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| One of Us |
Have been loading the 22-250 with Hornady 60gr SP for deer culling with excellent results and am wondering if anyone had experience with either the 53 barnes or 60 partition. Would there be significant advantages to either? | ||
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| One of Us |
Forgot to mention the 1-12 twist does a good job on the 60 sp but I am limited to 53 barnes due to length of bullet. | |||
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one of us |
The old saying of "if it's not broke, don't fix it" applies here. Lots of folks have used the 60 grain Hornady SP with the same results as yours. I'd stick to your current formula of success. The other bullets won't offer anything that your current bullet isn't already providing. In the 90s, I met a market hunter on one of of the larger exotic ranches, and all he ever used was the Hornady 60 grain SP in a battered .225 Win bolt rifle. He had it fitted with a 22" varmint taper Shilen barrel along with an older Leupold 6x scope. He fed his family and made a living with that rig, and he told me the 60 grain Hornady Spire Point was "the best bullet" he ever used. Bobby Μολὼν λαβέ The most important thing in life is not what we do but how and why we do it. - Nana Mouskouri | |||
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One of Us |
I am assuming you are culling deer with head shots if you are using a 22-250. If that is the case, the last I checked the deer do not wear kevlar helmets and I don't really see bullet choice impacting the ability of the 22-250 to kill a deer with a head shot. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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One of Us |
Glen, I see that you are the Glen in Texas, not the one in the Carolinas!!!! I shot a mule deer with a 22-250 using the Barnes 53 grain bullet about 5-7 years ago. It's kind of a funny story about how it all went down. I was hunting with our youngest son and we spooked a deer that took off running and both of us had to move to get a shot at him. I was using my 22-250 and my son was using a .270. When he broke out in the open going uphill my son shot at him and missed and I took at shot and rolled him. I lazered the distances and it was 345 yards. My son told me that was the luckiest shot he had ever seen to which I replied it was pure skill!!! (I think he was right) As we were walking up the hill to get him we heard shots coming from way over the hill and decided to duck down behind some sagebrush. In a minute another buck came running at us and looking back over his shoulder. He kept on coming and coming and finally my son shot him in the chest at about 70 yards. When we got up to the deer they were about 35 yards apart!!! An crude autopsy in the field showed that the Barnes .224 bullet had penetrated all the way through both sides of the chest cavity and was not recovered. I found the accuracy to be little less than the Nosler BT's that I had been using but still very acceptable. I have since used only the Nosler BT's in the 22-250 and .223 for deer with great success. I would recommend that Barnes 53 g. if you are looking for a change. Served me well. | |||
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| One of Us |
I use the 60g Partition in a 220 Swift. Generally I get complete pass thrus on heart/lung shot deer and medium sized hogs. The benefit of the Par is you don't have to head shoot them to get good results. When I first loaded the 60g, I had to test it. I waited for a doe to directly face me and shot her so the bullet would stay in her body. Got a/b 30" of penetration and the little slug looked like its bigger brethren. | |||
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| one of us |
A regular old 22LR is used to cleanly Kill Cattle, Horses and Hogs every day of the year. The point being it doesn't take any kind of special Bullet to do the same with Deer. There is a problem associated with Head Shots which was recently argued about in this thread. The next problem is your relative proximity to the Game. If you are up high enough, they can walk straight under you and ANY Jacketed 0.224" Bullet will work " IF " you actually hit the relatively small, Brain which is complicated by unpredictable Head Movement. ----- So, the Deer is off aways and the focus shifts to the Shoulder/Leg. The best thing is to get a through-and-through shot with a nice Exit. Some folks believe if you slow a Bullet down the Penetration Increases, and some believe the exact opposite. Both sides often site an example or two, but enough information is left out to make the info useless. We all know Exits are better than no Exits, or at least we all should. And the best way to get them in a marginal to inadequate Cartridge is to use the Super-Duper, Ultra-Premium Bullet. Only problem there, is that we know from Page 4 of this thread, that even using the most Super-Duper, Ultra-Premium Bullet, you do not always get Exits with a 22cal on a Larger Deer. It does seem the 22cals are well suited for the 50# Class Deer that some people Hunt though. ----- Head Shots are a Bad concept which indiocates a Rookie mentality. Using Inadequate Cartridges is the exact same. Good Hunting and clean 1-shot Kills. | |||
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And there you have it folks. The final edict! | |||
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HC, I generally don't try to get into it with others here. You are also +/ 5 months my senior on this forum (under the iteration Geedubya, Sept. '01). I was raised to respect my elders. However, I'm about to decide you are a real asswipe. GWB | |||
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Geedubya- Many of us have concluded the same thing about HC. In fact, I'd pretty much say it's unanimous...  Bobby Μολὼν λαβέ The most important thing in life is not what we do but how and why we do it. - Nana Mouskouri | |||
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| One of Us |
Interesting experience with the Partitions there. I used to use them in a hot loaded .270 with 130 grainers but started to see too many "pencil" through hits with little immediate effect. I once shot a nice large 3x3 mule deer with that 270 at about 190-220 yards off a nice solid rest and saw all kinds of rocks go flying on the opposite side. He did a 180* turn and I hit him again in the same place, ribs. Off he went running down into a timber patch and a final shot at about 25 yards did him in. All three shots were in a dinner-plate sized area in the ribs/lungs. I've left them behind due to this feature. Have you had any similar experiences with your 220 Swift????? | |||
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Not disputing your experience, but mine have been totally opposite. I have recovered partitions in 22, 25, 26, 27, 28, 30 and 33 cals from deer, hogs, nilgai and elk. Their front cores are gone, but the rears all look pretty much the same. The 25 is from a WT doe I shot head on. The bullet struck her where her neck meets the chest. I spent a good deal of time trying to find the bullet when I field dressed her to no avail. That slug was recovered b/w the muscle and hide in her ham. The 27 came out of a broadside shot hog AFTER in had centered a 6 inch mesquite tree on the way. They work well for me. | |||
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The ability for a 22-250 to take a deer with a heart and lung shot was never the question. Although not all the Hornady 60's exited, they were a DRT. Heart & lungs mush. I guess I would like more guaranteed penetration but hate to run the risk of these hard bullets failing to expand at these speeds unless they hit bone or heavy muscle. | |||
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| one of us |
So GW, all you have to offer is insults. I can understand that from tomekee who doesn't even know enough to properly string a recurve, but I somehow figured you above the tomekee level - obviously I was wrong. You got yourself so worked-up that you neglected to mention "which" part of my post brought on your insults. Would it be Head Shots indicate a Rookie? 22LRs don't Kill Cattle, Horses and Hogs each day, so up-close ANY 22cal jacketed Bullet will work? That 22cals don't ALWAYS provide Exits on Shoulder/Leg shots? That a 22cal can't Kill a 50# Deer? You got ANYTHING that will convince anyone that Head Shots on an unpredictable, constantly moving Deer Head is really a great idea and does not indicate the person using them is a Rookie? | |||
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The most reliable way to head shoot deer is whistle them to attention and hold just under the chin if it's looking towards you or at the base of the neck if it's looking away. Side-on is dicey. Carry on, gentlemen. | |||
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HC, two thoughts and I'm done. 1 No getting worked up on this end. Just making an observation. Kinda like the guy who got stopped by a cop on the highway. The cop strolls up and tells them man he stopped him for speeding. While writing the driver a ticket flies keep buzzing around him and he swats at them The driver remarks that those kind of flies are usually found in a stable buzzing around horses asses. The cop gets hot and says "are you calling me an asshole"? The driver says, no sir, I'd never do that, I'm just making an observation, but it is kinda hard to fool those flies. 2. I learned long ago to never argue with an idiot, as he knows he's always right. Best GWB | |||
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Hey GW, I'm beginning to understand you really have nothing "positive" to offer. And it is apparent you have no idea how to conduct a discussion when someone posts ANYTHING opposite of your thoughts. Tell you what I'll do, when you get your own web site set-up and everyone is in total agreement with you, I'll not bother to post an opposing view. Until then, thinking Head Shots on Whitetail Deer are a good idea, is a true indicator of a Rookie. | |||
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HC, I'm sure you're right (see #2 above). Best GWB | |||
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| One of Us |
That's interesting. It seems like I took about 4-5 deer and an elk with my .270 using Nosler Paritions and none of them remained in the animal. They all seemed to be broadside targets and I think that they were all shot in the ribs. Never found a one and always wanted to see how they performed. | |||
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| One of Us |
Glen, Did you have an experience that leads you to think there is something better, or do you just want to try it? If it's not broke....but here is my experience. My son and I have used the 53gr TSX on deer and antelope in western SD. All kinds of shot angles and presentations. A good shot is a good shot. The ranges have been from 30-350 yards and everything in between. I am not much into critter counting but easily over three dozen maybe even four. While not a huge scientific sampling, it is one heck of lot better than most examples cited on these boards. I have never recovered one TSX bullet and I process all my own animals. Penetration is fantastic, all complete pass throughs. A few pretty severe quartering to/away angles. I don't think I ever had one fail to expand from what I have personally witnessed. This is being shot out of a 22-250 with 1:14 twist @ approx 3850fps. If you want try them, you will not be disappointed. Are they going to give you an advantage over the 60gr SP? I can not answer that, as I have no experience with the Hornady's or the NP's. | |||
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| One of Us |
Heck, this thread has piqued my curosity. I think I'll go to the range tomorrow and shoot some 45 gr. TSX's out of an ol' 22-250 I picked up along the way. I'm going to my lease next weekend. I'll see if I can't shoot a hog in the head to see what happens. May even shoot him end to end (Texas Heart shot anyone) I'll report back one way or the other. GWB   | |||
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I have some 45gr TSX on the shelf, just haven't had the time to get to the range. | |||
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| One of Us |
Glen, I did the milk jug test on the 60gr Nosler partitions. Lined up 10 1 gallon jugs full of water, and shot it point blank with the 60gr part out of my 16" bbl .223. Found it in the 9th jug. I'm not big on small calibers for deer, but I'd feel pretty comfortable with that on whitetails. I also have the 53gr TSX on the shelf, but after testing the 60gr partition, I quit looking for a new load. | |||
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| one of us |
AND...last time I checked the 2nds versions of the 60 grain Partitions were on sale. Woohoo. Larry "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading" -- Thomas Jefferson | |||
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| one of us |
The 60 Hornady's are proven, and the 60 NP's are almost certain to work fine as well. I still have a few of the old 60 grain Nosler Solid Base that I load for my grandson's .223. He took two nice bucks with that load last fall, both of which fell to a single shot. I use a supply that I've squirreled away of the old Nosler SB's in .243 (100 gr), .270 (130 gr.), .308 (150 gr.), and .30-06 (165 gr). They kill deer and hogs as efficiently as any bullet I've ever seen. My theory is that Nosler quit making them because they worked as well as their Partitions at less than half the price. | |||
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| One of Us |
I like the 53gr TSX. My daughter shot a 140lb. doe through the shoulders and we dug the bullet outta the ash tree behind it. It had opened nicely in the animal (tissue under the petals) and still looked almost like the add even after sinking 4" into the tree. The deer fell with the browse still in her mouth. That was @ 70 yards. | |||
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In 12",the 53X is King. End of story. | |||
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| One of Us |
a 53 grain Barnes won't need a fast MV to take down a blacktail at under a 150 yds... I could list a load, but then that would start another long thread full of bilateral insults back and forth... I'll just say MV was about 2500 fps...deer was a little over 125 yds or so... shooter was a young gal around 10 yrs old at the time...caliber was a 22.250.. | |||
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| One of Us |
Nosler has the 22 Partition blems on clearance. A bargain IMO. http://www.shootersproshop.com...=8&s=393&t=Partition | |||
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| new member |
The 60s do not shoot very good in my gun. I started using the TSX 45 gr after I read about the 53 problems in others, and the Trophy Bonded Bear Claw got too hard to find. (I think I bought the last three boxes left for sale in 2008 and still have them as a fall back.) I load with 35.0 gr IMR 3031. Last season a 300 pound boar was trailing some sows and came to my feeder at 110 yards. We shoot hogs any time we can. I thought I'd shoot this one because he was so big. But at the same time I didn't want to mess with moving him so I tried to hit him a little far back. He was quartering away. The bullet hit mid body and exited the left sie fo the scull. He fell in his tracks. My plan failed, I had to tie on to him and get him out of there. Long story short, I use the 45 gr Barnes TSX and don't look back. | |||
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One of Us |
I'm currently trying to work up a deer/antelope load for my .22-250 with 45 gr TSX bullets. So far, there's plenty of velocity, but not the accuracy that I want. I used to use 180 gr Partitions in my .30 Gibbs for elk and moose. They chronographed 2990 fps, and with "behind the shoulder" shots, I would usually find the back half of the bullet just under the skin of the opposite shoulder. Here's some 180 gr Partitions that I recovered from six bull elk.  NRA Endowment Life Member | |||
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One of Us |
Hornady's website describes the 60gr SP as having "Explosive expansion, even at low velocities" Did you find them too soft? | |||
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One of Us |
Try backing them off the lands further than you would for cup & core bullets - seems to work for more than a few people. | |||
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| one of us |
weve done pentration tests with the partitions and the barnes 223 bullets using both the 223 and 22250 and the partitions are the ones to use. They usually end up (if you recover them) being a perfect little mushroom and the deer and pigs ive seen shot with them died real quick. the barnes bullet in 223 just isnt a reliable expander. In most cases if it opens at all its marginal and personaly i wouldnt take it into the hunting woods. Hands down probably the best bullet a guy with a centerfire 22 on deer sized game is the partition and its also what i consider the best bullet to load in my ar to protect my family. | |||
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| one of us |
I have some 70gr bullets loaded for deer. But some States does not allow 22 caliber. I'm from a state that you have to use a shotgun. | |||
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| One of Us |
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