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I am sure that by merely asking this question I will bestow the wrath of the spirits of British gun makers of yore but here goes.

Why are many of the older British calibers named for a bore diameter that is not the correct bore diameter of the said cartridge?

For instance the .404 Jeffery is either a .423 diameter or a .419.

The .425 WR is a .435.

The .400 Jeffery is either a .408 or a. 411.

So on and so forth.

Could this be the true reason that the British empire failed? Wink

Seriously though, what gives?



 
Posts: 5210 | Registered: 23 July 2002Reply With Quote
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never question the english!


577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375

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Posts: 27615 | Location: Where tech companies are trying to control you and brainwash you. | Registered: 29 April 2005Reply With Quote
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Because for some reason they choose to use bore size and not groovesize/bullet dia. ie: 303 Brit uses .311". If it is a much larger difference, then I would say marketing.

Same thing happens here. 38 Spec. uses .357-8" bullets. 44 Mag/Spec uses .429" bullets. 38-40 WCF uses .400" bullets Guess they did not like the sound of 36 Spec., 43 Spec., or 40-40 WCF.


Keith


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Posts: 4553 | Location: Walker Co.,Texas | Registered: 05 September 2003Reply With Quote
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or a 300 Savage is .308


Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.




What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10169 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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450NE=.458", 450/400=.408" or .411", 500NE=.510", 500 Jeffery=.510", 505 Gibbs=.510"...I think it was marketing but not just based on the bigger bore size, just a catchy name.

JPK


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Posts: 4900 | Location: Chevy Chase, Md. | Registered: 16 November 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
505 Gibbs=.510"


JPK, shame WRONG. the Gibbs shoots .505" bullets.

Keith


IGNORE YOUR RIGHTS AND THEY'LL GO AWAY!!!
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Posts: 4553 | Location: Walker Co.,Texas | Registered: 05 September 2003Reply With Quote
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Ah, and so you are correct - as Woodleigh confirms!

So I'll substitute: 577NE=.585"

JPK
(edit: glad I don't own and reload for a 505!)


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Posts: 4900 | Location: Chevy Chase, Md. | Registered: 16 November 2004Reply With Quote
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I'm not one of the smart ones Smilerbut I think Dr. ALF wrote here that the 404 Jeffery was originally .40-4 or something like that designating fourty caliber and four shots. Apparently they weren't advanced enough back then to finagle one into the chamber over a full magazine.

.40-4-400-4000 ?

.44-44 JCF ?
 
Posts: 157 | Location: South Carolina, USA | Registered: 04 January 2005Reply With Quote
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