Alright you shoulder cannon lovers--why hasn't anyone posted on the 2 bore that was featured in the latest edition of the Double Gun Journal? Just curious! Where have all the real men gone?

[ 07-01-2003, 05:41: Message edited by: ACRecurve ]

Ah, Yes, the 2 bore...

I can't make up my mind to shoot it, or sleep in it!!

jeffe

What! where?
I'm not sure if I can get that journal here- can anyone scan or send it, or post some info?

regards,
Karl

Great magazine.Published a 100 miles NW of me
here in MI.Never could afford it.It has great stuff for big bore double lovers.Magazine is great
quality and expensive.Ed.

2 Bore?? What calibre whould that be? derf

Derf,
Around 1.35".
Ed,
Did you get my mail about your cartridge cases?

Karl.

If I owned a 2 bore I would have so many gaps to fill in my collection as I like to step rifles up by 100 gr of bullet weight. It is an expensive bloody process. I have enough gaps to fill between .585 & .416

I doubt that anyone who has fired a 2 bore would have enough neurons left to post about it.

ah come on dan is that any way to talk to one of your friends

i had a 2 bore and fired it many times i loved that rifle but with a 700 nitro double rifle coming i had no use for the 2 bore.

the bore dia was 1.314
i used a 1.300 ball and a 18 thou patch and a half inch think felt wad between the ball and powder i used a charge of 550 grns of fg black powder.

I recently had a chance to handle a massive 25 lb. falling block rifle in 4 bore. The owner had it custom built 20 years ago or more, and it was designed to handle full-power smokeless loads. He has pushed 2200 grain conicals as fast as 1800 fps. He will readily admit that recoil at those levels is absolutely brutal -- and this guy shoots ground squirrels with a 600 Nitro.

The owner is a friend of John Ross, (author of unintended Consequences,) who had a similar rifle built in 2 bore. I'm not sure what the 2 bore weighed, but they stopped at 1750 fps with a roundball (that was cast hard and weighed somewhat less than half a pound.) John Ross wanted to try for 2000 fps, but this gentleman convinced him that they were at a point where the rifle had the potential to do serious physical damage. He is convinced it could kill a shooter who hadn't worked up to those loads and learned how to shoot it.

Double Gun Journal can usually be found at Hastings or Barnes and Noble bookstores with the periodicals. Cost is $12 to $15--don't remember for sure. Annual subscription cost in the US is about $37 for 4 quarterly issues. It is always very well done but it makes me lust after guns that cost more than I make in a year!

Good Hunting,

An old gunsmith friend of mine,Chet Parnell of Tenino WA had a nice 2Ga. It had a nice yoke on it to mount it to the bow of a boat. That would be the only way I would shoot a 2 bore.
Fuzz

I was talking with an old timmer at the Gun corral the other day. He built a muzzle loader from a 40mm barrel. He said they were shooting 5000gn + bullets in it. He showed me the blood stain in his ear muffs from the last time he shot it.
I think he was serious

Now when I have understand that there is no gun that can knock down or stopp a animal. Then the 2-bore is just nothing for big game. A .600 OK will make a bigger wound channel with expanding bullets. And a .700 Will make much bigger with expanding bullets. The 2-bore is just a antik black powder gun

Overkill
I believe that the 2 Bore projectile is bigger in the barrel than the expanded 600 OK. Sorry

As I was thinking of getting a 2 bore I researched the 2/huge bores I could find and notice people take the same liberties with stories of their rifle, as a 45-70 owner does amongst his small bore buddies.

Severely reduced charges is the most common.

An 8 bore load in a 2 bore behind the half pound ball and it rolls out the barrel at only a few hundred fps.

"Hell, that was 1300fps and 500ftlbs of recoil at least".

I read a 2 bore needing 700-800 grains to get some of the velocities mentioned in the above posts, yet we have these velocities quoted with something closer to a 4 bore load


Karl.

The article in DGJ was actually kind of disapointing.

Mickey1! Yes But a .700 expand to the double diameter is 1.400 the 2-bore is 1.300 And with a velocity of 3200 fps it will also give more shock effect

Overkill,
The 2 bore ball will retain a higher velocity through the animal than an expanding 700 cal. hence more 'shock effect' throughout the length of the wound.

Karl.

Karl! The 2-bore only have a velocity of 1300 fps! The 1000 grainer will create a hard shock when it hit the animal with a velocity of 3200 fps and expand. The 2-bore will have 17700 joule of energy and the .700 BMG IMP will smack with 30800 joule Wich will give the biggest shock effect?

I think that a 1200 grain hawk soft nose bullet in the .700 would be good. Expand to 2,5-3 times it orginal diameter. Big wound

Overkill

If you shot a .700/1000 grain bullet at 3200fps from a hand held rifle, I don't think you would be able to measure any bullet expansion for awhile.s

I also would like a copy of the video.

Mickey!

Do you think about blackpowderbigbore that have shoot his 2-bore with 500 foot pound of recoil energy is hurt?
The .700 BMG IMP rifle wil have a weight over 30 pounds

On small game yes.
But on the largest game 'shock' doesn't count.
Retained velocity over several feet of penetration is what counts.
I doubt the woodleigh bullets, pushed 1000 fps too fast, would penetrate more than a foot or two.



Make up your mind mate whether you are using SI units or imperial. Joules and fps in the same sentence...tsk tsk

Karl.

karl that was the load i used i mis quoted the foot pound figures (sorry but i am human)

the actually foot pounds of energy with the 550 grn load is 13000 foot pounds give or take 500 foot pounds

Mickey i didnt know that my lack of use of capitol letters annoyed you so much oh well.

[ 07-04-2003, 06:04: Message edited by: black-powder-big-bore ]

Run the two bore through the formula, and it has less than 300 fp lbs recoil with 25 lb rifle.Ed.

what formula Ed?
I use a simple one I think I read from Ed Matunas or might have been here even.

Bullet weight + (1.5 x powder weight), /7000, x velocity of bullet ,squared, / 64.34, / rifle weight.

Comes up with over 500ftlbs.

Recoil calculators here
www.beartoothbullets.com ,
www.huntamerica.com
www.handloads.com/calc/recoil.htm
www.bp-tec.com/recoil_calculator.htm

Give similar figures



Karl.

Karl-- I ran the bullet wt of 2000 gr and 500
gr of black powder through my velocity formula,
and the velocity is high enough(14-1500 fps)to generate about 300 ft lbs of recoil,when put into recoil math.Ed.

That's correct math mate but going from memory I think BPBB's claim was a 3500grain round ball in the 2 bore.

Karl.

It will take a lot more than 550 gr of BP to
get a 3500 gr ball up to 1500 fps.And you can't use finer granulation to try to get it, or the
pipe comes apart....Ed.

That's another point I have hounded BPBB with for quite a while.

I fear he will actually have to alter the laws of physics to dig himself out of the BS this time.

Karl.

I've fired a .700 RLG Improved at 3000fps with a 1000gr monolithic solid into solid oak logs alligned endwise and about 2 ft in diameter. The bullet went through 4 FEET of oak! It didn't expand at all, nor did it deviate from a straight line! All it shows is the rifling marks. You could in fact reload it and shoot it again! That is by far the highest penetration I've ever seen from a shoulder fireable gun!! In comparison a military .50 BMG ball went through 3 logs and also stopped, but didn't follow a straight line! A 470 MBOGO will go through 2 logs with solids! A 30-06 will usually do 1 log! Have not tried the 600 OK-1 yet on the logs, but expect 2 logs at 2150 fps.
Recoil was SERIOUS! I would like to see the 2 Bore load that would duplicate that! More importantly, i would want to see what was left of they guy who fired it!-Rob

One of the projects I've always wanted to do, is a Biiiig bore muzzle loader. Golf ball sized to be exact. To fire a patched golf ball in fact. Ya know.. a fun gun. Super big bore, cheap available projectiles, that don't weigh so much that they'll dislocate your shouler. Hmmmm..... someday.

Cas--You sure could find out how strong golf
balls are, and cut recoil.Patched aluminum balls
would cut recoil.Rob is right in that to get a two bore round ball to penetrate like his projectiles in the 700 BMG they would have to be hardened and at such a velocity , at least
2500 fps, it would take
an 80 lb rifle to shoot 3500 gr..And a 1/2 lb of
black powder.Two bore round balls still have a
lot of knockdown power at 14-1500 fps,but comfortable shooting means a 30 lb rifle.It is
an effective rifle if you can handle it.Does anyone have one and a chrono.With test info??Ed.

Heard someone showed up at the Linebaugh seminar with a 4 bore.

NO ONE would shoot it...

s

Ed,
Even a 30lbs 2 bore at 1400fps will have recoil over 400ftlbs- not comfortable enough for me

And the therorectical 2 bore at 2500fps with 1/2 pound of blackpowder gets over 2000 ftlbs recoil from an 80lb gun.
I aint firing it

Karl.