage. An old pilot, not a bold pilot, aka "the pig murdering fool" | |||
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Are these the same guys that put their motor oil in the radiator? | |||
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You mean it doesn’t go in there? | |||
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Seriously, do guys like this just keep their ammo in a bag or something and then they all go to the range together and dump their bags out on the table and start grabbing and shooting away? And do people this careless and so unaware of their surroundings and what they are doing hand load their own ammunition? Why is that a scary thought?  | |||
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I know a gunsmith, who will remain nameless, that did nearly the same thing. A double charge of SR4759 in a 30-06 Mauser welded the brass case to the bolt face. | |||
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Some years ago, I was at the range; a friend asked me to shoot some rounds with a BAR cal. 7 RM. The problem was that he put a 7x64 cartridge directly in the chamber; when I shot, I heard a big BOOM and felt a projection of gas/splinters on my hands. The receiver bulged in the lower (open) side, letting drop the trigger assembly; the brass was bulged and cracked. By a lucky chance, I didn't get hurted and the rifle has been perfectly repaired. Fortunately, it was the wrong cartridge but the same caliber.... We still can't believe how the firing pin could hit the primer. | |||
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About three years ago I had a customer do the same thing on a Shilen barreled Ruger 77. The action was unhurt but the bolt and the Hogue stock were destroyed along with the ejector. I would like to see the bullets after swaging to .257. | |||
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I know a guy that fired a 308 in a 25-06 break action handi rifle. The rifle was blown in half at the hinge pin. The chamber was blown off where extractor and bite housing was welded to the breech end of the barrel. The scope blew off and rotated back so hard and fast that when it wacked the top of his head it cut him deep enough to require stitches. There was a lot of melted brass in the action. When the chamber let go it split the barrel up to about the end of the forend and a jet of gas damn near cut his LH thumb off. The guy was about 75 years old and has hunted and shot rifles his whole life, he was pretty ashamed of himself. Another guy brought in a savage 243 that he mistakenly loaded 45 grains of bullseye under a 100 grain bullet, the barrel of that rifle actually went down range about 20 yards, all that was left of the receiver ring was the feed ramp and about 1/4 segment of the RH side of the front ring, amazingly the bolt stayed right where it was when it was fired, the rest of the rifle departed at a high rate of speed. Timan | |||
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There was an article in Rifle Magazine about a rifle that had a 7mm Remington mag catridge fired in a 7mm Weatherby rifle. The theory was that the bullet got just enough of a push to plug the bore before the case shoulder are expanded to fill the chamber. There was simply no place for the gas to go so the rifle actually exploded. So, even with same caliber cartridges, a catastrophe can happen. I believe this was documented in the early-mid '90s. | |||
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Now that one I don't understand. How is that any different than simply fireforming brass? I see 7mag and 300Wmag brass that has been fired in the 7Wby & 300Wby at the range all the time. As usual just my $.02 Paul K | |||
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Sounds pretty suspicious too me... | |||
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Following a quick glance at cartridge dimensions found in "Metallic Cartridge Reloading" [M.L. McPherson 1996], I suspect there would be very few ill effects from firing a 7mm Remington Mag in a 7mm Weatherby Mag chamber. This leads to a question of why the 7mm RM is always [commercially] loaded to lower pressures and velocities compared to the virtually identical 7mm Weatherby. Additionally, I note the 7mm RM has a larger case capacity than the 7mm Weatherby [McPherson 1996]. So, the 7mm RM should have a greater velocity potential, when loaded to equal pressures, compared to the Weatherby. As for free boring or no free boring...this is a rifle characteristic, and not a limitation of the cartridge. Has anyone done any fair comparison testing between these two cartridges? Have a happy and meaningful Easter. Albatross. | |||
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Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the first. Albert Einstein Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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It was a 7mm Rem mag in a 270 WBY | |||
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Now that makes more sense. Like a 280 in a 270 but on steriods. As usual just my $.02 Paul K | |||
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I'm glad no one was hurt.  I did the unthinkable a few years ago and shot a 280 Rem out of my Ruger M77 II that was chambered for 7mm Rem Mag. It was at a moment when I had too much going on at one bench and was distracted by conversation. I only ended up with a few blood specks on my face and the darn bullet grouped as a 1" flyer from the 7mag group. I still wouldnt consider using the 280 if I ran out of 7mag though.  ------------------------------- Too many people........ | |||
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You know guys, my take on this whole situation is this. There definitly is room in this world for some form of gun control. Jim Jim Kobe 10841 Oxborough Ave So Bloomington MN 55437 952.884.6031 Professional member American Cusom Gunmakers Guild | |||
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Seems like this is a much more common phenomenon, than I recently assumed... Thread about mistaken cartridges and the consequences... All I can say is, that you are not positioning yourself very well in an evolutionary sense... Discipline forgotten through familiarity... - mike ********************* The rifle is a noble weapon... It entices its bearer into primeval forests, into mountains and deserts untenanted by man. - Horace Kephart | |||
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I remember a hound hunter here locally who did the 308 in a 25-06 thingy and rifle WAS an Ithica LS 65. The story he told about waking up in the dark and thinking he had gone to Heaven was so funny I wish I had taped it!! Luckily the only thing ruined was the rifle. His face was swelled up like a pumpkin for awhile though! That is the reason I shudder sometimes when I see wildcat rifles for sale in the shows. Wonder if the "new" owner knows about the precautions for the safety with wildcats and their loading!! Aloha, Mark When the fear of death is no longer a concern----the Rules of War change!! | |||
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I helped a fello bore sight his 30-06 several years ago, he came back to me and ask if I had done it right? well I'm not perfect so I told him I would go to the range and help him out. When at the range I ask him for his ammo and he handed me a partially shot box and he told me these were the ones left from his last session so I took one out and started laughing! he ask what was wrong and I ask him what caliber his rifle was, he said 30-06! I ask him what caliber was the ammo he gave me and after looking with a very red face he said 25-06! He was lucky and after buying some 30-06 rounds the rifle actually shot pretty well. Later, Kirk | |||
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Right The caliber was 7mm rem fired in a Weatherby MarkV about 3 years ago the same happened in Sweden, also with a Weatherby MarkV. All locking lugs was peled of the bolt, and the bolt blew out of the back of the action, cutting the mans jaws, and stoped halfway throu his sholder. This incident showed the negative side of the highly markedet "3 RINGS OF STEEL" The advantages of that safetytheory is that you dont se caseruptures at medium to high overpreasures,The negative is when the preasure goes even higher, the hole bolt is blown backwards, This phenomen is more likly to happen on a Weatherby, than on a Remmington, especialy when not all 9 small locking lugs are in contact, then they are peeled of like a line of Domino bricks. Many other rifle cunstructions are designed with what i call a safetyvalve system. They have the cartridges pulled longer out of the chamber, and having a small gap between the barrelend and the bolt. When the preasure goes apx 50% to high, the brass punctures, and the gass escapes backwards preventing further presurebuilding.This hapens way below the strength limmit of the action. Then the next task is to control the leacking gas so it doesnt hit the shooter, this is most effectively done by using Fatboltsystems, or extra non rotating lugs(savages i think) or like Mauser 98, whith its many small gascontrol devices and big boltscrouts. On the fatbolts and savages you just put big gasescape holes in the front recieverring, to ventilate the leaking gas.The tight fitting fatbolt or the extra lugs on the savage, stops the gass from blowing into your face. When performed correctly this "Safetyvalve" system works perfect, though giving you a "hell of a scare" but whithout the risk of severely injuring you | |||
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I can “almost†understand someone mixing up a 25-06 and a 30-06 or other rounds based on a common sized/length case...but how in the hell does a guy load a much shorter 308 into an 06 length bolt action rifle without noticing it? | |||
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I think this post adequetly answers the last post. | |||
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Closest I came to that kind of disaster was when I loaded, I think the charge weight was 77 grains of what I thought was IMR-7828 in to a 7mmSTW. Just before heading off to the range I noticed the can of powder on the bench was Varget. That may have been interesting indeed. another time I was shooting a 7mm Mag off the hood of my truck and I droped a round on the ground. I was not paying much atention when I picked it up but the bolt closed very stiffly. so, I didn't fire. I poped out the round and iut was a .338 win. I looked down and there was my 7 mag,on the ground at my feet. someone else had dropped a .338 in almost the same spot. That also might have gotten my atention...tj3006 freedom1st | |||
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 You silly gal you...and all this while I thought women lost their sense of humor once they hit menopause! | |||
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Ricky You silly gal you . . . when you hit menopause and lost your humor you thought the same thing happened to all women becasue it happened to you. My wife tells me its not true. | |||
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Are you guys calling them wives now? I thought “life-partner†was the proper PC term nowadays? Life-partner or wife, they must be an incredible person to stay with such a cheap SOB...tell them they have my admiration and sympathy!  | |||
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How am I supposed to know what your husband calls you Ricky. "I thought" Thats your whole trouble Ricky. | |||
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You need to leave here and “swish†over and help your guy out on the other one, he ain’t doing too good so far!  | |||
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This Swedish story is quite new to me. I think that I ought to have heard it as I live in Sweden - are you quite sure that it really happened here?  Fritz The true and only Fritz Kraut | |||
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No its worse than that, its the guys who put water in their sump. | |||
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Yes i ame sure it happened in Sweden. There was an article in one of the Swedish huntingmagazines. The injuried was a gunsmith who should test a customers rifle, with the ammo the customer delivered. I have also discussed this incidence with Kennet Skoglund at Norma, where they have done som tests on this combination because they have produced the ammo. As he said the 7mmrem in a 270wea gives a surprisingly high peakpresure.. | |||
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Another thing in this debate, is that Rifles with long claweatractors, and socalled "controlled feeding" has a higer potential risk of beeing able to fire wrong ammo, because it is able to hold a to short and thin round in the extraxtor, vhile striking the primer. A pushfeeded action simply wouldnt be able to reach the primer with the firingpin. I have also heard of a 458winmag fired in an Brno chambered for 416rigby, Result alott of hot gasses and powder and brass particles all over the place including the shooters face. The 308 thing in a 06 chamber ( 25 6,5 and 270)can easily occure because the bigger shoulderdiameter of the 308, make it feel just like a perfect tight round in a litle to big 06 chamber. One guy trying the combination 308 in 270 chamber actualy managed to fire 5 rounds all hitting the target, but he was not pleased with the groupsize. He actually didnt realise the problem before a freind wondred why the brass looked strange, and all the primers was blown out | |||
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Maybe I’m a weirdo...but I normally check to see that I am loading the correct ammunition way before it ever gets put in the rifle where I would have the chance to see what it “feels†like when being chambered. Personally, I think anyone that is this careless should think about taking up a hobby other than firearms...or at the very least, restrict their shooting to times and places where no one else is anywhere near them and their “hand grenades.†| |||
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Hey Rick, how in the hell can someone run a stop light without noticing its red \I rolled a 7 mag down a 338 once. Most of us mere motals have done something supid by not paying attention, more than once in most cases. Billy, High in the shoulder (we band of bubbas) | |||
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