Is there a big advantage to either one of these? I was looking to have a commercial mauser (charles daly) built in a 338-06AI by the 'smith I usualy deal with with and he was telling me I should consider a 338-284 over the 338-06AI. I do not mind fireformomng brass, kind of enjoy it actually, so I was leaning towards the 338-06AI.

Any opinions?

Thanks!

the 338-284 will have more case capacity when the bullets are loaded out long.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
the 338-284 will have more case capacity when the bullets are loaded out long.

Boom

I respectfully disagree. The 06 Improved case has about 5% greater capacity than the 284. The straight 06 and 284 are about equal in capacity. If you seat a bullet to the maximum magazine length it will only use about 1/2 of the 284 neck whereas it will use the entire 06 neck. At worst it will be a wash and at best it would favor the 06 Impr.

Ray

My approach back when I was a Wildcatter was to use the 338/284 in a Savage M-99 or win. 88 and to use the 338/06 IMP in the bolt guns..

That only makes since to me as the .284 case has a recessed head and that is not very compatible with 100% feeding...30-06 brass is more available and always will be.

I agree with Ray. I've also never been happy with the 284 rebated rim.

I shoot my own 340PDK it is a blown out shoulder forward 280 case. In 338 it gives me right at 10% gain over the 338-06 that is a touch more than the 338Gibbs. I have also owned an 338-06AI. I would build a 338-06 any marginal gain the 284 case or the AI case will give you is very small. If you want to magimize on the 06 bolt face consider the 338Gibbs, hawk or Howell. In the 06 family at egual pressure you are at best going to see 1% velocity for 4% powder gain. The AI is 4% so figure 25-35fps. Load the std to 65,000 like the 270 and be done with it.

I've never really seen the advantage of the AI how often would you need to fire factory??

hmmmm...from my understanding i thought the 284 loaded out had the edge but i wont defend a wrong answer...

i know where there will be 284 basic brass up to 68 mm rebated and unrebated...make up your own wildcats everyone!

depends about 99% on action length, IMHO. The 284 is a 51-52mm case, like almost 1/2" shorter than the old'06. Sooo, that tells me that the 338 bullets have to take up more case room. IIRC, 98 Mausers, ie 8x57mms, have a 3.35" box length.
As far as the rebated rim controversy, are all those people in the service teams shooting the 6.5-284 able to make the case work, but nobody else out in the civilian ranks?

Rich
DRSS

quote:

hmmmm...from my understanding i thought the 284 loaded out had the edge but i wont defend a wrong answer...

I don't have data on a 338-284. But looking at the 284 & 7mm-06 the 284 has a 1 gr advantage. The AI will move it back to the 338-06AI. In a 06 length magazine with the bullet seated out the advantage will go back to the 284. I'm not interested enough to try and measure it. But, if you assume a 1 for 4 I seriously doubt you can see any difference either way.

Rich, I have not doubt that the 6.5-284 can be made to feed. Is a push feed better or easier??? I have no clue. I've only played with a 284 in a MKX. It was not a drop in and feed great. The 06 based cases are. I'm lazy and see no advantage that "I'M" interested in that would make me want to deal with making it work.

I have a solid piolet PTG 338-06AI reamer and headspace gauge for sale. 338-06Ai it a really cool looking round. Mine feeds like butter with no mods from a Rem 700.

Blueprinted- How much for the reamer?

Back in the early 90's I built 3 338X284 in short actions. My intent was to use the 180gr ballistic tip and push it out of a 22" rifle barrel at 2800fps. Got the 2800 plus with H4831 but the bullet was not up to snuff. Bigger bullets in short actions did not work because it took to much powder area seating the bullets to fit the magazine. Since that time I have completely gun into the 338X06 cartridges from the basic through the Gibbs. All are in handguns except for one 24" Van Horn .338Gibbs.
The 180gr Accubond in my version of the Gibbs has been tested by several across the country at 2830 Average FPS from 16.5" handgun barrels.
3100+fps from the 24" barrel. The step up from the basic .338X06 to the Ackley Improved as previously stated did not gain much because pressures required to gain much usually caused case failures( primer pocket) after only a few reloadings. Very much like the .338X06JDJ with upper limit loads will not hold a primer after 2-3 loadings. I over came the primer pocket problem by going to RWS brass and I am at 10 reloadings without problems.

To come full circle now I will be chambering my Strikers for both the ,338X284 and the .375X284
so that my wife can feel a bit safer with the Magazines extra rounds. That 180gr Accubond is an incredible bullet which is why I feel good going back to the .338 X 284.I have used the .284 case since it came out and have had one feeding problem, not an extraction problem.

With the lighter weight bullets either cartridge is fine. Bigger bullets in my opinion
require the 06 case improvements to get the most bang for the buck. When building the .284 whatever have the gunsmith throat for the size of bullet you intend to use. The magazine determines the length in my Striker. On the single shot Encore handgun, the bullet used determines how deep I cut the throat.

For what its worth
Neal

Seems to me Browning,Ruger and ULA all came up with a way to get the 284 case to feel in thier bolt action rifles. I've got a Mike Bryant build 284 on a Win action and it feeds just fine.

I had a 338-270AI moved the shoulders alittle forward to get alittle more case capacity. I just didn't get along with that caliber for some reason and at some point you can get what I call diminished return (velocity) on some wildcats.

I'd sure talk to your gunsmith about why he figures the 338-284 is better than using the 06AI case might be the extra case capacity doesn't work. Well good luck

why not use the .280 rem case its a bit longer than an '06 should have more room.

the Marines are shooting the 6.5-284/142 Sierra load in their M14's...how can that work? 10 rounds downrange in 60 seconds including a magazine change and in the 20" ten ring at 1000 yards. Most with high X-count (10" center) at that distance. IMHO, individual barrels will show more velocity difference than you can find between the cartridges in muzzle velocity.

Build what you like and go-happy!

Rich
DRSS

I had a 338-06 Imp. for while. It had a short neck and very little taper. Extremely good round, near 338 factory speed, extra rounds in the mag. Might as well improve it as you're not likely to forget your handloads and shoot into town to pick up some factory.

The best of the lot was my old 338/9.3x64 but when it comes down to it, the .338 Winchester factory round is the hands down winner, all things considered...It is about as good as it gets...I ran the gauntlet on the .338 wildcats many moons past, and finally settled on the factory round.

I have a 338-284 built on a Savage 99CD and a 338-06 built on a Husqvarna 9000. I like both cartridges, but would ALWAYS build a 338-06 on a long action bolt gun. If I was going to build a short action .338" bore rifle in 2007, I would probably opt for the 338 Federal, as the performance out to 300+/- yards wouldn't be much different than the 338-284 and it would have the advantage of being a factory production cartridge.

I'm using 210 grain Partitions in both the 338-284 and 338-06.

Jeff

I favour the 284! Since I'm a .375 kind of guy, the 375X284 in a Czech milsurp Mauser feeds perfect.

Winchester stopped selling the Silvertip bullets eons ago. When I was aware of it, I bought all the 300 Grain I could by visiting the Gun Shops wherever I went. The chamber has a long throat, thats why I seat the bullet to the first cannelure!