The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores .395/310gr SHARK Swims With AuthorityGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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O.K. Gerard, are we ignoring the .395 again this morning in RSA? | |||
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Did you contact RCBS or CH4D RE: delivery time of dies? | |||
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CH4D is making the 400/.395 NE dies, said it would be 3 or 4 months, in the works still. Redding is making the .395 Tatanka dies, estimated 4 to 6 months, in the works still. Hornady made the .395 Ruger Max dies in 2 months, done! I just need a .395 Ruger Max rifle: in the works now!!! Step by step. Max has sent the reamer back to me. He has the proper dies and a rifle, and is reporting 3/4" 100 yard groups with the .395/310gr SHark, IIRC. hopefully he is slaying elk with those bullets, and not wasting much meat.  | |||
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What's to ignore? Our existing designs are finalised and working exactly as intended.  I am thinking about adding to the 395 range, the Tatanka has all that CAPACITY.  But I have to finish the last of the extended range of 50 SPs first (up from the 17 shown on the website).  Raw material will only be available when RSA wakes up with a hangover on the 7th of January.  Nothing can change the fact that the .395" in a 1:12" twist is the thinking man's caliber.  I am content and reminding myself: "Lord, give me the wisdom to tell the difference between that which I have the power to change and that which I must accept."     | |||
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Gerard, would a bullet like the tipped TSX or MRX Barnes expand more vigorously with the tip removed? Maybe this would be a neat experiment. I know the tips are supposed to help the BC, but in applications where BC isn't all that important would the removal of the tip create a bullet that opened more readily than the standard TSX and the tipped varieties? Perhaps this would improve the on-game performance of such designs when utilized on lighter framed animals. Sorry if this is hijacking, but it got me curious. | |||
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With bullets we purchased from outside sources, in every experiment I have done with tipped and untipped mono bullets and in most experiments I have done with tipped and untipped lead core bullets, the untipped bullet expanded more reliably. The proviso is that the same bullet must be tested comparatively, some tipped and some with tips removed. Ideally, the test medium must be struck at an angle. With in house designs I manufactured experimentally, the same was seen. I gave up on tips to aid expansion in 1997. My opinion, fwiw, is that tips are to increase BC and to manipulate other aspects of the bullet design. | |||
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Amen. I keep telling myself: "Patience, Jackass, patience." | |||
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Thank you for sharing your knowledge Gerard. | |||
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Uh, mind if I join the conversation? Just got back from my second elk hunt. * * * * Oh? What happened? (watch yer language) Small cow in freezer. And now the rest of the story: The weather was terrible. 11 degrees for a high in town, lower where I was; winds gusting and lowering the chill factor; snow and more snow and forcast for 6" to 8" that afternoon. Saw two herds on several days of over 200 elk, but they were on private land. On my last day, a small herd of about 40 elk were moving slowly in my direction through some BLM land and I moved to try and intercept them. Got a shot of about 220yds at the only cow that did not have an animal on the opposite side of her. (Remember the penetration of Macifej's bullets?) She was a small cow. One shot at a 45 degree angle facing away and with a good up angle also, and she was down within a few yards. Macifej, yer bullets lack weight retention.  Only have three pieces and they are small. Although... there is this exit hole on the far side of the animal.  Considering weather, did not have time or fortitude to perform a CSI autopsy. Bullet broke a rib on the back right side and ranged forward, making a hole in the left front shoulder and exiting. Lungs and heart were a mess. Will go through meat as I process it at home to see if I can find any more fragments. Oh, and there was quite a bit of meat damage in the lungs and heart. Max .395 Family Member DRSS, po' boy member Political correctness is nothing but liberal enforced censorship | |||
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 Congratulations! ------------------------------- Some Pictures from Namibia Some Pictures from Zimbabwe An Elephant Story | |||
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AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!! Man what a great Christmas present!!! Congrats on not giving up! the 395 rides again... yes pics please... 577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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Congratulations Max: First to blood the new .395 Ruger Max! First new cartridge of the .395 Family to be blooded. I am guessing that about 45 grains of nose splintered into 6 petals and about 265 grains of bullet escaped the offside shoulder into the countryside ... based on shooting of waterbuckets. Where did you find the 3 slivers that you recovered? Regarding "meat damage" in the heart-lung area: Did it look like a hexagonal explosion inside the lungs? Nice Christmas present for the .395 Family. Thanks Max. I got the reamer back from you, thanks, and am waiting for my smith to finish the 500 Mbogo and start on the .395 Ruger Max for me. | |||
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Max put "The Hex" on a cow elk. | |||
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Pics are in a standard film camera and I hope they turn out. I hunted alone (I know, stupid), but hunting friend had other commitments and lives in Oklahoma. Suuuuure---a hexagonal wound channel. It was too cold and snowing to be sure. There was quite a mess in the chest cavity which could have come from the bullet slivers or Roy Weatherby's hydrostatic shock.I'm not sure yet where all the slivers went the three that I recovered were: a. one in upper part of chest stopped by rib cage b. two in the goo...heart/lung/blood mess. c. also found rib fragments in goo. Ron, both Brett and I thank you sincerely for the use of your reamer.  If you didn't already have your Tatanka, I'd say, "Ya gotta get one of these." I know you will, though. Recoil seems the same as my .375H&H with the same bullet weight. Accuracy is excellent. Macifej has gotta get his now.By the way, does everyone who you show one of these bullets want one? Its getting expensive! .395 Family Member DRSS, po' boy member Political correctness is nothing but liberal enforced censorship | |||
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Nice work Max!! You are a tough S.O.B. sir if you're out hunting alone in those conditions. My hat's off to you......... Happy to see that your equipment worked as planned. Sounds like a slightly challenging shot. Regarding the bullet performance - not sure how it could be a faster killer without causing excessive collateral damage. Appears to be too much Gun/Bullet for small Elk at that range. Amazing they can keep moving with port and starboard vents and vaporized heart and lungs! Smart to take a film camera as most digitals spontaneously expire at those temperatures. So I have 200 rounds of brass, access to a reamer, a source for bullets, & dies. Now all I need to do is get one of those Rugers and have a barrel blank made. | |||
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I guess if one got stuck in a fast twist rifle you could screw it out with allen wrench Voodoo Shark! So the cow was a mess after the sharkee bit her eh'... Think Different...Think Sharkee 395!  577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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Thanks, Macifej. Temp when I went out on two days was a minus thirteen degrees. Spent more time in the vehicle than out on the high plains (well over 7,000 ft) in that temp. The bullet performed fine. I was just pulling your leg as far as weight retention. Elk do seem to keep moving a few yards after being hit if they were moving when you fired. Pick up any Ruger MKII in a magnum caliber and convert! I might even know someone who can get you brass bullets. He lives in San Diego. .395 Family Member DRSS, po' boy member Political correctness is nothing but liberal enforced censorship | |||
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I know you were kidding. I was babbling about how the thing could work better. Seems like it might make a good lion load as well. | |||
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RIP! Any photo photodocumentary evidence yet of your second profession as an Oral Surgeon!!  | |||
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Macifej, You missed my last photo shoot with that request. I am working and will have to wait until the coming weekend to get the SHARK to smile and show off its lead filling and "color case softening." This is more like a combined rhinoplasty and dentistry on the SHARK. Very technical, eh? You don't have to ask again. I'll post it here for yuks, when I can. | |||
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Here is what the annealed and lead-filled SHarks look like. The one on the far right has not had the rhinodentoplasty, still virgin. Any scratches are from steel wool used to shine them up a bit after the smoking ended and I rubbed the virgin with it too:   I used a brass punch and a little brass hammer to tap #4 lead birdshot, one at a time, into the nose, 4 pellets to each nose. Then I stood them nose-up loosely in a brass nut sitting upright on the bottom of an inverted tin coffe can. The nut is just to keep the torch from blowing them over. No water as a heat sink, it takes forever with the torch if water is used. Just point the torch flame downward onto the hollowpoint until the nose of the bullet starts glowing red and the lead melts. Leave it standing to cool until the lead solidifies. There is a bonding process involving a chemical application inside the cavity and then pouring in molten lead. That's next. This will work for now. BTW, the three bullets shown with lead nose filling weighed 323.0, 323.0 and 323.4 grains, average 323.1 grains. Amazingly consistent with birdshot from a sliced into shotgun shell. Winchester brand. | |||
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Very Interesting!! We await the bucket busting results for comparison. It would be interesting to see the comparison test of SHark lead snout HP -vs- FN -vs- DaRippa........ | |||
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Hi Rip Is the lead consistent in the bullets. The pictures make it look as though it's not. I know it's only a small amount of lead but if it's not even and comes out of the barrel at a 180,000 rpm and is front loaded accuracy could go down the tube. Do you think moving the COG forward will have any effect. Take good care, Dave | |||
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Dave, No this is not a match ammo bullet when I have finished hammering bird shot into the nose and torching it to melt. There may be irregular voids, gas bubbles in the lead fillings, and irregularities in the volume and density of the filling. Better uniformity could be obtained with bonding a molten lead core poured in. The SHark is match quality before being messed with. It is O.K. for game. It blows off the nose at 1600 fps or 2800 fps and will kill. Max proved it on elk at about 200 yard range. This birdshot trick is not worth the trouble. | |||
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I think the results would be interesting to see when the hex size is reduced by say 15 or 20 thou for a heavier weight and if they blow off no loss on solid projectile weight just heavier teeth that might do more damage before blowing off at possibly a higher velocity. No criticism just thought it would be interesting... Go team .395/400 Nitro! 577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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RIP! I might be inclined to go with Cold stuffing the snouts rather than the hot stuffing process you used. A simple die with ram an manual feeding of whatever material floats yer boat. I would try to load em with some anaerobic hardening liquid (Red Loc-Tite) and retest! Should eliminate any voiding/bonding problems and a lot easier to apply. Won't mess with the CG much either. | |||
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I am not planning to modify them anymore. They are excellent target & game bullets that are legal anywhere to kill any game that a softpoint would be used on. GSC has perfected the Copper hollowpoint on the HV. That is indeed a much smaller diameter cavity and much deeper cavity that opens into 3 petals. Hey the Shark works differently: six secondary missiles at all velocities above the speed of sound. | |||
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I was happy with the performance on my small cow elk (small is a relative term). Since RIP is not going to shoot these lead-filled items, I'm not going to worry about them. The 309 grain bullet seems to be a nice medium weight for use on most things. What I want to try, though, is a few of the lighter "cup and core" bullets to see how they perform. For my 400/.395, I may use primarily cast bullets, going back to its "aboriginal" beginnings. Max .395 Family Member DRSS, po' boy member Political correctness is nothing but liberal enforced censorship | |||
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Steel ballistic tips??? I am old enough to remember the old Remington bronze point which had an aerodynamic nose of brass inserted into a small HP. Used this on deer and elk (I did not know any better), in 308 and saw both deer and elk shot w it in 270 Winchester and 30-06. It was a VERY explosive bullet. The hard brass insert cut the lead HP in two and just blew it to smithereens. At least it did at typical timber hunting ranges. Any hard insert in front of an expanding bullet, even one made from copper, is probably not a good idea! Also not recommended for a FN solid. Andy | |||
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There's a limit to what is practical and useful in the hunting spectrum. Cost is also a factor given that "practicing" or load development with a $15.00 bullet isn't really an option for most guys. | |||
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Macifej, i can use the glue you mention red lock tite, to improve the expansion of copper bullets that don`t expand properly in some velocities ? Or if the nose cavity is too big so its filled with testmaterial and don`t perform well enough in the expansion. | |||
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This thread got me thinking about something. Has anyone tried to insert red loctite in the hollow point cavities of the Barnes TSX to insure positive expansion all the time, every time. It would be interesting to test them and see what results one gets... Every thread that I have ever read on the TSX mentions the same things over and over. Dead accurate but once in a while, they don't expand much... I must have to much time on my hands lol. P.S. Never wanted to hijack this thread | |||
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Guys, you are getting it backward. Plugging the nose with lead, was meant to slow down the guaranteed expansion of the SHark, which will completely blow off its nose at 1600 fps or 2800 fps, same/same, about 85% weight retention with no significant increase in frontal diameter, just secondary missiles. Allowing red Loctite or epoxy to solidify in the nose of a TSX would decrease expansion. Dead soft pure lead bonded inside the nose cavity with exposed tip, like a Swift or North Fork allows controlled expansion and increased frontal diameter with the malleable copper. If the Swift had no lead in it's hollow, copper nose, it would blow off its nose at 1600 fps too. Any problems with some of the TSX's are related to copper nose wall thickness being too great in proportion to the width and depth of the hollowpoint cavity. Barnes eventually gets them right, in their continued striving to imitate GSC reliability of expansion at a wide velocity range with excellent weight retention. . | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores .395/310gr SHARK Swims With Authority
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