It seems that Into the Wilds is inspiring wannabes to the Alaska bush. I was overhearing just such a conversation between two would-be adventurers about going and living in the bush and living off the land. Comes to find out, neither had the means nor the experience to survive in such conditions as they would have to deal with in the remote bush.

Now, here's a challenge - a $500 challenge. If you were to go into the bush and you did not have firearms already but had $500 with which you could spend on firearms for living in the bush for a minimum of six months, what would you get? Doesn't matter if the guns are new or used but if used, set a reasonable retail value.

For me, I would try to get 3 guns with my $500. One would be a used pump 12 gauge Mossberg shotgun ($130), a used centerfire bolt-action rifle (anything as close to .30 caliber as I can get, probably a Savage in .308 Win, about $225), and a new .22LR rifle ($145 Ruger 10/22).

Win,CZ, browning Bolt Action used Cal.338 - $325.00
Shotgun Pump 12 gauge used - $150.00

Roland

I was looking to see if that was playing here in Alaska and it isn't. I've been to that bus where he died many times over the last few years and I always get an eerie feeling when I go inside. Anyways, if I were to go into the wild for 6 months I would take a used 300 WM, Ruger or Winchester and a 22 pistol for shooting small game. I'm sure I could find both for under $500.

True bush living is much different than going on a big game hunt. I'd say a 22rf, 30-06 and a 12 ga would be a good setup, though I could see getting by with just two of those guns. You also need to factor in ammo in the equation.

Used gun prices are quite a bit higher up here than what you quoted, and I think you'd only be able to get two guns for $500.

Ditto Paul H......12 gauge would be expendable for me though.

Joe

While an 06 or 300 mag would be desireable. My first choice would be a 12 ga pump, preferring a Rem 870. with a supply of 6s and some slugs. In my travels from Bethel to the east near the Yukon, there can be alot of air around moose and caribou at times. Ptarmigan have been plentiful, have no idea what they taste like but sure one could survive, throw in an occassional rabbit.

12ga and .30-06...if we are limited to $500

.22 cal rifle and a .338 WM. That would cover every thing pretty well.

A shotgun would be a waist of money and space. You can carry a huge amount of 22LR ammo for the same weight and shooting for sport goes out the window when hunting for survival. At close range the 22 has little meat damage. You can pick off small game at ranges well out side of a shotguns effective range.

Will

22lr, 30-06,12ga you can find ammo just about any village ! you could get by with the 22lr and the 30-06 use the oney you save on the 12ga and buy snars and a good ax

Just MHO, but the twelve gauge will just put more air between the big critters, the noise spooking the big critters......a .22 will take care of the cyclical highs of ptarmigan & snowshoe hares.....the Brooks are full of chickens and bunnies as we speak.....I would rather have a short spread of subsistence fishing net to stretch across a small stream then a 12ga......but we are talking guns......again, jmho, if you can't feed yourself with the .30-06 & .22 rimfire, take the $500.00 and buy youself an old school bus.....

Joe

buying multiple guns with $500 wont go too far if you use a scope that wont screw up. id try to find a used remington or ruger with a leoupold or burris in some cal from 308 to 338 then spend the rest on a single shot 410 or 20 ga. bottom line is getting something that wont break or screw up

Irons are the way to go. When I lived in the Bush, I rarely saw scopes. There's just little point to them in the arctic most of the time. Simplicity is best.

30-06 or a 30-30 carbine along with a .22 pistol would be very suitable.

I lived in the Alaskan bush years ago and it's not for everyone.

I'm sure there are exceptions but most who live in the bush do not have what can be described as a gun collection.When I was there,I had only three guns,30/06 & 22 rimfire rifle plus a 44 magnum revolver.I could have easily done without the sixgun.

Even though living off the land 100 % is possible,I wouldn't want to be without general provisions such as flour,dried beans,etc,etc.

I agree with the negative assesment of the shotgun for bush living.The bulk and weight of the ammo is excessive for small game and it's noise tends to scare off big game.

As Paul mentioned,bush living is not like going on a hunting trip.There is a mind set to living in true wilderness that most people cannot adjust to or even understand.Most people would think of it as being "poverty stricken".

Ironically,I don't consider a lot of ammo to be neccesary.I doubt if I shot more than 10 shots per year from my 30/06.But of course,keep in mind that I kept a supply of general provisions.Whenever I hear of someone who plans to live "completely"off game meat,my reaction is usually that they are probably biting off more than they may be able to chew.

Just give me a 30-06.

This thread brought something back to my recollection that I haven't thought of in years.

In the part of Alaska where I lived (between Circle and Eagle),we called those who made vacation trips with various types of watercraft on the river "floaters".

One particular floater was on the Yukon river on a log raft and he wore a trench coat with machetes carried inside his coat.Apparently these were sewn in holders.He did not appear to have a gun.

I'll bet those machetes cost a lot less than 500 dollars.

An SKS, and a .22 ought to leave a fair amount for ammo, mostly .22

How about a Marlin 45/70 guide gun. You could use the 45 cal pills for the big critters and 410 shotshells for the little ones.

i ve used iron sight almost exclusivly from 1969 to 1990 including 375 and 416 with maybe only 2 or 3 animals shot with a scoped 338 during this time then i started using scope . a scope will triple the range you can shoot with iron sights . i got my nra expert for offhand shooting in 1971 so i understand sights, most suck like beads and buckhorns and i hate peeps except target shooting. now im not criticizing people for using open sight, just the sights themselves. i would prefer scope sighted rifle with irons and quick release like weaver and i say weaver because weaver is better than much more expensive and come back to zero with the best of them. i have a rem 660 in 308 with irons and 4x leopold and savage 24 ovr under 22 --20 ga with 20 in bbls this is one of my favorite guns and i preferr the 20 ga on grouse to the 22 any way the limit wqas $500 on this post i have far less than 500 into these . but now i guess ill be trying to cram 410 shells into my guide gun but i got more than 500 into it so it dont count

no trophy animal? okay, meat eating situation then.

it is going to be a tough place especially winter and distances for a shot can be a tough one so the .30-06 gets my vote-no belted magnums, less blood shot. Stick to a heavy bullet,gauranteed penetration and meat. Does not matter to me if it has irons or scope-preferably irons. Snow and fogging in the winter is a hassle.

Bullets you can find anywhere in bush Alaska. Figure to spend up to 30.00 per box max for the .06 -- this would cove any game animal in any and all situation.

You have to have a .22 rifle, easier to carry quite a few rounds to get by for quite some time. Good for small game ie.. grouse, ptarmigan and rabbits and maybe a porcupine if a club of sorts is not handy.

6 months you say so the need for a shotgun is out and spring time before the geese and ducks fly I should be out on my way selling my fur ie....wolves, marten, lynx, wolverine etc.....have to cache in to catch the next barge up so I can gear for new trip into the hearland and really do good!

Might be able to buy a new .375 Ruger for any and all game with my newly acquired monies. But then ammo would be a scarce thing too. So might just put away for a .........

Should cover it, a .30-06 and a good shooting .22 rifle-when does this begin? I am ready

I have a Marlin Guide Gun too, and I didn't even know that I could shoot the .410 shotshell in it also - uh duh. Anyway, it's more than $500, so it doesn't fit Into the Wilds economic criteria.

As far as eating off the land, the truth is most of my camp meat were taken with a .22LR, either a rifle or a pistol. Most were grouse, ptarmigan, quail, rabbits, or squirrels who were mainly sitting targets. The .22, IMO, is the most versatile of all survival calibers.

There were times when I would come across a flock of quail, grouse, etc. and the shotgun came in handier. I could get one as it sits, the next on the wing, then wait until the rest of the flock comes to roost 35 yards away and repeat the process. I could feed a camp of 4 in 5 minutes.

I also would carry 00Buck and slugs for bigger game of opportunity. The 00Buck is an impressive killer of deer but a lot of meat wasted. As far as defense against Grizzly - I don't know - I've never had a shotgun in hand when I've come across them.

For purely living off the land, I think the centerfire rifle would be the least versatile. If living alone, one deer-size animal should suffice for 2 to 3 months eating good. As far as using it for defense then the bigger the better. I was at a gun show yesterday and I did find .30-06 rifles in decent shape, some even with low-price 3x9x40 scopes, for $250 or less. The lowest priced medium caliber that I found were 8mm Mausers for around $200, and that would also be sufficient for a bush defensive/hunting firearm.

A handgun would be very adaptable to bush-living situations but most .357s, .41s, and .44s would come close to or exceed the $500 limit. Besides, most bushwacking wannabes have little or no skill or experience with handling handguns effectively.

So, if I were one of those guys that got inspired by Into the Wilds, I think that I would still stand on my original opinion and try to get 3 firearms for my $500 - a 12 gauge pump shotgun, a .22LR rifle, and a .30 caliber center-fire bolt action rifle with back-up iron sights.

All of the varied opinions stated have been very informative. I'm glad to hear from you all who have lived in the Alaska bush.

how about the rossi youth 3 bbl set 22lr 20 gauge and 243 one rifle 3 bbls 275 bucks leaves some for a scope and lots of ammo also could do 2 one in 308 and one in 22mag 20 gauge combo for about 100 bucks more.

I have never known a woodsman who went to the bush for a lengthy period without taking general provisions.A great deal depends on the climate but it's my impression that we've been talking about Alaska.If a man is in the bush of Alaska in the winter time with nothing but rifle and ammo,his survival will be very problematic and certainly uncomfortable.

Certain survival/reality TV shows seem to be inspiring a lot of naive notions.Before I took to the bush,over thirty years ago,I had already had a lot of primitive camping experience but I also read everything on the subject of wilderness living that I could get my hands on.Reading such books does not replace experience by any means but nonetheless,I doubt that I would have made it otherwise.

Even with the knowledge I had,I made a lot of mistakes and every day in the bush was a series of learning curves.

Theoretically,one can make do with nothing but proper clothes,rifle and ammo,axe and knife.However,if I saw a man head off into the bush of Alaska with nothing else,I'd consider the odds to be very much against him.

I consider going into the bush without provisions to be something very unwise.

Between Eagle and Circle you say? I lived downriver from Circle and would use their boat ramp frequently.

Yukon,

I was there in the 70's.

I can't stand that hippy-type freak at WWG. They'll never get a dime from me ever again.

I would probably go with John Taylor's recommendation for Africa (I'm guessing it would work pretty much anywhere).
His idea was a .22 RF to put food in the pot, and a large bore revolver for 'things that go bump in the night'.
Sounds pretty reasonable to me, as many here have noted, you can keep yourself well fed with a 22, and as for the handgun, well I guess you would have to pick the one you thought might do the job for the $$$.
Not sure I'd want to take on a Brown Bear with a handgun though...

quote:

I have never known a woodsman who went to the bush for a lengthy period without taking general provisions.

so true. we would have to have time to collect wild "lavender tea" and gather quite a bunch of berries-blueberries and cranberries. willow bark as a temp. remedy for aches and such. spruce pitch for cuts/abrasions, mix in water and boil for congestion etc..,

you would almost have to consider a couple of large pack dogs to aid in your wandering to help get settled. worse comes to worse they'd be food.

there is alot of fine country but it is a tough one for sure. animals move around and you have to be good to excellent to make it work. best to learn how to make snowshoes prior to departure and/or a canoe depending on the time of year.

set up food caches here and there in tress and prepare. sure would be nice to have a coleman lantern them candles get old with what little light. oh well can't be choosy.

anything more to add?

30-06 & 22

quote:

Originally posted by ray m:
I have never known a woodsman who went to the bush for a lengthy period without taking general provisions.A great deal depends on the climate but it's my impression that we've been talking about Alaska.If a man is in the bush of Alaska in the winter time with nothing but rifle and ammo,his survival will be very problematic and certainly uncomfortable.

Certain survival/reality TV shows seem to be inspiring a lot of naive notions.Before I took to the bush,over thirty years ago,I had already had a lot of primitive camping experience but I also read everything on the subject of wilderness living that I could get my hands on.Reading such books does not replace experience by any means but nonetheless,I doubt that I would have made it otherwise.

Even with the knowledge I had,I made a lot of mistakes and every day in the bush was a series of learning curves.

Theoretically,one can make do with nothing but proper clothes,rifle and ammo,axe and knife.However,if I saw a man head off into the bush of Alaska with nothing else,I'd consider the odds to be very much against him.

I consider going into the bush without provisions to be something very unwise.

EXACTLY! Well Said

I saw the movie today...

Liberal in the wild starved to death...

great movie overall though...

hey boomie, living in the sticks like I do means I can't make it to Blockbusters. Is that movie available as a DVD? Am interested in what this person(s)did right or wrong. Can get it tomorrow.

reminds me of 2 individuals that had the same delimma of sorts. Being non-residents they still took up camp some 25 miles up river years back. Could not by law hunt anything big or small depending on the type of game. The two about shot each other and both about died. Troopers came in an said they wont' be back anymore. Go help yourself with there belongings-what little they had. Just a dingy and a small cheap alum. canoe. They would not come here for help-too bad. They could have got help and food.

Tstorm,

Thank you.

with regards,
ray

quote:

Originally posted by grizz007:
hey boomie, living in the sticks like I do means I can't make it to Blockbusters. Is that movie available as a DVD? Am interested in what this person(s)did right or wrong. Can get it tomorrow.

reminds me of 2 individuals that had the same delimma of sorts. Being non-residents they still took up camp some 25 miles up river years back. Could not by law hunt anything big or small depending on the type of game. The two about shot each other and both about died. Troopers came in an said they wont' be back anymore. Go help yourself with there belongings-what little they had. Just a dingy and a small cheap alum. canoe. They would not come here for help-too bad. They could have got help and food.

They must have been hiding from the law
It also says in them game laws, if you need it for survival Kill it & Eat it!

come to think of it, as most "floater" originate from the Chandalar Lake country this would make sense. They even had a mail box hanging out on the river bank-a good one.
Me thinks they hung out till the end and then could not have the will to hunt - no what I mean? Assholes gave up.

I'd take a couple dozen small snares over a 12 ga any day. Setting snares for snowshoe hares is a much better gurantee of getting meat, and frees you up to spend precious time on other bush living endevours.

I'd also agree that going out with some staple foodstuffs is a much better approach than a huge collection of guns. Also I'd give much better odds of surviving on fish vs game meat.

Paul, when ever I head out to I always carry picture wire rolled up, does not matter if I am heading to Fbks. Does not take much space and in need almost a guarantee in getting small game. Good point! My minimum carry anywhere always consist of my 629.

The reason I posted this originally was to see what guns you guys would take into the wilds if you were limited to $500. I think it goes without saying that experience, other provisions, food, attitude, etc. should be included in you bush "gear". The two characters that got me thinking about this had just seen Into the Wilds and were saying that if they had an "AK and a Nine" that's all they would need to live in the bush. I, myself, can think of other things I would rather take into the bush, but we're talking about guns. Hell, I'd rather have a spear (Britney) myself.

Namibiahunter

Chris only took a .22 and did well but them seeds is what did him in it seems. Yep the thread got hijacked no question. I personally would not take a spear.

still a .30-06 and a .22 probably a Marlin papoose of sorts.

I would go with just two rifles. A 22lr either auto or bolt and the best centerfire rifle I could find for my money in 6.5x55, 270, 30/30, 308, 7.63x54, 30-06, 300 WM, 8mm, or 338 WM. It must have iron sights and a scope would be a bonus. Pack in plenty of ammo for the 22lr and at least 3 boxes of ammo for the CF. Probably the cheapest rifle you could get ahold of would be one of the mosin nagant rifles, preferably the shorter one. Use the left over money to get supplies, snares and fishing net are also worth thier weight in gold.

quote:

Originally posted by grizz007:
hey boomie, living in the sticks like I do means I can't make it to Blockbusters. Is that movie available as a DVD? Am interested in what this person(s)did right or wrong. Can get it tomorrow.

reminds me of 2 individuals that had the same delimma of sorts. Being non-residents they still took up camp some 25 miles up river years back. Could not by law hunt anything big or small depending on the type of game. The two about shot each other and both about died. Troopers came in an said they wont' be back anymore. Go help yourself with there belongings-what little they had. Just a dingy and a small cheap alum. canoe. They would not come here for help-too bad. They could have got help and food.

it is in theaters right now so you will have to wait 6 months for the video or get into the city. I would send you a dvd but...

a 22 hornet and thousands of rounds and a light weight 06 with iron sights would be cool.