Looking for Africa worthy rifle in 458 win mag, and looking to spend $1300 give or take a couple of hundreds. I will use it for cape buffalo. I was told a controlled feed is the way to go for dangerous game, but I don't mind a very reliable push feed. Suggestions please.

Thanks.

cz in 458, winmag or lott -- have it bedded, done deal

couple bucks more, cut off to 21" move sight back

I bought a M70 Super Express 458 win some years back and had it rebarrelled, so have the old barrel laying around somewhere. If you can get a M70 magnum, if I can find the barrel, it's yours for shipping.

Another vote for the new Win M70 on the "Classic" action. Probably one of the nicest handling 458s. Action properly sized for a 458 Win Mag. If I had not recemtly bought an FN 458 I would be picking up a M70.

Again... bed it properly. Check feeding etc. If you want to find a problem you may find mag capacity lower than you may like. Not an issue for me.

Another vote for the Winchester M70

having had issues with winchesters,and being TOTALLY unwilling to pay for a "pre-fn classic" knowing the faults there, I stand by my recommendation ...

and, since the 458 winmag can be fired in the lott chamber with no important issues, just grab a CZ

I handled a new 458win mod.70 at the last SCI convention.They had a nice one on display with a reddish stock.You could walk up to it and handle it with no hassle.Winchesters have a good reputation for feeding reliably.It seems like a good rifle for the price.Solid action and trigger too-you can't go wrong.

Another vote for the CZ, many good reviews from PH's all over Africa.

I can't vouch for the .458, but I love Whitworth .375 h&h.

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Winchesters have a good reputation for feeding reliably.It seems like a good rifle for the price.Solid action and trigger too-you can't go wrong.

George,
winnies have a MIXED reputation for feeding, with the pushfeeds ALWAYS feeding better than the classics (talking post 64 guns here) and then there's the period before FN that you could get a great gun, or crap, as they seemed to have been making them out of the spare parts bin before bankruptcy sale

some are GROSSLY over priced, for what you get...

and, while i like the new trigger, some folks love, some don't care for, the old trigger

Can you say RUGER M77 458 Lott???...you can find one once in a while...not to get a hoohaw going.

Don't chump change on the very tool that will make or break your trip...nor the practice ammo or "tuning" service cost...that's just wrong thinking.

The rifle and ammo represent only about 5%-10% of the actual TOTAL cost of the endeavor. Forget the "fancies" and put the money where it will do the most good.


I DO agree with Jeffeosso...a CZ 458 Lott, 20-22" bbl, tune-up by a reputable, knowledgeable 'smith and LOTS of practice before-hand...if you cant find a Ruger.


I wouldn't feel under gunned with any caliber from 375 up in any well known, TUNED-UP push feed, CRF OR Semi auto...or with any of my well used big boomers from 338 up.

It's not necessarily how big the bullet is, it's WHERE the bullet is placed that brings home the trophy's.

Luck

I've got a nice Ruger 77 that in just about perfect shape. Ruger put a new stock and floor plate on it a few years back...............

I have a Whitworth and a M70 Safari, and the M70 is hands down a smoother rifle. Faster lock time too. My M70 is a .416, which I think is the ideal buffalo gun. Shoots flat enough to handle plains game out to 300 as well.

No matter what you buy for a DG rifle, you must be prepared to shoot a minimum of 100 full load rounds while trying to identify its' shortcomings, and it will have some. So you need to understand that you will have to spend additional funds to have the rifle made 100% reliable for hunting DG.

Over the past 20 years I have owned DG caliber rifles by Browning, Remington, Ruger, and Winchester in calibers from 375H&H through 458Lott and some were from the Custom Shops of these manufacturers. All were purchased new and every single one, except for the Browning, required multiple trips back to the manufacturers or to qualified gunsmiths to correct issues.

Oh my, all this fuss about feeding, Brand of rifle, etc.
Good thing I did not realize it was so complicated or I might not have used a Miroku/Winchester 1895 in .405 to down my buff. I was way undergunned!

That was Ok as my DG PH has some type of bolt action .375 H&H to back me up. I forgot to ask him of the make, whether it had a fixed
mag floorplate, a push feed, etc ad boredom.
He and the trackers just went out and found the game, he told me where to shoot it, and I did.

Oh yes, I was very familiar with the rifle, the hand loads, and had practice a lot on buffalo targets.

I have owned both a M70 .458 and a couple of CZ 550 .458's - one that had some custom work done to it and I preferred the Winchester.
I currently own a Zastava M70 in .458 that I can also recommend. It is the only .458 that feeds rounds smoothly from the action without needing any polishing or smoothing work done. The CZ's (I've owned 2 in .458) were terrible in this regard.
The Zastava's are rugged and reliable and are very affordable. With the money you save you can get the factory stock bedded/ crossbolted or simply fit a synthetic like I did. I fitted a Hogue to mine and it'll put 3 shots in under 1/2 inch at 50 meters.
I also like your choice in caliber - the .458 is a great proven round and with the powders and awesome projectile available now it's better than ever!
Good luck with your hunt.

Regards,

Russ.

I've owned CZ550's in 30-06 and 416 Rigby, and both actions were rough as a cob.

Lots of Interarms / Whitworth rifles out there in your budget. Look around and you could find the rifle, scope, rings and a box or two of ammunition all in you $1300 budget. I would start there as it is hard to beat a CRF M98 factory chambered in the cartridge you are looking for IMO.

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:
Can you say RUGER M77 458 Lott???...you can find one once in a while...not to get a hoohaw going.

Don't chump change on the very tool that will make or break your trip...nor the practice ammo or "tuning" service cost...that's just wrong thinking.

The rifle and ammo represent only about 5%-10% of the actual TOTAL cost of the endeavor. Forget the "fancies" and put the money where it will do the most good.


I DO agree with Jeffeosso...a CZ 458 Lott, 20-22" bbl, tune-up by a reputable, knowledgeable 'smith and LOTS of practice before-hand...if you cant find a Ruger.


I wouldn't feel under gunned with any caliber from 375 up in any well known, TUNED-UP push feed, CRF OR Semi auto...or with any of my well used big boomers from 338 up.

It's not necessarily how big the bullet is, it's WHERE the bullet is placed that brings home the trophy's.

Luck

another vote for a RSM.

I checked out the Win. web site and the list of features for the Win 458.One gets plenty for the cost.Included is a one piece bottom metal(not sure if that includes an integral mag box), a three pos. safety, a Pachmeyer recoil pad, three recoil lugs,and two cross bolts.

ahh .. a though just occurred to me -- if you have some time, you could get a ruger 77mkII in 7rem, 300, 338, and rebarrel to 458 win ... would make a nice light rifle

Another choice would be to have a gunmaker or gunsmith put one together for you like jeff is suggesting.This is a good way to go about it especially being in the US where there is a somewhat competitive market for such work and prices are not anywhere near Canadian prices.I probably would never consider buying a factory big bore if I lived in the US unless I had to wait years or many months before it was completed.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
ahh .. a though just occurred to me -- if you have some time, you could get a ruger 77mkII in 7rem, 300, 338, and rebarrel to 458 win ... would make a nice light rifle

That's a really great idea. However, a wuss (Rimes with...) like me would make it at least nine pounds.

For new rifles I would vote for the M70.

But keep your eye out for an FN Browning Safari from the 1960s. These can sometimes be found in this price range. They seem to have made a lot of them in .458 and dealers will often be willing to let one go that has been sitting on the shelf too long. Maybe a bit on the light side and have a stock thats more suitable as a deer rifle. But higher quality than anything new at this price IMO.

I have a CZ in .458 Lott, it's an excellent rifle for the money. I often see them online at or below your price range. If you find a used one, odds are it wasn't fired much. Mine holds 5 rounds in the magazine, spectacular firepower!

I've taken 2 ele, 3 buffalo and a hippo on land with the Lott.

I also have a Win M70 classic (controlled feed) in 375 H&H. It's a slick feeding rifle. I personally find the flip-up rear sight on the M70 way below acceptable for DG use. Mine is scoped, so the sights are only backup. If I were going to hunt with the Win's open sights, I would get a more rugged rear sight. The CZ I shoot open sights only.

There is a ton of rifles AND pistols from 22 to...that have been used on cape buff and every other critter on the face of the earth and a ton of weapons from single shot to auto used for the same purpose...

Anyone who has worked with rifles knows how easy...relatively speaking...it is to build a nice rifle of ANY CALIBER...from old military to modern receivers.

Again...no matter WHAT caliber you want and no matter what receiver you use, it STILL takes a bit of work to make it into a rifle that you will stake your hide on...so pick your poison and get on with it...it takes TIME to sort a shooter unless you do it yourself and THAT takes time and knowledge also.

Lots of very desirable rifles in the auction houses...lots of the same thing in sporting shops around the country...if you have a specific caliber/brand you just have to look for it...if not Buds discount usually has an excellent selection of just about every brand/caliber available and they take PLASTIC.

I even made a 458 WM on a SMLE receiver that can handle the pressures of a bottom end 458 WM load...it's not pretty, it's a bit rough, but it hasn't skipped a beat when stroking slowly OR fast and it's a 7 down, 1 up shooter...it was originally just a "what if..." project that turned out very usable and NO sage rat has ever gotten away or required more than one round.

Luck

I'd recommend a new Winchester Model 70. About $200 more than you had budgeted. I have a CZ 500 in 500 Jeffrey and love it, but I had a lot of work done on it. If you want something that works smoothly out of the box, go M70. A CZ 550 in 416 Rigby is a thought also. The Rigby case feeds pretty easily and just a touch up by Wayne at AHR would have it feeding slicker than snot. If it's not enough recoil for you, Wayne could always rebarrel it to 450 Rigby down the road.

I'd go with a CZ 550, properly bedded with two cross bolts. Add Talley rings with allen bolts instead of levers if scoping. Better magazine capacity, controlled feed, and leave the barrel long - it's easier on your ears.

If you are interested, I have a very nice 458 mag in a Whitworth. It has very nice wood and shoots well. Contact me if you are interested.

quote:

Originally posted by dean119:
For new rifles I would vote for the M70.

But keep your eye out for an FN Browning Safari from the 1960s. These can sometimes be found in this price range. They seem to have made a lot of them in .458 and dealers will often be willing to let one go that has been sitting on the shelf too long. Maybe a bit on the light side and have a stock thats more suitable as a deer rifle. But higher quality than anything new at this price IMO.

A friend of mine had one of these. It was very nice . And very light weight.
The 458 calibre CZ 550 is the lightest of the CZ 550 Magnums as they all seem to have the same barrel contour. Probably Not the 500 Jeffery's and I don't know about the 450 .
I've really enjoyed the Interarms Mark X and Whitworth Express. . The Zastava is basically a copy of the Interarms rifles. I just hope it has a similar under barrel recoil lug on it. And it looks like it could use a better rear sight. Are you set on the 458 calibre ?
Winchester does have the Model 70 in 416 Remington. Which is my favourite 416. Not saying it's better than the 458 . But it is a great round.

I think you're right, up to 458 the CZ's have the same barrel contour, so the larger bores are less muzzle heavy and lighter.

My 500 Jeffery has a different contour

I just checked Gunbroker and no fewer than 17 Win M70's in 458 are listed.
Most of them in the 1200 range plus or minus a bit, some control feed some push feed.
There is even a pre 64 super duper special safari for 15K!
My first choice would be a Win M70, second choice would be a Mauser based (Interarms, Whitworth, Rem 798, Browning Safari etc)
Final choice for me would be the CZ, I've had them and they are nice enough but always seem like they need a bit of work and slimmed down to be about right.
I also really like the Rugers in 458 but they are usually over your 1200$ limit

You can probably meet your budget with a CZ, M70, or Mark X/Whitworth, new or maybe used, not including optics or gunsmithing.

It would be best if you tried to handle examples of these to see what you like. I have rifles in all three platforms and in stock form would prefer the Model 70 Winchester. Other people have different preferences.

They make these in 458 Lott

http://montanarifleco.com/?page_id=178

Fits your price range, hand lapped barrel control feed, 3 pos safety

quote:

Originally posted by Double BC:
They make these in 458 Lott

http://montanarifleco.com/?page_id=178

Fits your price range, hand lapped barrel control feed, 3 pos safety

to remind everyone, the MRC action will actually fit in a model70 stock -- consider it a winchester clone

and i'd buy this faster than a pre-N.Carolina winchester

Another way I look at this is no matter how much one spends on cheaper rifles or how many one owns you will never have a proper rifle.A proper rifle being a custom rifle with a hand made stock etc...IThis thought comes to mind when I shoulder my Martini Lott with the Satterlee action.I feel like I should just rebarel it when the bore uses and do away with cheaper rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by Cold Trigger Finger:

quote:

Originally posted by dean119:
For new rifles I would vote for the M70.

But keep your eye out for an FN Browning Safari from the 1960s. These can sometimes be found in this price range. They seem to have made a lot of them in .458 and dealers will often be willing to let one go that has been sitting on the shelf too long. Maybe a bit on the light side and have a stock thats more suitable as a deer rifle. But higher quality than anything new at this price IMO.

A friend of mine had one of these. It was very nice . And very light weight.
The 458 calibre CZ 550 is the lightest of the CZ 550 Magnums as they all seem to have the same barrel contour. Probably Not the 500 Jeffery's and I don't know about the 450 .
I've really enjoyed the Interarms Mark X and Whitworth Express. . The Zastava is basically a copy of the Interarms rifles. I just hope it has a similar under barrel recoil lug on it. And it looks like it could use a better rear sight. Are you set on the 458 calibre ?
Winchester does have the Model 70 in 416 Remington. Which is my favourite 416. Not saying it's better than the 458 . But it is a great round.

Zastava did built the Interarms X ....

There is an Interarms 458 in the rack at Cabelas in Lacey for $619.

zastava makes the interarms, markX, whitworth, and remington 798 rifles

My only complaint about these rifles 4 in fact(I also own a 270WSM) is that they had an extremely short barrel life.I shot TSX's exclusively through them and they had slim barrels.