Kute does not speak for the majority of B.C.er's or Canadians. On most subjects he seems to be quite knowledgable, but when it comes to this topic he "loses it". He has been banned a number of times on other forum(s) due to the loss of his "temper".

That statement is a lie, from a common liar with no history here on AR; it would not surprise me if this "Mikey" is a G/O or a relative or employee of one. "Mikey", you know that you are a LIAR, so, why not try to be a man and tell the truth....I have never said that I ...spoke for the majority, etc..., so, you are full of shit and it is very obvious.Actually, I think that you are a TROLL!!!

The facts are that I participated in Canadian Gun Nutz and was summarily banned from there for daring to argue with a Pakistani immigrant who had said that Canadians don't even know their own fathers; he also made many extremely aggressive and violent anti-American comments with which I took issue. I could have ignored the extreme anti-Americanism, but, since I have many relatives and friends in the U.S.A. and am, generally, quite pro-American, I chose to take issue with this.I frequently spoke out against the extreme bigotry frequently shown on CGN, where the Chinese immigrant who hosts it refers to Caucasians as "white bastards" and thus was banned by a hypocrite.

I was PMed on CGN three times by "Cariboo" who posts here and invited to join his forum, "Huntshoot.com" and eventually did so. I did not participate very often and was silent for about three months, then posted a "tongue in cheek" comment about the violent Indians in B.C., for which he chose to ban me. I got back on that forum some months later as a number of guys had PM'ed me on other forums asking me to do so and "Cariboo" welcomed me back to the forum.

I participated in this forum and was frequently attacked by a certain poster there, who also attacks others due to their being biologists and other resource professionals. He claims to be a "Forest Technician" and consistently slags other people personally for reasons of his own.

After a number of incidents, I asked him to tell me where he graduated from, in Forestry, and a number of other questions relevant to his self-styled "expertise". The use of the term "Forestry Technician" here in B.C. is specifically directed toward graduates of a recognized, post-secondary programme at B.C.I.T. and Selkirk College. Many bush labourers try to pass themselves off as being "FTs", but, they are NOT and Canuck, who is a Registered Professional Forester can verify this, if he chooses.

So, "Cariboo" decided to ban me from his site because he, evidently, will allow this individual to harass others, but, won't allow others to defend themselves in similar terms. It's his site and I really don't care as it was his idea for me to come there and he can rescind the invitation at his pleasure.

I have NEVER been banned from ANY other site, not an American based one or an internationally based one; the comments made are both dishonest and false. This speaks to the character of the poster and his attempt to vilify me is typical of the kind of punk that infests every gun forum I have investigated.If, this liar can provide proof of his allegations, why hasn't he?

I very deliberately post provocative opinions here on Canadian issues as I think that it is beneficial to both Canucks and others to investigate how we all feel about controversial issues. I base my comments on REAL bush experience and some education and am specific as to my background in order to be honest and factual. I will "take my lumps" when my hardline Canadian nationalism irritates others, this is an international forum, after all. BUT, I am NOT going to accept lies and gutter behaviour directed at me and that is that.

There have been a number of questions concerning this issue directed at me and I thank those posters for their courtesy. I have posted everything I currently know on this and am trying to obtain further info. BEFORE going further in terms of political action here; this includes waiting until the B.C.W.F. annual meetings to get a clearer idea of the best route to take in respect of a solution to the current problems.

22wrf, As to your comments concerning B.C. resident outfitters and their "jobs"; the problem is that the B.C. G/Os who are attempting to further restrict resident hunting and cream off the valuable trophys for their clients are NOT B.C. people, as I have stated.

The prevalence of American trophy hunters you refer to has largely been due to several factors; one is that most residents did not hunt Sheep and there used to be lots of game to go around. Also, the Yanks were generally friendly, respectful guys who were not into the spotter planes, radios, camps in protected wilderness areas with flush toilets and all the other crap of the contemporary "outdoorsman" from various foreign lands. These people want BIG trophies for bragging about in the slick hunting magazines that they read and oftimes write for, they are NOT real bush hunters and are resented by locals...even G/O's employees.

Times are changing and a large number of people here strongly oppose high-tech, commercialized hunting by ANYONE. Forty years ago, it was tents, horses, Trapper Nelsons and sweat, now, it's aircraft, quads, guide-lackeys and comfy cabins with satellite phones to call your editor, or, your mommy, and people just don't accept that as worthwhile to we who own the Sheep, Elk and so forth.

Craig Nolan, The $$$$ conponent in this is the "wild card" of course and I have some ideas on how to deal with that, but, one of my major reasons for posting here concerning this issue is to refine those. The B.C. Government can deal with this by legislation, an "Order-in-Council" to eliminate ALL non-resident hunting is easily done, but, there are better and more "hunter-friendly" methods; the potential "draw system" for non-residents AFTER all residents needs are met would be my choice.

The upcoming election you refer to is for the "Feds" who do not really impact on the situation in B.C. concerning resource allocation. Many Canucks will vote Conservative because of the gun issue here, but, the concern about the Conservatives being to close to the Americans, especially "Dubya" is very strong and will tend to influence a Tory government to a considerable degree. Thus, they will not be inclined to mess around with B.C. jurisdiction over resources, a traditional sore point here, anyway.

DPhilips, I take your point and this is one of the major reasons why I have yet to make any public-media statements about this. I do not want the RMEF, SCI, FNAWS or whomever involved in B.C. wildlife issues as they are foreign organizations with very heavy involvement of the Guide/Outfitters and wealthy trophy killers from wherever. These people want to "conserve" B.C. wildlife for themselves and so do I, the difference is that I have a birthright to do so.

Also, organizations such as these and the N.R.A. are a focal point for media and "anti" activity here and their involvement actually works against conservation as they alienate many non-hunters who do not believe in allowing foreign organizations to influence B.C. decisions. This is a place for the B.C.W.F. and it is our right and duty to deal with our situation here in B.C.

I think that further restrictions on or banning of foreign hunters here will strengthen the position of resident hunters and increase our opportunities to harvest our native game. I know a number of the most well-known environmental leaders quite well and they generally accept resident hunting, but, are opposed to non-residents. Of course, that could change......

Muygrande, your poll is really a bit irrelevant as only the B.C.-Canadians here on AR really have any say on this issue, so, you should ask them. However, since I advocate a situation where ordinary Canucks can actually hunt Stone's Sheep, for example, which most of them cannot afford to do now, why wouldn't they agree with me? Ask away, the results are going to be interesting.

AZWriter, so, B.C. looks like New Jersey...jeez, boy, ya gotta lay off the Mescal, it's warping your perceptions! But, since you write for "Petersen's Hunting", I ain't real surprised....the Yukon is next!

I am going to reiterate, IF, you are a non-resident hunter who wants to hunt in B.C., the single, best thing that you can do is to join the B.C.W.F., get involved and make your voice heard, respectfully and courteously. This will do more to advance the cause of non-resident hunting here than all the bullshit about me, Canada, $$$$$, "rights" or anything else.

My feelings on this, I think, are pretty widespread here in B.C., but, are not "set in stone" and I doubt that most other B.C. hunter's opinions are, either. So, serious, personal involvement in a B.C. conservation organization that is not involved with the commercialization of our game is the best possible approach to maintaining or even improving non-res. hunting here.

How can you not respect the zeal, passion and honest feelings expressed. Very well done, my friend.

Now as to this B.C-Canadian poll - where are all those residents who have no Stones on their wall or in their stomachs?

Oh, just for info my outfitter for the N.W.T. trip is a lifetime resident of your beautiful B.C.

I must say that Kutenay's last post does deserve a lot of respect in the sense that he is passionate about his homeland and passionate about wildlife and passionate about his privileges in his homeland. Nothing wrong with that at all.

However, I believe he sometimes reads too much into what other folks, especially "Amurican" folks, have to say.

for example, he says "22wrf, As to your comments concerning B.C. resident outfitters and their "jobs"; the problem is that the B.C. G/Os who are attempting to further restrict resident hunting and cream off the valuable trophys for their clients are NOT B.C. people, as I have stated".

Well, I wasn't talking about G/Os who are "attempting to further restrict resident trophy huning and cream off the valuable trophys for their clients, and whether they were B.C. people or not. All I was stating was that if people who are passionate about this issue (such as Kutenay) go to the government and ask that all foreign hunting be stopped, all outfitters, whether they were born in B.C., or Canada, or elsewhere, will be right there lobbying against banning foreign hunters and their argument will naturally be that they will be losing their livelihood. Thus, a $$$$ against conservation issue.

I don't know how many folks who have grown up in B.C., or in Alberta or the rest of Canada, currently guide or outfit in B.C. But I bet it would be the majority of them and I suppose the only way to find out is to get a list of every licenced outiftter in B.C. and call them and ask.

To restate my views, (and they are only views Kutenay, as I readily admit that I have no right to dictate what goes on in B.C. as I am not a citizen of B.C.)

1. Certainly, B.C. folks, and then other Canuks, should have first crack on their sheep permits before foreign folks.

2. A lot of people rely on the hunting industry to earn their living in B.C. (not just guides and outfitters but hotels, restaurants, sporting stores, and down the line) and a lot of the money comes from foreign sources.

3. That means that with all of the pressure on those beautiful Stone Sheep, the resource should be protected about all else. And if that means giving less permits to foreign folks then so be it.

My arguement is, and always has been, the sheep should come first, and their ranges should be expanded if at all possible.

And yes, I agree 100 percent that it should be absolutely illegal to hunt by the use of helicopters.

Attack, attack, attack. I hope I am not the only one that can see the irony in Kutes banning from some "Canadian" forums.

Call me a liar in one breath and then confirm exactly what I stated in the next. Seems like you "lost" it again Kute.

As far as my post being a lie, someone had asked if You spoke for the majority of Canadians, I stated that I believe you do not.

I have better things to do then read your constant rantings about immigrants, G/Os and Americans.

I do not post much but enjoy the wealth of knowledge on this forum, but it irks me when someone like Kute openly disrespects our neighbours to the south.

Kute, passionate you may be, but take time to think before you jump.

You exaggerated the situation and attempted to denigrate and discredit me instead of posting the actual facts concerning the TWO forums I was banned from and that is a lie. Of course, you use exactly the same rhetoric that your type always does, referring to my posts as ...rants...

IF, you are so concerned about this, why don't you post YOUR location and what YOUR credentials, experience and solutions to B.C.'s current wildlife/environment problems are????? Could it be because you are some snotnosed kid with a loud mouth and NO actual knowledge, I kinda think so.

So, don't read my posts, you are not a credible poster on this issue or anything else and your opinions are as worthless as your attempts to vilify me are phoney.

Kute:

You know there was a bit of hyperbole in that Jersey comment, eh?

Are helicopters legal for hunting in Canada? I know they are in New Zealand; I refused to use one. If you can't walk up the mountain, time to give up hunting.

Actually, you and I might have more in common than you think. I hate quads too.

PS - I have only written twice for Petersen's, but I do know some guys who write for them. That mag is getting better than it used to be. I write because I like to write; I don't do it for a living.

Kute, keep digging.I don't think I need even try and vilify you, you do a fine job of that yourself.

Azwriter, helicopters are legal in NWT and I believe Newfoundland to transport hunters.

Az - As I hire my personal trainer Feb 1 in getting ready for a Sept NWT backpack hunt, I find that I understand "walk the mountain or stay home" a little too much for those who still love to get out and see the world as they mellow into the "golden years"! Certainly for anyone that is handicapped or aged (are they the same in some instances) I do not have a problem in them using a helo. However, a true "trophy hunter" should be ostracized from the fraternity (sorority) by the use of "motorized" "in most cases" transportation. Just my $0.02. Just a long winded way to say that there are always exceptions to any "rule".

quote:

Originally posted by muygrande:
Az - As I hire my personal trainer Feb 1 in getting ready for a Sept NWT backpack hunt, I find that I understand "walk the mountain or stay home" a little too much for those who still love to get out and see the world as they mellow into the "golden years"! Certainly for anyone that is handicapped or aged (are they the same in some instances) I do not have a problem in them using a helo. However, a true "trophy hunter" should be ostracized from the fraternity (sorority) by the use of "motorized" "in most cases" transportation. Just my $0.02. Just a long winded way to say that there are always exceptions to any "rule".

You need to hang out at SCI more if yu believe that.

quote:

The use of the term "Forestry Technician" here in B.C. is specifically directed toward graduates of a recognized, post-secondary programme at B.C.I.T. and Selkirk College. Many bush labourers try to pass themselves off as being "FTs", but, they are NOT and Canuck, who is a Registered Professional Forester can verify this, if he chooses.

Although it is somewhat of a sideline to this thread, I thought I'd take a second to verify that Kutenay's comment above is absolutely true. Professional foresters and forest technicians have their right to practice spelled out in legislation, and are regulated by the Association of BC Forest Professionals. It is technically unlawful to call oneself a professional forester or technician without bona fide credentials and endorsement of the Association. We take this pretty seriously.

Canuck

As a stranger only occasionally reading here, I will tell you that kutenay has provided the best analysis and appears to be well qualified and knowledgeable in this topic. Common sense tells me he is like on target. Regards to you, kutenay. ned

I went to the source and talked to the (former) concession holder. In short, the continuous pressure from environmental groups lead to reduction in his brown bear quota, however, his initial investment (and payments to service that debt) remained the same. He pleaded with GOABC and SCI for support but found none. He didn't see any other way than to sell, or face possible bankruptcy. He hopes this provides a strong signal to the involved organisations/agencies.

Frans

I have heard that the minions of the Wildlife bureaucracy in dear old Victoria, B.C. have been besieged by irate B.C. residents demanding that the changes in allocation of Sheep and other game animals desired by the GOABC, NOT be enacted. The bureaucrats, servants of a "neo-con" government that knows the price of everything, but, the value of nothing with respect to their environmental policies, have heard the word and have postphoned any changes in favour of G/Os and their wealthy foreign clients......the battle goes on and will continue.

At the forthcoming annual meeting of the B.C.W.F., I hope to be able to present the initial proposal to end non-resident, commercial exploitation of B.C. hunting/wildlife and change the entire system to one where any wildlife we may choose to share with foreign hunters is done by a draw system. This would encourage sportsmanlike hunting, rather than the current spotter plane and radio-directed killing of ego-boosting "trophies" in numbers greater than resident demand reasonably allows.

"The times, they are a'changin" and B.C. hunters are getting more active in managing our wildlife and habitat. This can and, I hope, will offset the destructive influence of $$$$ and may even allow at least some opportunity for the average Yank or whomever to hunt here for a price he can afford, instead of having the wealthy pay $30,000 per hunt and thereby restrict Sheep hunting to themselves....that which does not change, is the will to change....

Mikey. I think you head is way up your ass here my friend. Kutes has never shown anti American views but rather pro BC or pro Canadian. There is a big difference. I share these ideas. I am American, living in Canada, for 50+ years.Big money, whether from US or Europe has the ability to distort facts and corrupt. This is true of the 'anti hunting' groups as well as the outfitter/gov't sides.I think there are far too many outfitters,hence too many intrests chasing too little land/concessions/game. The price of concessions is ridiculous. This causes the entire system to be out of wack with reality. Outfitters need the big money to get a return on investment.
I guided for an outfitter in Sk. He got $4000 for a whitetail hunt,was booked solid and couldn't make ends meet. He now raises cattle.
In BC as everywhere else there are people who know how to fix the problem, however, usually the loud clammering of money prevents them from being heard.
Kutes,don't feel too bad about the cgn ban.It's happened to the best of us.Some of the mods there can't blow their nose without the manual.Mark

From what I recall, Kutenay's 'banishment' at CGN was, at least on one occasion, voluntary. (He just stopped posting there)

There has been a long discussion regarding the sheep allocation resident vs non resident on huntshoot, cariboos site.

BTW Good post, Kutes.

quote:

Mickey. I think you head is way up your ass here my friend. Kutes has never shown anti American views but rather pro BC or pro Canadian.

35404

Are you confusing me with someone else? Not sure where I ever said Kutes is anti American.

I think that he is referring to the "Mikey" who took a few shots at me on this thread a week or so ago, not to you. It seems that most of the guys on AR can discuss sensitive issues like men and respect honest feelings, but, there are always going to be the odd "trolls" who simply have to get attention by slagging someone who speaks honestly and bluntly. This is much more common on some other forums I can't be bothered to waste time on than it is here.

BTW, what's up with the citizenship situation...since you were born here, do ya think that the assholes in Oddawa might actually accept you as a Canuck....or do ya have to buy and wear a turban?????

Mickey 1 not you, but close. Sorry for the confusion. Mark

quote:

Originally posted by kutenay:
I think that he is referring to the "Mikey" who took a few shots at me on this thread a week or so ago, not to you. It seems that most of the guys on AR can discuss sensitive issues like men and respect honest feelings, but, there are always going to be the odd "trolls" who simply have to get attention by slagging someone who speaks honestly and bluntly. This is much more common on some other forums I can't be bothered to waste time on than it is here.

BTW, what's up with the citizenship situation...since you were born here, do ya think that the assholes in Oddawa might actually accept you as a Canuck....or do ya have to buy and wear a turban?????

As far as the dual citizenship it looks good. When I turned 18 I had to pick, according to US law at the time, but that has changed.

Canada doesn't seem to care but they aren't very fast either.