quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:
Make mine a Rigby and only a Rigby, A Remington is a Johnnie come lately wantabe... The Rem is just a re-invetion of the wheel

I'll drink to that,

yes, the .416 is the johnny come later, including the rigby, as the 404 was there before and working great...

things that make you say "dang"

The 404 is not a 416 caliber. The Rigby is the original in 416 caliber and hase been around for over 100 years. The Rigby was the choicew of Jack O'conner, and Harry Shelby raved about its performance on game.

What's not to like

read what i said .. the .416 is the johnny come later, period.. your dismissale of the remington was that its "new" .. well, heck, the .424 bullet was the original, and the 416 was the marketing hype to be "better" ..

trying to make you THINK about your nostalgia ..

+10, for the greatest 40 ever, the might Rigby.

Should have been a pole question....

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:
Make mine a Rigby and only a Rigby, A Remington is a Johnnie come lately wantabe... The Rem is just a re-invetion of the wheel

I'll drink to that,

yes, the .416 is the johnny come later, including the rigby, as the 404 was there before and working great...

things that make you say "dang"

The 404 is not a 416 caliber. The Rigby is the original in 416 caliber and hase been around for over 100 years. The Rigby was the choicew of Jack O'conner, and Harry Shelby raved about its performance on game.

What's not to like

read what i said .. the .416 is the johnny come later, period.. your dismissale of the remington was that its "new" .. well, heck, the .424 bullet was the original, and the 416 was the marketing hype to be "better" ..

trying to make you THINK about your nostalgia ..

The 404 Jeffery was first, but alas it is a larger caliber (diamiter) and not a .416 caliber and that is the topic .416 which of course the the Rigby is, the original

It is hard too love the 416Rigby and not have a soft spot for the 404J as well. But, as for Remington, Weatherby, Ruger or Mary Taylor More - thank you, but no thank you.

When I started thinking about a Buffalo hunt, I started thinking .416 of some type. I finally settled on the Remington, got a Model 70 Win Safari Classic and started reloading and shooting, with great results and satisfaction. My son then expressed a desire to accompany me, thus another rifle became necessary. This time I got the Rigby in Ruger #1. The why for the #1 was I found a great deal on a beautiful rifle. After shooting both extensively for several years now, I could hunt with either chambering and be very confident. The Rigby can be loaded to speeds (2650 to 2700 fps on a 370-400 grain bullet compared to 2450 to 2500 fps) that are much faster if so desired. I would replace the #1 with a Bolt of some type, just to have the quicker second shot if needed. Bullet of choice being the North Fork 370 grain soft and solid. The brass for the Rigby is a little more expensive, but not prohibitively so. Good shooting.

I have 6 416s all 416 Remington Mags.But if i were buying one today I would get a ruger.The reasons the cost of the gun the cost of ammo and brass.I snagged up 8000 pcs of 416 rem mag brass cheap about 10 years back not it no longer made.Hornady loads the 416 Ruger and has brass.The recoil is way less than the 416 rigby due to less powder.I will probally make or just buy a 416 Ruger.Will the 416 Ruger make it not sure unless alaskans buy a bunch of them .I have not seen any in alaska yet but have heard of some.When I can buy a 416 for under $1000 I buy it.Alaska is not the place for a pretty gun but a tough gun.Africa is drier and way hotter than alaska.My 416s usually get wet in Ak.I had a kid flip on the 4 wheeler with my 338-378 Weatherby it say in the creek for about 4 hours untill we could get it out.It cleaned up good but no pretty wood just stainless and fiberglass.I have shot my 416s around 3000 something times so far.I hope that some day I do get to take them to Africa.In the mean time they are my tent and truck guns and for the forest and thickets.Good luck with your 416 .I think they are the best all around Rifle for Dangerous game!!!!

You mean there is a .416 besides the .416 Rigby........alright! Who knew!

Some of you guys need to take your comedy act on the road.

Six months ago there are some that probably never heard of a 416 Rigby, now it the greatest cartridge ever developed.

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:


The 404 Jeffery was first, ... the original

the rigby being of smalelr bore, sir, was a means to go around the proprietary nature of the gun trade then ... they are, in the practical sense, indistingishable from the other, which is way rigby DID IT THAT WAY.

I don't even have a dog in this fight, but I see that the .416 Remington and .416 Rigby have earned a lot of respect, among commercial loads. I see that the .416 Remington now gets the nod from Don Heath, which is a darn good endorsement IMO. Of course, the Ruger round has yet to prove itself, but I notice there's still no love for the .416 Weatherby!

quote:

Six months ago there are some that probably never heard of a 416 Rigby,

This I dont believe. You have to be either very young, totally unread or simply down right ignorant not to have heard of the 416 Rigby. Its a legend. You dont have to like it, but; dont say this. AR members know better than.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:


The 416 Rigby was first, ... the original

the rigby being of smalelr bore, sir, was a means to go around the proprietary nature of the gun trade then ... they are, in the practical sense, indistingishable from the other, which is way rigby DID IT THAT WAY.

It doesn't matter why the 404 is NOT a 416
The Rigby is the First 416 and still going strong.

You can continue to try but you will never make a 404 be a 416

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:


The 416 Rigby was first, ... the original

the rigby being of smalelr bore, sir, was a means to go around the proprietary nature of the gun trade then ... they are, in the practical sense, indistingishable from the other, which is way rigby DID IT THAT WAY.

It doesn't matter why the 404 is NOT a 416
The Rigby is the First 416 and still going strong.

You can continue to try but you will never make a 404 be a 416

Yes, you are correct, the 404 is the first heavy medium bolt gun round, and it's not a 416.

YOU keep harping on about "first", not about merit .. the FACT is the 416 rigby is a near copy, in a marketing ploy, of the 404.. no, REALLY, and stickign yoru fingers in your ears and saying "but the 404 aint a 416" make zero difference.


You can continue to try but you will never make a rigby (second) be a jeffery (first)

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:


The 416 Rigby was first, ... the original

the rigby being of smalelr bore, sir, was a means to go around the proprietary nature of the gun trade then ... they are, in the practical sense, indistingishable from the other, which is way rigby DID IT THAT WAY.

It doesn't matter why the 404 is NOT a 416
The Rigby is the First 416 and still going strong.

You can continue to try but you will never make a 404 be a 416

Yes, you are correct, the 404 is the first heavy medium bolt gun round, and it's not a 416.

YOU keep harping on about "first", not about merit .. the FACT is the 416 rigby is a near copy, in a marketing ploy, of the 404.. no, REALLY, and stickign yoru fingers in your ears and saying "but the 404 aint a 416" make zero difference.


You can continue to try but you will never make a rigby (second) be a jeffery (first)

Apparently you can not comprehend that we are talking about .416 diameter cartridges not .423 are you getting senile?

Hell ther were calibers before the 404.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:


Yes, you are correct, the 404 is the first heavy medium bolt gun round, and it's not a 416.

YOU keep harping on about "first", not about merit .. the FACT is the 416 rigby is a near copy, in a marketing ploy, of the 404.. no, REALLY, and stickign yoru fingers in your ears and saying "but the 404 aint a 416" make zero difference.


You can continue to try but you will never make a rigby (second) be a jeffery (first)

Forgive me if I am wrong but didn't the 404 come out factory with a 400 gr at or about 2,150 fps while the rigby came out factory with a 400 gr at or about 2400 fps.

Of course the 404 Jeffery did the job for a long time until the 458 win stole its thunder. Quite a shame, more buff would be dropped without major follow up if more hunters brought 404's instead of 458's.

John

John
404 - 2250 400gr
416 - 2350 410gr

of course, you can also load the 10,75x68 to 400gr at 2200, but it was classically loaded to 350 at 2250 (with soft bullets) and was a settlers favorite amounst the germans and dutch ... and apparently the french in SE asia ...

yes, the 458 winmag jumped into the pile, and made a heck of a splash, as did the 416 rem and 458 lott...

and they all have to try to compete against the 375HH


jwp - we going to go to name calling? I'll pass, thanks .. to quote judge judy "below me" said with a strong yankee accent

Hands down I'd opt for the Ruger Mark II in .416 Rigby. The Ruger is a steal at its price. Anything custom approaching the Ruger would be 10 grand USD.

I second the recomendation .. I have had them in 375, 416, and 458 .. but i would only recommend for the RSM, not the "markII" as that is a different rifle altogether (300win, 30-06, and such)

I'll third the RSM, very good rifle for about $2k, don't have to do anything except make sure the screws are snug, good finish, decent wood, nice metal, functional, safe.

John

I have had both the RSM as well as a number of CZs. The Ruger is indeed a nice rifle right out of the box but it is too heavy especially in a .375 H&H. The CZ is much better balanced and, with a little work, makes up into a really nice gun. I prefer the CZ and it looks like the Winchester guys will soon have a Winchester Safari Express rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
I have had both the RSM as well as a number of CZs. The Ruger is indeed a nice rifle right out of the box but it is too heavy especially in a .375 H&H. The CZ is much better balanced and, with a little work, makes up into a really nice gun. I prefer the CZ and it looks like the Winchester guys will soon have a Winchester Safari Express rifle.

I think most will say the RSM is too heavy for the 375H&H. But the heft isn't too bad for the 416 and is definitely welcome in the lott. I have a win 375 H&H and A Sako 75 Stainless in 375. The Sako weighs about 8.5 lbs with scope, which is just about right.

John


John