Charles Newton. From Kohlbacher's Comments (1957)
"Mr. Newton was perhaps one of the greatest experimenters of all times. His own personal gun room, contained over 400 rifles. There was every conceivablecal. from .22 to .600 and up to 4 bore-besides the many conversions which he engaged in almost constantly, in quest of performance." He
spent a forune on research & development. I once had a collection of cartridges obtained from Newton-it appeared there was no cartridge ever put on the market that he did not attempt to improve on (including American, British & German makes) The average wildcatter or experimenter or experimenter may in the course of a lifetime develop 3 or 4 or a half dozen wildcat cartridges and have guns to take them. But Newton had hundreds of them...He was a Genius." This is quoted from Bruce Jennings Book: "Charles Newton: Father of High Velocity".
He gets my vote. I was friend of Bruce who hammered Newton stuff into me, I was a willing diciple. I happened onto Newton fairly late, I think I was in my late 50's. But I knew of his Legend. Then I traded a rifle for my first Newton Rifle, and met Bruce Jennings at his invitation to see his collection...I was, as is said "hooked". The more I learned, the more I became appreciative. You can't very well appreciate being ignorant, can you. And in things Newton, I was sure ignorant.
I appreciate Bruce teaching me & basically edifying me in Newton, his cartridges, and his rifles. He told me once. Wayne Van Swoll once visited him for info before he wrote about Newton, plus other gun writers would consult him before taking up the pen...
Anyway, I mention this only to present my attitude on the subject: I post on this AR Forum only to edify, to be positive and share information...I like to pass on what I have learned from the former top expert on Newton, my former friend, Bruce Jennings, He made me a convert...and I hope to make others so to carry the torch, so to speak. Charles Newton was an American Great...and his Legacy should go on...it doesn't need historical value to do so, only the credit it deserves.
For instance, as far as Newton Cartridges...the .256 Newton is great, on a near par with the .65-06, perhaps better in some respects. The .30 Newton outdoes my .300 Weatherby, the .35 Newton is oh so much like the .358 Norma Magnum (but without a belt)...etc. etc. His designs can stand up to anything modern...you may get more performance (slightly) say from a Lazzeroni...but not from an equal capacity case..read "efficiency". My .280 Newton is very much a 7mmSTW..and on & on...but I present my case, not only as a Newton Aficianado...but to afford good info, to lets say "edify"...the way I learned the good stuff!
Aloha All,
Tom

Amen!!!

Now that it appears we will have new Newton headstamped brass, it may bery well be time to take a serious look at the Newton line, specifically a 35 Newton. I have been threatening a 35 Whelen for about twenty yeras now, this may be the time to step that notion up about one or two power levels. Got any 35 Newton loading data you would consider sharing? I currently own a beautiful bore good overall condition 256Newton.

Rich

i think the 35 newton is 4th in line for me...i got 3 more rifles and projects ahead of it. jamison is the coolest!

question is do i need ( ) a matching 30 and 400 newton to go with it

hey...if rip and master rifleman was here we'd have most of the no belt club here

and to quote alan warner...

"It is my opinion that, in most cases a belt is a waste of time. The Englishman who started it all should be dug up and slapped."

Alan

maybe all the anti belts should have a tagline...how bout "belts are for those who dont have shoulders"

Newton was certainly outstanding in his field. The .375 Ruger Wildcats will be better than Newton stuff though, except in the nostalgia department.

the whole "no belt gang" is here

the rugercats will be better but the 35 newton will be enough and no need to form brass. that is an advantage to some.

I have felt [for many years] Newton cartridges would have gone a long ways had he had the powders available to us nowdays! I had Darrell Davenport [Hawaii] make a Jap 6.5 into a 256 for me in the 50s and it STILL SHOOTS! Very underestimated person/cartridges. A friend of mine over on the Eastern Side shoots a 30 Newton and has for many years. No Elk is safe from Dan. Too bad NRA politics got in the way of a great developer. I feel that both he AND P.O. are in the Hall of Fame for wildcatters for good reason.

Aloha, Mark

norma 204 and MRP powder is the ticket there ,iam sure . The relaoder 22 and 25 thats what they called in the states.

Hi: I don't shoot the .35 Newton, so can't give 1st hand experience of loading it...but P.O. Ackley's "Handbook for Shooters & Reloaders" has it listed...and the .358 Norma Magnum, .35 Ackley Magnum data should be interchangeable. Ackley lists
81 gr. IMR 4350 for 2800 fps (250 gr) bullet, but also says the factory load was 3,000 fps with the 250 gr. bullet. Then the .35 Belted Newton is listed at 3,000 fps with 75 gr. 4350 (250 gr bullet). Phil Sharpe in his "Complete Guide to Handloading" says "The .35 Newton is an unusally powerful brute of a cartridge, comparing at the muzzle with the English .450 Cordite Elephant Rifle. Also the American White Hunter, Charles Cottar used it on Rhino & said:
"The bullet raked the body the entire length, coming out the chest. It was an old Rhino and speedily became a good one."The old Speer Manual lists 77 gr of 4320 for 2940 fps. (250 gr bullet). I would try 4320 or 4350. The thing to remember...even though a big case, also has a big bore, so is not awfully overbore & real slow powders are not indicated. The H4831, and maybe even 4350 may be a bit slow. When you load for the .30 Newton, then you are more overbore & would use slower burning rate powders. Phil Sharpe show the old powders of 15 & 1/2 (77 gr)
giving the highest velocity. This powder was replaced by 4064. The Phil Sharpe says: "As much as 75 gr. of 4350 behind the 275 gr bullet has been used, but we don't recommend it. Work up from 65 gr. to suit your rifle and play it safe. This is no chuck rifle!" Then he lists
70 gr. of 4064 behind a 250 gr. bullet. But I think 4064 a tad fast, would try 4320 & 4350...but not slower than 4350. Anyhoo, that's the info I can afford. Talking to you guys makes me want a .35 newton! I have everyone but that one, from .22-.416. I'd rather shoot a 250 gr. .358 bullet at 3,000fps than any .375. This will give me about 5,000 ft lbs energy, flat trajectory...all I'd ever need. If I want more, I'd jump to my .416 Newton which is alike the great .416 Taylor, sans belt.
Aloha, All
Tom

Idaho Sharpshooter: I don't mean to make you jealous...but from my friendship of Bruce Jennings, he provided me with a mint .256 Newton barrel that had never been mounted on a rifle! Barrel unfired as as new as the day made, except made in 1918! Don't know where he latched on to that one, but I gladly took it off his hands & replaced the ,256 Newton barrel with it. Its accounted for 2 nice Antelope & a heavy Mulie. It was Chas Newton's favorite cartridge, and I can see why. The 6.5s have never been popular here, although well liked in Europe & Scandanavia. P.O. Ackley called the .256 Newton one of the finest in its class. yes indeed. It was said experienced riflemen of the day, preferred it to either the .257 Roberts or .270 Winchester. I load mine upt to 3115 fps with a 129 gr. Hornady Bullet & it's just fine.
Best Regards,
Tom

boom stick: I have a friend, Newton fan who has:
a .22 Newton, .256 Newton, .280 Newton, .30 Newton,.33 Newton, .35 Newton, and .40 newton!
He got me interested enough & I perused the old books...after Newton made his .40 Newton, so did Neidner, Gebby and a host of others...calling it by their names...but were all the same as the same .40 Newton or .400 Newton as sometimes called. The .33 Newton is very much a .338 WinMag. I think only one was made. The .30 Newton is a good one, also the .280 Newton (I'm still experimenting with that one!) The .30 Newton is the parent of the .280, .35 & .40...all just necked up or down. I think the .35 Newton is probably the most efficient, best design of the offshoots of the .30 Newton case.
My .416 Newton I haven't had experience with as still waiting for my custom dies.
Oh, well, I'll probably get a .35 Newton built...then I'll have almost the complete array of Newton cartridges made for his rifles (I can't count the Savage Hi-power, .22-250 (he made the first one), the .250-3000 Savage, and unknown to most..designed the .25-06. To stir up more controversy...Neidner said old Chas had very much to do with the design of the venerable .30-06 when he was a reservist at the Armory that developed it. His other cartridges look very much like the '06 design, albeit fatter.
Did I ever mention I like Newton?! And shooting todays Pronghorns & Mulies with rifle made in 1918?
Best Regards,
Tom

In other words, a factory should reproduce the newton line ditch the rest of belt magnums? I think that would be cool to see and try some classics that would give the german cartridges a competition.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
the whole "no belt gang" is here

You forgot me!!

quote:

Originally posted by .366torque:

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
the whole "no belt gang" is here

You forgot me!!

sorry about that torque

thanks for the tagline...

i'll be second.

I've got a .35 Newton rifle and mine likes H414, RL19, & H4350 with the 250 gr. and heavier bullets. Although H414 gave excellent accuracy, it did not deliver the velocities Newton claimed and the latter two powders were used with 250 & 270 gr. bullets to reach 2900+ fps, which was where I stopped due to recoil. More load development will be done to see if I can safely reach Newton's claim of 2950 fps with a 250 gr. bullet, which I believe is obtainable in my rifle. This is a great cartridge, very powerful, in fact, probably overly powerful for anything but the largest North American game.

Very informative post. i was wondering if any of you guys that have these newtons could post some pics of them. I would realy like to see them compared to something like a 30-06 case. Thanks Karry

White Bison,

you are just a D-O-G dude!!

Mine still shoots right at or just under an inch!
And, mine is still original, unmessed with...yours now goes into modified class.



best regards,

Rich

Idaho Sharpshooter...You are right..but mine is original in the respect all the same except "cosmetic" improvements. New copied stock with precise bedding & new wood, new barrel, repolished & reblued. Hey the Antelope don't seem to notice...they drop like lightning struck them.
My .256 is probably better than the new rifle from Newton as better wood, etc. were upgrades
offered and were not very common.
I, too like oiginal rifles...but if the years haven't done them justice,like some 88 years
old, and all design kept the same...I would rather have the rifle spiffied up & looking great for another 100 years! Newton offered a lot of options too...rubber recoil pads, cheekpiece stock, higher grade wood. I've even seen a couple with nice factory engraving.
And Newton himself mentioned the flats on the receiver were just right for scope bases.
As long as the original design is the same, I like having the guns look new.
I'll probably use my .30 Newton on Elk this year.
Good chatting with you, you are obviously (like Straw Boss) a man of discriminating, keen
taste.
Aloha,
Tom