I once read a story about a PH who had two different elderly clients suffer fatal heart attacks after shooting a big bore rifle at DG.

Even PH Capstick, suffered a broken collarbone in his later years when a newly purchased double rifle "doubled" on him.

As we grow older, we lose muscle mass, muscle tone, and our bones weaken.

On my last safari, I had a mild cardiac event after being on the track of buffalo for 18 klicks.

I was wise enough (suffering enough actually) to not rush and try to get into position for the shot, but rather concentrate on getting my heart to stop beating like a meth freak running from the law. (Pissed the PH off a bit though - nice 40" + buff just standing around waiting for darkness).

At what age should we sell or retire out boomers??

BH63

When we shoot guns that are older than the shooter, we should take care that the gun is not injured. If the older gun can survive, so should the shooter.

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
When we shoot guns that are older than the shooter, we should take care that the gun is not injured. If the older gun can survive, so should the shooter.

I don't know if that is practical, but it sure sounds good....

BH63,

At a few month away from 70 I can still shoot my 20" barrel 458 but the 375 is just more fun and actually it always has been. I don't think I can answer your question.

Mark

I don't think I qualify as elderly yet, but there are some things that are just not as much fun as they used to be. Big recoil is one of them.

quote:

Originally posted by BuffHunter63:
* * *
As we grow older, we lose muscle mass, muscle tone, and our bones weaken.
On my last safari, I had a mild cardiac event after being on the track of buffalo for 18 klicks.
* * *
At what age should we sell or retire out boomers??

You ask an interesting question. After 65, even if you're still in decent shape, you should probably sell or trade-off any .300 and larger Weatherbys in the safe. Hard kickers and cheek bruisers are for younger men.

I think it depends on the individual. I am in my mid 70s and still enjoy shooting and hunting with my 416 Rigby bolt gun an 450NE double. For domestic practice they are both fun on feral pigs.

On thing that I have found that works on the range is an molded mouth piece that keeps all the recoil from going through the jaw into the skull.

Still shy of 70, over 65.

I shoot a 500 AccRelNyati, which is the ballistic equivalent of a 500Jeffery in a smaller Ruger Hawkeye package. Yes, it rocks the boat on the bench. I have plans for downsizing in a few years and have considered a 416 Ruger, maybe 330gnGSC at 2600fps.

My wife has crossed 70 and has a 375Ruger. Her stateside rifle is a mild-mannered 270Win, accurate and light in a Tikka.

Personally, if one learns to shoot big bores, then pretty much all of the medium bores like 338 and 375 are pretty easy to shoot and not very distracting. Maybe I'll change my tune in a ninth decade (80+) but Ray Atkinson seems to like a hot 338 in his eighties. That sounds about right to me, and I use a 338WM on smallish California mule deer. I'm neither broad shouldered nor "muscled", but recoil is more the noise and a mindset. When a person holds on and rolls with it, even on the bench, it is not bad at all. The main thing is to pretend to be in "hunting mode", where each shot is an experience, and limiting the number of daily rounds. I typically only shoot 10-15 of the big boomers, 500 and 416 [loaded to 6200ft#], and usually under 30 rounds or even 20 on the medium bores, in a range day. 270 and 243 don't count, but they make noise.

Those numbers may go down as I age, yet I think that a 338WM is quite comfortable. Just enough shove to let you know that it went off.

Well, I'm not quite 62 and after October's safari the .375 Weatherby becomes a keepsake and I'm going fishing. Not enough meat left in my chest after July surgery, but I've had fun developing loads and practicing with it over twenty years.

I believe, as stated earlier, that the physical fitness of the shooter does come into play. Also, each of us has a different “threshold” for discomfort! Elmer shot (quite well) some big stuff when late in years! My 9.0 pound AI kicks pretty good when shooting from the bench, at 66, I’m good for 20 or maybe a few rounds more from the bench......but have no problem resisting the urge to shoot the following day! memtb

People get fragile when we get old.

I am 55 and finding I don't shoot my big guns nearly as much as I use to .
My 416 rem mags are the top of my limit on recoil .I shoot alot with reduced loads also .I also use two past pads with my 416 rem mag and my.338 win mag .It sucks getting older everything gets rattled around alot.more than it use to .I just bought another 416 rem mag Lord knows why it was almost what I wanted but I.dought I shoot it as much as I use to .My.favorite practice bullet Speer 350 grain just got discontinued again .I.can shoot very well at 2400 fps above that it's not as fun.Have fun shooting.I shoot standing off a milk crate off a 60 pound bull bag on top of.the.bench that is alot more.fun !

My father and a good friend had to stop shooting big bores due to retinal problems and the risk of going blind. That would probably be enough to make me consider stopping, but my eye doc says my retinas are great. So I'll quit when they throw dirt in my face. Can't imagine the last day of the last safari if I knew it would be. I think that would be the saddest day.

Besides, my .416 was built for me and is a real pussycat. And it will do anything I really need.

quote:

You ask an interesting question. After 65, even if you're still in decent shape, you should probably sell or trade-off any .300 and larger Weatherbys in the safe. Hard kickers and cheek bruisers are for younger men.

No, simply change your loads to something you are comfortable shooting and that the rifle shoots accurately!

I replaced my 375 H&H with a 375 Ruger Guide Gun.

I replaced my 416 Rigby with a 416 Ruger Guide Gun.

The problem was the platforms for the 375 H&H
and the 416 Rigby. The Ruger Guide Gun is lighter, more compact, not as bulky. The stainless steel barrel/action, great iron sights and the muzzle brake are significant
enhancements. Both rifles are stupid acurate
and easy to load for.

I have come to really like the muzzle brake on the Rugers. I find them not terribly obnoxious and they make the rifles much easier to shoot.

At 67 I no longer can tolerate dragging boat anchor rifles thru the jesse and feeling wiped out at the end of the day.

Still enjoy shooting my David Clay custom M70 458 Lott, it fits me like a glove, the good fit and stock design really mitigate the recoil.

The older I get the smaller my guns get, recoil tends to work on old injuries for sure, my right hand injured in a roping event, after rebuilding it, is still stiff and if the trigger guard hits my middle finger, the air turns blue with cuss'en as I go to my knees!! My shoulder, also, from roping can't take a hit like it used to..Im at the .338, 375 stage at 84..have no use for taking a pounding anymore...besides I finally learned what I always knew, its where ya stick the bullet not how big the bullet is...I would take that getting killed with a grain of salt. If it did happen many things can cause a heart attack..Its easy to have a heart attack in Africa, usually when your presented with he bill.

And I thought this thread was about shooting the elderly (which I greatly resemble lol) ...

Don'r blame it on the gun.

I was in camp once when an American hunter died while on safari.

He had a 416 Rigby.

He was an alcoholic in his younger days, and his liver was seriously damaged.

He had heart problems too, as he could hardly walk to the swimming pool 50 yards away from his hut without stopping to rest.

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:

quote:

You ask an interesting question. After 65, even if you're still in decent shape, you should probably sell or trade-off any .300 and larger Weatherbys in the safe. Hard kickers and cheek bruisers are for younger men.

No, simply change your loads to something you are comfortable shooting and that the rifle shoots accurately!

My thought exactly. A .458 WM 500 grain at 2000fps recoils a lot less than 2150 fps. Anything shot with it, if it is properly placed will never know the difference.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Don'r blame it on the gun.

I was in camp once when an American hunter died while on safari.

He had a 416 Rigby.

He was an alcoholic in his younger days, and his liver was seriously damaged.

He had heart problems too, as he could hardly walk to the swimming pool 50 yards away from his hut without stopping to rest.

Did the hunter need to hire an extra porter to carry around the oxygen tank?

I'm just starting the fun really at late 40's now 53. But I am a large framed guy and can and will take a pounding. Was worried after shoulder surgery on right shoulder but been pounding away all summer with a .458 Lott that makes .416's feel like a pussycat. I don't plan on giving it up unless it's medically necessary and even then I usually ignore the doc's...May just stay at the 505 level and go hunting with the money I saved from buying something bigger while I can.....

quote:

Originally posted by Nick Adams:

quote:

Originally posted by BuffHunter63:
* * *
As we grow older, we lose muscle mass, muscle tone, and our bones weaken.
On my last safari, I had a mild cardiac event after being on the track of buffalo for 18 klicks.
* * *
At what age should we sell or retire out boomers??

You ask an interesting question. After 65, even if you're still in decent shape, you should probably sell or trade-off any .300 and larger Weatherbys in the safe. Hard kickers and cheek bruisers are for younger men.

Not trying to stir the crap but, Bullshit.
I'm 64. I still shoot my .470 NE off the bench and off sticks. I have a .500 MDM which shoots a 450 gr CEB at 2430 off the bench. I can put 50 rounds out of my .458 Lott off the bench. Age has nothing to do with it. When you get to the point that the recoil is bothersome, then you can downsize. Not everybody is recoil sensitive.

There are two obvious problems with the question.

First, every person does not handle recoil the same no matter what the age.

The second issue is fitness. Some stay fit as they age. Personally, I exercise two hours a day. At the tender age of 62, I am lifting more weights than I ever have.

Is there a certain age? No!

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
There are two obvious problems with the question.

First, every person does not handle recoil the same no matter what the age.

The second issue is fitness. Some stay fit as they age. Personally, I exercise two hours a day. At the tender age of 62, I am lifting more weights than I ever have.

Is there a certain age? No!

quote:

Can't imagine the last day of the last safari if I knew it would be. I think that would be the saddest day.

Amen

Well, I will tell you how it is with a whole bunch of us here.

Youngest of the lot is me, at 68.

I do shoot 460 Weatherby class rifles quite regularly off the bench.

I use 2 shoulder pads between my shoulder and the stock.

I think I will continue shooting these - one major reason is no one else would, to sight them after a scope is installed!

But, there is no way I am going to hunt with anything but my 375/404.

And I expect to be doing that until the day when I am physically incapable of going on safari.

Some interesting posts. One big variable that Mr. Atkinson touched on, is that some people have been a lot harder on their bodies than others.

Old injuries come back to haunt you as you get older.

For me, having been hit by a train, decades of martial arts training,and surviving a liver transplant has added a lot of scar tissue and some parts of my body don't give anymore.

I still shoot my .416 off the bench, but only enough to verify my zero.

As I write this, my left hand has a nasty looking bruise from the pounding it took while sighting in an ultra light .300 Wn Mag.

Still I would rather have the recoil than have to lug a heavy rifle. LOL

BH63

quote:

Originally posted by BuffHunter63: decades of marital arts training,

I've been married over 40 years to the same woman. Would that qualify for an honorary degree in marital arts?

Ray B: Yes, an honorary Master's Degree. You will be awarded a Doctorate when you reach 50 years, but only IF you make it. And, Saeed: I'm 67, and still shoot the big boomers. So, I would fit in perfectly with your group! My mind tells me I'm in my 30's;, people tell me that I look like I'm in my 50's; and, with all of that BS, I'll still continue to hunt until they pull the sheet over my head.

We get old too soon
And wise too late

But even though I will be 70 in a couple of months, as long as I am still guiding for big bears, and I don't foresee quitting anytime soon, I will still carry my 458 as wounded bears are just as dangerous as they were when I was young .

I am 73 and I shoot a ,577NE with a 700 grain bullet and a .50-110 with a 450 grain bullet. I love it in the field. I was fortunate enough to have killed 4 cape buffalo with them last month. One shot each.

Just turned 69 and I still shoot a lot! My mantra is you carry the gun far longer than you shoot it. I can still take damn near any amount of recoil once or twice but carrying a heavy gun 10 miles is just too much these days. My 8lb 500a2 is just about perfect for DG. Nothing wrong with loading down either and I always use a muzzle break.

quote:

Nothing wrong with loading down either and I always use a muzzle break.

I agree,
In my 577 and 500 I am still under 2000fps. and they really put cape buffalo on the ground.

Downsize?
400 whelen?
375 flanged?
BPE carts?
Loading down? (75% rule)

I’m beat up at 39, especially in light of what you guys are shooting.

My 8 lbs .375 h&h whitworth doesn’t bother me, nor did my 8 lbs .450-400 ruger number 1.

One of the worst guns I ever shot was a 9 lbs .338 off the bench. Same with the .300 win mag.

Being in my 60s I still enjoy my .577 and .505 at full loads but I excercise so I can handle them, hike with them, stay steady while aiming, and keep my bones strong. Keeping up with upper chest exercise and abdominal is critical to maintaining strong musculoskeletal structure.

Some people seem to thrive on recoil when they're young but most, researchers have asserted, don't.

As a 67-year-old hunter who just wants to use an adequate calibre, I fire just enough shots from the bigger ones to be sure I'm on target.

You don't flinch? Well, I've been known to. So, I put some white closed-cell foam between the rifle and my shoulder while sighting in, which hopefully prevents the nerves developing really bad habits. I know I'll feel no kick at all when shooting at big game.

Our range is against a line of hills which cause annoying crosswinds, so to shoot too much at long distances is often meaningless in establishing lateral zeroes.

Also, since I no longer countenance use of rangefinders for my game hunting, knowing the exact drop of my bullets at 300 or 400 yards is a bit academic because I will never be sure of the distance out there in the field.

So, if my bigger rifles are 2.5 inches high at 100 yards, I leave them at that and ease the nerves down with a few shots from the .22. With luck the bones will stand up to this regime as long as I need them to.

Here's my dad, 2 weeks before his 80th birthday. Kinda like one dagga boy killing another dagga boy!

He stayed in shape with lots of reps with light weights....even some chukar hunting in hells canyon, providing it wasn't too extreme. He was always up for the hunt and kept a VERY positive attitude.

Ive posted this link here before, I always enjoy watching it. BTW, the double is a .500 Sabatti, loaded with 570 gr X bullets (he also shot a .577 quite a bit, at the time). But, he was tougher than most!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u14WMSjA49o

quote:

I fire just enough shots from the bigger ones to be sure I'm on target.

That has been my method as long as I have been hunting, regardless the caliber.

quote:

Originally posted by Head Trauma:
I replaced my 375 H&H with a 375 Ruger Guide Gun.

I've been thinking about trying to locate a .375 Ruger Guide Gun for bear hunting over bait.

I'm glad you thoroughly enjoy yours.

BH63