I am trying to shoot a very very large resident Mamba that resides in a thicket here where I am working.

I have my .500NE with me and was wondering if I pulled the bullets out of the cartridge, poured some powder out and filled shells with some lead split shot from my fishing box. Then plug the end with wadding and wax could I convert my double to a shot gun?

The confrontation maybe at close range and I doubt that I can hit a dancing and angry serpent with a bullet.

And besides what if I miss?

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
I am trying to shoot a very very large resident Mamba that resides in a thicket here where I am working.

I have my .500NE with me and was wondering if I pulled the bullets out of the cartridge, poured some powder out and filled shells with some lead split shot from my fishing box. Then plug the end with wadding and wax could I convert my double to a shot gun?

The confrontation maybe at close range and I doubt that I can hit a dancing and angry serpent with a bullet.

And besides what if I miss?

I recomend bringing a shotgun and leave the 500 for the big stuff!

I do not access to any other weapon where I am working.

Make sure to put a wad between the powder and the shot, a 1/4 inch piece of cardboard like tha piece from a box will do, put another thin cardboard wad like a piece from the back of a pad of paper over the shot and then use the wax to seal the overshot wad in. Use about 3/4 ounce of shot.

That will work but it will lead barrel pretty fast.

Hopefully I will only use it once. Someone reckons I should fill the cartridge with rice or coarse salt? How much powder (%) would I need to remove? If any?

No Wise Cracks.

Others have said it, place a card between the shot and the powder. We use foam backer rod for cases that have a large volume and it should work fine in this application. So, powder, short piece of backer rod foam or cardboard, shot, card material, wax.

I would not shoot this at a snake the first go. Shoot it at a piece of cardboard at the distance you estimate you will be encountering the snake. If you get a good pattern, repeat the loading and go kill it.

I hear they are fast and deadly. I want to hear that you killed it and not the other way around.

Matt

Obviously there is no shot gun available...I have successfully made "shot shells" for a 458 Lott. All good advice above I was able to crimp the case around the over shot wad then used 2 part epoxy over that wad but wax will do.. As mentioned you may need several pieces cardboard over the powder the amount will be determined by how much space needs to be filled to bring the shot to within 1/4" or 7mm of the top of the case. Good luck let us know how it goes

I used to load 12guage blanks with fast burning pistol powder and rice....it was deadly on snakes to about 20 feet but it took a bit of experimentation to get it to boom instead of poof!

Good tite wads and a good crimp to build pressure....

I would think the powder would be too slow to get much pressure without some resistance....but that's just a wild guess....


Don't get bit! I want to hunt with you someday!


.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
I am trying to shoot a very very large resident Mamba that resides in a thicket here where I am working.

I have my .500NE with me and was wondering if I pulled the bullets out of the cartridge, poured some powder out and filled shells with some lead split shot from my fishing box. Then plug the end with wadding and wax could I convert my double to a shot gun?

The confrontation maybe at close range and I doubt that I can hit a dancing and angry serpent with a bullet.

And besides what if I miss?

All of the advice about building a shot capsule here is correct I've done it. You can remove as much powder as you want I'd take out approximately 1/2 of the powder or so just make sure your bottom wad provides light compression on your powder charge so it will reliably ignite.

In a .44 mag with a shot capsule I use 8grs of powder instead of my normal 20 grs if that is any help.

I wouldn't try rice or salt with a snake as tough and dangerous as a momba you might just piss her off. If you had access to a shot shell with #8 or better #9 I'd scavenge that and use it, the more shot the better. Your range will be short like 10 to 20 feet. Shot fired out of a rifled barrel tends to spread out quickly and disperses badly at any kind of range.

I've killed a pile of rattle snakes with Number 9 shot and capsule out of a .44 mag pistol. Even on big snakes it is devastating. As my buddy in Texas says it puts a snake in park right now!

The other thing you can do is remove powder as necessary drop in a wad of cardboard fill with shot and then crimp the shell closed at the mouth to hold it in

Sir;

I grew up in the rural Southern USA and have been around snakes most of my 71 years. I have also lived in Southern Africa and have seen all the black Mambas that I want to see. What you are contemplating IMO is fool hardy. You need a 12 bore shotgun with shot suitable for what you are wanting to kill. Those black Mambas are not the common garden variety rattlesnakes that we have here in USA. Compared to a rattlesnake they are lighting fast, more aggressive than you can believe and even will go out of their way to attack you.

On one occasion a black Mamba dropped from a tree after my wife and two children we had with us. I do not believe it was an accidental drop as the the snake missed by wife's head by inches. Black Mambas are known to to after the head of people in Africa.

I hope you are within 1/2 hours drive of a hospital that has anti-venom as that is all the time you will have with a Big black Mamba.

Regards;

Transvaal

The thought of all this makes me cringe. Lead shot from your fishing box? Those are probably something like a quarter inch in diameter, right? You need a more dense shot pattern to make sure you actually hit the snake in the head, and a few big pellets will leave big holes in the pattern, especially since the shot column will be spinning. If you have to do this, use smaller shot so you will have a better pattern, and you will be close. Too close. Wow, you must have brass ones. What if you miss? Load more than one shot load, and have a paramedic with you with antivenin. Really, this is a marginal idea.

quote:

Really, this is a marginal idea.

Note I have already hunted this snake with my .22 but chickened out as I felt I was severely disadvantaged.

I am keeping notes about the hunt and will post once I am successful.

I suppose that asking for a video of the hunt is too much? How about the traditional trophy pictures?

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Brooks:
I suppose that asking for a video of the hunt is too much? How about the traditional trophy pictures?

Trophy pictures but no video mate.

Indeed it makes for fine hunting and will post a report later.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
I am trying to shoot a very very large resident Mamba that resides in a thicket here where I am working.

I have my .500NE with me and was wondering if I pulled the bullets out of the cartridge, poured some powder out and filled shells with some lead split shot from my fishing box. Then plug the end with wadding and wax could I convert my double to a shot gun?

The confrontation maybe at close range and I doubt that I can hit a dancing and angry serpent with a bullet.

And besides what if I miss?

You most certainly can do so! I HATE SNAKES....... With a PASSION.. I am scared shitless of Snakes too! All of them!

A couple of years ago I wanted to have in my pocket a couple of "ShotShells" when out hunting, so I started to develop some loads doing that, and had tremendous success with getting it to work. There is one major downside, and that is HEAVY LEADING of the barrel, but normally that takes from 3-5 shotshells fired. Shooting one, will give some leading, but not enough to alter your main big bore load, or bullet. Several firings of shotshells will lead the barrel so heavy that it will alter your velocity by 200 fps, your POI at 50 yds by a few inches. So there is a downside.... And I never found any alternative that would produce the same results... Without the Leading, and I tried EVERYTHING there is to try.

But, you cannot use the same powder that you use with your normal big bore load. I used Unique, 15 grs, wad to hold powder, fill it with shot, cap it off. This with 500 MDM, and 650 grs of #8 Shot..... Not quite the capacity of a 500 NE... But, should be able to do the same thing with ease.

If you do get serious leading... Shoot a couple of standard loads... BULLETS... Cleans it out perfectly..


Here is a short thread from that time....

http://forums.accuratereloadin...043/m/1951051011/p/1

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
I am trying to shoot a very very large resident Mamba that resides in a thicket here where I am working.

I have my .500NE with me and was wondering if I pulled the bullets out of the cartridge, poured some powder out and filled shells with some lead split shot from my fishing box. Then plug the end with wadding and wax could I convert my double to a shot gun?

The confrontation maybe at close range and I doubt that I can hit a dancing and angry serpent with a bullet.

And besides what if I miss?

You most certainly can do so! I HATE SNAKES....... With a PASSION.. I am scared shitless of Snakes too! All of them!

A couple of years ago I wanted to have in my pocket a couple of "ShotShells" when out hunting, so I started to develop some loads doing that, and had tremendous success with getting it to work. There is one major downside, and that is HEAVY LEADING of the barrel, but normally that takes from 3-5 shotshells fired. Shooting one, will give some leading, but not enough to alter your main big bore load, or bullet. Several firings of shotshells will lead the barrel so heavy that it will alter your velocity by 200 fps, your POI at 50 yds by a few inches. So there is a downside.... And I never found any alternative that would produce the same results... Without the Leading, and I tried EVERYTHING there is to try.

But, you cannot use the same powder that you use with your normal big bore load. I used Unique, 15 grs, wad to hold powder, fill it with shot, cap it off. This with 500 MDM, and 650 grs of #8 Shot..... Not quite the capacity of a 500 NE... But, should be able to do the same thing with ease.

If you do get serious leading... Shoot a couple of standard loads... BULLETS... Cleans it out perfectly..


Here is a short thread from that time....

http://forums.accuratereloadin...043/m/1951051011/p/1

Michael

Thanks for that and will let you know when I next enter the dragons den.

I will do some tests and post them here.

Presume I can just extract the bullets using a pair of pliers?

quote:

Thanks for that and will let you know when I next enter the dragons den.

I will do some tests and post them here.

Presume I can just extract the bullets using a pair of pliers?

ROYAL KAFUE LTD
Email - fairgame@iconnect.zm
Tel. (00260) 966 745747

More than welcome... I completely understand your situation, and concur with no compromise when it comes to crawly things with no legs.......

Yes, you can extract bullets with a pair of pliers.

Use a faster handgun powder such as Unique or similar........... Not much of it.. 15 grs.....

I did a rather extensive study on this back then....

Michael

Michael,

I have at my use a .22 and a .500 and cartridges to go with. And a pair of pliers.

It would be very interesting to convert the double to a shotgun for such use.

I am in limbo and working for a large agricultural project and the over sized Mamba is about the only thing keeping my attention at the moment.

Cheers

And by the way if anyone who has a 500 and is willing to do some testing them let me know. My cartridges are limited and at $25 a round here.

Why don't you use the .22 and shoot it in the head, from a safe distance?

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Why don't you use the .22 and shoot it in the head, from a safe distance?

Yep! Me too. Snipe that nasty bastard from 50 yards!

.

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Why don't you use the .22 and shoot it in the head, from a safe distance?

It is a thicket. A messy tangle of trees and grass.

But I hear you and will burn the grass when it is dry.

Anyway back in town for night and see what I can rustle up to help me out. But I am dead keen to convert the 500. to take shot and will be an interesting experiment.

I'd also want a panga hanging from my wrist whilst I tried this.

Best of luck.

Drop me a pm and I will email you a chapter from " the complete reloading guide" on shot shells for rifles. It has a load for a 458 win mag. 500 gns of shot ( about 1oz) over 26gr of 2400 powder ( no powder mfr given). The best results were obtained when the shot was contained in a plastic tube that holds the shoot together and prevents the rifling from spin it apart too quickly.

There is only one 2400; the classic Hercules. Now Alliant. Back to the snake; how about saturating the area with gas and burn it to death? I don't know anything about black mambas but I hate all snakes. Only good thing about living in Iowa is that they only have garter snakes. They say that there are rattlesnakes here but I have never seen one.

Be very careful. That mamba can move faster then you can and don't go alone.

Are you in an area where anti venom is available within a very short time?

I concur with the fire idea.

I would take a long pole say - 10 to 12 feet long and tie a bundle of rag - the size of grape fruit and soak some engine oil and petrol to make a smokey fire. Snakes DO NOT like that.

Or if you wanted to play cowboys and Indians, you shoot flaming arrows!

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:
Michael,

I have at my use a .22 and a .500 and cartridges to go with. And a pair of pliers.

It would be very interesting to convert the double to a shotgun for such use.

I am in limbo and working for a large agricultural project and the over sized Mamba is about the only thing keeping my attention at the moment.

Cheers

I have used some of these Big Bore Shotshells on those creepy crawly things..... Very effective, however it does have its downsides. Leading. One or two shotshells and everything is fine, not enough leading to make a difference, fire a full load before going after elephant or buffalo, and it will be clean as can be, ready to go.

I tried everything I could think of to Keep Effectiveness and to not lead the barrel. If I had a solution that would not lead the barrel... Then it was just not effective. I did tests in several of my cartridges. But I recorded data only on one cartridge that I can find. I did this in 2009. The most effective was to just simply put in the 15/Unique, cardboard wad over the powder, fill the case full of shot, then a cardboard wad over top of the shot to hold it in place. This would lead the barrel, but in all cases it was very effective out to 10 yards.. Effective as in killing what I needed to kill at 10 yards!!!!!! Long way! Most were Extremely Effective at 5 yards. Some were even effective out to 15 yards.....

After trying all the buffers I could think of, and get my hands on, I ended up right back at the beginning with just bare shot against the barrel and live with the leading. Making sure if I fired a few to shoot a few jacketed rounds down the bore to clean it out.

Here is some of the test work just to give you an idea......

Ok, bear in mind he doesn't have any real shotgun shot; he will be using fishing sinkers. As he said in one of his posts. Those large size shot will not give a dense pattern. Not like a #6 shot will. I would chop them up into the size of #6 shot and you will have to get very close. Don't worry about leading your bore; you will only get one chance at this.

I would want to pattern whatever 500NE "shot" load I was going to use, before going after the snake. I'm not scarred of most snakes, but mambas do scare me.

It would probably help that slow powder from the .500 burn better, if you could dump maybe 3 shells worth of .22 powder in with the half load. And cutting the split shot in half will double the chances of a kill. Very scary idea---I like the idea of the 30 yd sniping with the .22 better, for safetys sake.

quote:

Originally posted by Heym SR20:
Drop me a pm and I will email you a chapter from " the complete reloading guide" on shot shells for rifles. It has a load for a 458 win mag. 500 gns of shot ( about 1oz) over 26gr of 2400 powder ( no powder mfr given). The best results were obtained when the shot was contained in a plastic tube that holds the shoot together and prevents the rifling from spin it apart too quickly.

Thanks for the reading. Bloody interesting stuff and if I can figure out what to sleeve the cartridge with then this sounds like the way to go.

Options on shot are rice, ball bearings from bicycles, fine gravel (coarse sand), varying sizes of lead split shot.

Personally are am inclined to go with the coarse sand and sieve the larger granules.

I have not got that many rounds to play with.

Obviously I wil have the .22 along and take the snake at a distance if that is possible.

I am busy this week and try again when I have burnt off some of the grass.

Thanks for the PM's and you chaps certainly know your stuff. As one chap put it - having a couple of shot cartridges in your possession can be the difference between a plump bird dinner or corned beef again.

I wouldn't use sand - do you really want to send an abrasive down your fine barrels and mess up the rifling. Your best bet would be to scrounge / steal / borrow or beg some shotgun shells and canabalise those.

As regards plastic tube, you might get away with using strips of old drinks bottles rolled up or similar - think on a shot cup in a modern shotgun cartridge.

A very elegant solution would be to get some sleeves made up allowing you to shoot 410 cartridges. http://www.gaugemate.com/info/sub-gauge-adapters. But then on 2nd thought in Zambia 410 cartridges are probably harder to find than 500 NE cartridges.

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:

I HATE SNAKES....... With a PASSION.. I am scared shitless of Snakes too! All of them!

Me too!

Having shot probably hundreds of snakes with a rifle and caught those that were not in thickets I would recommend the .22 at a distance for mamba. Either you immobolise or not. They move extremely fast through bush and vines and can go for you. We only ever had one "docile" one that we caught and that was because we saved it from a severe injury - why? Never handled them but used special tongs. for big pythons we used shotgun. but if it comes for you would be nice to have a 12 gauge! If you know it's hole you can pour ammonia or petrol down it and seal it.