Looking for a low power variable to put on a 458 Lott. I have a Swarovski 1-6 I ee will that hold up to the pounding? Don't mind getting another scope like vx6 1-6 illuminated and want it mounted as low as possible so rings also needed CZfactory or Warne or Alaska arms etc. info on ring height to clear would help. AHR modified cz 602 going to cull some buffs

D’Arcy Echols reccomends you have open sights on a Lott.
He’s only built a few .
I ‘d go w/ a Leu 1x4 til the Lott kills it, then the open sights .

OK maybe a red dot then

Or open sights lol

I've been using a Nikon Monarch 1-4. It has held up fine to a couple hundred 350gr bullet loads and about 100 500gr loads. One of the few scopes that I don't see a lot of complaints about with breakage. No idea on ring heights. I have it in low Warne rings, but it is on an Enfield action rifle.

A red dot is a great option, though. Some guys seem to have been doing well with the Bushnell TRS, and similar. AHR has CZ mounts for the Trijicon RMR style sight. I have an RMR on a Glock pistol and it is a great sight.

Jeremy

I have been exceedingly happy with the Leupold VX-3 1.5-5x20mm scopes.

I have used them on two different .416 Rem Mag and they have never lost their zero.

The long eye relief means you won't get cut by big recoiling boomers.

With detachable mounts, you have a very versatile DG rifle.

BH63

I have a Kimber Caprivi .458 Lott wearing a Leupold VX-6 1-6 scope with Leupold QD rings. The scope height is good and the rifle points well. It has held up to over 100 rounds loaded with a 500 grain bullet, and better yet has no blood on the ocular. The Leupold QD mount comes off and remounts with the zero held within 1 MOA.

Ask me again in July and I'll tell you how it did in Africa.

Interesting to me Mr. Echols recommends open sights. At least on his synthetic Legend stock it is definitely built for scope use. When I had one I simply could not get down on the open sights. Other than that I like it though it did not really fit me.

Mine carries a Leupold scope.

I would look for a solid, top-mounted ghost-ring-type peep sight.

Ray Atkinson reckons the only modern scope than can handle more than about 100 shots on a 458 Lott is a certain Leupold Compact 2.5x.

Swarovski claim to have nailed the problem of recoil on erector tubes with their four helical springs at the back, on the Z5 and Z6 lines, but I worry that in time the tube's pivot mechanism may wear, allowing the assembly to to move forward in the scope and cause parallax.

The problem begins with the very concept of constantly centred reticles, which articulates the erector tube instead of moving the reticle alone or adjusting zero in the mounts. With luck one day some major maker will admit it is not really that smart having whole erector sets and variable mechanisms suspended on wee springs at the whim of bumps and inertia. Patches to make this system more secure have been popping up ever since 1960 but image-movement's relative fragility compared with reticle-movement and solidly fixed reticles can never be overcome. Even if, say, Nightforce's erector system can withstand 12,000 rounds on a cannon calibre, were the same engineering effort put into the old technology, the scopes would have to last even longer because there would be less to go wrong.

If you want to read more about the problem and possible remedies, my book Light at the Start of the Tunnel (by 'Samuel B. Mann') is being launched tomorrow and should soon be available in America.

Which one and how many rounds has it survived?

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Mine carries a Leupold scope.

Mine wears a Trijicon 1-4..Have used it in Africa twice with no problems.

I have never killed any of these, all of them having been used on rifles up to and including
500A2 recoil levels:

2.5X Leupold
1.5-5X Leupold
2.5-8X Leupold

All are fairly light, the 2.5X is "Ultralight."
No 30mm tubes, all 1-inch tubes.
Less strain on the mounts.

Saeed's amazing record with the 2.5-8X Leupold is a picture worth a thousand words, at least,
used on his .375/404 JS of 1997.
Maybe 200 rounds a year for 20 years and still ticking,
even though it has clobbered some foreheads in the annual camp shoot off at end of each safari.

Since hearing about the durability of Nikon scopes from Doc McCourry, I have bought nothing but Nikons.
On 416Tanzan's suggestion of the SlugHunter scope for my .458 Win. Mag. LongClaw (.458 WML), I added three of those to the collection.
The WinCzechster .458 WML with Nikon SlugHunter has fired over 400 rounds of full steam .458 WML,
including 500-grain TSX at 2342 fps MV, and 400-grain HV at 2542 fps MV.
Three shots with the 500-grain TSX at 2250 fps went into 0.19 MOA.



I might do whatever necessary to mount the short-tubed Nikon SlugHunter 3-9X on a .458 Lott,
as well as a backup Leupold 2.5X.

If the Nikon SlugHunter is not your cup of tea, pick another like the Nikon 1-4X20mm Monarch, or two of them.
Or any two of the Leupolds above.

I have only had to send two Leupolds back for warranty work, and they were of the 6.5-20x42mmAO ilk.

Sightron and Trijicon are worth a look too.
My Sightron 4-16x40mm Mildot survived a 500 A2 with 4 rings holding it to a rail.
A Trijicon 1.25-4x24mm (with 1-inch tube) is barely long enough to fit on a Ruger M77 Hawkeye without extension rings.

For the heavy, expensive Euro scopes on a CZ: The standard, OEM, CZ factory rings cannot be beat for strength, available in 1-inch and 30mm.
The standard height ought to do, they have worked for me with the big ocular bell on a 30mm-tubed Nikon African Monarch 1.1-4x24mm with R4 (German 4) reticle.
Here it is on a 500 Mbogo CZ:



That one is worth risking the extra weight, especially with the ultimately strong CZ OEM rings.
Replace the main mounting screws with automotive-quality socket cap screws for handy QD function:



Carry the QD-QD lever (5mm hex key/Allen wrench) in your pocket.
The 2.5-8X Leupold is just barely long enough to mount on a CZ 550 Magnum or BRNO ZKK 602 without any extension rings, just OEM CZ rings:



In your pants pocket, it is less likely to snag brush or clothing or flesh like those other QD levers.

I do like that Nikon SlugHunter in extension rings on a Ruger. I could buy 10 of them for less cost than one of some Euro scopes.



A big brass token filed to fit the screw slots works as the QD-QD lever on those Ruger rings,
just like on the old Weaver rings:



Rip ...

I’ve always heard that 2.5x was THE big bore scope; the Timex of big bore scopes if you will...

quote:

Originally posted by gunslinger55:
Which one and how many rounds has it survived?

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Mine carries a Leupold scope.

Not sure, maybe M8, but he gets them from pawn shops, which makes me think the new ones mybe are not quite as good. 1000 shots rings a bell.

Ok sm338, knowing your fondness for heavy European scopes
which are more robust, those built on the classic 4x erector tube (1-4x, 1.5-6x, 2,5-10x etc) with FFP reticle or the new SFP 6x erector tubes?

Personally on anything bigger than a .375 I like rail mount scopes, and the old prism rail that can be drilled through exposes other weaknesses in the system before the scope moves.

I use the Leupold Delta Point relfex (dot) site on my CZ 458 Lott; mounted on front bridge with the AHR detachable mount. It is holding up well after 500+ rounds. Have the open sites as an first back-up and can also mount the NECG Peep on the rear bridge for use instead/in place of the reflex site if needed.

If I scoped this I would first try either the 2.5x or 3x Leupold.


Eric

quote:

Originally posted by BaxterB:
I’ve always heard that 2.5x was THE big bore scope; the Timex of big bore scopes if you will...

I think Phil Shoemaker has had one of these on his 458 for many years. Leupold also makes a fixed 3x that is good, but it is now only available on special order.

quote:

Originally posted by ColoradoMatt:

quote:

Originally posted by BaxterB:
I’ve always heard that 2.5x was THE big bore scope; the Timex of big bore scopes if you will...

I think Phil Shoemaker has had one of these on his 458 for many years. Leupold also makes a fixed 3x that is good, but it is now only available on special order.

His daughter has one on her Echols 416. Seems capable!

Just a couple of points to add to RIP's comments.

Nikon makes a compact Monarch 2-8 scope.
It FITS on the CZ Safari Magnum, just barely.
Eye-relief is a respectable 4" at all magnifications. It is a great scope and we have one on one of our 416Rigbys.

As a former Leupie 2.5-8 user myself, I would call the Nikon Monarch 2-8 the ultimate replacement, possibly even more rugged than the Leupold.


The Nikon Slughunter is a great DG scope. It has 5-inch eye-relief throughout. It's parallax is set for 75 yards which works fine out to 300-400, the most anyone will shoot in Africa, and is probably better in close at 50 yards if you want to shoot the pupil of an eyeball. For the same scope with 100-yard parallax, get the Nikon Inline. We've got those on a 270, two 338's, a 416, and a 500. My older 1.65-5 Slughunter is a back-up for the 500.

Ditto on the Nikon -
Leupold has a well known fix it for free warranty FOR A REASON - i've broken several

Truth be told, the Japanese made Tasco Titan (sold under Lynx brand in SA, iirc) is/was immune to recoil -- hundreds of rounds in a #1 459 lott, more in others, have seen ONE broken, and that was due to a long fall, landing on scope, onto tarmac

i've sold off ALL my leupolds for Nikons ...

no at lott but on my 458 win mag i went from the 2.5 leupold heavy duty reticle to a nikon 1-4x20 monarch 3 with a german reticle. there is no comparaison between the 2.

on a note for the ruger fan and the oem rings. the mossberg choke screw handle is really handy.

but i prefer alaska llc qd rings.

I find that my European scope have shorter eye relief.
My favourites now for big bores are:
-Nikon Inline and Slughunter. 5 inches eye relief. Tough scopes.
-Weaver Ultra Slam 1-5, DG scope 4 inches eye relief.

quote:

Originally posted by medved:
on a note for the ruger fan and the oem rings. the mossberg choke screw handle is really handy.

Yep, I have some of those in my kit too.
But that version of the QD-QD-lever is not as photogenic or nostalgic as my Star Trek token.
The Mossberg choke wrench, just basically a flat, rectangular metal key with a protrusion to fit the cross slot on a screw-in choke,
is lighter in the pants pocket though, and a good option.
I have some steel plate that I could make custom ones from too.
There is no shortage of QD-QD-levers.

Rip ...

quote:

Originally posted by Brian Canada:
I find that my European scope have shorter eye relief.

Agree, too heavy and usually too short in the eye relief. I only own two of them and that is enough!
An FFP mildot reticle on one of those monsters is nice, but best on a heavy, tacticool rifle of some sort, like a 50 BMG!
My favourites now for big bores are:
-Nikon Inline and Slughunter. 5 inches eye relief. Tough scopes.
-Weaver Ultra Slam 1-5, DG scope 4 inches eye relief.

Brian Canada,
What scope are you using on your 577 NE?

I get mixed up with Grand Slam and Super Slam, now I have to throw Ultra Slam into the mix.
Has Weaver gone and changed the Super Slam to Ultra Slam?

Weaver's "Super Slam Dangerous Game" 1-5x24mm is amazing.
That is what it was called when I bought them a few years ago.
It is actually a brilliant and true 1X on lowest setting. Optically as good or better than the discontinued $800 Nikon African Monarch 1.1-4x24mm.
But it is a also a 30mm-tubed scope, heavy!
I cannot say if they are as rugged as the Nikon.
I have 3 of the 1-5X24mm Weaver SSDG scopes, used on 400 Whelen, .395 Tatanka, and 404 RIP only so far.
Good so far.
Edit: But diascontinued too, like the Nikon African?
From Amazon:
Weaver Super Slam Matte Scope (1-5 x 24 Dangerous Game with Heavy Dual-X Reticle and 30mm Tube):
Currently unavailable.
We don't know when or if this item will be back in stock.
Powerful 5 times magnification with fully multi-coated lenses that employ an extra hard coating on exterior lenses fashioned in a European Style 30mm tube
Argon purged tubes to eliminate internal fogging
One piece construction that allows for a waterproof, fogproof, and shockproof scope
Heavy Dual-X Reticle with 1/4" adjustment at 100 yards
Measures 10.6 inches in length and weighs 14.8 ounces



And a hand-picked review from Amazon:
December 6, 2014
Verified Purchase
"Bought one when they were on sale and replaced the Leupold scope on my 416 Rigby because the zero would change. This scope is far better with better eye relief. Liked it so much when the went back on sale I bought another and replaced the orther Leuplod scope I had on my 460 Wby. The scope has a very good long eye relief for heavy recoiling rifles. On 1x you can see the front sight post. Very fast easy scope to use. One thing you will not see written about these scopes and I don't know why, but they fail to mention these are European style First Focal Plane scope, That means the point of impact is not effected when you change the power setting as on most American scope, it also means when increase the power setting the reticle magnifies too so the cross hairs appear thicker on the higher power. Which is how you can tell it's a First Focal plane scope. Normal wholesale cost on these scopes is well over $500,00 so I don't know how Amazon can sell them less then that. I am a gun dealer and I bought them for hundreds less on Amazon then I could from my supplier. I have huntered several Elephants and Cape buffalo in Africa on several trips. This is by far the best value on a quality dangerous game scope on the market."

Discontinued at Midway USA also, they were selling for $439 there.



Gone the way of the Nikon 1.1-4x24mm Monarch African ...
Too heavy and too expensive for the mass market, when the Nikon Monarch 1-4x20mm will do better business?

Rip ...

I had a Ziess Victory 1-4 0n my M03 ,lasted 60 shots then was had it ,[apart from that a really good scope]then had to go to open sights ,bought a Leupold 2.5 or 3x ,cant remember on a recommendation on AR, but the FOV was so poor I sold it straight away, have a Nikon I'm going to try out .I was told to get an old Pecar or Kahles scope ,which were more robust than modern offerings,in this day an age scope manufacturers cant make a decent scope for big bores ?

Leupold Vari-X III. 1.5X5 20mm; over 100 shots and still going strong.

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Leupold Vari-X III. 1.5X5 20mm; over 100 shots and still going strong.

Not for nothing but 100 shots from a 458 Lott could have easily happened at a bubba
shoot charging water jug meet up at Keith's. 100 shots from a 458 Lott no joke happened quite frequently, unless you brought a bunch of rifles. We would frequently shoot 6 or 800 plastic jugs that we had all gathered together filled with water put on stands and had a ball

That's torture, man!

RIP, On my .577NE I use the Weaver Super Slam DG scope.( not "ultra slam as I stated above) 1-5 X 24 with 30mm tube. Warne rings I think. I really like it.

Last year I had it mounted a bit too far back and cut myself several times. I am a stalk-crawling shotgun shooter type and this year I have moved the Weaver ahead half an inch. If you use all 4 inches of eye relief then it won't get you.

They say it is a tough scope. The .577 in a heavy rifle gives a long mean push, more than a sharp kick. Probably not so hard on scopes.

I have not used my Nikon's with the 5 inches of eye relief yet.
I will put a Nikon Inline on my 50-110 switch barrel.

I see people have mentioned Kahles. In my opinion Kahles one of the best, but the eye relief is very short.

quote:

Originally posted by GBE:
Ok sm338, knowing your fondness for heavy European scopes
which are more robust, those built on the classic 4x erector tube (1-4x, 1.5-6x, 2,5-10x etc) with FFP reticle or the new SFP 6x erector tubes?

Personally on anything bigger than a .375 I like rail mount scopes, and the old prism rail that can be drilled through exposes other weaknesses in the system before the scope moves.

I think less is more when it comes to variable multiples, esp. in the modern, constantly centred-reticle scopes. This is because as we turn up the power, the lenses should have to move out (cf zoom camera lenses) and big ones probably have to move out farther. This adds even more inertia to the front of the erector tube to act under recoil and bumps.

In the old reticle-movement scopes this is less important because the erector set is solidly mounted in the main tube. But even there, 4x multiples were thought to be ground-breaking. Though I generally prefer the humble 3x multiples, I have grown fond of the now-classic 1.5-6x German scope and a little Nickel 1-4x variable.

My old Sako .338 is presently wearing a dural B.Nickel 1.5-6x36 and "I like it fine, so far". It has a rail and I mounted it in eBay-found Blaser dovetails on top of the boxy Optilock bases. You have to be lucky to find those female dovetails in the Anglosphere, which probably explains why unrailed, unsoldered steel tubed scopes cost the big bikkies, even though they were cheapest when new.

I have used a Leupold VX3 1.5 - 5 with very good results. I also have a Burris Fast Fire 3 dot which I have come to when the scope magnification is not needed. Gives many options and accuracy at the same time.

I am a big fan of the MONARCH 3 2-8 BDC. Another option worth looking at is Nikon's BLACK FORCE1000 1-4 30mm tuber, illumination and built tough. I use one on a pig gun and love it for low light situations.

Most of the compact scopes these days all have the annoying '' Tactical'' Reticles, useless for hunting, for people with M16s running around a course ,shooting at Targets of Osama Bin Laden .Steiner has a compact P4Xi around $600.00 ,Steiner claims all their scopes will handle 50BMG recoil forwards or rearwards .Nickel has the Magnum Safari scope 1-4 but at $3000.00, um NO . Burris claim all their scopes will handle 50 BMG recoil ,find that one hard to believe .
Sightron ,I'm told handle recoil, but others say they are not good ,maybe higher priced[ high power variable ], yes but higher power scopes not suitable for a hunting rifle like a Lott.

Have you checked out Nikon's BLACK Force1000 1-4x24? I have been using it on a .300 BO, I know, nothing close tot he Lott recoil wise, but it is a heck of a scope and built tough. Great price as well too.

quote:

but higher power scopes not suitable for a hunting rifle like a Lott

The Nikon Inline 3-9, parallax at 100yards, and the Nikon Slughunter 3-9, parallax at 75yards, are the toughest scopes I know.
Set them at "3" in the forest, and crank up to "9" if you need a 300 yard shot. Eye-relief throughout both scopes is 5 inches.

Michael458 shot more big bore loads than most ever will when developing and testing his MDM and other African-size cartridges. He settled on Nikons after repeatedly breaking most other brands.

The Nikon Monarch 1-5 is no longer available and seemingly the same for the Weaver Super Slam dangerous game scope ? , I will try out the Nikon [that I already have] when I get a 1 inch mt for my M03 ,there are the Weaver 1-4 30mm shotgun muzzle loader scopes ,might be worth a try

will have a look at the Nikon Black force
cheers

quote:

Originally posted by Robertcat:
... Burris claim all their scopes will handle 50 BMG recoil ,find that one hard to believe ...

Well, I don't know about the others, but I would be inclined towards the 1-4x24 with 'Posi-Lock', possibly the most sensible scope development I've heard for many years.