quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
My father, God rest his soul, raised registered Appaloosa horses as a hobby on our cattle ranch.
He went to the doctor feeling lousy, and came home with a diagnosis of prostate cancer. He sold the livestock off to pay his bills over a few years. The herefords sold for what beef cattle were bringing at the sale barn, the dozen head of registered mares brought well over one-hundred thousand dollars to a single buyer who had lusted after this small foundation breed herd for years. The stud horse went for over fifty-thousand. He was able to leave my mother fairly well fixed when he died nine years later.

That is fortunate for your mother, but if the goal is wealth building and investment, then there are other methods that are probably more effective and with lower risk than investing in livestock.

quote:

If you spend five thousand dollars each on half a dozen custom rifles chambered for oddball, or not-so-popular cartridges and come down with cancer...when you die will your last thoughts be:
A. I enjoyed them, I hope somebody else will and give my wife 1/4th of what they cost me to build?
OR
B. The buyers were all thrilled to pay two to three times what I had in each one.

Most likely, I will be thinking:

Damn, I sure am glad I bought 3 revenue properties in my 30's and 40's, which turned out to be good investments, and never had stoop to buying rifles for any other purposes than my personal enjoyment.

Or even MORE likely....

"Damn, I had a great time hunting with rifles chambered in cartridges *I* liked, and didn't give a hoot about what anyone else said!! "

And

"Hell, I'm DYING here boys, PASS ME A DAMN BEER!!!"

quote:

Having a custom rifle built for an unproven or oddball cartridge is like paying the same price for a single-wide with a tip out as a good house.

..

Naw, it's more like saying "I'll do what pleases me, rather than what pleases other people, regardless of what some guy I have never me will pay for it in 20 years!"

quote:

Have you ever noticed that a large number of posters who might knock a choice of rifle/calibre very frequently will not only have not owned one but might not have even see one in the flesh or handled one. They are reflecting a "bulk opinion" they have picked up from reading.

Mike

I'd say most of them...Especially when it comes to newer cartridges.

I also say that I rarely hear proponents of new cartridges knock old ones, but the anti new crowd sure likes to talk shit about new ones..most of the time never even having shot one!

We have here two different philosophies.

Hedonism verses Altruism. Which is better? Is there a correct answer? Understand that Hedonism is basically self pleasure and Altruism is taking more care in another's pleasure.

What does this world need more of? I'd have to say greed is more closely tied to Hedonism than Altruism.......and where has greed brought us?

I'd have to side with Idaho Sharpshooter...

Holy smmmokes....this is getting heavy now!

375 H&H if for no other reason I can almost alwys find ammunition for it where I'd be hunting. I'm the same wy with a 30.06 doesn't really have an impact on your decision making process until it happens and you spend valuable time searching for ammo that no one has ever seen...

quote:

Originally posted by idahochukar2:

What does this world need more of? I'd have to say greed is more closely tied to Hedonism than Altruism.......and where has greed brought us?

I'd have to side with Idaho Sharpshooter...

Great!!

So, please get a very fine 375 Ruger built. then sell it to me in a few years, for less than what you paid for it.

That wil be taking care of my pleasure quite nicely, and you will enjoy seeing the big grin on my face.

Thanks!

If he did get a custom rifle in 375R, he would be selling it at a very substantial loss!

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
If he did get a custom rifle in 375R, he would be selling it at a very substantial loss!

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

That will fit right in wiht his beliefs of Altruism and "taking more care in another's pleasure"

So he will be happy and I'll I'll be happy!!

didn't we beat this one to death already?

https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/...=613106156#613106156

Here's the deal.. while i EXPECT to see some rugers in high odllar guns, just like 500a2 rather than 500 jeffe, i dont EXPECT to see a lrger number of them...

why?
not because people won't choose them.. oh no, i expect a guy with a 50K purdey to have 2 or three cheap rugers...

the cost advantage of the ruger being in a standard length action is entirely lost with $1000.00USD is less than 20%of the price of the gun.

So, if *I* was going to build a 50K rifle, would i do it in an HH,,,, sure, why not, because the other hoitytoity guys that might would buy it off me would rather the HH than the ruger...

now, if I was going to build a 1500 bang around rifle, ruger indeed...

lets face facts, other than the winchester (made from unobtainium) the cost of a high dollar platform rifle (not ruger, CZ, or weatherby) is going to be MORE than the cost of buildign a nice bangaround rifle on a ruger


oh well, i guess i am just howling into the wind
jeffe

[QUOTE]Originally posted by idahochukar2:

We have here two different philosophies.

Hedonism verses Altruism. Which is better? Is there a correct answer? Understand that Hedonism is basically self pleasure and Altruism is taking more care in another's pleasure...

QUOTE]

Have you never heard of AltruHedonism? (bit like Jews for Jesus)
AltruHedonism is where people find self pleasure in what they do, that just so happens to please other folk as well.
Custom riflemakers&clients are often such.

The choice of caliber for that super custom rifle is a verey personal decision. I do applaud those who have the means to claim cost/resale is no problem or interest. I would add that if you travel you should be aware of ammo availability. I know the air lines or who ever will never loose your ammo. I have heard of to many cases of this happening to ignore it. I have to agree with Rich that the availability of .375 H&H ammo any where in the world would make it a top contender in my book. I talked to a man who lost his supply of .300 Wby. The only thing he could find in that caliber was some 125 gr factory loads. This put a damper on shooting large plains game with his pet Wby.
Perhaps in 20 or so years this may change and you can find .375 R or even .400 H&H in all the usual places right beside the .375 H&H. Till then I will stick with the proven.
Bill

I wouldnt build a custom rifle in 375 because 1.there are a LOT of factory 375s being made 2. its outclassed for african big game by the 4+ calibers, and too big for american game.
its a compromise, and custom rifles shouldnt be

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Cooley:
The choice of caliber for that super custom rifle is a verey personal decision. I do applaud those who have the means to claim cost/resale is no problem or interest. I would add that if you travel you should be aware of ammo availability. I know the air lines or who ever will never loose your ammo. I have heard of to many cases of this happening to ignore it. I have to agree with Rich that the availability of .375 H&H ammo any where in the world would make it a top contender in my book. I talked to a man who lost his supply of .300 Wby. The only thing he could find in that caliber was some 125 gr factory loads. This put a damper on shooting large plains game with his pet Wby.
Perhaps in 20 or so years this may change and you can find .375 R or even .400 H&H in all the usual places right beside the .375 H&H. Till then I will stick with the proven.
Bill

I've heard this so many times...and it's

I guess a guy should leave his pet double rifle, chambered in some obscure cartridge, at home then...

Actually, other than the 30-06, 375 H&H and maybe 458, we should leave all our rifles at home!!!

Or maybe, there is another way around this, and perhaps a guy intending to go on a African trip should investigate his options!

Gatehouse,

start a poll here asking how many have been to Africa more than once and the airlines/customs folks have never lost any of their stuff. That ought to be a pretty interesting thread. A friend is going to Mali in the spring to fill out some holes on his wall. They are about the last place left where you can get a trophy Roan Antelope. He also wants one of those Forest Buffalo. The government has a list of approved cartridges, and they are considering making you buy the ammunition there...I bet there's not a single round of 375R on the shelves anywhere there yet. His outfitter said (last week) if the cartridge is not on the list before you get there, they might just keep the rifle. He had offered to test drive my 550 Gibbs, but I think I'll just keep it here. 458 Lott isn't on the list yet, so you know where that leaves the 375R

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Gatehouse,

start a poll here asking how many have been to Africa more than once and the airlines/customs folks have never lost any of their stuff. That ought to be a pretty interesting thread.

Without a doubt, this happens. And without a doubt, there are ways to minimize the risk of not having any ammo to hunt with. Lots of guys on AR have hunted with obscure but fun wildcats- They managed to get ammo there one way or another.

quote:

A friend is going to Mali in the spring to fill out some holes on his wall. They are about the last place left where you can get a trophy Roan Antelope. He also wants one of those Forest Buffalo. The government has a list of approved cartridges, and they are considering making you buy the ammunition there...I bet there's not a single round of 375R on the shelves anywhere there yet. His outfitter said (last week) if the cartridge is not on the list before you get there, they might just keep the rifle. He had offered to test drive my 550 Gibbs, but I think I'll just keep it here. 458 Lott isn't on the list yet, so you know where that leaves the 375R
.

I suggest anyone going to Mali choose a rifle on the approved list. For everywhere else, there is Ruger.

Rich,

How does Saeed manage with his wildcat 375/404?

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by WbyPower:
Rich,

How does Saeed manage with his wildcat 375/404?

Mike

Making a wee bit too much sense here..............

If id built a super custom 375 id go with aither a 375 Allen Mag or 375 Snipe-Tac. Im not too much into classic etc etc I just go with what I want and whatever feels good cause in the end its OUR money.

So thats my choices because I feel that no other 375 comes anywhere close to these two in ballistics anbd power.

Somehow this all seems premised on the fact that you have to choose between the 375 H&H and the 375 Ruger.

I'll probably end up owning another 375 Ruger (that Alaskan sure looks good to me too!) before I get a 375 H&H, but I can easily foresee having both cart's in my gun safe in time.

Variety is the spice of life.

Cheers,
Canuck

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
just imagine, back in 1958 you had bought two M70's, one in 300H&H and one in 300WM and put them in the gunsafe. Both are NIB, which one is going to bring the most $$$? I rest my case.

I guess I have a couple of minutes to nit-pic...

You might have a little problem getting those in 1958 since the 300WM was released in 1963.

you point is solid though.

Lance

There are actually a few of us who buy rifles to use rather than for any investment potential.

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
There are actually a few of us who buy rifles to use rather than for any investment potential.

Who'd a thunk it??

458,

Are those the same people who bought Yugos because they were less money and got better mileage than Mustangs? In 1963 you could have gone to the Chevy dealer and bought either a split-window or a Biscayne station wagon for the same $$$...most bought the wagon because it had more room.

375R...the new king of .375's in Canada, it's official now.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
There are actually a few of us who buy rifles to use rather than for any investment potential.

Phil I agree. I was told by several people I was crazy to take my nice pre 64 Super Grade 375 H&H to Zim this past June on my first safari. My thoughts were it shoots great and was made to go to Africa so I took it. Yes it now has some rub marks and blueing wear from sweaty hands and riding in rack but now every time I pick up this rifle I can't help but think of the fine leopard, kudu and other animals I took with it. Can't wait to put more wear on it.

quote:

Originally posted by HAY-MAN:

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
There are actually a few of us who buy rifles to use rather than for any investment potential.

Phil I agree. I was told by several people I was crazy to take my nice pre 64 Super Grade 375 H&H to Zim this past June on my first safari. My thoughts were it shoots great and was made to go to Africa so I took it. Yes it now has some rub marks and blueing wear from sweaty hands and riding in rack but now every time I pick up this rifle I can't help but think of the fine leopard, kudu and other animals I took with it. Can't wait to put more wear on it.

And really.....aren't these two quotes what its all about?

Earlier I posted that I would get a high $$ Rifle made into a .375 H+H, that doesnt mean I wouldnt have a Ruger, Weatherby or a JRS. I just wouldnt get it in the above mentioned Rifle. Now give me a SS/Glass "working Rifle" for the Alders of AK, or up close & personal in Africa or northern BC......It would likely be a 375 Ruger, & for many reasons!

I wouldnt worry too much about my ammo not making it to my destination...just like I wouldnt worry about the Plane I am sitting in not getting there either!

No brainer, 375 H&H !

Gatehouse,
by time an ornery cuss like you finally heads to Valhalla, the wife will likely not be shooting any of your rifles...she'll sell them and keep the investments to live off of. It's the idea that she gets good money back from the sale. I have seen too many elderly women get ripped off taking guns into a pawn or gun shop and saying "...these were my husband's, what will you give me for them..."?". I got thrown out of a place for telling a lady that the offer of $100 for a two-digit Python with stag stocks from the owner was stealing. She was good to go since the original bill of sale said $96.00. A couple years back, some guy came by my folks place and offered to tear down the old barn and hauls it off; AND pay her a thousand bucks and straighten up the ground. My mother called me, and I had a friend back in Illinois connect her with an outfit that buys old barns and sells them to yuppies who must want to say "yes" when somebody asks them if they live in a barn. The barn was built in 1904 and had oak beams, 12"x12" uprights mostly, 8"X8" and 8"x12" for cross beams, and the floor in the loft was all 2"x12" to 24" wide oak.
She got a top bid of over $35,000. My dad would have had no clue it was worth that, nor would I. Buy what you like, but think about the widow forty years from now.
Don't diss my buddy IdahoChukar2, he probably has more double rifles and shotguns than you have empty Moosehead cans out in your backyard.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

quote:

he probably has more double rifles and shotguns than you have empty Moosehead cans out in your backyard.

What would you expect from a guy who kills black bears with his Bear bare Paws I mean hands!

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Gatehouse,
by time an ornery cuss like you finally heads to Valhalla, the wife will likely not be shooting any of your rifles...she'll sell them and keep the investments to live off of. It's the idea that she gets good money back from the sale. I have seen too many elderly women get ripped off taking guns into a pawn or gun shop and saying "...these were my husband's, what will you give me for them..."?". I got thrown out of a place for telling a lady that the offer of $100 for a two-digit Python with stag stocks from the owner was stealing. She was good to go since the original bill of sale said $96.00.

One more reason to buy rifles to shoot and hunt, and buy other investment vehicles if you want to leave an inheritance.


[/QUOTE]Don't diss my buddy IdahoChukar2, he probably has more double rifles and shotguns than you have empty Moosehead cans out in your backyard.
[QUOTE]

I dont' drink Moosehead. I think it's more popular east of here, I dont' even know if the local beer store sells it...

quote:

Originally posted by yellowhammer:
375 H&H if for no other reason I can almost alwys find ammunition for it where I'd be hunting. I'm the same wy with a 30.06 doesn't really have an impact on your decision making process until it happens and you spend valuable time searching for ammo that no one has ever seen...

This is the reason I vote for the 375 Wby. It can shoot either!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
just imagine, back in 1958 you had bought two M70's, one in 300H&H and one in 300WM and put them in the gunsafe. Both are NIB, which one is going to bring the most $$$? I rest my case.

And that's a fact, Jack!!!

I'm having a custom .375 H&H rifle made for me by Precision Rifle & Tool of Mebane, NC. The current US national Class F (1,000 yard) champion shoots one of their rifles. It has a left-hand Montana Rifleman receiver, a McGowan 24" barrel, and an English walnut stock with ebony fore end. The rifle will be matte blued. I had Jerome Glimm engrave the bolt knob, and Clint Meier is doing the stock checkering. Additionally, the rifle has NECG Masterpiece front/rear iron sights and a NECG barrel band sling swivel stud. It will also have a Leupold VX-3 1.5-5X20mm scope in Warne QD mounts/bases. Total price will be about $4,000 for all above. I ordered it in January of this year, and hope to get it early this Fall. I'll post pictures and range reports after I receive it.

375H&H. The answer is so obvious. No other rational choice.

That might change in ten years, but I doubt it.

If I was going to have a full house custom built it would be a .375 H&H.

I have a decent .375 H&H that has served well in Africa.

For US hunting I might build one similar in .375 Ruger, but frankly I built a 1909 Argie into a practical hunter in .376 Steyr to get a nice handy little rifle with some punch. If it doesn't work out well, I'll have it rebored to the Ruger.

I think Holland and Holland might have a heart attack if you asked them to build one of their "Best Grade" rifles in 375 Ruger.

I'll take the 375 H&H thank you - whether it be a fancy rifle or not.

[/QUOTE]

I'd say most of them...Especially when it comes to newer cartridges.

I also say that I rarely hear proponents of new cartridges knock old ones, but the anti new crowd sure likes to talk shit about new ones..most of the time never even having shot one![/QUOTE].. ....

Too True ; Pretty ODD isn,t it ..... But then then there are those who obviously are mentally challenged ,who think pistols were perfected in 1911 , There too stupid to admit the absolute superiority of a Glock or S&W M&P ......
.I can think o
f alot of things to do with lots of money [OTHER] than having a 5K $ rifle built ...... And other than a desire to start a fight would never ask the question on a public firearms forum ..... But thats ok ...

quote:

375 Ruger- The NEW KING of the .375'

Yeah, only because you just bought a new 375 Ruger - flavor of the month. Last month it was the 25 WSSM; the month before was the 450 Marlin, and so on. Don't worry you'll grow out of it.

1) 375 H&H
2) 375 WBY

quote:

,who think pistols were perfected in 1911 , There too stupid to admit the absolute superiority of a Glock or S&W M&P ......

Hmm, I resemble that remark!

JPK

quote:

Originally posted by Gatehouse:
I would still go with the Ruger although the Weatherby does have it's appeal.

If you were building a "classic" style wood/blue and concerned about resale value you probably should go with H&H, since people that like old fashioned guns usually prefer old fashioned cartridges, too.


Even in Idaho...Classic

.

quote:

Originally posted by JPK:
[QUOTE],who think pistols were perfected in 1911 , There too stupid to admit the absolute superiority of a Glock or S&W M&P ......

It was perfected in 1911 and further refined since. Why do you think Sig and S&W are now making 1911s in addition to the myriad of wiz bang models they already produce?

Moreover, there is John Browning's grand ole' 50 caliber. I just came from Afghanistan where I saw many of our military vehicles armed with them as well as many foreign countries. Let's see if any other models make it that far. Lou