Sometimes I get a good laugh out of some of these posts. Sometimes it is like a bunch of old women sitting around the porch.

I have an easy cure just get an action that will handle a 460 weatherby and problem solved.

Jarrod!

I don't want to rain on your parade but very few PHs in Africa will use the 460 Weatherby as a DG rifle. Among them it has a very poor reputation and they absolutely hate to see a client show up with one.

465H&H

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:

Among them it has a very poor reputation and they absolutely hate to see a client show up with one.

465H&H

What's with the big 460? I imagine horrendous recoil and lack of experience amongst the clients has nothing to do with this PH disdane you speak of...

Tex

It may be that most can't handle the recoil and the muzzle-blast on the 460 Wtby. So far, I've not seen a Weatherby in a 460 w/o a brake. I and my ol' shooting partner have seen quite a few who bought Wtby's and only shoot less than 5 rounds and consider they're ready for whatever. Of course, we never saw any holes on the targets whatsoever. There's absolutely nothing wrong with the round except excessive recoil and blast with full-tilt-boogie loads because of too light of a rifle and muzzle brake. If the 460 was made in aa heavier rifle w/o the RW stock style, it may well survive into the next century or two. Of course, there'll be Wtby. lovers out there who'll jump all over me over this.

FWIW, the Cabela's at Hamburg PA has a CZ .458 Lott on the used gun rack for $750.00. Doesn't look like it has had a box of rounds through it...

465H&H,
I don't think you really understood my post. I was being sarcastic.

Anyway take a 460WBY and load it down a little and it still has more punch than the 458WM or the 458Lott.
I've never hunted in Africa but if I did I personally would probably take the lot.

465H&H

I have previously owned two 460s in Mark V Deluxes. Never used them on anything bigger than pigs.

They load down very easily to 458 Win. 85 grains of 4064 use to do just over 2000 f/s second and with full accuracy and no fillers. That load is about 20 grains under a top load of 4064 for 500 grainers.

With their vertical stack in line feed their feeding is super reliable and Wby now offer a 3 shot magazine as an option.

Mike

So what did you think about it loaded down a little bit? was it fun to shoot. I assume it was a good hog buster

The 460 is tops in all respects. Apart from having owned two of them I have direct involvement with a couple of others. After rebedding and floating the accuracy is astounding....using a bag of lead shot behind the butt.

The two I had plus the couple others I have been involved with all had the early integral Pendleton Dekickers which were probably no better than magna porting.

I will probably get at least another one for the "just to have" department

At the time I had the second one a mate of mine had a 450 Ackley that was rechambered from a BRNO 458 Win. Playing with the 460 compared to the 450 Ackely was like cruising around in a 456 V8 manual compared to a little engine. 400 grain Speer flat noses and 500 grain Hornadys with the nose cut back to a flat point would not feed reliably from the 450 Ackely. The staggered feed and a chamber not much bigger than bullet diameter does not help. The 460 would feed those in a walk.

Strangely, an aquaintance of mine in America has 450 Dakota and a friend of his also has a 450 Dakota but neither will get the same velocity as the 460 with full loads. Perhaps the big freebore in the 460 is the reason.

Mike

If your only shooting targets, pigs or tin cans the Weatherby 460 will give you all the fun you can handle in the minimum number of rounds fired. But we were talking about dangerous game rifles here. Rifles used as stopping rifles for large african game such as elephant, buff and possibly hippo. In this context most consider the 460 Weatherby too much of a good thing. High velocity, over 2300 or 2400 fps with solid or soft point bullets is not needed and probably a detrement. Range tests of penetration in various mediums have shown that velocities of 2700 fps give less penetration then those below 2400. Also they tend to not penetrate in a straight line. In addition, solid bullets are more likely to deform with the added velocity. Loading the 460 down to Lott velocities is an option and is a good thing as pressures are lower. The problem is that the large Weatherby case reduces magazine capacity over rounds based on the 375 H&H case. As stated above the 460 Weatherby needs a muzzle break to reduce recoil to a manageable level. If your PH or trackers get even to the muzzle a busted ear drum can result putting him out of combat. I would never, never use a muzzle break on the DG rifle. You can say if the trackers and PH know about it they can stay back when you fire. But in the heat of combat things happen so fast and from unexpected directions that getting out of the way may not be an option. Very few can handle that kind of recoil and shoot accurately. If you can handle that much recoil you are better off to go to more bullet weight and a larger caliber.

465H&H

Mike 378,

It's time for you to quit buying rifles and go to Africa to shoot some stuff.

500,

It looks like 2007. My best shooting mate is making his 5th trip next year to complete his trophy collection of plains animals and 2007 would be Zebra etc and lots of them. Would prefer to do bigger stuff in Australia and simply because more flesh on the ground for dollars expended A lifetime of pigs, roos and goats is a habit that dies hard

I have no interest in trophy size etc. My shooting mate has been very keen on that. I think he has shot about 130 to 150 of the plains animals.

I would like to try on Zebra/wildebeeste type animals 378 and 460 loaded with both premium and non premium Hornady type bullets. My mate will probably get 338/378 to try.

Mike

500,

This is what my mate wants to get in 338/378 for the "flesh on the ground" trip.

http://www.weatherby.com/_images/products/rifles/_enlar...rr_desertmag_big.jpg

What a great thread. Lots of good points on both sides.

GaryVa.
"Ifficient" in a DG rifle is pretty much meaningless much like a hot rod car, it still cooks but at a cost, agreed...but Considering the cost of a Safari today do you really think haveing a efficient cartridge is meaningful?...

Mike,

If you took that rifle on safari with me, I would jump out of the airplane.

quote:

Originally posted by 500grains:
Mike,

If you took that rifle on safari with me, I would jump out of the airplane.

You could just throw the rifle out of the airplane...

Ray, GaryVA,

Since I was one of the folks who raised the efficiency issue, I'll take liberty to horn in here...

The .458 Lott does what the .458 Win was supposed to do at lower pressures. This means it doesn't have to be underloaded the way Winchester and others began to do when their ammo began to fail. (Using better solids would have helped a bit, too!)

However, there is a tendency to try to take both of these cartridges for a walk, and load them up to their SAAMI pressure ratings, which brings the .458 Win up to its original pressures (subject to the type of heat problems that ball powders like BL-C(2) are, and to clumping and other stuff when they are compressed). The issue of efficiency is that, when the .458 Lott is brought up, it does have more punch than the .458 win, but not as much more as the extra powder might suggest. Hornady is even producing .458 Wins with a heavy magnum load that is within a few hundred ft-lbs of their .458 Lott load.

It doesn't strike me that the efficiency question has as much to do with the low-pressure safety problem PH's are so very concerned about that the Lott was designed (reintroduced from long Watts) to solve. But I think this is your point, isn't Ray?

Dan

Yes, that was my point...also the word efficient has to do with the amount of powder etc. purchased to shoot a single round, and I don't think that applies to anyone but varmint shooters who shoot literally thousands of rounds at a single sitting....

The 458 and the Lott are in my opinnion two different cartridges and shouldn't even be compared to each other...The Lott is a bigger hammer...

The 458 Win. with a good handload is efficient if the word is a good one...You can get 2100 FPS with a 500 gr. bullet and at safe pressures, or pressures equal to 416 Rem., 270 WCF etc....The Lott on the other hand can do the same thing at like velocity but with less pressure, now that does not make it efficient, it makes it safer I suppose, less recoil and blast..but load costs would be the same.