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Long Live The Rigby, here, here,  _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Another vote for the Remmie here..... Who gives a rat's backside if the Rigby is a "classic" and the Remmie isn't?? If you're going to use such a chunky monkey case, it might as well be sporting a larger caliber bullet.....  (that was directed at jwp mainly  )......."Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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Make mine a Rigby and only a Rigby, A Remington is a Johnnie come lately wantabe... The Rem is just a re-invetion of the wheel I'll drink to that, _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Blah, blah, blah.......  "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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'   Your right . I do have to get one .........I will , just after I get a bull dozer ..Got my eye on a little Komatsu ..... About the same price as a used box lock double , but it will make me more $$$$$ Then I can get another 416 ...If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined .... | |||
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I have one of each and if there is any difference on game it is only in the mind of the beholder. The difference is ammo availability, price, rifle weight and a slightly shorter, quicker bolt throw for the Ruger. When it comes to dangerous game Nostalgia alone ain't worth a bucket of warm spit. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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And for Idaho SS benefit...as every PH in Zim knows a .416 solid cannot be relied upon to stop a poacher with a frontal brain shot. (an elephant yes, a poacher no  )Most who have been on the forum long know the story but for the benefit of the new guys... Pro guide walking with a bunch of photographic tourists in Chizarira National park runs into a gang on poachers. Gang leader opens fire with his AK47 on the tourists. Gide fires one shot back with his .416 (rem). Federal TB solid. Poacher drops AK and runs off. I was called in to investigate as the local police didn't belive the guide or the clients version of events. Lying about three paces from the AK as a chunk of human brain the size of my fist. There was a major blood trail from a torn artery leading off into the jess and the poachers body was at the end of the blood trail some 70m from where he was shot. The police didn't belive a man could run away after having 1/3 of his brain blown out, but careful analysis by both Police forensics, the pathologist and parks trackers confirmed this was the case and that the poacher actually bled to death....so much for 'knock out power' | |||
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Ganyana, Obviously another misinterpretation of Taylor's Knock Out Values.  This is a gold mine, but maybe just let it go as not using enough gun? ------------------------------- Will / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun. --------------------------------------- and, God Bless John Wayne. NRA Benefactor, GOA, NAGR _________________________ "Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped. “Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped. red.dirt.elephant@gmail.com _________________________ If anything be of note, let it be he was once an elephant hunter, hoping to wind up where elephant hunters go. | |||
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I own the Rem. 416 And that rifle with a full load goes over 2400fps.Thats with a 400gr bullet Good shooting to you. | |||
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Dang! And that was a CNS shot! So much for muzzle energy! "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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Must have been the Remington version _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Only one of the inefficient big cased versions could fail to stop a man...... "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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You know boys, I suspect that the situation that Ganyana has brought to light could have been one of those round nose solids that veered off course? Maybe hit the wrong spot, veered off course not giving proper penetration, only taking out 1/3 the brain? Maybe the bullet broke up? Who knows these things? Wonder what would have happened with a proper FN Solid? Of course one might want to consider other matters that the 1/3 of the brain that was taken out was not a vital organ, at least in this particular case? Now, for more important matters at hand, deciding what exactly is the best 416 cartridge. I don't think the bullet actually realizes the exact cartridge that is is being booted off from! I never have had a particular bullet inform me that it would rather be booted off from a nostalgic, classy cartridge than that with is just common. Now I am truly a fortunate individual in the very fact that I own and shoot not only 416 Remington, with several Win M70s so chambered, but also 416 Rigby and have at times owned and shot 416 Taylor. Not a hoots difference in any of them, as far as the bullet and it's effectiveness goes. Which brings me right around to my very own, 416 B&M, that is chambered of course in the very finest of rifles known to man, Winchester M70s! It's short, little fat, and can drive 400 gr 416 caliber bullets at 2300 fps! It can also drive 350s at 2400-2450 fps depending on the rifle. Now that in and of itself is no better, nor worse for that matter, than any of the big traditional 416 caliber cartridges, eh? Nah, not two cents worth of difference. But here is the kick, it can be done in 18 inches of barrel! Depending on either wood stock or the Winchester Ultimate stock, it can also be done on a platform that weighs from 6.5 lbs to 8 lbs max. Now unless you have them side by side, have one in your hands at a time, there is zero doubt in my mind which one I would rather tote around with me all day in the field! Since it is a 416 it don't have any recoil to speak of, and is a pleasure to shoot and handle! Now if in Alaska, I opt for my hillbilly gun, stainless and CAMO Ultimate stock, 350 Swift or Barnes TSX at 2400 fps will do anything I need to do! Wet weather be damned too! At 6.5 lbs it's not a burden, and with an 18 inch barrel it's short enough to crawl around in the brambles if need be! Try that with a 11 lb musket in 416 Rigby! Yes, JWP, I am talking to you! HEH! Then if going to Africa with it to shoot eland and kudu maybe, then put my pimped out Mrytle stock on it! If you would like to see these rifles let me know, most already have. Now I know this is taken a turn from the original reason for this thread, but it is thought provoking! Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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yes, the .416 is the johnny come later, including the rigby, as the 404 was there before and working great... things that make you say "dang" opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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The 404 is not a 416 caliber. The Rigby is the original in 416 caliber and hase been around for over 100 years. The Rigby was the choicew of Jack O'conner, and Harry Shelby raved about its performance on game. What's not to like  _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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I prefer my Rigby to be housed in a 9 to 9 1/2 pound musket. With the Rigby I can send a 400 grainer 2600 FPS or a 350 Grainer 2900 or so FPS. Try that with the Johnnie come lately's _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Ok try this one on for size. 9lbs and near 4 ft long musket is too big for my narrow ass to be toting around! And if you keep running those bullets that fast they will bounce off the heads of certain sorts and not get proper penetration due to bullet breakup! Better get some FN solids for that velocity!  M http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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.416Rigby... 240 grain impala at 3280 ft/sec..  DRSS: HQ Scandinavia. Chapters in Sweden & Norway | |||
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Ya know guys, Although the .416 is a little bigger then what I need here in Oregonia, I have shot about every one out there. "Except for the B&M version). And I will have to say that although I do hold a certain amount of Nostalgia for the oldies, the rifles that I have used such as the Rigby's have been big ass, heavy, slow handling guns. Hell, I've used big air driven jack hammers that felt lighter than one of those damn CZs! I think it's the main reason that I have remained with the smaller .375; especially the .375 Ruger with it's little 20" tube. The short guns just feel better in the tight brush that I hunt in. But I just may try out one of Michaels B&M series, Hillbilly rifles. Short, light, with plenty of power. Definition: Hillbilly rifle: Short, light, stainless, synthetic, beer bottle opener attached to the sling, and most importantly; Camo painted! Hmmmm, may even go for the .50! Heh Michael. . . . . . . . Call me. . . . | |||
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The Rigby can be fit into the same action as a 416 Rem. It takes a bit of work, but can be done. Remmember Harry Shelby's 416 Rigby was built br John Rigby on a standard Mauser action. I like my CZ much better than the Ruger at 9 to 9 1/2 pound it is of the correct wieght IMHO and balance pefectly _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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DWright Here is my Win M70 Hillbilly 416 B&M  And my "Pimped" out Myrtle Stocked 416 B&M  My 16 yr old (mr cool with the glasses) with his oryx and 416 B&M and 350 Barnes TSX  My oldest 19 yr old with his kudu and the same bullet and load in 416 B&M.  Funny thing is, neither animal complained or said a word to them about being shot with this lowly cartridge instead of a fine nostalgic 416 Rigby? Go Figure?  Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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OK, ahh, so exactly what dictates a correct weight? I figure as long as it doesn't beat hell out of you, the lighter the better. | |||
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DWright We can figure out where to attach the beer bottle opener, probably along with the front sling stud? No, maybe on the rear sling stud, don't want that opener to hit your hand during recoil! I think that will work, let me see, if I can work it out, I will post a pic!  Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Michael, The bottle opener goes right by the rear sling stud. . . . sheeesh! Though you'd of all would know that! If I knew how to get you a pic of the correct installation I would. But alas, I have no camera, and well, the rest is self explainatory. | |||
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I got this thing sorted out with the can opener! Look here, no rifle is more versatile than a B&M, made to order!   Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Down here in South Carolina we find there is damn few things that can't be solved with a little duct tape! Have to get myself some of that fancy camo duct tape for this job I think! Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Yup, folks, what we have right here on this forum IS the ULTIMATE Hillbiily rifle! Except no imitation! | |||
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416 B&M this stands for Bowel Movement (translation- Knocks the shit out of them) _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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I actually like your system a little better then mine, as mine hangs free so you can open a bottle O brew pretty quickly with no having to undo the tape. But your system requires you to actually be sober enough to undo the tape for proper use. This may be a safer all around set up. Hmmm, may have to rethink my system. | |||
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First custom gun I have really thought about. My relations in South Carolina (The South Will Rise Again!) would love that gun. Camo-short barrel-beer opener-duct tape - wow! Better than the ultimate woman!!! | |||
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If you can't duct it, f**k it! Lol If you think every possible niche has been filled already, thank a wildcatter! | |||
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JWP  http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Dogcat I feel you are man who can truly recognize a fine quality firearm along with it's added accessories! Who needs nostalgia when they have a B&M and all it's added gadgets? Why I figure a man can add just about anything one might need in the field on a B&M with a little duct tape! Why a man might even be able to add a roll of toilet paper for that big Bowel Movement JWP talks about! I may call JD at SSK and have a roll of duct tape sent out with every rifle from now on!!! Michael http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Uh-oh. Doesn't this mean we now have to have a .416 vs .458 caliber debate?  (No, let's not!) In the animal world, the head is always a vital body part. In the human world, not necessarily.
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Probably a Democrat -- we know they're brain dead...... "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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416 B&M???????  Never heard of it.The display of PURE POWER is nothing short of AWESOME ! 1 JOHN 3:18 | |||
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