I am considering having a 405 Win rifle built. Hornady factory Ammo is readily available and cheap. It uses Hornady's.411 diameter 300 grain bullet. But when I consulted Douglas barrels, their bore/groove dimensions for .405 Win are.405/.413. Their 40 caliber barrels are .400/.410. I don't like either for a .411 bullet. Any suggestions? The action is a Sharps Borchardt.

Have you tried Shilen? I got a .411 dia barrel from them for my 400H&H

quote:

Originally posted by Zephyr:
Have you tried Shilen? I got a .411 dia barrel from them for my 400H&H

That is right.
We went through that for the 400 Whelen.
Shilen was the only correct barrel to use for a .411"-diameter bullet.

I do believe the Shilen specs are:

.411" groove (published at web site)

.404" bore/land
(not published, guesstimated by RIP, might be .403", do not think it is .405", sumbuddy who know, please tell)

Twist 1:14"

Good twist too, for 300-grainer to 400-grainer.

I have two of those Shilen barrels.
They will make them as light as No. 4 sporter contour in both chrome moly and stainless, they did for me, I have one of each.

Riflecrank Internationale Permanente

I talked to Shilen. .403/.411 is their specs. A good price and delivery in 2-4 weeks. I also found that Al Story makes barrels and his have a good reputation, even though they are .400/.410. They will work with a 300 grain .411 bullet

Vol717,

Thanks for that Shilen bore diameter, saves me from looking it up again.

I also forgot about Krieger:

Krieger is the only other acceptable barrel we found on the 400 Whelen trail:

.411" groove
choice of bore diameter, either .403" or .405"
1:14" twist, 6-groove
Chrome moly only, with minimum contour they will make being a No. 4 sporter contour.

I went with Shilen chrome moly first time, wanted stainless second time, so that eliminated Krieger, back to Shilen.

BTW, we found that any of the .410-caliber bullets worked just fine in the .411/.403 Shilen barrels of our 400 Whelens.
Even the stubby .410/210-grain Hornady XTP handgun bullet used in fire-forming:



Riflecrank Internationale Permanente

I routinely use .410 barrels for .411 bullets Hornady, made for the .405 WCF. They are very soft bullets and no issues noted with them.
No reason to use a 411 barrel for that bullet when there are many other .410 bullets out there.

Vol717,
It appears that you may have all the information that you need if all you plan to shoot in your .405 WCF is Hornady bullets.

However, if you plan to shoot monolithic solids such as bullets by Northfork, you may need to consider whether that will affect your bore size plans.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:




Riflecrank Internationale Permanente

Now THAT would become my go to light bullet load for sure!
210grs at 2731fps!
Nosler doesn't even list a 200gr 30'06 load with that velocity!

quote:

Now THAT would become my go to light bullet load for sure!

Might be great for varmints, but hitting anything solid would likely explode the bullet.

It is a good kids training and plinking bullet though at 1400 fps.

I see your point.
Maybe a solid or mono of the same weight would not break apart. I'm just shocked at the speed and that 58grs of 4198 can even fit in the Whelen case.

I have a 450/400 double rifle if I want to shoot big, tough bullets. I want this rifle to be very light for carrying. It will have a nice front sight and a short rib with Talley bases milled in. I will have a Talley aperture sight for the times that I don't need a scope.

Vol,
The Miroku/Winchester 1895 in .405 is light for that caliber and fits your requirement rather well. Why not just buy one and start shooting it?


You can customize the sighting (peep & and scope) as a later project.

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:
I see your point.
Maybe a solid or mono of the same weight would not break apart. I'm just shocked at the speed and that 58grs of 4198 can even fit in the Whelen case.

Yes, a brass or copper monometal, ballistic-tipped, .410-cal/210-grain, "expangible" bullet would be interesting.
Might even be able to get higher MV than 2731 fps with those.
There were no pressure signs or trouble getting that much H4198 into the 400 Whelen.
But you might want to start at about 53 grains of H4198 and work up. 58 grains might be getting close to max.
Comparing the 30-bore to the 40-bore for velocity/energy with a given bullet weight: Bigger bore rules the roost.

Riflecrank Internationale Permanente

quote:

Originally posted by Vol717:
I have a 450/400 double rifle if I want to shoot big, tough bullets. I want this rifle to be very light for carrying. It will have a nice front sight and a short rib with Talley bases milled in. I will have a Talley aperture sight for the times that I don't need a scope.

Are you building a single-shot 405 WCF rifle, or a lever-action rifle?

The Ruger No.1 in either 405 WCF or 450/400 NE 3" are fun, as well as the BAC/Miroku 405 WCF as shown by crshelton. I get to play with all three of those.

But I still want a ".406 Ted Williams Thumper" with a stainless Douglas .410/.400, 1:14" twist, No.4 sporter contour, on a bolt action, 6-shooter.

There is no cure for my disease.

Riflecrank Internationale Permanente

I've been shooting .411 diameter .405 Winchester bullets out of a McGowen 405 barrel and they do quite well.

McGowen specs are:

Bore .402″ | Groove .412″ | twist 1-14″ (6 Groove)

RIP, do you want a six shooter with one in the chamber or six down?

Last time I looked a Sharps Borchardt was a single shot.

quote:

Originally posted by Vol717:
Last time I looked a Sharps Borchardt was a single shot.

Yep, 1878, crshelton's Win 1895 got me disoriented.
The Talley peep on a quarter rib, aperture located no more than a half inch forward of the action would be workable, as a limited-use, close-range backup to scope.
If the peep of a Remington "Rough & Ready" combination rear sight can do it on a Roller, a Talley peep can do it on a Sharps Borchardt, I reckon.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
RIP, do you want a six shooter with one in the chamber or six down?

I know I can get 5 down with a 404 Jeffery in a CZ 550 Magnum, using the standard factory bottom metal.
And that is the most ideal box and ammo combination possible.
It perfectly fits the "Mauser Cosine Law" for box widths and cartridge case diameters.

Maybe 6 down with a coffin floorplate added?
The 5 + 1 sixshooter 404 Jeffery is a cinch.
But the 6 + 1 sevenshooter .410/404 Jeffery is the dream.
Maybe the 6 + 1 can be done for the 400 Whelen in an M70 with a Wiebe XRM box or a Sunnyhill/McMillan combo.
No excuse.
See .406 Ted Williams Thumper on wildcat forum.
Highjack off.

Riflecrank Internationale Permanente.

Mmmmkay...
Have we thought about taking off the rim and adding an extractor groove to the 400 Jeffery like what happened to make the original 404 Jeffery? Existing dies and reamer. 5 down in CZ550. .410 bullet. Wam bam, you're welcome we can right the wrongs of history by realizing the true vision of the bolt action DGR emulating the 400 Jeffery because it will be the 400 Jeffery rimless. No head stamp issues! 100 years of load development already done.

Putting that cartoon cannon on my ignore list makes looking at the page so much better.

Hello boomstick,

I am copying your post over to the wildcat forum, to the ".406 Ted Williams Thumper" thread where we can get as bizarrely impractical as we please.

Riflecrank Internationale Permanente

One of my old 450-400s had a .411 bore, I shot both .410 and .411 bullets in it at the time when .411s were hard to find, come to think of it so were .410s and everything else.

Judge G built a 405 with a long throat on his win. mod. 95, and got 2000 plus FPS with 400 gr. bullets..Used it on Buffalo on a hunt I booked him for with Pierre Van Tonder. He had some peep sight trouble with it but shot one or two buffalo with it successfully.