The line of calibers of the PH serie is now offered with a new solid bullet . I have seen only loaded ammo pictures and I don't know what is the bullet shape INSIDE the case .Anyway it has a flat point and a black coat ( teflon?)

Has anyone a picture of this new bullet?

We better ask Don Heath -he works for Norma!

Kevin Robertsson wrote for a swedish magasine then norma introduced the PH line. He was testing Rhinobullets in 0,375/340gr and 370gr? and some made backward as solids.

I saw the cartridges at German I WA today. They start with 9,3x62 and the all african calibers. Nickel case and the bullet is black. Unfortunately there was not so much information available but they also mentioned Don Heath.

quote:

Originally posted by Nordic2:
Kevin Robertsson wrote for a swedish magasine then norma introduced the PH line. He was testing Rhinobullets in 0,375/340gr and 370gr? and some made backward as solids.

Could you share any more news or results on this.
Were these Solid Shank bullets that expand?
What did the article say in brief?

I tested the first .375/350gr Rhino Solid Shank bullets when they came out. Later a 380 grainer with a RN saw the light. Here is a photo I took of these 2 bullets, first 2 being the 350 grain Semi-Spitzer (one being sectioned) and the 3 rd bullet the 380 gr RN bullet. Some changes have been made later on, but I have not tested those. I see here that both bullets are now being made 10 grains lighter.



Thanks
Warrior

Here they are, good news for any serious PH or Guide, got the catalouge at IWA 2010 in Nürnberg yesterday:

A comperhensive line of ammunition that no other maker can offer!

Its good they got rid of all those heavy bullet loads, which I think was a crazy idea...

Am I the only one who notices that they have the 416 Taylor with a 400 grain bullet @ 2,395 and the 416 Rigby and 416 Rem 400 @ 2,330 ????

Since when is there such a small diff in velocity between a 9.3 and a .375 H&H? Looks like an extremely hot load to me in the 9.3.

Warrior

I'd love to see that expensive ammo on a date with a chronny.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
I'd love to see that expensive ammo on a date with a chronny.

mmm the 458 winny with a lighter bullet is looking a bit sad don't ya think?

quote:

Originally posted by reddy375:
Its good they got rid of all those heavy bullet loads, which I think was a crazy idea...

The African PH range is still there and the heavy bullets are great!

Those solids look real good. I'd bet they cost a small fortune But whats money you want something that can stop a DG comeing at you.

quote:

Originally posted by Warrior:
Since when is there such a small diff in velocity between a 9.3 and a .375 H&H? Looks like an extremely hot load to me in the 9.3.

Warrior

...275 gr (9.3) vs. 300 gr (.375)?...

...at dg distances, is higher velocity necessarily better?...

Warrior is talking nonsense as usual. A 9.3x62 286gr load is an easy 2400fps with local Somchem powder. A 375H&H 300gr load is comfortable at 2500fps. Why would a 275gr load, 11gr less, in a 9.3x62 be a hot load at 60fps more? Take no notice of him.

Yes it was the solid shank he tested.

quote:

Warrior is talking nonsense as usual. A 9.3x62 286gr load is an easy 2400fps with local Somchem powder. A 375H&H 300gr load is comfortable at 2500fps. Why would a 275gr load, 11gr less, in a 9.3x62 be a hot load at 60fps more? Take no notice of him.
donttroll

What gives with this name VVarrior

Is this an annal take off on "Warrior" and the insulting tone is very similar to some other players on this forum. So, who are you really?

quote:

Originally posted by VVarrior:
Warrior is talking nonsense as usual. A 9.3x62 286gr load is an easy 2400fps with local Somchem powder. A 375H&H 300gr load is comfortable at 2500fps. Why would a 275gr load, 11gr less, in a 9.3x62 be a hot load at 60fps more? Take no notice of him.

You are a real asshole - I have done testing with SA powders at a ballistic lab and tested all powders and bullets that I could lay may hands on. That is more that what you can say - your opinion is pure conjecture.

Warrior

Fourbore,
Who am I? I am Warrior's alter ego. The other side of his split personality. I follow him around and point to his propensity to get his facts wrong. When the error of his ways is highlighted, he invariably becomes insulting and raises a very large smokescreen.

Ole Warrior here has just proved the point very eloquently. He gets his facts wrong with his comparison of the Norma 9.3x62 and 375H&H speeds. When this is pointed out, he reverts to type and calls me an asshole and claims to have all the facts and research.

quote:

You are a real asshole - I have done testing with SA powders at a ballistic lab and tested all powders and bullets that I could lay may hands on. That is more that what you can say - your opinion is pure conjecture.

Go to this link http://www.dlswc.co.za/Reload/default.asp and select 9.3x62. Check the Somchem data for a 286gr bullet. 2408fps. Then select 375H&H and check out the speeds for a 300gr bullet. Right at 2500fps. So both the Norma loads are hot loads when compared to the Somchem data. But noooooo! Warrior knows better than Somchem. He has done all the research and the Somchem data is pure conjecture.

Take no notice of him, he talks nonsense most of the time.

quote:

Originally posted by Warrior:
Since when is there such a small diff in velocity between a 9.3 and a .375 H&H?
Looks like an extremely hot load to me in the 9.3. (275 gr Norma @2461 fps)
Warrior

Fourbore

2,408 fps is indeed a hot load with SA powders in a 9,3x62.
I have done the research, so I know.
A lab did it for me and that is all that matters to me.
I paid for what I wanted to know and have spent 6 months on proof loads.

Somchem has not done much work on the 9,3 x62.
They only tested 1 Soft bullet - a 286 gr Norma bullet to a max of 2409 fps using S335.
S335 is not ideal, it is too fast and gives pressure.
Also Somchem only tested a monometal - a 250 gr Barnes-X going to a max of 2425 fps.
This is limited research to say the least.

My research goes far far beyond that !!!
I have tested from 180 grains right through to 320 grains with S321, S341, S335, S355, S365 and various duplex and mix loads.
S335 is only to be used with light bullets between 180 and 230 grains in the 9,3x62.

Please do not take any note of VVarior - he has no experience with the 9,3.


Warrior

450 gr solid in a .458 Win Mag @ 2100 fps is a joke.

With 450's one could probably achieve 2300 in a Win Mag.

quote:

With 450's one could probably achieve 2300 in a Win Mag.

Easily; check Barnes No.4.

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

Hey Warrior,

quote:

S335 is not ideal, it is too fast and gives pressure.

In your infinite wisdom, what local powder do you recommend instead of S335? How would it be a better choice?

Is Rhino powder avalible in South Africa / Afrcia?

quote:

Originally posted by VVarrior:
Hey Warrior,

quote:

S335 is not ideal, it is too fast and gives pressure.

In your infinite wisdom, what local powder do you recommend instead of S335? How would it be a better choice?

I will share this with you in great detail if you are prepared to meet with me. Any time in Johannesburg, you decide on time and place between April the 1st and the 8 th, and I will be there.

Will make it very interesting for you.
So the ball is now in your court.
Looking forward to meet face to face with you.
Not this business to take liberties with each other at distance.

Thanks
Warrior

Gentlemen - list of cartridges and bullet weights are correct, something got lost in the translation from metric to imperial for the velocities- eg 500/416 does 2325fps. .458 Lott does 2400fps. .416 rigby and rem do 2400fps. The only ones on that flyer that are correct are 9,3, .416 Taylor and .470. And yes, we have used a new powder for the 9,3 with a slightly lighter bullet to get the load to reach the required energy levels for several African Countries which allow the use of the 9,3 on dangerous game. Fortunately it shoots to approximately same point of impact at 100m as the new 9,3 loading with the 286grn Swift A frame.

I doubt you will see any on the shelves before october. Also, Norma brass (in the big sizes) will be available to handloaders after June.

Hi Don.

Which bullets are Norma using in this cartridge line? Is it a new Norma bullet? For sale soon for reloaders??

Are there ANY published loads getting the 416 Taylor 400 @ 2400 (+/- 5 fps)

That load seems hot.
Most load to 2300 or 2350 and nothing wrong with that.

416 Ruger is 400 @ 2400 with about 102 grains capacity
416 Taylor has 92 grains capacity

Hey Warrior,

quote:

I will share this with you in great detail if you are prepared to meet with me.

You expect me to drive 500kms there and 500kms back for your pearls of wisdom? I think I know why you make the offer. It is a smokescreen to hide the fact that you have been caught out again. You don't know what to put on the table because there is nothing. C'mon, at least give it a go. S355 is slower so it will give a little more speed than S335 at the same pressure? What do you say? Am I right?

I found some loads but not published loads from a bullet or powder manufacturer getting 2395 fps with some SOFTS but not solids.

458 Win cases, WLRM primer, 400grSP, RE15: Start 71gr @ 2300fps/Max 75gr @ 2395fps.
" , " , " , Varget: Start 70gr @ 2265fps/Max 74gr @ 2450fps.
" , " , " , IMR4064: Start 66gr @ 2240fps/Max 70gr @ 2400fps.
" , " , " , IMR4320: Start 71gr @ 2315fps/Max 75gr @ 2360fps.
" , " , " , Win748: Start 71gr @ 2170fps/Max 76gr @ 2380fps.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
Are there ANY published loads getting the 416 Taylor 400 @ 2400 (+/- 5 fps)

That load seems hot.
Most load to 2300 or 2350 and nothing wrong with that.

416 Ruger is 400 @ 2400 with about 102 grains capacity
416 Taylor has 92 grains capacity

quote:

Originally posted by Don Heath:
Gentlemen - list of cartridges and bullet weights are correct, something got lost in the translation from metric to imperial for the velocities- eg 500/416 does 2325fps. .458 Lott does 2400fps. .416 rigby and rem do 2400fps. The only ones on that flyer that are correct are 9,3, .416 Taylor and .470. And yes, we have used a new powder for the 9,3 with a slightly lighter bullet to get the load to reach the required energy levels for several African Countries which allow the use of the 9,3 on dangerous game. Fortunately it shoots to approximately same point of impact at 100m as the new 9,3 loading with the 286grn Swift A frame.

I doubt you will see any on the shelves before october. Also, Norma brass (in the big sizes) will be available to handloaders after June.

Shame on you Norma, this is inexcusable from a company such as yours to produce printed matter with errors so fundamental as this. We saw similar errors in the PH ammunition catalogue.

I hope something doesn't "get lost in the translation" when you are loading your ammunition!!!!!

Surely someone needs to proof read and get it right before publication. Don?

Hi Buffalo

Yes, the bullets are new, both in design and material. Probably be a couple of years before surplus production gets packaged and sold to reloaders though.

Boomstick- if you use some of the new 'high energy' powders that were developed for the US military you can get pretty surprising results in certain calibers. Hornady has done this with their new loads. However, they are not applicable to all cartridges, and no powder plant can afford to develop these powders without government funding...and they can be quirky, giving very even results in some cartridges and decidedly odd results in others where they should work just fine.

Also, you as handloaders are very unlikely to see these powders on the shelves for a long time.

Those solids look great like they can't wait to kill some DG.

Don,
How are these new solids constructed?

465H&H

Thread Hijack alert.
Don, any chance we can get the dimensions that Norma are using for their 416 Taylor confirmed. As you know there have been several threads in the past about this & I've been holding off ordering anything till this is so. 100 Norma cases, reamer, dies & barrel would make me a happi(er)man.
Steve

now what would you do with a rifle that big Steve - your deer arent that big down there.....

quote:

Originally posted by muzza:
now what would you do with a rifle that big Steve - your deer arent that big down there.....

Yeah, but our hares get real ferocious & take some stopping when their addrenalin is up.
Steve.

quote:

Originally posted by Don Heath:
...
Fortunately it shoots to approximately same point of impact at 100m as the new 9,3 loading with the 286grn Swift A frame.

I doubt you will see any on the shelves before october. Also, Norma brass (in the big sizes) will be available to handloaders after June.

Oh my God, norma brass available after June 2010, this autumn will go "crazy"

Are there any news on the availability of brass as June has passed? At least you can see the loaded ammunition at German Triebel webpage incliuding prices.