The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores 375 Bore PollGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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It's not about replacing the H&H. It's an alternative. You guys take this stuff so personally. Did Ruger call you names as a kid or steal your milk money? The .375 H&H's legacy and place is secure, why can't you be? -+-+- "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." - The Dalai Lama | |||
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Slug, is that like "alternative lifestyles"? Rule One: If it ain't broke, you can't fix it. Rule Two: if you price yourself out of the market, get the marketing guys to redefine the market. If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with BS! It's sort of like Ruger not caring enough to offer the standard 375H&H at a competitive price, like CZ and Remington and Winchester and Savage and Sako have for decades. Instead, they build this bulbous RSM that is better suited for the 416 Rigby/505 Gibbs class of cartridges, which they do not offer, at nearly three times the retail of the others. The other thing: it doesn't give anybody with a chronograph a reason to trade up. The marketing strategy seems to be competing with the H&H, which is like Ford's decision to build a Lincoln Pickup truck to compete with their own half-ton at three times the price. You guys come off like a twelve year old boy who has just had his first wet dream...thinking he is the only one in the world that special. The H&H has done it all for nearly a hundred years. The 375R is nothing but a re-packaged 376 Steyr, and we all know how that worked. The H&H is the world's standard 375 caliber, everything else is just that; something else. The 375R will be a real player when the custom houses of Europe start chambering for it. Until then, it's a fat 375 Whelen, just a local phenomenon. We're not threatened by it, more likely amused by all the blather. If you want one, buy one, just don't expect to be in a large enough group to get yourselves certified as a tribe and get government handouts. Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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that would be a very nice 9,3x64 Brennecke wouldn't it? Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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90+ years of marketing leadtime and the HH can't muster more than 1.5 to 1 ratio? LOL opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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But you may be able to improve on it
If you run a company, and can redefine the market, you are good at your job.
Sure it does, if you want 24" barrel H&H performance out of a 20" barrel. You have not shot one over a chrono, so please, tell us how you knwo this?? The owners of 375 Rugers that have shot them over chronos indicate they are getting the advertised velocity, but you, having never shot one, somehow know differently! Hilarious!! 
Except...the Steyr did NOT meet or exceed H&H velocities, it came CLOSE...And Steyr has a pretty small North American market share compared to Ruger.
Me thinks a fat 375 Whelen isn't a bad thing to be. 
I knwo I am pretty amused by some of the blather I hear about the 375 Ruger- and it's not the blather comeing from the men that have actually shot, chronoed, hunted with one! 
H&H owners are getting gov't handouts?  375 Ruger- The NEW KING of the .375's!! | |||
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Since the 375 Ruger uses the exact same head dia as all the other standard magnums I would not call it "bulbous"
The 375 Ruger offers more powder capacity than the 375 H&H so is quite a bit more than a re-packaged Steyr.
Since when have the custom houses of Europe been the real players in the US market? Ruger is certainly taking a gamble by daring to compete against the 375 H&H and there are a lot of nay-sayers ready to critisize it without any personal experince The 375 H&H is an icon - so was the 300 H&H - but knowledgable shooters set it aside for a shorter cartridge fifty years ago and I will not be suprised if the same thing happens to the 375H&H. There is not a single thing it can do that the 375 Ruger can not do at least as well. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Actually, this is an ongoing quandary for me. Why? I'll never know. Except, that the H&H with the plethora of modern loads loads make it hard to beat. Two come to mind, the Federal 260gr Nosler Accubond and the new Norma PH 350gr with both Woodleighs. And everything in between. But it is long and belted, neither a death knell, far from it. But the Ruger case looks good. But the rifle? Not to me. If CZ chambered a 550 in 375 Ruger that would be my next. Since they don't, yet, I bought another M70 Classic Safari Express. And I'll keep trying ot make it perfect as it's far from it, short of a rebarrel. So it might not be kept long, again. But that's OK. This is the bore that I want for PG, but I don't need it. Why do I need a 375 when I can shoot a 416? Now THERE'S a quandary. | |||
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You've been saying how you've got nothing against the Ruger but I think you've finally outed yourself. Talk about "alternative lifestyles"! I thought this was a friendly discussion but you seem to have taken it a bit personally. WTF? -+-+- "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." - The Dalai Lama | |||
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 "We" do?
Exactly who has started all this stuff lately? Blather...well, you are right..there is a lot of blather but I think there is a divergence of opinion on whom it is coming from. You don't seem to want to let the 375 Ruger owners/enthusiasts enjoy themselves. If it is truly not an issue to you, why do you keep it up? Cheers, Canuck | |||
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This is also a good twist on the numbers. Good show! JPK  Free 500grains | |||
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MacD37, You are right. I think it is great that we have the choices we have. I tend to hunt with my 3006 when it isn’t enough I get my .375 H&H out, if it looks like that won’t be enough I will use my .458 LOTT and when that isn’t enough I will by or borrow something bigger. I don’t get excited about small increases in power. Use enough gun. Bill Member DSC,DRSS,NRA,TSRA A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way. -Mark Twain There ought to be one day - just one – when there is open season on Congressmen. ~Will Rogers~ | |||
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Here are the 375 Ruger Pros and Cons from a newb 375 caliber owner and handloader's perspective Pros Shorter case More case capacity More velocity from equal barrel length Lighter, more handy rifle Less Expensive Rig Bonus: Hornady Dies include $25 worth of free bullet offer when purchased Cons Less History Could fall out of favor and make brass hard to find Steeper case angle is not as slick as HH...TBD IMO Factory ammo not readily available everywhere if my luggage gets lost From where I sit, the Pros far outweigh the Cons. I think the Ruger will unseat the HH. I don't really care if it does, but I have enough 375 Ruger brass to make it a moot point from my vantage point! | |||
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Maybe next year Ruger can chamber a long, tapered, belted 375 and name it the Idahoan.  Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Actually I think the con "factory ammo not readily available everywhere" should be exponentially weighted if one is headed overseas, especially Africa, where this issue would be huge and one of the reasons the H&H wins, hands down & slam dunk, for safari hunters. | |||
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Phil, they already did that, nearly 20 years ago; while they were waiting on Hornady to get some 375R brass and ammunition to them....arrr-arrr! There is nothing wrong with the 375R, it's just not anything better than a 375H&H. If you went to the Ruger factory and shot ten different 375R's in a row, the variances in MV between them would likely be a larger spread than the velocity difference claims. "...he shoots, he scores.....". regards, Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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....And, a lot of yea sayers without any personal experience, as well. But one thing is certain, there are thousands of people with personal experience with the 375 H&H, and not just on paper, over a crono! I say the Alaskan version will be the bulk of the sales that will see anything more than paper, because the rifle is just about perfect for Alaska. The rifle will sell far better, if it is chambered for the 338 Win, 9.3X62 Mauser, 9.3X64 Breneke, and even the 350 Rem Mag. IMO the lasting part of this equasion is, the RIFLE! Nobody is afriad any of the 375s will push the old 375H&H out,because they never will, but when everyone expresses a positive opinion of the 375R, it will certainly garner the opposite opinion. that is what the mantra "FORUM for the EXCHANGE of ideas" is all about, on the net! Only one side is not EXCHANGE! ....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1 DRSS Charter member "If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982 Hands of Old Elmer Keith  | |||
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Rich, You very well could be right. The difference in performance between th 375 R and the 375 H&H is so insignificant as to be meaningless. So is the difference between the 300 Win and the 300 H&H. Caliber choice is simply a matter of personal preference and why some rounds make it and others fail often doesn't make sense to many of us. Thank God we can at least argue over it. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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458, spirited honest debate, one of the great joys of this forum. I can appreciate the virtues of the 375R, and it will likely be "the" rifle in Alaska for those not wishing an 1895 in 45-70. I wonder if they will offer it in 458WM? Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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I don't know but they cycle through the action mighty slick. The combo would sell great in Africa but I would have serious reservations about the durability of the stock. The same would go for a 416 R. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Phil, Are you saying that the stock on the Alaskan is an area for potential improvement? I spoke to Brown Precision and they said they will be making their "Alaskan" model for the new Ruger Hawkeye. That would be a significant improvement over the hogue I would think. Joe "I can't be over gunned because the animal can't be over dead"-Elmer Keith | |||
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The wood stock on the "African" model is one I would have reservations about with anything larger than the 375. The Hogue probably would take it although I personally think the Hogue is an abomonation on a DGR. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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is the wood-stocked one cross-bolted? Is a little Marine-Tex going to cure the splitting concerns? The Hogue 'sho look ugly in the pictures, perhaps it is like the homely girl who can cook, keep a clean house, baby her man, and work a fulltime job to boot! Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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I voted other as my next 375 is going to be either a 375 AM or 375 Snipe-Tac. I wouldnt mind a 375 ruger one day though seems to be a neat cartridge for pigs! Hunting its not a Hobby its My Way of Life!!! | |||
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I think the key here is, if you're talking factory rifles or customs. My H&Hs have generaly been small light(8 lbs scoped) guns. In a factory gun the new Ruger is very hard to beat. For H&H power its a very compact handy package. Its also priced right for a new 375. I handled one of the big Rugers at the range the other day, it was a Rigby. It was the new one with barrel band, to be honest it felt very good for weight and balance. The size of the forearm totally blew it. It felt 3" wide. Made my CZ feel pretty good. For half the price (up here) and way less weight the 375R looks good. This from a guy just starting to work on another 378.  | |||
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I have one that can do all that and then some. Only she's 5'8 and 130 pounds. I guess she's more like a Dakota 76 than a Ruger Alaskan. "I can't be over gunned because the animal can't be over dead"-Elmer Keith | |||
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I would go for a .375 Ruger in an Alaskan.....................my next choice would be for a .378 weatherby. | |||
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Yep. Works good; lasts a long time... | |||
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Ruger hit up on a good idea for the 375, putting it in a shorter non belted cartridge. There is definitely no guarantee for success though. The 300 win bested the 300 H&H due to impeccable timing and the market for 30 cal rifles in the US. The marginal step up in performance was no where as critical as the step down in price to use a standard action in lieu of the magnum length action. Outside of the AR forums, the popularity of the .375 class of rifles dwindles dramatically. Most people picking a 375 rifle are likely to be big game hunters in either Africa or Alaska. The availability of H&H ammo in these areas is likely to skew their purchase. I wish Ruger best of luck on their endeavor, it will be a tough sell, luckily, most of the risk is on the ammo side as the rifle action isn't much different than a 300 win. On an aside, to say one kills much better than the other is a discussion best left to internet forums rather than afield. In the bush, numbers become a poor argument to dead game. I doubt either would pile up any more than the other. John | |||
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